Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Your not the most objective person in this one IMO. Frankly you are as biased as the Liverpool fans.
Dags: maybe you won't believe me, but i actually quite like you. So it would kind of (kind of, yes) sadden me to see you stay away from this thread, but by staying away you give the impression of being afraid of other views who maybe are not the truth, but who are until now as valid as your views.
It's also rather simple to divide the people who don't share your opinion in two categories: Man Utd fans (and thus demons and devils) and the neutrals who you call wind-up merchants. I guess i'm a wind-up merchant...
I will stop this discussionn this is useless. Lets agree to disagree. I will come back in this thread because (although a Spurs fan) i really like Liverpool and English football does interest me...
You're not a wind-up merchant Gerd. But Dags' point is that you can't have a decent discussion with the majority of posters in here. When the news/accusation first came out about Suarez the majority of Liverpool fans in here took a wait and see position and if guilty give him a big ban, with a couple (including me) expecting Suarez to be guilty based on his past indiscretions / mentality to win at all costs and Evra not being stupid enough to play the racism card when it wasn't valid ( as that is even more damaging imo).
From everything I've seen it was a heated exchange that looks negative and whatever Suarez said wasn't friendly imo.
A side note; Everyone seems to ignore the fact that these are professional football players doing a job and are unlikely to really care enough to abuse players to a huge extent. Bellamy is an example of looking like a raged man one minute and joking with the same player the next. It isn't a fan vs fan situation, it's just a job. Anyway...
However so far I haven't seen any conclusive evidence that Suarez was in fact using a racial slur. I'm all for banning him for what he is accused of, and personally I'm not that bothered by him being banned anyway as he needs a kick up the arse. However even with all the experts, video evidence and testamony I haven't seen a single report in the media or post in here that unequivocally proves Suarez made the racist comment. The fact that there is still so much discussion and semi truths being posted and counter posted by quoting the report in here and that the media can't actually pinpoint anything more from the report than that Suarez was unreliable just shows how weak the actual facts are. I think that is what generally the Liverpool fans in here are complaining about.
And for that valid complaint, because it could just as easily be the otherway round with different players, the Liverpool fans in here are portraited as RAWK nutters who will do anything, including condoning racism, to support their player. It's far, far from it, but that won't get in the way of mostly Utd fans coming in here to have their say and attack even the most valid and sensible of discussions or opinions. It's pathetic tribalism that quickly detoriorates into the mess this thread now is.
As an example look at Beachryan's last post, he is probably the most sensible and balanced Utd poster I know on here. Even that is an "inciting" post that has a negative slant, yet actually neither of the quote's contradict each other.
The lawyer, who deals only in facts, is saying that it isn't just a one vs the other because the report shows it's also about cultural understanding, subtleties in language, subjective conclusions based on testimony, social responsibility on how any perceived racism is handled.
The PR spiel is saying that even thought there isn't any unequivocal evidence a player can be banned for 8 matches because an opposition player accused him.
So Ryan, there aren't actually two sides with opposing views, there is one who only states what he knows and the other spins what he knows, pretty much what you did with your post. Yet even from your generally balanced views you are also caught up in this nonsense. Which, imo, only highlights how sensetive the subject is and how difficult it is to deal with. I'm not really sure what else the FA could do tbh, but that doesn't mean it's the fair decision and doesn't mean the Liverpool fans in here should be treated as idiots or RAWK members.
