The Retro-PES Corner

[Marlon Anthony]

@rockstrongo Can't wait to get to PES 2013, so many things I wanted so bad in a football that they finally incorporated, bringing boxed nets back, The fans wearing your teams shirts, the stewards and people walking around the ground, the animations.. Most of it was just aesthetic stuff but it goes a long way in making a game feel immersive!

 

[miguelfcp]

@WhoAteMeDinner: The "newcomers" group is made of newgens, regens of default players and regens of previously retired, real-life players. It's not always easy to recognize whether a player is a newgen or a regen, I understand your struggle, but usually newgens have higher stats and quirkier statsheets: comes to mind a guy (Chapi? probably) who impressed me with a statsheet filled of +80 stats as a 17-year-old, but when I looked at his mental stats I almost had an heart attack: 40-somethig for both mentality and teamwork. These kind of discrepancy between a player's stats is quite common on newgens, much more than on regens.
So your challenge is even more difficult, as you've been signing only regen defaults. That is actually a great idea to test out!

@rockstrongo: Actually I see things on a different perspective: the fact that it's so difficult to capture a screenshot makes the moment feel more important. I know that when I'm capturing PS2 pics and videos I have to spend a few more seconds trying to find the right light so that the image has decent quality, and also finding the right angle because if I tilt the camera even slightly it's going to look like sh*t - thanks to the 4:3 resolution of the PS2 on the TV. All these requisites give such importance to the moment that for a while it's like I'm taking pictures of Minanda Kerr instead of a freakin' highlight of a goal on a football game.

 

[mattmid]

@miguelfcp But you are taking pictures of Minanda, just not Kerr

 

[miguelfcp]

I can't believe I actually wrote Minanda Kerr...Retro-PES is a drug and it's chemically affecting my brain.

 

[rockstrongo]

@rockstrongo Can't wait to get to PES 2013, so many things I wanted so bad in a football that they finally incorporated, bringing boxed nets back, The fans wearing your teams shirts, the stewards and people walking around the ground, the animations.. Most of it was just aesthetic stuff but it goes a long way in making a game feel immersive!

A great deal of good stuff in that game.
I've noticed that all teams in la Liga since it's licensed has the right music for when players go on the field.
Little things making it great!

Impressed with the game play as well,tough teams are tough,you have to be smart,and I'm only playing professional (manual)

Going between 15-20 Min games,the good thing with 20 Min is that gameplay feels much more loose v 15 Min,cpu building up slower etc.
Haven't really noticef that before

 

[WhoAteMeDinner]

@WhoAteMeDinner: The "newcomers" group is made of newgens, regens of default players and regens of previously retired, real-life players. It's not always easy to recognize whether a player is a newgen or a regen, I understand your struggle, but usually newgens have higher stats and quirkier statsheets: comes to mind a guy (Chapi? probably) who impressed me with a statsheet filled of +80 stats as a 17-year-old, but when I looked at his mental stats I almost had an heart attack: 40-somethig for both mentality and teamwork. These kind of discrepancy between a player's stats is quite common on newgens, much more than on regens.
So your challenge is even more difficult, as you've been signing only regen defaults. That is actually a great idea to test out!

@rockstrongo: Actually I see things on a different perspective: the fact that it's so difficult to capture a screenshot makes the moment feel more important. I know that when I'm capturing PS2 pics and videos I have to spend a few more seconds trying to find the right light so that the image has decent quality, and also finding the right angle because if I tilt the camera even slightly it's going to look like sh*t - thanks to the 4:3 resolution of the PS2 on the TV. All these requisites give such importance to the moment that for a while it's like I'm taking pictures of Minanda Kerr instead of a freakin' highlight of a goal on a football game.

@miguelfcp , thanks for the information, very useful as always. Was wondering about some of the very strong stats of certain players in the Newcomers list and that explains it being re gen former real players.

You are right, it sure feels like a tough challenge in PES 6 on the Playstation 2 and I will stick with signing just the re gen defaults on that list, but getting better bit by bit is fun.

 

[slamsoze]

@miguelfcp , thanks for the information, very useful as always. Was wondering about some of the very strong stats of certain players in the Newcomers list and that explains it being re gen former real players.

You are right, it sure feels like a tough challenge in PES 6 on the Playstation 2 and I will stick with signing just the re gen defaults on that list, but getting better bit by bit is fun.

I remember some newcomers are KoNAMi fanfic generic players who are true wonderkids and have great potential. To be true i never signed them as they were out of my taste, most usual because they have wrong positions according to their stats and heights.But i always checked them through database or by a friend of mine that used to build a team around them.
Firsty two greek guys Delios a CB with 1,65 height and Ioannidis a DMF. After the FW guys from Japan Shimizu and Mizuno.I think they were pacey but only CF and SMF and short for my formation.I dont use SMFs.After i remember a German AMF Kaizer or Kruger,most possible Kaizer.Some others i remember Bos,Shaw ,Bustos,Chapi,Merino etc.
You can check them here.It is a pretty cool database pesneoseeker.It is a pes wikia that was pretty decent in retro years but has left unupdated for years after 2013.
http://pes.neoseeker.com/wiki/Master_League_Youths

 

[rockstrongo]

@miguelfcp good point about capturing stuff,you capture more important stuff,still would like to have an option with in game recording,without caption card/pc,that's what I'm missing from my Xbox one

Recorded the highlights Vs Barca last night on my phone,just to discover my gf coughing loudly in the background,plus 5 insane seagulls going apeshit outside my window

 

[fmicablues7]

With all these comments about it, i decided to have a go again with PES 2013. I did play a few games, but i was disappointed. PES 2012 feels much better IMO. In fact, PES 2013 feels like a dumbed down PES 2012, apart from the shooting. A few things i noticed :
-The CPU seldom tries long range efforts, and when it does, it is always low shots.
-The CPU over-directness, Barcelona CPU playing like a Mourinho's team. This is surely the most annoying thing in this game.
-Catch-up bug. It was annoying in PES 2011, it disappeared in PES 2012, but it is there again in PES 2013. This, combined with the lack of acceleration stat, make the pacey players useless.

I encourage those who liked PES 2013 to try PES 2012 and share their point of view. I will try others games on PES 2013 in the same time.

 

[rockstrongo]

With all these comments about it, i decided to have a go again with PES 2013. I did play a few games, but i was disappointed. PES 2012 feels much better IMO. In fact, PES 2013 feels like a dumbed down PES 2012, apart from the shooting. A few things i noticed :
-The CPU seldom tries long range efforts, and when it does, it is always low shots.
-The CPU over-directness, Barcelona CPU playing like a Mourinho's team. This is surely the most annoying thing in this game.
-Catch-up bug. It was annoying in PES 2011, it disappeared in PES 2012, but it is there again in PES 2013. This, combined with the lack of acceleration stat, make the pacey players useless.

I encourage those who liked PES 2013 to try PES 2012 and share their point of view. I will try others games on PES 2013 in the same time.

I agree,think in general Pes 12 is a much better game,shooting is very tough though.
I think for me,Pes 13 is a gateway to 12,even though I started with twelve a few weeks ago,I found it really good,but also extremely tough.
I'm going back to 12 eventually.

I've seen comments in other threads on 12 being one of the worst ever.
Really laughable

 

[Madmac79]

Honestly I completely disagree on catch up bug. I think the game is really physical with all those shoulders vs shoulders and defenders are very good in recovering and last instant tackling, but if I leave behind somebody with let's say Bale, he stays behind. I've done a lot of friendlies playing with fast players and I can say pace makes a world of difference at least in my experience.

Pes 2011 was on another whole level. It was impossible to defend the ball and you couldn't effectively leave anybody behind for more than a few meters before being irremediably recovered and deprived of the ball regardless of stats. But that's not what I'm seeing in 2013.

 

[Madmac79]

I agree,think in general Pes 12 is a much better game,shooting is very tough though.
I think for me,Pes 13 is a gateway to 12,even though I started with twelve a few weeks ago,I found it really good,but also extremely tough.
I'm going back to 12 eventually.

I've seen comments in other threads on 12 being one of the worst ever.
Really laughable

Yeah, I've read that too. Leave them be my friend. Sometimes it's just useless to argue.

 

[fmicablues7]

Honestly I completely disagree on catch up bug. I think the game is really physical with all those shoulders vs shoulders and defenders are very good in recovering and last instant tackling, but if I leave behind somebody with let's say Bale, he stays behind. I've done a lot of friendlies playing with fast players and I can say pace makes a world of difference at least in my experience.

Pes 2011 was on another whole level. It was impossible to defend the ball and you couldn't effectively leave anybody behind for more than a few meters before being irremediably recovered and deprived of the ball regardless of stats. But that's not what I'm seeing in 2013.

I might have been too harsh in my post about this point. Yes, PES 2011 was clearly worse than PES 2013 in that regard. But i really think speed is more useful (not to the point of being overpowered) on PES 2012. It's funny you talk about Bale, because i was playing against Mertesacker with him and i could barely outrun him on PES13. Look at M'Bappé run against Argentina, it's impossible in my experience to do it in PES 2013. Take in account, i only use the RT button (Xbox 360 controller) to run, maybe there is another command.

 

[rockstrongo]

Yeah, I've read that too. Leave them be my friend. Sometimes it's just useless to argue.

Its the best way
That's why discussing in here never ends up like it does in the 19 thread,people have respect for each others experiences

 

[rockstrongo]

Also,@fmicablues7 @Madmac79 one thing I've noticed, regardless of which Pes games you play, especially more modern ones,catch up bug is almost always worse on slower game speed,and on lower difficulty!

I had problems with catch up bug on 17 playing on -1.
But once I started playing 0 it disappeared!

Not really onboard with catch up bug on 13,haven't really experienced it.
But I agree that 12 is probably a more complex game, especially CPU defending is very hard to break down.
Really like both games though,mainly play 13 for it's licences.
Not to shabby having two great ones to chose from!

 

[Madmac79]

I might have been too harsh in my post about this point. Yes, PES 2011 was clearly worse than PES 2013 in that regard. But i really think speed is more useful (not to the point of being overpowered) on PES 2012. It's funny you talk about Bale, because i was playing against Mertesacker with him and i could barely outrun him on PES13. Look at M'Bappé run against Argentina, it's impossible in my experience to do it in PES 2013. Take in account, i only use the RT button (Xbox 360 controller) to run, maybe there is another command.

Wtih R1+R2 (dual shock) you could do the special sprint, as it was in Pes 2012 but I suspect you already know. Plus I rarely use it too.

I think too anyway, that generally it's definitely hard to completely outrun defenders. But personally my impression is that it's more an "environment" matter due to the things I said above (more physical battles, less space, better tackles by defenders that are more reactive etc.) than stats going off as it used to happen in 2011 or other more recent chapters. To carry on your example, with Bale it's still hard to dribble as if the defender X stays tight to my body I feel all his pressure, but once I'm over him I can feel I'm faster than defender X. Maybe to explain myself better, it's more a Pes 5 than a Pes 11 situation, to me .
And by the way, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't acceleration substituted in both Pes 12 and Pes 13 by explosive power? I can't see it either in 12.

Anyway you don't happen to play on pc do you? I'd love to find a decent patch for 2012 as I've found in 13 (even if a bit dated). I don't know if it was the same on Ps3 and 360, but on PC they had the horrendous idea to: 1) deprive the games from rain on game 2) putting in this indecent motion blur.
Luckily at least the motion blur can be patched away on both but I wanted to find some complete package for 2012.

 

[Madmac79]

Also,@fmicablues7 @Madmac79 one thing I've noticed, regardless of which Pes games you play, especially more modern ones,catch up bug is almost always worse on slower game speed,and on lower difficulty!

I had problems with catch up bug on 17 playing on -1.
But once I started playing 0 it disappeared!

Not really onboard with catch up bug on 13,haven't really experienced it.
But I agree that 12 is probably a more complex game, especially CPU defending is very hard to break down.
Really like both games though,mainly play 13 for it's licences.
Not to shabby having two great ones to chose from!

I completely agree on all man. Two great games for sure.

Completely spot on, to me, also on your comment about game speed: I've always played next gen games (can't genuinely remember if also 12 and 13 at the times, but could totally be) on -1 or even -2 to have a more realistic rhytm, but lately I'm starting to think I've always done it wrong. It seems like it subtly screw up things. Better to have a game slightly faster, but more coherent in the rest.

 

[rockstrongo]

I completely agree on all man. Two great games for sure.

Completely spot on, to me, also on your comment about game speed: I've always played next gen games (can't genuinely remember if also 12 and 13 at the times, but could totally be) on -1 or even -2 to have a more realistic rhytm, but lately I'm starting to think I've always done it wrong. It seems like it subtly screw up things. Better to have a game slightly faster, but more coherent in the rest.

Very true man
13 is great on 0 (for me,but also animation wise)
I play 12 on -1,cause it's a bit pacey though

 

[rockstrongo]

@fmicablues7
Found this one from one of my first games on Pes 12,a screamer from Villarreal (not me)
I think you see more of this in 12 than in 13,as you pointed out

 

[fmicablues7]

Nice one @rockstrongo. Yes, i miss these screamers from the CPU in PES 2013.
I personally play -1 speed on PES 2012. I never noticed the influence on catch-up bug, i didn't play a lot PES 2014-2018 though, so i don't know for these.

Wtih R1+R2 (dual shock) you could do the special sprint, as it was in Pes 2012 but I suspect you already know. Plus I rarely use it too.

I think too anyway, that generally it's definitely hard to completely outrun defenders. But personally my impression is that it's more an "environment" matter due to the things I said above (more physical battles, less space, better tackles by defenders that are more reactive etc.) than stats going off as it used to happen in 2011 or other more recent chapters. To carry on your example, with Bale it's still hard to dribble as if the defender X stays tight to my body I feel all his pressure, but once I'm over him I can feel I'm faster than defender X. Maybe to explain myself better, it's more a Pes 5 than a Pes 11 situation, to me .
And by the way, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't acceleration substituted in both Pes 12 and Pes 13 by explosive power? I can't see it either in 12.

Anyway you don't happen to play on pc do you? I'd love to find a decent patch for 2012 as I've found in 13 (even if a bit dated). I don't know if it was the same on Ps3 and 360, but on PC they had the horrendous idea to: 1) deprive the games from rain on game 2) putting in this indecent motion blur.
Luckily at least the motion blur can be patched away on both but I wanted to find some complete package for 2012.

I also seldom use this special "burst" command, because i'm so used to PS2 PES simplified commands. You're probably right about the environment matter, even though i feel like it is better portrayed in PES 2012.
Theoretically, explosive power is only agility (we can see that by comparing explosive power values in PES 2012 PS3/PC with agility values in PES 2012 PS2, which has old-gen stats system). However, this thread in pesstatsdatabase forum found that explosive power could be agility + acceleration : https://pesstatsdatabase.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26681 So, is this copy and paste of stats lazyness from Konami, or is explosive power only agility ? Hard to say.

I play on PC btw. I can't help you for patches, as i prefer to do my own editing on the default game. I didn't notice yet there was no rain in PES 2012/13. That's a shame.

 

[loco]

Anyone here into ISS?

 

[rockstrongo]

Anyone here into ISS?

PS2 days,played it to death,great game

 

[rockstrongo]

Two wins in a row!
Real Betis 3-0 Real Sociedad
Pretty much had this game from the start

Real Betis 2-0 Osasuna
Tough game,sealed the deal late with a howler crossbar and in by my SS/LMF Campbell.
Two clean sheets,nice,defending getting more natural.

One thing I like is that when playing a cup game against "nobody's" the stadium is 2/3 full.
Nice feature

And for you still playing 18,3 pens in 11 games.
10th place,good position!
Campbell's howler below

 

[Marlon Anthony]

Been playing a bit of PES 2010 recently. Had some fun moments and not so fun ones with this one. I was nostalgic when I first booted it up and visually it wasn't as bad as I remembered. One thing I noticed was the player faces remade for this game were phenomenal at the time and look great now. There's still some cartoony looking ones from '09 in there on the likes of Milner, but star players looked quality. I liked the lighting in some stadiums but PES on this generation always struggled with colours and lighting with everything looking a little dull and washed out at times.

It's the last one to run off the PS2 PES mechanics and I don't think it's as pleasurable to play as WE9LE now I've had a few games with it. The limited passing directions and dribbling gets frustrating when a simple play or option presents itself and a player runs it into a defender or passes it on rails to someone in the least dangerous area.

Still though, some nice ball physics with some weight and sound effects give the ball a nice thud feel when struck from range.

I want to attach/host some gifs and images but not sure what's the best hosting website to use and also what's the size limit here? I've tried uploading a gif but it just fails and it doesn't seem to tell me the max file size..

 

[Chris Davies]

I want to attach/host some gifs and images but not sure what's the best hosting website to use and also what's the size limit here? I've tried uploading a gif but it just fails and it doesn't seem to tell me the max file size..

I use Imgur for everything, best for quality and they don't delete your stuff. Plus you can copy/paste the direct link to the image and embed it, rather than having to link to a web page URL.

 

[Marlon Anthony]

I use Imgur for everything, best for quality and they don't delete your stuff. Plus you can copy/paste the direct link to the image and embed it, rather than having to link to a web page URL.

Thanks. Is there a size limit on Imgur? I tried just now and I'm wondering if my gif is too big..

Anyway you don't happen to play on pc do you? I'd love to find a decent patch for 2012 as I've found in 13 (even if a bit dated). I don't know if it was the same on Ps3 and 360, but on PC they had the horrendous idea to: 1) deprive the games from rain on game 2) putting in this indecent motion blur.
Luckily at least the motion blur can be patched away on both but I wanted to find some complete package for 2012.

First of all, Yeah the motion blur is terrible. never understood why they felt the need to force that on. I'll never forget the pre-release screen shots of '11 and everybody was speculating whether it was some "bullshot" nonsense or whether it was really a apart of the game. Poor Console users.

Secondly, as far as patches for older games go, check out https://www.pesnewupdate.com/

They include patches for last season and this season but most of them include the old PESEdit patches from the season the game was released as a base so I've just been downloading them. I prefer PESEdit's patches because they keep it as close to the vanilla game as possible and only change the bare minimum such as badges, kits and add a few unmade player faces that are consistent in quality to Konami's. Very clean patch and very faithful to the vanilla games art direction, love it.

Here's a link for one for PES 2012 https://www.pesnewupdate.com/2016/08/pes-2012-pes-next-season-patch.html

 

[miguelfcp]

@loco: I'm 99% sure I made a post here on the Corner about ISS on the PS2 - though after 50 pages I haven't got a clue of where it might be. I have both ISS and ISS3 for the console and from time to time I play a few matches on it; though it's clearly not a game that could rival PES at the time it was launched, if it had a bit more depth (I don't think it had club teams on it, also it lacks a proper career mode) it would definitely rival FIFA back then, as the gameplay is quite enjoyable though a bit too arcadey. I'm still waiting for any football game to give me such satisfaction as ISS3 does when I'm performing a long pass, I think I mentioned here how I actually quit a friendly match on the game, went to the training mode and spent a few minutes just spawning long balls from one side of the pitch to the other, just to watch that beautiful mechanics/animations/ball physics of the movement itself.

Also after watching the video you posted I came upon this one, showing a few tricks I didn't even know you could pull off on the game. So tonight after 15 years of having ISS3 in my collection I'll finally open up a whole new world of enjoyment on it when I get to try out those fancy tricks and dribbles for the first time ever. Thanks Retro-PES Corner!

 

[Madmac79]

Thanks. Is there a size limit on Imgur? I tried just now and I'm wondering if my gif is too big..



First of all, Yeah the motion blur is terrible. never understood why they felt the need to force that on. I'll never forget the pre-release screen shots of '11 and everybody was speculating whether it was some "bullshot" nonsense or whether it was really a apart of the game. Poor Console users.

Secondly, as far as patches for older games go, check out https://www.pesnewupdate.com/

They include patches for last season and this season but most of them include the old PESEdit patches from the season the game was released as a base so I've just been downloading them. I prefer PESEdit's patches because they keep it as close to the vanilla game as possible and only change the bare minimum such as badges, kits and add a few unmade player faces that are consistent in quality to Konami's. Very clean patch and very faithful to the vanilla games art direction, love it.

Here's a link for one for PES 2012 https://www.pesnewupdate.com/2016/08/pes-2012-pes-next-season-patch.html

Thanks man. Any other site is an offfline feast! I can't remember having all this troubles to find material on any other "recent" Pes. By the way I do agree with you, the basic PesEdit patch, which luckily is included in the link above as I can't find it anywhere else, is the best choice.. I think I'll stick to it too. The next season one is a bit messy with the kits and the rosters.

 

[loco]

@loco: I'm 99% sure I made a post here on the Corner about ISS on the PS2 - though after 50 pages I haven't got a clue of where it might be. I have both ISS and ISS3 for the console and from time to time I play a few matches on it; though it's clearly not a game that could rival PES at the time it was launched, if it had a bit more depth (I don't think it had club teams on it, also it lacks a proper career mode) it would definitely rival FIFA back then, as the gameplay is quite enjoyable though a bit too arcadey. I'm still waiting for any football game to give me such satisfaction as ISS3 does when I'm performing a long pass, I think I mentioned here how I actually quit a friendly match on the game, went to the training mode and spent a few minutes just spawning long balls from one side of the pitch to the other, just to watch that beautiful mechanics/animations/ball physics of the movement itself.

Also after watching the video you posted I came upon this one, showing a few tricks I didn't even know you could pull off on the game. So tonight after 15 years of having ISS3 in my collection I'll finally open up a whole new world of enjoyment on it when I get to try out those fancy tricks and dribbles for the first time ever. Thanks Retro-PES Corner!

Yes! I remember back in the day I used to be a huge WE/PES fan, but when these games came along there were many aspects about them that their sim counterparts just couldn't match. The sweet animations, physics and movements where simply the best any football game had seen at the time. Also, this series introduced the SS position for Konami games. The scenario mode was really enjoyable too.

 

[Madmac79]

Anyone here into ISS?

I loved with a good passion KCEO soccer games, even if they were more arcade than the regular saga. Unfortunately I haven't played much the Ps2 ones (might give it a shot sooner or later) but consumed all the N64 chapters. They had tons of very nice features and some fantastic variety.. I often dreamed back in the days about a Konami game that would pick the best characteristics of both. I agree with @miguelfcp , with some career and clubs it would have surely became more popular. The gameplay was 100 times better than any Fifa at the times.