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DagsJT
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
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Liverpool Thread
- Thread starter Misfit
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jackarmy
SWIM AWAY!!!!!!
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
The FA have made an example of Suárez in the light of leniency showed by FIFA/UEFA on similar issues. I don't condone racism and it certainly has no place in football, but if it is the case that they (the FA) have acted upon Evra's statement only with no witnesses to the alleged remark, then they should be ashamed of themselves. Also, didn't Evra have previous for playing the race card whenever it suited? For him to go telling all on French television was a sure-fire sign of his case being as watertight as a sinking ship.
I agree with Liverpool making an appeal, it's an absurd punishment, and also begs the question, if this is what Suárez gets, what will John Terry get, once the FA conclude their own investigations? I seriously doubt he'd get a £40k fine and an 8 match ban. Because he's English, and part of their national team.
The FA have made an example of Suárez in the light of leniency showed by FIFA/UEFA on similar issues. I don't condone racism and it certainly has no place in football, but if it is the case that they (the FA) have acted upon Evra's statement only with no witnesses to the alleged remark, then they should be ashamed of themselves. Also, didn't Evra have previous for playing the race card whenever it suited? For him to go telling all on French television was a sure-fire sign of his case being as watertight as a sinking ship.
I agree with Liverpool making an appeal, it's an absurd punishment, and also begs the question, if this is what Suárez gets, what will John Terry get, once the FA conclude their own investigations? I seriously doubt he'd get a £40k fine and an 8 match ban. Because he's English, and part of their national team.
kevano22
TDWFYU
- 2 August 2003
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Two words to bring the club to the next level...
Two words to bring the club to the next level...
D
DagsJT
Guest
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
danremedios Daniel Remedios
Reaction in Uruguay is of general bemusement. Also a clear suggestion that Patrice Evra used derogatory terms against Luis Suarez.
danremedios Daniel Remedios
Uruguay media also believe that the FA are using the Luis Suarez case to set an example. A chance to prove their stance to FIFA.
Tim Vickery on Five Live: "Bemusement in Uruguay. The word he used is not pejorative. FA is sending a message to Fifa with this."
danremedios Daniel Remedios
Reaction in Uruguay is of general bemusement. Also a clear suggestion that Patrice Evra used derogatory terms against Luis Suarez.
danremedios Daniel Remedios
Uruguay media also believe that the FA are using the Luis Suarez case to set an example. A chance to prove their stance to FIFA.
Tim Vickery on Five Live: "Bemusement in Uruguay. The word he used is not pejorative. FA is sending a message to Fifa with this."
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jackarmy
SWIM AWAY!!!!!!
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
A mate of mine from work (Liverpool fan - and he is seething right now!) reckons the FA made an example of Suárez as a way to have a go at Blatter for his handshake remark, seeing as the FA and FIFA don't see eye-to-eye. Sounds far fetched but I see his point in a way.
Given that Liverpool will need a striker in the transfer window I have a fear that they will stump up more cash to pip us to buy Rory Donnelly from Cliftonville (we've already had a bid accepted). Been in the news today that Kenny has been in talks with him.
I have a feeling Liverpool could take this all the way to CAS.
A mate of mine from work (Liverpool fan - and he is seething right now!) reckons the FA made an example of Suárez as a way to have a go at Blatter for his handshake remark, seeing as the FA and FIFA don't see eye-to-eye. Sounds far fetched but I see his point in a way.
Given that Liverpool will need a striker in the transfer window I have a fear that they will stump up more cash to pip us to buy Rory Donnelly from Cliftonville (we've already had a bid accepted). Been in the news today that Kenny has been in talks with him.
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PIPA23
retired :)
- 21 June 2007
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
not sure if Rory Donnelly is a player we need just RIGHT now, even if he´s a great prospect..
I think we can give chance to some full matches to Carroll first and think of a back up striker in January..
not sure if Rory Donnelly is a player we need just RIGHT now, even if he´s a great prospect..
I think we can give chance to some full matches to Carroll first and think of a back up striker in January..
PIPA23
retired :)
- 21 June 2007
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Blackburn should be worried. With a name like that they'll get an 80-match ban if Evra complains...
Blackburn should be worried. With a name like that they'll get an 80-match ban if Evra complains...
PIPA23
retired :)
- 21 June 2007
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
...English newspapers will have a nice christmas
poor guy..
...English newspapers will have a nice christmas
poor guy..
TikTikTikTikTik
*****
- 7 August 2004
- Team
- Liverpool
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Tbh, my first thought when the decision was delayed was that they didn't have any clear evidence and were deciding whether they needed to set a political example instead of looking at the actual facts.
The way the club and Kenny having been having a go at the FA and their inconsistancy it wouldn't surprise me if they did use this to take it to a next level and attack the FA in courts of law. Or the threat will be enough during the appeal for the FA to back down. Either way it might be quite a drama set to unfold.
@ Pipa,
Lets hope they sue every paper which runs with racist as headline.
Tbh, my first thought when the decision was delayed was that they didn't have any clear evidence and were deciding whether they needed to set a political example instead of looking at the actual facts.
The way the club and Kenny having been having a go at the FA and their inconsistancy it wouldn't surprise me if they did use this to take it to a next level and attack the FA in courts of law. Or the threat will be enough during the appeal for the FA to back down. Either way it might be quite a drama set to unfold.
@ Pipa,
Lets hope they sue every paper which runs with racist as headline.
StuartCulli
College Dropout
- 25 July 2006
- Team
- Newcastle United
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Looooooooooooooool
Looooooooooooooool
PIPA23
retired :)
- 21 June 2007
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
“@kennethdalglish: Very disappointed with today's verdict. This is the time when @luis16suarez needs our full support. Let's not let him walk alone. KD”
“@kennethdalglish: Very disappointed with today's verdict. This is the time when @luis16suarez needs our full support. Let's not let him walk alone. KD”
Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I take it you are joking?
And Suarez ban is a joke considering there is no concrete proof of what happened. Absolute farce. If proved 100% guilty then fair enough but how can he be just from going by one persons word against another?
Two words to bring the club to the next level...
I take it you are joking?
And Suarez ban is a joke considering there is no concrete proof of what happened. Absolute farce. If proved 100% guilty then fair enough but how can he be just from going by one persons word against another?
bebo
Looking for a Manager
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
LINK!!! for Suarez admitting to use racist remarks to Evra ?? Evra admitted to use remarks to insult Suarez ,but Suarez said he didnt hear it! Evra went on French TV to state his claim.
LINK!!! for Suarez admitting to use racist remarks to Evra ?? Evra admitted to use remarks to insult Suarez ,but Suarez said he didnt hear it! Evra went on French TV to state his claim.
jackarmy
SWIM AWAY!!!!!!
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
However if Evra admitted using a pejorative towards Suárez then shouldn't that have been cited?
In a court of law it would be seen as one person's word against another, and with no recorded proof or witness statement the case wouldn't have a leg to stand on. For the FA to act as judge, jury and executioner based on this alone with one side of a story would smack of gross victimisation. I think this case is going to go on for a while.
However if Evra admitted using a pejorative towards Suárez then shouldn't that have been cited?
In a court of law it would be seen as one person's word against another, and with no recorded proof or witness statement the case wouldn't have a leg to stand on. For the FA to act as judge, jury and executioner based on this alone with one side of a story would smack of gross victimisation. I think this case is going to go on for a while.
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- Thread starter
- #29,446
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
sickening blow that.whilst there is hardly any clear evidence but rather based on "he said,she said",will be interesting to see captain of england john terry's verdict which evidence is pretty much caught on tv.
sickening blow that.whilst there is hardly any clear evidence but rather based on "he said,she said",will be interesting to see captain of england john terry's verdict which evidence is pretty much caught on tv.
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Alright, my final 2c on this whole deal:
In a way I agree I think Suarez has been a bit harshly done by here. Not in terms of his ban - that is absolutely in line with what should be the case here (and has precedence in FA rulings) - but in the way this was played out in public. I personally don't like the way Evra went to the French press. If he had just gone to the ref afterwards fine - that's the appropriate channel - but to have gone to the press is never the right thing to do. And of course they ran with it - they're the scum on the scum at the bottom of the barrel.
What should have happened then is that Liverpool should have dealt with this quietly, and United should have cooperated. Liverpool should have contacted Evra or his representatives, Suarez should have apologised for any miscommunciations, everyone should have remembered it's just a game and the two should have maybe done a charity event. There, done and dusted.
Instead, and I guess this is somewhat my opinion, King Kenny saw this as chance to measure his sizeable bollocks against Fergie's (despite Ferguson pretty much withdrawing from the whole thing). At some point Liverpool FC decided the best defence in this case was offence. And that's when I lost any sympathy for them or their player.
The way that Liverpool FC - as a historic, proud organisation - has played this out has been shameful. First, make up false accusations against Evra crying wolf, and publish them as often as possible in as many places as possible. Then have their manager continually talking about the case, including saying that Evra should be held responsible if no evidence is available. And now this official club statement is probably the least professional, most embarrassing thing I've ever seen a professional organisation produce as a defence.
I'm actually ashamed to be a football fan, to see how ridiculous this whole thing has gotten.
And now Suarez will be hounded out of England because he's foreign and the media love to hound out a talented foreigner. And I wouldn't be surprised if Evra or his family is threatened by some deranged Liverpool fan (or perhaps their webmaster). All because Liverpool decided to 'go to war' over this.
It's just sad, is all it is. Suarez made a mistake. Whatever contextualising, cultural-defined excuse you want to give, he said something he shouldn't have. Everyone f*cks up, and most do so in professional environments. You apologise and you move on.
Alright, my final 2c on this whole deal:
In a way I agree I think Suarez has been a bit harshly done by here. Not in terms of his ban - that is absolutely in line with what should be the case here (and has precedence in FA rulings) - but in the way this was played out in public. I personally don't like the way Evra went to the French press. If he had just gone to the ref afterwards fine - that's the appropriate channel - but to have gone to the press is never the right thing to do. And of course they ran with it - they're the scum on the scum at the bottom of the barrel.
What should have happened then is that Liverpool should have dealt with this quietly, and United should have cooperated. Liverpool should have contacted Evra or his representatives, Suarez should have apologised for any miscommunciations, everyone should have remembered it's just a game and the two should have maybe done a charity event. There, done and dusted.
Instead, and I guess this is somewhat my opinion, King Kenny saw this as chance to measure his sizeable bollocks against Fergie's (despite Ferguson pretty much withdrawing from the whole thing). At some point Liverpool FC decided the best defence in this case was offence. And that's when I lost any sympathy for them or their player.
The way that Liverpool FC - as a historic, proud organisation - has played this out has been shameful. First, make up false accusations against Evra crying wolf, and publish them as often as possible in as many places as possible. Then have their manager continually talking about the case, including saying that Evra should be held responsible if no evidence is available. And now this official club statement is probably the least professional, most embarrassing thing I've ever seen a professional organisation produce as a defence.
I'm actually ashamed to be a football fan, to see how ridiculous this whole thing has gotten.
And now Suarez will be hounded out of England because he's foreign and the media love to hound out a talented foreigner. And I wouldn't be surprised if Evra or his family is threatened by some deranged Liverpool fan (or perhaps their webmaster). All because Liverpool decided to 'go to war' over this.
It's just sad, is all it is. Suarez made a mistake. Whatever contextualising, cultural-defined excuse you want to give, he said something he shouldn't have. Everyone f*cks up, and most do so in professional environments. You apologise and you move on.
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gerd
Retired Footballer
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I honestly think the sentence is harsh. But not necessarily a bad thing for Liverpool and Suarez himself. I completely agree with tiktiktik's first reaction. This could be a blessing in disguise.
I think that statement on Liverpool's side is a much bigger mistake. I'm becoming persuaded that Suarez did not meant this as racism...it's about cultural differences...apparently this has no negative connotation in Uruguay...
We will never know if Evra feels offended (in that case Suarez should get a punishment) or that it were merely opportunistic crocodile tears...personally i tend to think it was the latter... Frustration of a player who has a horrible season and simply is a shadow of his former self.
Racism should be punished, but i have my doubts in this instance.
I honestly think the sentence is harsh. But not necessarily a bad thing for Liverpool and Suarez himself. I completely agree with tiktiktik's first reaction. This could be a blessing in disguise.
I think that statement on Liverpool's side is a much bigger mistake. I'm becoming persuaded that Suarez did not meant this as racism...it's about cultural differences...apparently this has no negative connotation in Uruguay...
We will never know if Evra feels offended (in that case Suarez should get a punishment) or that it were merely opportunistic crocodile tears...personally i tend to think it was the latter... Frustration of a player who has a horrible season and simply is a shadow of his former self.
Racism should be punished, but i have my doubts in this instance.
TikTikTikTikTik
*****
- 7 August 2004
- Team
- Liverpool
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Agree with most of what Ryan posted, apart from the Liverpool/Kenny going public. Remember Suarez was pretty much judged and sentenced the moment Evra went public with it and the club felt that they had to defend him. It's not the way it should be done, same goes for Evra, both are in the wrong. But with the media being what it is saying nothing is like saying he is guilty (which is sad). Agree with attacking Evra though, that's a new low imo.
It's all a bit sad and pathetic on multiple levels, there shouldn't be racial insults on the pitch, there shouldn't be a media witchhunt/bias created, there shouldn't be political issue's clouding the judgement of a potentially career damaging sentence of a player. And likely, it will be a one off warning till it happens again in a few years, which is even worse. Just give everyone lenghty bans who have been found guilty.
Agree with most of what Ryan posted, apart from the Liverpool/Kenny going public. Remember Suarez was pretty much judged and sentenced the moment Evra went public with it and the club felt that they had to defend him. It's not the way it should be done, same goes for Evra, both are in the wrong. But with the media being what it is saying nothing is like saying he is guilty (which is sad). Agree with attacking Evra though, that's a new low imo.
It's all a bit sad and pathetic on multiple levels, there shouldn't be racial insults on the pitch, there shouldn't be a media witchhunt/bias created, there shouldn't be political issue's clouding the judgement of a potentially career damaging sentence of a player. And likely, it will be a one off warning till it happens again in a few years, which is even worse. Just give everyone lenghty bans who have been found guilty.
TikTikTikTikTik
*****
- 7 August 2004
- Team
- Liverpool
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Moving on somewhat,
Atleast Carroll with get a good run in the team and we will find out whether he can do a job, as the team will now have to play to his strengths as there is no need to comprimise between a system better suited to Suarez and one suited to Carroll. And Suarez gets his annual winter rest which should help with the cup/league run-in.
Moving on somewhat,
Atleast Carroll with get a good run in the team and we will find out whether he can do a job, as the team will now have to play to his strengths as there is no need to comprimise between a system better suited to Suarez and one suited to Carroll. And Suarez gets his annual winter rest which should help with the cup/league run-in.
D
DagsJT
Guest
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
The ban doesn't take effect until after any appeal that Suarez makes. Liverpool could drag this on for a long time, particularly January if they're trying to sign a striker on loan as cover.
The ban doesn't take effect until after any appeal that Suarez makes. Liverpool could drag this on for a long time, particularly January if they're trying to sign a striker on loan as cover.
jonnyluvrod
Championship
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I can't believe it!!!
Aston Villa fans are accusing Suarez of abusing Heskey now...
Apparently he called him a striker...
I can't believe it!!!
Aston Villa fans are accusing Suarez of abusing Heskey now...
Apparently he called him a striker...
D
DagsJT
Guest
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
It seems Suarez called Evra negrito, which has the same meaning as the word "mate". I've seen Dani Pacheco called Thiago, the Barca player, plenty of times over Twitter. Naughty Dani.
It seems Suarez called Evra negrito, which has the same meaning as the word "mate". I've seen Dani Pacheco called Thiago, the Barca player, plenty of times over Twitter. Naughty Dani.
jonnyluvrod
Championship
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Cultural differences will never be understood by our dumb F.A...
Negro - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Negrito - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Cultural differences will never be understood by our dumb F.A...
Negro - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Negrito - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
D
DagsJT
Guest
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Suarez was only asking for one of these:
Suarez was only asking for one of these:
TikTikTikTikTik
*****
- 7 August 2004
- Team
- Liverpool
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I don't think you can use a word without it's context as a defense. I can call my mate a lazy n@#$$ and he'll laugh, if I call some random person on the street one he'll will probably punch me (and rightly so).
The grey area is the actual evidence and the precedent they have set. Had Suarez not have admitted that he said anything would what have happend then? Will the FA ban Terry for more games as it seems ( I haven't seen it myself) that that is a far more offensive and obvious case?
I don't think you can use a word without it's context as a defense. I can call my mate a lazy n@#$$ and he'll laugh, if I call some random person on the street one he'll will probably punch me (and rightly so).
The grey area is the actual evidence and the precedent they have set. Had Suarez not have admitted that he said anything would what have happend then? Will the FA ban Terry for more games as it seems ( I haven't seen it myself) that that is a far more offensive and obvious case?
gerd
Retired Footballer
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I partly agree tik. But Suarez comes from a completely different culture where it seems negrito is neutral...and it happens sometimes among friends too...yesterday i ended a mail to a friend with 'hou je goed onnezelaar'...which wasn't meant to be offensive.
The problem is that Suarez behaves constantly like an asshole and i tend to think (like i already said) that Evra exagerated... but to be honest, there is some poëtic justice in this all since Suarez always exagerates and simulates. This could actually be a good thing for both Liverpool (a new forward and/or playing time for Carroll and an assessment of his possibilities).
I partly agree tik. But Suarez comes from a completely different culture where it seems negrito is neutral...and it happens sometimes among friends too...yesterday i ended a mail to a friend with 'hou je goed onnezelaar'...which wasn't meant to be offensive.
The problem is that Suarez behaves constantly like an asshole and i tend to think (like i already said) that Evra exagerated... but to be honest, there is some poëtic justice in this all since Suarez always exagerates and simulates. This could actually be a good thing for both Liverpool (a new forward and/or playing time for Carroll and an assessment of his possibilities).
bebo
Looking for a Manager
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
negrito in spanish here is sweetie, honey or love. I call my wife negra as for Dear! which most hispanic use that word EVERYDAY!
I assume it was a sly gesture of hey! little dark kid as to say your just a little thing. For English media to take it to a racial slur is SAD ! Suarez will probably leave the country and let this be a warning to every Hispanic in the UK . LEAVE DODGE!
negrito in spanish here is sweetie, honey or love. I call my wife negra as for Dear! which most hispanic use that word EVERYDAY!
I assume it was a sly gesture of hey! little dark kid as to say your just a little thing. For English media to take it to a racial slur is SAD ! Suarez will probably leave the country and let this be a warning to every Hispanic in the UK . LEAVE DODGE!
elaleramone
Uruguay nomá!
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
I'm from Uruguay and i can tell you that "negro" is not an insult. If i'm playing football and there's a black player that i don't know his name, i call him negro, and he doesn't starts crying or gets angry. A person who is blond we call him blond, a red hair is a red hair, and a black is a black. I dont know where is the discrimination there.
It is said that Evra said "SUDACA" to Suarez, that YES is DISCRIMINATION, because that is the word that some european people uses to call southamericans inmigrants, in a derogatory way. But of course, Suarez is South American and Evra french, is really easy for de FA to make a decision
I'm from Uruguay and i can tell you that "negro" is not an insult. If i'm playing football and there's a black player that i don't know his name, i call him negro, and he doesn't starts crying or gets angry. A person who is blond we call him blond, a red hair is a red hair, and a black is a black. I dont know where is the discrimination there.
It is said that Evra said "SUDACA" to Suarez, that YES is DISCRIMINATION, because that is the word that some european people uses to call southamericans inmigrants, in a derogatory way. But of course, Suarez is South American and Evra french, is really easy for de FA to make a decision
D
DagsJT
Guest
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)
Thanks Bebo and Elaleramone, interesting to know.
Thanks Bebo and Elaleramone, interesting to know.