The Retro-PES Corner

Okay so I have nothing serious today, just played three quick games now, really tough draw against Ruhr (Agali so stronk) saved thanks to Izmailov's cracking shot (see below) and then relatively easy wins over Weser (2-0) and Westfalen (4-0 damn they're bad in the back!).

Still 8 points ahead of Marmara. Lookin' good.

 
lazoli said:
@Madmac79 and @Orhainmalz will post it here when we stream.

The game’s recommended requirements are way too low for today’s standards so you don’t even need a good PC to play it. Would be nice to have more people:)
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Would it still work if the PC was a modern one? I normally use a mac but i do have an old pc laptop but it keeps freezing now. So im thinking of getting a new one maybe.
 
Been playing We9le (PC) despite having all the modern consoles and FIFA. My ML comprises of 75% of default ML players and remaining are odds and misfits off the player market. I have a guy that it 202cm tall called Matic and a 160cm AMF call Shimizu to complement with a possibly the shortest goalie off the market. You have to watch when they celebrate together after scoring a goal.
 
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First game played in our mini league that wildwind set up. A really tight affair between Nurnberg and Ath Bilbao. Nurnberg took an early lead before Bilbao equalised late on. Nurnberg almost won it with a free kick that hit the bar in the dying minutes.

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We created an online WE9LE league - Lesser League
We allowed to choose 1 team with OVR 72 or less, 15 min match

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I scored 2 quick goals and he get 1 back end of first half. Keep on holding up tight in midfield and nothing happen until extra time. His Vittek score a nice goal just outside pen at 90 min to make it 2:2. I push everything up and score at last sec. (Sorry Japan!)

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He score a great header from a fast counter attack and keep it to the end. I got 13 free kicks but can't score one. My best free kick taker only have 72 in FK........ That's the challenge to play with lesser team.
 
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Nurnberg took the lead after another very tight and tough first half. Ath Bilbao got generous in the second half and gave away about four souvenir balls, hitting them high into the stands as the shots got more and more desperate as time ticked away. In the end Nurnberg saw it out to take the points. In true fair play spirit Lazoli also threw the ball back after my player was injured. In true modern football, my players surrounded the ref trying to get him sent off (ok, they didn't really :) )
 
@mattmid It's all about fair play:BSCARF:

My last league game was against @wildwind, Nurnberg(lazoli) vs (wildwind)Osasuna. Both teams started the game looking for that valuable 3 points they desperately needed which would potentially mean winning the whole thing... 12th minute into the game, Osasuna conceded a free-kick in a dangerous position when Osasuna defender brought down the Swiss international Cantaluppi right at the edge of the box. It's always dangerous when he is behind the ball and that is why he scored a beauty from that freekick to make it 1-0...When everybody thought the first half was going to end with this score, Nurnberg big man Vittek took advantage of a quick counter-attack and scored another one for, "The Club", right before the half time whistle ~ 2-0
Second half, tactics change, and it immediately reflects to the football on the pitch. Nurnberg was trying to keep the score at 2-0 and so played defensively which cost them a goal at the 61th min by Delporte. Then another one at the 78th by Punal. Nurnberg changed tactics to find that winning goal 10 minutes left in the game. Kiessling even had a clear shot at the goal at the very last min but Osasuna goalkeeper wasn't going to let anything in. Osasuna had their chances too but with time running out both teams had to settle for a draw. 2-2

Great game @wildwind :BEER:

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Really great games today. All of them being extremely tight and looked like they could have gone either way. Looking forward to more of these tournaments:)
 
Now that we have a vast array of retro-pes gamers here, i'd like to ask a question : In your opinion, which PES portrays the best individuality and stats in gameplay ? The game where you feel you control Messi, but also the game you feel you're playing against Messi, when CPU-controlled. Don't take in account difficulty, animations, graphics, just the stats. I can't decide between PES 3, PES 5, PES 2008-2014 on PS2/PSP and PES 2010 PS3.
 
fmicablues7 said:
Now that we have a vast array of retro-pes gamers here, i'd like to ask a question : In your opinion, which PES portrays the best individuality and stats in gameplay ? The game where you feel you control Messi, but also the game you feel you're playing against Messi, when CPU-controlled. Don't take in account difficulty, animations, graphics, just the stats. I can't decide between PES 3, PES 5, PES 2008-2014 on PS2/PSP and PES 2010 PS3.
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PES 3 for me. Can't play any other football game after I got hooked on that.

Besides player individuality, I just love how that game adheres to tactical settings. Players actually, and noticeably, move to where you indicate them with attack arrows! However at the same time it's all much more natural, tactics does not override simple football logics, as in current PES games.
 
Tinker said:
PES 3 for me. Can't play any other football game after I got hooked on that.

Besides player individuality, I just love how that game adheres to tactical settings. Players actually, and noticeably, move to where you indicate them with attack arrows! However at the same time it's all much more natural, tactics does not override simple football logics, as in current PES games.
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You're absolutely true about tactics. The design might be simple compared to PS3 PES tactics, but it works flawlessly. I also really enjoy PES 3. I fear the day where it will be simply too easy for me. As yet, i struggle and i like that. Seeing how @Anjin seems to crush the CPU, i might be a bad player though. :LOL:
 
I'm not sure there's a definitive answer really. I guess you'd have to have the same option file in each one to really answer it accurately.

Then are the player's stats correct. And that's where everybody would have a different opinion on what stat number is right. Then let's say for example Messi would be the number 1 player in speed when dribbling with the ball at his feet, I think we can probably agree on that. So then where do you set him for Dribbling speed, does he dribble at the same speed he can run? Probably not but for arguments sake let's say he does, so he would have to be set at 99 for Dribbling speed and then everyone else would be somewhere below that down to a lumbering centre back.

I guess with top speed now being recorded that is a stat that perhaps could be used to rate players. Although it's a flat out speed so it could be argued a speed over a distance might find a different order but it would at least be a scientific based way of doing it rather than guess work. Using the gap from top to bottom you could work out increments to use the full 1-99 on the Speed rating. That would (certainly in retro one's) really show up individuality. So taking this page... http://www.espn.co.uk/football/blog...yers-man-citys-leroy-sane-breaks-speed-record

Obviously that's just one league so you would need all but using just the Premier League Sane would be 99 and whoever was slowest you could set at a low figure and see how long they take to cover half the pitch and then set that figure as the low stat and put everyone else in between in increments between the top and bottom recorded speed.

You could use passing accuracy for short passing too.

I seem to have wandered off a bit here so I'll stop!
 
mattmid said:
I'm not sure there's a definitive answer really. I guess you'd have to have the same option file in each one to really answer it accurately.

Then are the player's stats correct. And that's where everybody would have a different opinion on what stat number is right. Then let's say for example Messi would be the number 1 player in speed when dribbling with the ball at his feet, I think we can probably agree on that. So then where do you set him for Dribbling speed, does he dribble at the same speed he can run? Probably not but for arguments sake let's say he does, so he would have to be set at 99 for Dribbling speed and then everyone else would be somewhere below that down to a lumbering centre back.

I guess with top speed now being recorded that is a stat that perhaps could be used to rate players. Although it's a flat out speed so it could be argued a speed over a distance might find a different order but it would at least be a scientific based way of doing it rather than guess work. Using the gap from top to bottom you could work out increments to use the full 1-99 on the Speed rating. That would (certainly in retro one's) really show up individuality. So taking this page... http://www.espn.co.uk/football/blog...yers-man-citys-leroy-sane-breaks-speed-record

Obviously that's just one league so you would need all but using just the Premier League Sane would be 99 and whoever was slowest you could set at a low figure and see how long they take to cover half the pitch and then set that figure as the low stat and put everyone else in between in increments between the top and bottom recorded speed.

You could use passing accuracy for short passing too.

I seem to have wandered off a bit here so I'll stop!
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I know there will be no definitive answer. But it is always interesting hearing different opinions on that matter.

I wonder though why Konami never used the full range for the stats. For some stats, there are nearly no differences between 1 and 50, but a big difference between 50 and 60.
 
Yeah, maybe pes3 has the best default option file as well? As they increased the teams and players perhaps the accuracy of ratings went down. I've never done any option file editing in pes3 but lots in pes6 and I definitely notice differences between players, players you just know you're wasting your time with a through ball. Either way the stats in the retro pes's definitely allow you to 'capture' a player if you can get them rated correctly.

I'm getting into we9le now after having never ever played it and as well as the online stuff we are doing I had some Finnish teams stats ready to go into my pes6 norway file but instead I've put them into the we9le option file and I'm going to have a play with them. I'm intrigued to see how many fouls there'll be :)
 
fmicablues7 said:
Now that we have a vast array of retro-pes gamers here, i'd like to ask a question : In your opinion, which PES portrays the best individuality and stats in gameplay ? The game where you feel you control Messi, but also the game you feel you're playing against Messi, when CPU-controlled. Don't take in account difficulty, animations, graphics, just the stats. I can't decide between PES 3, PES 5, PES 2008-2014 on PS2/PSP and PES 2010 PS3.
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Great question.

Luckily for us, all the game of that generation had great individuality, even the worst ones. Obviously what changed from one to another was what kind of "environment" (inertia, physics etc.) they chose to gave to each single chapter.

To me, if we only talk about controlling your own players and feel them, Pes 5 is really superb in highlighting technical differences.. I'm noticing it all again in this days while playing with the defaults. Obviously, for how much I can love this chapter, it isn't unfortunately a contender for the CPU side.
I'd say Pes 2009, 10 and 11 (pc) all have great invididuality in both sense, but they are penalized by the structure they are built on (still find each of them super entertaining tho).

If I had to say two games that to me truly nailed it all around, I'd say Pes 3 and Pes 13 (must be something magic in the number 3?).

I think we already talked enough about Pes 3.. not only you can feel your players pad in hand, but each player of the cpu plays, or at least tries to play accordingly to his strength, both stats and special abilities. Surely the most balanced one of the old gen in this regard.

I'm also re-discovering Pes 13 (pc) in this days by playing friendlies here and there and I must say it's wonderful in that sense. You can feel physicality in shoulder vs shoulder contacts and headers, you can feel players with a good pace leaving behind the others, or shooting power in players which have it.. and I can say cpu is pretty good even if maybe a bit too direct.. but fantasy players create, fast players search the one v one (and find it, if you don't cover accordingly) and so on. But that's something I also remember from my Master League days with this game years and years ago, how playing against let's say Neymar was quite a different experience. Days ago I played a Classic Brazil vs Classic Argentina and a Genoa-Livorno back to back and boy.. you don't need slow motion replays and analysis to attest that stats do make enormous differences here.
 
@fmicablues7: Interesting question. One of the things that made my fall in love with PES on the PSP, particularly the 2009-2014 era, is the fact that there's so much player individuality on it. You could immediately spot who was the star player (or star players) of the CPU team, it was easy to spot their dominance on the pitch. I still have nightmares with a Besiktas AMF/SMF hybrid from a save I did a year ago, but at the same time I was always looking forward to face that turkish team just because of him. He wasn't particularly fast, but he was agile and his dribbling skills were amazing. I got to the point of using man-marking (which I never use) and I purposefully changed my usual starting eleven to include a player of mine who seldom played, but everytime I played Besiktas he'd be on the team to carry out a single mission: stop that little Besiktas' guy.

More recently, in my PES2008 PS2 save I still recall how regen Maldini was always absolutely dominant in the back...curiously he was playing for Besiktas too! But he never instilled in me that level of fear/excitment/anticipation that a few PSP CPU controlled players did.
 
Madmac79 said:
Great question.

Luckily for us, all the game of that generation had great individuality, even the worst ones. Obviously what changed from one to another was what kind of "environment" (inertia, physics etc.) they chose to gave to each single chapter.

To me, if we only talk about controlling your own players and feel them, Pes 5 is really superb in highlighting technical differences.. I'm noticing it all again in this days while playing with the defaults. Obviously, for how much I can love this chapter, it isn't unfortunately a contender for the CPU side.
I'd say Pes 2009, 10 and 11 (pc) all have great invididuality in both sense, but they are penalized by the structure they are built on (still find each of them super entertaining tho).

If I had to say two games that to me truly nailed it all around, I'd say Pes 3 and Pes 13 (must be something magic in the number 3?).

I think we already talked enough about Pes 3.. not only you can feel your players pad in hand, but each player of the cpu plays, or at least tries to play accordingly to his strength, both stats and special abilities. Surely the most balanced one of the old gen in this regard.

I'm also re-discovering Pes 13 (pc) in this days by playing friendlies here and there and I must say it's wonderful in that sense. You can feel physicality in shoulder vs shoulder contacts and headers, you can feel players with a good pace leaving behind the others, or shooting power in players which have it.. and I can say cpu is pretty good even if maybe a bit too direct.. but fantasy players create, fast players search the one v one (and find it, if you don't cover accordingly) and so on. But that's something I also remember from my Master League days with this game years and years ago, how playing against let's say Neymar was quite a different experience. Days ago I played a Classic Brazil vs Classic Argentina and a Genoa-Livorno back to back and boy.. you don't need slow motion replays and analysis to attest that stats do make enormous differences here.
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I really rate PES 2013 for many things, but the CPU was so annoyingly one-dimensional, always trying to dribble through the entire defence and never playing possession game. That's why i prefer PES 2012, which was similar but had more diversity in CPU's playstyle.
 
oh and don't forget 2013 wiped out our old friends in ML

though I haven't played it, so ugh, can't say stuff.

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aside from that, all retroPES honestly have different strategy and technique used by the player to play well which is why i get hooked on 1 installment for a while
 
fmicablues7 said:
I really rate PES 2013 for many things, but the CPU was so annoyingly one-dimensional, always trying to dribble through the entire defence and never playing possession game. That's why i prefer PES 2012, which was similar but had more diversity in CPU's playstyle.
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Mmmh.. maybe I have to play it a bit more, but I have a good memory of at least stars standing out pretty well in terms of behaviour compared to the rest of the players. Although CPU is indeed globally a bit too direct as I said above, yes. But I played so many seasons in Master League back at the times that my memories about variety in the matches being at least decent must had some truth :D.

It's strange what you said about Pes 2012, tho. I liked it too a the times but everytime I think about it, I remember it as a downgraded version of 2013. I can't remember CPU being that much better, maybe I'll try it again in future.
 
Madmac79 said:
Mmmh.. maybe I have to play it a bit more, but I have a good memory of at least stars standing out pretty well in terms of behaviour compared to the rest of the players. Although CPU is indeed globally a bit too direct as I said above, yes. But I played so many seasons in Master League back at the times that my memories about variety in the matches being at least decent must had some truth :D.

It's strange what you said about Pes 2012, tho. I liked it too a the times but everytime I think about it, I remember it as a downgraded version of 2013. I can't remember CPU being that much better, maybe I'll try it again in future.
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Playing both games right now, I'd say except for the great shooting in 13,Pes 12 is better in all other areas.(Pes 13 has better pace as well)
Much tougher CPU ai.
Never been beaten as much as I am right now on Pes 12,happy if I stay up.
A little gem of a game
 
@fmicablues7

I am just a terrible exploitator in PES games. I don't really resort to gamey shit, I just use what (who) I have to their fullest potential and exploit AI's weaknesses. Considering that all PS2 PES games are similar in a way and that I've played way too much PES 6 and 5 in the past, it was bound to happen.

Still it's only league results, I wonder what WEFA will be like? Top teams in my league, especially Ruhr and Rekordmeister are damn tough and it might be hard to win international trophies...


Once I'm back in the game later this evening I might try recording a full match if you guys wanna see it, since I've got game to do 1080p and all sweetfx thingies works and overall the game looks gorgeous. Just don't have any real editing tools to cut and render entire match into highlights.
 
rockstrongo said:
Playing both games right now, I'd say except for the great shooting in 13,Pes 12 is better in all other areas.(Pes 13 has better pace as well)
Much tougher CPU ai.
Never been beaten as much as I am right now on Pes 12,happy if I stay up.
A little gem of a game
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I remember it being really tough too in 2012, I just don't remember it being much more varied than 13.. but I'm just talking sensations, I haven't touched it since then so who knows. After all those were two conceptually very similar chapters, and our own whole perceptions regarding an edition or another often switch based on many factors.
 
Madmac79 said:
I remember it being really tough too in 2012, I just don't remember it being much more varied than 13.. but I'm just talking sensations, I haven't touched it since then so who knows. After all those were two conceptually very similar chapters, and our own whole perceptions regarding an edition or another often switch based on many factors.
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Yes they remind themselves of each other,strange shooting in Pes 12 and a bit more pace,but both being good games.
It's hard playing any modern games after playing 11-12-13 for me.
If you have it laying around give it a go
 
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