Manchester United Thread

@Vann: You'd have a point if LVG was getting results. He's not. We have less points now than ANY OTHER PREM SEASON. Fine, not all time, but that's 25 years. And of course 15 odd less goals. We've had 15 matches this season with no goals at halftime. Had numerous matches where Manchester United literally did not shoot the ball at the other goal more than 2 times in 90 minutes.

My issue with LVG isn't that he plays dull football, incessantly. It's that it doesn't work, and he's too old/egotistical/stubborn to do anything about it. Personally I don't buy into the success at the expense of entertainment being an actual thing in a league. You don't win a league by being dull every match, it's impossible. You have to score goals. And to do that you have to try and score goals.

LVG is the worst of both worlds. We're going to finish in a lower position than last year, with our lowest point total in 25 years, with our lowest goals scored in 25 years, with our fewest goal attempts in 25 years and he will have changed nothing to fix it.

If that's not enough to get you fired, might as well get him on tenure.

@PIPA: You're totally right. If Rooney had carried an injured player off the pitch he would have been sent off, the press would have redone their front pages and Mike Dean would have flown from wherever he was to send off Juan Mata. Speaking of people not being afraid, check the refereeing we have in the post-Fergie era. We get no marginal calls, and get loads of harsh ones. Refs are making up for lost time.

To repeat, Mark Noble physically picked up an injured player and hauled him off the pitch. Explain to me which part of the refereeing rules that is okay in? He didn't even get a speaking to.
 
Last edited:
You can get away with dire football if you're amassing a lot of points.

You can't really get away with it when you're struggling and going backwards tho, esp. not after spending close to 300m, and not at a club like Utd who were successful only a few years ago.

I quite like LVG tbh, I like his demeanour and the fact that he actually has tactics - meaning in the tougher games you can get results - but, as Beach says, he is clearly too stringent it their application which has led to the team struggling against the lesser/defensive teams.

He should get credit for his use of youngsters tho. Of course injuries have played a part but there's no way Mourinho would have done anything remotely like this. He'd have loaned in Falcao before even acknowledging Rashford's existence.
 
Last edited:
Seems you're pissed off, Vann...no need for that.

Norwich winning at Old Trafford is indeed in a way entertaining. Look how people react to Leicester...most football fans call it a fairy tale...and to be honest, ifi wasn't a Spurs fan i would also hope that Leicester win.

So Norwich winning is entertaining from the point of view of a neutral, but hardly for a Man Utd fan.

You also say that there are 15 worse teams than United. That is true, but the standard for United seemed to be that there were 19 worse teams than United not 15.

Maybe United should go for Wenger who considers 4th place a trophy, i don't think the average United fan would agree (and for the record, i agree with Wenger, but perhaps not for Arsenal, as a Spurs fan i would happily sign for a 4th spot every year).

LVG now gets lots of credit for the youngster he introduced in the first team. I'm not sure if he dserves that credit. If Rashford is this good, shouldn't he have had a chance much more earlier than now?
 
gerd said:
Seems you're pissed off, Vann...no need for that.
Click to expand...

Not pissed off with you old friend. My anger is more towards the short sighted and ignorant comments from fellow United supporters, sincere apologies if I came across that way. But your previous comments/remarks seem so unbalanced and bias I am surprised at you Gerd? I do have issues with all the comments in your recent post, if I may continue?

gerd said:
Norwich winning at Old Trafford is indeed in a way entertaining. Look how people react to Leicester...most football fans call it a fairy tale...and to be honest, if i wasn't a Spurs fan i would also hope that Leicester win.

So Norwich winning is entertaining from the point of view of a neutral, but hardly for a Man Utd fan.
Click to expand...

This is a circular argument. Football is nearly always entertaining to someone, even a draw can be rewarding. I don't fully understand your point. It is an understatement to say true entertainment in the way (I think) you're describing has been short in supply for us this season (and the last two) I don't see how that isn't the case the same for every club at some time. In your opinion, its seems, United are beyond that. 30+ years following the club I can accept it a few poor seasons, I did under SAF, why wouldnt I for LVG. He has to build a team almost from scratch, only DDG and Smalling from SAF reign could be playing for us in the future.

And when I highlight we are not the worst team in the league by a long shot and you reply with this....

gerd said:
You also say that there are 15 worse teams than United. That is true, but the standard for United seemed to be that there were 19 worse teams than United not 15.
Click to expand...

You've well and truly moved the goal posts now Gerd mate. We are not good enough to be champions, I don't like that but it doesn't make it any less true. What has past achievements go to do with now? Not much from where I'm standing. We're 5th with 4 four points separating us from the 3rd and 4th spot, that is a fact, why ignore that?

gerd said:
Maybe United should go for Wenger who considers 4th place a trophy, i don't think the average United fan would agree (and for the record, i agree with Wenger, but perhaps not for Arsenal, as a Spurs fan i would happily sign for a 4th spot every year).
Click to expand...

Apart from this comment being borderline snide as a point of discussion, it is worthless. The only supporters that will be happy at the end of each season are the supporters of teams with silverware to show or who avoid the drop.

Look at man city, every year I used to hear, "winning isn't everything" or "we don't care about trophies" All that soon changes once the silverware starts to adorn the walls, anyone who says different hasn't seen their team win anything, ever.

gerd said:
LVG now gets lots of credit for the youngster he introduced in the first team. I'm not sure if he dserves that credit. If Rashford is this good, shouldn't he have had a chance much more earlier than now?
Click to expand...

This is kinda funny do you not see your bias here? When he brings in these young players, it should've been sooner.......

Wait, is it because he's Dutch?
 
Last edited:
beachryan said:
@Vann: You'd have a point if LVG was getting results. He's not. We have less points now than ANY OTHER PREM SEASON. Fine, not all time, but that's 25 years. And of course 15 odd less goals. We've had 15 matches this season with no goals at halftime. Had numerous matches where Manchester United literally did not shoot the ball at the other goal more than 2 times in 90 minutes.

I cannot defend aspects of the teams play, but this is a brand new team, some only playing together for less than one season


My issue with LVG isn't that he plays dull football, incessantly. It's that it doesn't work, and he's too old/egotistical/stubborn to do anything about it. Personally I don't buy into the success at the expense of entertainment being an actual thing in a league. You don't win a league by being dull every match, it's impossible. You have to score goals. And to do that you have to try and score goals.

LVG is the worst of both worlds. We're going to finish in a lower position than last year, with our lowest point total in 25 years, with our lowest goals scored in 25 years, with our fewest goal attempts in 25 years and he will have changed nothing to fix it.

If that's not enough to get you fired, might as well get him on tenure.
Click to expand...

You can win a league with 1 goal a game and clean sheets, the gooners have a song about it.

We are are not playing in any other season we are playing in this one, the one with City and Spurs as 1st and 2nd, the one with reigning champions barely in the top 10. It seems your inability to grasp the present is somehow LVGs fault. We are 5th and in a semi-final. The rest of the league must be absolute dog shit if we're in that position.

You have made your mind up, you refuse to look at any positives, enjoy your year off.
 
Last edited:
Hi Vann. Thinks for your mild repliy. I hope i didn't offend you.
You made some good points in your last post.

It's true that most Belgians consider the Dutch as our big rivale, but i don't. I rather like the Dutch and certainly Dutch football. Since i've read the book about Enke, i don't like LVG and Frank De Boer.

But still i consider him a good manager. Only bespied the fantastic work with Ajax, AZ and Bayern, he has had some spectaculair fails (for instance the first time he was national coach in Holland). It seems there is no middle grond with him. He's either very good or very bad. Imo he's done a bad job at United, considering all the money he spend. But who am i?
 
Wow, just can't agree with much of that Vann. Fair enough you're obviously entitled to your opinion as a long time fan as well. If you genuinely see where LVG is taking this United team, how his philosophy is moving us in a positive direction...then good on you. Wish I did!

Personally I just think the game has passed him by, and that his tactics don't work in the premier league, or possibly in today's elite-fitness times. And it's not getting better, it's getting worse.

There are mitigating circumstances - we might well 'win' the injury league for the 3rd season in a row (someone should seriously look into this, it's ridiculous). We put a lot of eggs in the Schweinsteiger basket and he'll basically have only played 3 months of the season. We didn't buy a defender presumably to let Phil Jones have his finally healthy season...and I'm not sure he's played more than 60 minutes all year. And as I've posted on here before, I don't believe any team in the modern game at the top level has churned through an entire squad in such a short space of time. Basically, we have 20/25 'new' players in our squad, in just 3 years.

But that doesn't excuse terrible substitutions, tactics that, after the first WHU semi-final had the players being quoted as saying : We had no idea where we were supposed to be playing, and a cautious first approach that has made actually watching us worse than at any point in my lifetime.

He seems to get a lot of credit for Rashford, but he's only there because Will Keane came on and tore his groin with his first shot, and Rooney is injured, and we shipped off James Wilson for some good-knows-why reason given LVG himself said Wilson was the reason we didn't buy a striker in the summer. It's luck.
 
De Gea was really phenomenal as he has been all season...kept us in while we really didn't deserve to be in...

and Martial is great. Can't wait to see where this kid can become in the future.
 
You lots know who else is a having a phenomenon season RM's Navas. Think De Gea has a long stay @mutd . I'm sure Navas is much cheaper and earning less then De Gea.
 
By the way, i've heard on two seperate podcasts that Fellaini was very good against Everton.

In one podcast (The Times' football podcast) they were saying that LVG often plays Fellaini in a position or role where he is useless. It seemed the combination with Rooney worked very well.

Fellaini is a very peculiar who is not 'kind on the eye', but he can be very effective if you play him according to his strenghts...perhaps not a player United fans like to see, but nevertheless very usefull (just like in our national team, he should never be in the starting 11, but he scores loads of very important goals, he is our top scorer).

About that same match, this was a very good demonstration of the very poor first touch that Lukaku has. I still think he is overrated...he's has been linked with big clubs like Chelsea and United...IMO he is not a player for a big club...Everton is the maximum imo.
 
Re: Fellaini - the issue is that he's at his most dangerous when given kind of a 'free' roll in the attacking third: go create mischief. And he's a nightmare to defend in that scenario. But, it means you have to sacrifice the rest of the team by getting someone else to his other responsibilities, and it forces a certain style.

If a team were built around him, he'd probably post some excellent numbers in the league, but that's just not what United should be doing. I hope he goes on to have a great career...somewhere else.

Re: Lukaku - his United audition didn't go particularly well did it? My thought is that he's overpriced now for what he is, but I'd love to have him for what Everton purchased him for. I think he has more goals than anyone bar Aguero in the past 3 seasons or something like that. Not too shabby. He also gives the option of going long, playing holdup and is still really young.

United need a CF next season, and if not Lukaku I don't really know who they go for. It needs to be someone immediately ready for the first XI in the premier league, that's a big risk for most imported players.
 
Harry Kane? Although obviously i hope he stays with Spurs.

About Lukaku: he's hopeless in our national team...i prefer Origi, Batschuayi and (now) even Benteke (although even Benteke is not good he is very bad, there rarely is middle ground with him).
 
I kind of want Kane to stay at Spurs too - he's from there, has a great relationship with the club and is in a team doing well - no real reason to leave.

Guess there's a bit of a dearth of great strikers at the moment. Who knows what big Ed has in mind, might finally get his crush Cavani!
 
If Mourinho does join I could see something like
DDG/Navas/Butland
Azpilicueta Smalling Someone? Shaw
Schneiderlin Sanches
James* Rooney Martial
Ibrahimovic*

*or Griezmann​


Conte might fancy playing 3 at the back (often if not always) so Azpilicueta might be open to getting back together with Mourinho, who prefers solid fullbacks
 
gerd said:
About Lukaku: he's hopeless in our national team...i prefer Origi, Batschuayi and (now) even Benteke (although even Benteke is not good he is very bad, there rarely is middle ground with him).
Click to expand...
I've been impressed with Batshuayi whenever I've seen him play.

Definitely has the best football brain out of the four.
 
Thank God top 4 is gone now. P45 for Van Gaal?

Drawing 1-1 chasing crucial points...ends match with 1 striker and players passing backwards. Soooo typical. No urgency or drive from the players or the manager.
 
Wouldn't say top 4 is gone. A win for us now might do it but looking at the team it's probably unlikely.
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36188860

Manchester United manager Louis van Gaal says expectations at Old Trafford are "too high".

How bout this Louis, I'd like United to expect to finish above West Ham and Leicester, given our spend, players and profile. Is that too high for you?

I swear...that man must be a closet City plant/Liverpool fan.
 
The fact we can still claim the FA Cup and a spot in the CL this year is beyond bizarre. It truly has been a God awful season for the big clubs . at least one of the two shouldn't be too much to ask for poor little Louis I hope.
 
2 wins and it's a successful season. Madness. Can't believe how much LVG's 'philsophy' of football has destroyed my love of watching the sport. 2 shots in 90 minutes against Norwich City, in a crucial match. It's just so mind-numbingly dull.

Worst thing is, if we do manage to win both (and I don't believe we will) then somehow our least successful 2 months in modern history are just wiped away. And it's nothing to do with how 'good' LVG is, it's to do solely with how incredibly weak City have been.
 
Last edited:
beachryan said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/36188860

Manchester United manager Louis van Gaal says expectations at Old Trafford are "too high".

How bout this Louis, I'd like United to expect to finish above West Ham and Leicester, given our spend, players and profile. Is that too high for you?

I swear...that man must be a closet City plant/Liverpool fan.
Click to expand...

If we try and look at what he said from a different light, it might be good. Meaning, what he has now isn't enough and wants more/better talent. That I would be very happy with.
 
The Ferguson Manchester United would have won the EPL this season with a huuuge gap...Perhaps even with the same players...
 
gerd said:
The Ferguson Manchester United would have won the EPL this season with a huuuge gap...Perhaps even with the same players...
Click to expand...

Damn right. Wouldn't even be close.

Managers are supposed to get more out of the players they have...LVG does the opposite.

I guess proof will be when he leaves, but I don't believe a lot of these players are as bad as his system makes them look. Most notably Schneiderlein, Herrera, Memphis and Darmian.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom