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Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread

I have a question guys. Do you think that Carragher should keep playing ? He has been pathetic since the start of the season and he is involved in every goal they scored us.
Plus, what do you think we should do in the transfer market, buy a defender or a player to cover Torres when he is injured ?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Carragher is definitely past it. I don't think he would start if everyone was fit though.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Rafa has to take a lot of the blame. But there's not any other manager available who is as good as him, and I doubt those who are, would want to come to our club.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

spaletti's better, he might come who knows.

id stay with rafa though, he has made some mistakes in the transfer market and the teams obviously not playing very well but hes a class manager.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Rafa is tactically one of the best managers around. He might not be consistant with his performances, or able to handle pressure or even mind games, but he's able to humble even the strongest teams on the pitch with his tactics. Instead of replacing him, the smart thing would be to get a new number two to work alongside him. Someone who excels in the areas Rafa is bad in.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I agree with RuneEdge. Someone who excels in the areas Rafa is not so good in. With mind games, I would have to go for Kenny Dalglish as Rafa's behind-the-scenes man. Fergie never got the better of him in that area.

A lot of the unrest seems to be caused by backroom anxieties - particularly as we let two Yanks buy our "franchise" (their words) borrowing money against the club - and therefore Rafa has had to work tiny miracles to get certain players in. Remember how long it took to replace the dross Houllier left and consider that any new manager would no doubt, want to create his own team, then to sack Rafa would be the wrong option. Anyway, Liverpool are not, for the most part, a sacking club or likely to push the panic button due to a four game losing streak, despite what the media might want.

In other news, Fergie says Rooney might not make Sunday. Take it he's a cert to play then.:D
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

spaletti's better, he might come who knows.

id stay with rafa though, he has made some mistakes in the transfer market and the teams obviously not playing very well but hes a class manager.
No way Spalleti is better than Rafa. His methods injured a lot of romans players, he didnt care about his players (Aquilani for example).
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Remember how long it took to replace the dross Houllier left and consider that any new manager would no doubt, want to create his own team, then to sack Rafa would be the wrong option.


I think rafa's done the old jedi mind trick on you lot,

cos errm I think the 2005 Champs League team had alot of Houlliers "dross"...

2005 FFS!! (we only had 15 titles then)

so this tactical genius has had 4 years to "create his own team"...

lucas and spearing please stand up!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Out of Benitez, Ferguson and Wenger, who was the quickest to 200 premiership wins? Errr Senior Benitez, thats who.

4 years isnt a long time.

Your also forgetting we got to ANOTHER CL final with Benitez's TEAM. People always forget that.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Out of Benitez, Ferguson and Wenger, who was the quickest to 200 premiership wins? Errr Senior Benitez, thats who.

4 years isnt a long time.

Your also forgetting we got to ANOTHER CL final with Benitez's TEAM. People always forget that.

Do you mean 100 wins?

He'd have to win 50 times in one season for four seasons to do 200...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

FFS, Rafa has to take the blame, like any other manager. But he's a world class manager, and the alternative arn't ones you can say, would do so much better than Rafa.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

FFS, Rafa has to take the blame, like any other manager. But he's a world class manager, and the alternative arn't ones you can say, would do so much better than Rafa.

World class? well thats subjective so i'll leave that one

and whether anyone else would do better remains to be seen...

but I doubt many would get that much time after making so many blatant mistakes...
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

Keep Rafa At Pool

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Re: Liverpool Thread

Yeah lets not start all this again.

Rafa's problems seem to be man-management (getting the best out of players, keeping everyone happy etc), transfers and he hasn't always done so well with the media. Obviously there are exceptions to that (Torres) but in general this is where he has struggled. You guys have got more professional players on your books than anyone else in the country, yet hardly any of them are good enough to play in the team. That's gotta say something to you!!

What Jermain Pennant said in that interview about Benitez neutering players I actually agree with. He does sound a bit bitter about his time at Liverpool but then again, I can understand why. For a good example of this, look at Ryan Babel. He was meant to be one of the hottest prospects in Europe and has shown glimpses of that for you, and regularly plays well for Holland, but when he puts on a Liverpool shirt, more often than not he looks average at best.

Maybe Rafa has a problem with sort of traditional wingers with flair, I mean I can't think of one who has played at 'Pool in his time and done well?

Babel, no. Riera, no. Gonzalez, no. Pennant, no. Kewell, no. Leto, no. El Zhar, no. Zenden, no.

Then there's the various other younger lads who have either come and gone or are still not looking any closer to getting in the first team. The only one who's done well is Benayoun and he isn't really a winger. The fact that when Torres is out, Rafa would still rather leave Kuyt on the wing than put him in his natural forward position is strange to me.

Tactically he seems to like his players very disciplined (with the exception of Gerrard now, and possibly Johnson) and maybe this ideology he holds, combined with the not so great man management is what is causing the problem. I know some managers dont like being too friendly with their players and there is nothing wrong with that if it works, but I seriously think Rafa has some issues here. If what Torres put in his book about when he announced he was having a baby is true then that's really bad (and why would he lie?).

That said, it's obvious he's a very capable manager and like you say there aren't that many available who could do better, and it would mean starting over and a serious clear out.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Have to agree with the man-management aspect. You never see the passion for Rafa like the players had for Mourinho, and have for Fergie aswell. Ronaldo's comments seem to confirm that.

And it's probably the biggest problem, it's all business/work with Rafa. It goes for any type of job imo, if you have a boss who doesn't inspire you you're unlikely to get that extra effort from the staff.

And the creative players comment is valid aswell, it's only the very best, or experienced ones (Gerrard, Torres, Beni,......) that seem to be able to do the job and excell. All the younger, less experienced players seem to suffocate under all the instructions and duties.

But this crisis is in a large part down to the defense being utterly crap this season, and that's not something Rafa can be held responsible for imo. Atleast not to extent everyone is making out. After all he's created/managed one of the best defenses in europe for the past 5 seasons with little change to the players. However Carra being very poor with both Skrtel, Agger and Aurelio out injured and a more attacking RB has been the main cause. Ofcourse the lack of ability to keep possesion hasn't helped either.

But there hasn't been a big change to the team in general, it's the combination of poor form and injuries and an obvious lack of cover for Gerrard and Torres. But they missed quite a lot of last season aswell so that shouldnt be the main problem.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

El Zhar? Leto? They've started what, 3 games in their Liverpool career?

Fuck me, talk to Vicente, who said Rafa made him the best winger in Europe. Babel's as much of a success that Nani is. Kewell was perpetually injured, so how can you blame him? Riera's a solid player, and that's what you get (normally) at 7M. And Pennant? FFS, he's the thickest footballer around. Rafa tried so hard with him, but he refused to listen. Had the talent, but too much of an ego. Kinda like Quaresma. And Zenden? Really? He was bought in to bring experience to the squad as much as anything else. Nobody really expected him to set the world on fire. Gonzalez is the only one you can say, and really, he's not setting La Liga alight is he? And he was sold immediately.

And Yossi is as much a winger as Arshavin or Messi are. And at 5M, he's done as well as Arshavin has in that time. And who cares where Kuyt is playing, as long as he is scoring goals, and providing the work rate. And systems with traditional wingers are almost obsolete anyways. Rafa doesn't want wingers, he wants clever player who can play anywhere. Hence the inquiries about Silva.

And of all those 60 players registered, more than half are youth team players. Who cares about them? Our first team squad is just as big, if not smaller than other teams.

And for idea that he likes his players discipline, I suggest watch us playing end of last season. We should as much fluidity as any team out there.

And I'd might as well add, that for all of Rafa's tenure here, only Chelsea and United have the won the leagues, and are still, two of the best teams in Europe (a position Liverpool might also command under Rafa). That's the most successful manager in club football, and the richest team in the league.
 
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