Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

According to some guy in RAWK he met Alberto and Insua today and asked him about his future. He told him that he wants to stay and love the fans, but it looks as he is going.

BxCPF.jpg


Say bye bye to our only truly creative midfielder.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

Or maybe the single reason to compare him to Hernandez is that they are both young and from Mexico. It's not like the press needs any more...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

Supposedly Mexican football fans now call their next great talents the "next Chicharitos" regardless of where they play.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

yeh, it's just like when a young striker comes on the scene here, he's called the "next Danny Cadermarteri".
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

UJSupanova said:
nope, any Sunderland fan will tell you his best position is right midfield.
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But during the second half of last season he played centrally,
couple of games that stood out for me were Chelsea away and west ham
at home. Henderson kinda reminds me of Schweinsteiger(?) he too started
out as a winger despite lacking pace, but look at the type of player
he turned out to be. Could also look at Gerrard with his one season
playing wide.

Playing wide will probably do him well now as our midfield is congested but
in a couple of years he will play more central. Thought the problem with yesterday we lacked an explosive player with pace and trickery to come
off the bench and create havoc.

Ditto Aquilani and Insua there are much worse players at the club who i'd rather see shifted out.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

Liverbird said:
Does Dalglish know that football is played outside England? Or am I missing some magical advantage of being british?
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how dare ya!dont you know he won the world c...i meant premiership with british players many moons ago???dont you know that you'll never win anything with foreign players??dont you know that football is only played in england?mata?aqualani?zapata?meireles?forget them,give a henderson,adam,downing,carroll anytime.Barca are stupid to be paying 30mill for cesc.unlike us paying a smart 35,20 for carroll,downing.KING KENNY KNOWS!dont believe me?ask pipa,HE KNOWS....

PS:time for my pills.....
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

This post sums it up, some people really need a dose of reality.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=279747.0

I already know the responses to this thread -

So are we not allowed an opinion anymore?
Are we meant to blindly follow the manager?
Why can't we say a player had a bad game?
Is that not allowed anymore?

So with that said, I'd just like to say that we currently, as a football club, have some of the most fickle, want it all now, spoilt (despite the fact we havn't won the title for two decades), demanding whopper fans in the country, and frankly, a lot of people following this club now sicken me. Not just get on my nerves, but genuinely sicken me.

The after match thread yesterday was a disgrace. And I don't mean the above, people just having an opinion. I mean the knee-jerk, demanding, slagging off of players, writing off of players, questioning the manager (to the point of wondering what a previous manager would have done with the money we've spent), and basically running down their own team after the first game of the season which didn't even end in defeat.

I know the fans who will take exception to this post already in here. I know exactly who will pipe up and tell me to shut the fuck up. Possibly one has been banned already, and another will certainly pop up. Because I know the kind of support we have and they would be two of the prime examples.

You didn't even have to be a betting man to know that if the first game of the season didn't end in a win, then the whoppers would be out in force, and the after match thread would be full of posts writing players off, crying about new signings being awful and generally being doom and gloom. Henderson is a waste of money. Carroll, despite having a good game I thought, is a waste of money, Adam is a overweight midfielder not as good as Alonso. etc etc. And don't get me started on the Aquilani love. But why? Why do people write off players after ONE game?

Andy Carroll for me, had a good game. Yes, he faded second half, but so did everyone else. And yet Suarez after the first 20 minutes, had arguably a worse game than Carroll and gets off pretty free from any criticism. Which is a good thing, because we know how good he is, but a player can have an off day too. So why should he get stick? Yet Carroll gets it in the neck, and primarily because in the back of the mind of all the demanding fans who destroy his every touch, he cost £35m and should be scoring hat-tricks every game.

Henderson, on his full home debut, had a quiet game against his old club, and he's suddenly a waste of money again. Why? He's a young lad, why can he not be given time to settle?

I saw someone say Downing was, is and always will be average. And this is because he went quiet in the second half. Had he played like he did in the first half in the second half, would that even have been levelled at him? Or are fans now lying in wait with their pre-conceived opinions on a player, and as soon as they get chance, wheeling them out and crucifying them for no other reason than to say 'I was right'? And yet that despite him having a fairly effective debut.

And the crowning comment from yesterday was that 'the jury is still out on Enrique'. Despite him having a very solid debut, after one day in Liverpool and being thrust into the team. 'Jury is still out' is the most ludicrous statement I think I've seen in RAWK in a long, long time for someone making their debut after one day at the club.

And it goes on. With each draw, it's the end of the world. With each game a player doesn't play to the ludicrous standards our fanbase (certainly in here, maybe not at the game) now have, they get written off.

They aren't supported anymore, they are judged.

Fickle fans lying in wait to destroy their every touch, rather than say 'unlucky lad' and get behind them to spur them on if they aren't having a particularly good game. Every misplaced pass now means a player is abysmal. Someone's favourite will get away with a misplaced pass (Suarez most of yesterday) and yet someone they deem 'average' (Downing, Adam) will get hammered if they aren't laser like in their precision. It's fucking pathetic.

At the moment, after that after match thread yesterday, I don't think I'll be posting much in the main forum. It's dominated by whoppers. Fans who don't seem to know what support is. But then they'll get annoyed that they are even being questioned.

It's not about having an opinion on a player, manager or game. It's about the knee-jerking black or white responses. If a player misses a chance, he's now a waste of money. If he misplaces a pass, he's a waste of money. Rather than just having a bad game, or he's still a good player, just off form.

Maybe fans have moved on and I havn't moved on with them, but if the way to support your team is to now be utterly despondent after a draw, crucify players on their debut, pick holes in their play and generally write them off after ONE match, and even question the manager to the point of comparing him to an ex-manager (it happened yesterday 'What would Rafa have done yesterday?') then I'm glad I havn't moved on with our fans.

I know who'll get in a strop with this post, and I know who'll cry about 'I'm entitled to an opinion' but they'll miss the point. I don't give a shit if someone doesn't rate someone, or a player, or thinks someone had a bad game when I think they played well, but the reactions in the after game thread yesterday wasn't supporters for me. It was demanding, spoilt morons. People only too ready to start moaning and slagging off, pre-armed with pathetic bile towards players they've decided they don't like after one match.

I don't even know why I'm writing this after one match to be honest. It could be knee-jerk in itself, but just remember where this club was 12 months ago and be glad you're even watching it in the premier league and talking about title challenges. The fact we havn't won it for 20 years surely precludes this spoilt attitude our support now has? Money spent or not.

Feel free to say 'I have every right to an opinion', but you'd be missing the point. The team had a game of two halves yesterday, one they won, one they didn't. We had 4 debutants. We didn't lose. They don't deserve some of the knee-jerking shit flung in their direction by the 'I want us to fight for the title!!!' demanding support we now have. If Chelsea (they currently are), Arsenal or even Man Utd draw, are they also shit?

Get a grip and get behind the team.
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This "Sky Sports" generation of fans are a joke. A midfield and forward line consisting of ONE SINGLE PLAYER who was here a year ago, Suarez and Carroll hardly played any matches together due to injury and still working on their partnership, Suarez clearly knackered from the season and then the Copa America, a left-back who joined the club the day before the match and a right back who's shown a lot of promise but is still young. What exactly do you expect?

I really don't understand some people. It's like they honestly believe that Football Manager is a perfect replication of real life. This thread has become like a childrens playground at lunchtime with the "opinions" being spouted. I'd hate to have some of these "fans" around when Shankly was the manager, we wouldn't have won a thing because he'd have been sacked by these "fans" by then.

I think I'll be visiting this thread a lot less this season if this is the reaction after one game, not even a defeat, with the circumstances already mentioned. I could get better thoughts on the match from a nursery.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

Misfit said:
SMH.gif
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what´s this supose to mean? :CONFUSE:

Do we realy need to criticise everyone and everything..? Henderson just played first ever game for us, against his boyhood club.. obviusly he was nervous but i don´t think he was bad at all... just lower the expectations, he´s no Messi and he´s very young.. decent player for the future and will prove his price..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
This post sums it up, some people really need a dose of reality.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=279747.0

...
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The article makes a point, but it's a point (or points) that could have been made last season.

He's saying give the new signing a chance (e.g. Downing, Henderson) he could have said that this time last year about Jovanovic, Danny Wilson.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

People didn't write off Wilson or Jovanovic, especially Wilson who most fans realise has a lot of potential for us.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
This post sums it up, some people really need a dose of reality.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=279747.0



This "Sky Sports" generation of fans are a joke. A midfield and forward line consisting of ONE SINGLE PLAYER who was here a year ago, Suarez and Carroll hardly played any matches together due to injury and still working on their partnership, Suarez clearly knackered from the season and then the Copa America, a left-back who joined the club the day before the match and a right back who's shown a lot of promise but is still young. What exactly do you expect?

I really don't understand some people. It's like they honestly believe that Football Manager is a perfect replication of real life. This thread has become like a childrens playground at lunchtime with the "opinions" being spouted. I'd hate to have some of these "fans" around when Shankly was the manager, we wouldn't have won a thing because he'd have been sacked by these "fans" by then.

I think I'll be visiting this thread a lot less this season if this is the reaction after one game, not even a defeat, with the circumstances already mentioned. I could get better thoughts on the match from a nursery.
Click to expand...

Great find Dags & also a good post, this sums up my feelings exactly. If people are moaning now, then how did they keep the razor away from their wrists when H&G were around.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
This post sums it up, some people really need a dose of reality.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=279747.0



This "Sky Sports" generation of fans are a joke. A midfield and forward line consisting of ONE SINGLE PLAYER who was here a year ago, Suarez and Carroll hardly played any matches together due to injury and still working on their partnership, Suarez clearly knackered from the season and then the Copa America, a left-back who joined the club the day before the match and a right back who's shown a lot of promise but is still young. What exactly do you expect?

I really don't understand some people. It's like they honestly believe that Football Manager is a perfect replication of real life. This thread has become like a childrens playground at lunchtime with the "opinions" being spouted. I'd hate to have some of these "fans" around when Shankly was the manager, we wouldn't have won a thing because he'd have been sacked by these "fans" by then.

I think I'll be visiting this thread a lot less this season if this is the reaction after one game, not even a defeat, with the circumstances already mentioned. I could get better thoughts on the match from a nursery.
Click to expand...

Spot on dags, why do you think i spend a lot less time on here nowadays?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

I think I saw earlier that he had the best pass completion for Liverpool on Saturday?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
People didn't write off Wilson or Jovanovic, especially Wilson who most fans realise has a lot of potential for us.
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Some quotes from the same place you got that article from:

Danny Wilson:
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=276421.0

"hopefully Bolton take him when Cahill gets sold."

"He was not fantastic for us in his senior appearances and more often than not watching the reserves I thought Wisdom was the better player."

"TBH I think he's a lightweight - he might do OK up in Scotland but I think the Prem is too much for him."

"Completely agree, been a bit of a waste for him this past year."

"been really underwhelmed when i've seen wilson play this season, maybe it was him being played out of position, maybe it was his lack of experience, but i didn't see any particular qualities in him that stood out like i did when i saw first play in the 1st team. wilson seemed lacking in physical strength, with average pace, and i thought his passing was off the mark whenever he was pressured into a forward pass."
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

again another player criticised without any reason..

he barely played, and if, he played as full back, wich he is not..

he´s 19, CL and National proven player.

...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

cfdh_edmundo said:
Some quotes from the same place you got that article from:

Danny Wilson:
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=276421.0

"hopefully Bolton take him when Cahill gets sold."

"He was not fantastic for us in his senior appearances and more often than not watching the reserves I thought Wisdom was the better player."

"TBH I think he's a lightweight - he might do OK up in Scotland but I think the Prem is too much for him."

"Completely agree, been a bit of a waste for him this past year."

"been really underwhelmed when i've seen wilson play this season, maybe it was him being played out of position, maybe it was his lack of experience, but i didn't see any particular qualities in him that stood out like i did when i saw first play in the 1st team. wilson seemed lacking in physical strength, with average pace, and i thought his passing was off the mark whenever he was pressured into a forward pass."
Click to expand...

You do know what the word "potential" means, right?

And yes, let's cherry pick from a forum to find some quotes like that. Do you want me to do the same to show people showing support for him?

Pointless post.

And doesn't that again highlight my previous point? That some people are idiots who critisize without giving players a chance? As Pipa said, he's 19. People expect players to be the next world beater at 19 and if they're not, they need to be sold.

Was Zidane a world beater at 19/20/21? I'm pretty sure I saw that he didn't really get on the map until his Juventus days. And he turned out alright.

Same with Thierry Henry. Deemed to be wasted talent at Juventus, people thought he was a risk when he joined Arsenal. Again, turned out to be a decent player.

But no. These days, if a player isn't good enough to get into their teams best ever 11, they're useless. Even after one game, players are being judged. Ridiculous. How many world class players had debuts that weren't world class? I'm not saying any of our players are world class or will be world class, but I am saying that if those world class players had been judged like our fantastic fans, they probably wouldn't have gone on to become the players they did.

Nothing like giving players a chance eh? I find it completely stunning that we're even having this debate, whether it's right to judge players on their debut or not. Unbelievable really. In a similar situation, Utd fans are calling De Gea all kinds for his two mistakes. The lad has unbelievable potential but some are calling him a waste of money already?!
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

lets leave this discussion aside for a second and tell me whether the rumours which claim that Liverpool has shown interest on Paddy McCourt are true (I for one would not like to see him on Anfield for some reason) and also heard that Damien Comolli has landed in Spain for a potential move over the Uruguayan International Diego Godin or some other people say its gonna be a shocking move for Higuain who is struggling to find a place on RM's starting 11. Have your say!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

besarti said:
lets leave this discussion aside for a second and tell me whether the rumours which claim that Liverpool has shown interest on Paddy McCourt are true (I for one would not like to see him on Anfield for some reason) and also heard that Damien Comolli has landed in Spain for a potential move over the Uruguayan International Diego Godin or some other people say its gonna be a shocking move for Higuain who is struggling to find a place on RM's starting 11. Have your say!
Click to expand...

Saw something on RAWK earlier about McCourt but not anywhere else, same with Comolli.

We've been linked with Godin for a bit now, I think he's more likely to be a target than Higuain though.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

nothing official but would make sence only if we get rid of Joe Cole imo..

we need a winger who could sit on bench..and if McCourt is good, he would be good for the squad as another wing option.. but currently we have already very big squad that needs to be sorted imo..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
This post sums it up, some people really need a dose of reality.

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=279747.0



This "Sky Sports" generation of fans are a joke...
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Complete assholes imo. If they are just going to slag people off, fuck off and support another club! The great club that is Liverpool do not need "fans" like them.
Imagine if The Pool went on to win something meaningful this year. What will the pricks be saying then?! Double headed tossers. The lot of them.

I thought the debutants played pretty decently. Room for improvement but no way can I say they were poor. I can see quality and potential in them. Slating Henderson is just a joke. People on here and elsewhere who are doing it are cocks. First game FFS. He didn't do anything outstanding but was neat and tidy. Was probably told to just keep calm and keep the ball moving. I thought he did that.
Go support Chelsea or someone else if all you are going to do is moan about players after 90 (or less) minutes of football FFS!

I despair. They might end up being absolutely shite but for now, give it a rest and get behind them.

And I bet all these people who slate all the players can hardly kick a ball themselves!! Fans? Like fuck they are!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

The problem is these fans get taken as a sample of our fans in general, as seen by the post a few pages back about Danny Wilson.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

nah, i still belive we have reasonable fans.. i don´t visit sky sports website at all..

just look at our pre season tour, this away fans were amazing and other teams can only dream about having such fans..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

DagsJT said:
You do know what the word "potential" means, right?

And yes, let's cherry pick from a forum to find some quotes like that. Do you want me to do the same to show people showing support for him?

Pointless post.

And doesn't that again highlight my previous point? That some people are idiots who critisize without giving players a chance? As Pipa said, he's 19. People expect players to be the next world beater at 19 and if they're not, they need to be sold.

Was Zidane a world beater at 19/20/21? I'm pretty sure I saw that he didn't really get on the map until his Juventus days. And he turned out alright.

Same with Thierry Henry. Deemed to be wasted talent at Juventus, people thought he was a risk when he joined Arsenal. Again, turned out to be a decent player.

But no. These days, if a player isn't good enough to get into their teams best ever 11, they're useless. Even after one game, players are being judged. Ridiculous. How many world class players had debuts that weren't world class? I'm not saying any of our players are world class or will be world class, but I am saying that if those world class players had been judged like our fantastic fans, they probably wouldn't have gone on to become the players they did.

Nothing like giving players a chance eh? I find it completely stunning that we're even having this debate, whether it's right to judge players on their debut or not. Unbelievable really. In a similar situation, Utd fans are calling De Gea all kinds for his two mistakes. The lad has unbelievable potential but some are calling him a waste of money already?!
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The point of the post was to contradict you're statement that "People didn't write off Wilson", re-read it maybe you will understand it now.

My argument was it's all very well saying "fans are too harsh on the club", it's true that players should be given time to settle at a club before they are judged. Calling on fans to rally round the club and give it 100% support is very noble.

But my point was WHERE WAS THIS SENTIMENT LAST YEAR? Sorry for the caps, but time and again you've failed to grasp this point.

Finally saying you'll scurry away and abandon this thread due to negative attitudes posted by other Liverpool fans is like wanting some sort of zero-criticism regiem that wouldnt have been out of place in the DDR. (You do know there is an ignore button by the way?) No one wants to see fans continually slating people at the club (although I notice you didn't have a major problem with it last year when your fans were slating the new signings). But fans will always post their worries after underwhelming performances (and 1-1 at home to Sunderland is underwhelming for a team with CL or Europa League ambitions). The other thing about that article you posted is the line about, "And don't get me started on the Aquilani love." So now fans aren't allowed to get excited about a player in the squad with great technique, who played brilliantly for his country against the World Champions ? Would Spurs fans tell each other not to get excited about Kranjcar playing well for Croatia, if Chamack scored a hattrick for Morocco would Arsenal fans tell each other not to get excited?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I Just Can't Get Enough!!)

The sentiment last year? Paul Konchesky was never good enough for Liverpool, that point remains today. Joe Cole had his chances, I was a fan of his but he's been awful for us. Poulsen should've been good, again had a dire season and looked WAY out of place in the team. Meireles has suited us very well. There's the sentiment from last year.

Critisicm is fine, but at least back it up with common sense. Having a go at a player for not putting on the best 45/90 mins of his career on his first competetive game for a club is ridiculous and if you think that's fine then you're entitled to your opinion as well.

And the line about Aquilani, now it's you that's missed the point. The point of that article is to get behind our new players as well as old. People constantly saying "X is rubbish, if Aquilani played then all would be right in the world!" (sounds familiar somehow...) is not showing support for the players at all. How would you feel if you move to a club and you've got a section of fans not giving you a chance whatsoever and constantly calling out for you to be replaced? Not exactly going to help you play to the best of your ability is it?

See the Arsenal thread and Bobby's posts. He's said enough times that people need to get off the players' backs and give them encouragement instead of abuse. And that is SPOT ON. When you've got people labelling you as having nothing to your game apart from free kicks and that you're a disgrace before you've even kicked a ball for the club, are you going to be full of confidence and fired up?

You want to keep going back to last years signings though. And people were prepared to give them chances, apart from Paul Konchesky who many doubted because he's been in the game long enough for people to know he's not the class that Liverpool should be signing. But you still want the players to do well because they still play for your club.

Players deserve a chance unless they already have a reputation for playing to a certain level, in which case you know they wont work. So what sentiment are you getting at exactly?
 
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