Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread

Yeah, I think we let the moment of selling Gerrard go. That was two seasons ago when Real Madrid were offering around 30M. If I dont remember incorrectly, that was what Benitez wanted to do before he was sacked. Selling Gerrard and Torres and dont renewing Carrager ´s contract.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Sky Sports suggesting Newcastle have made an offer to loan Carroll back for the season with an option to buy. Can't see the point myself. Same as Aquilani in the past, either keep him or sell him.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I also can´t see us loan him, either he stay or he will be sold, depends on the American tour imho..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

£35m for an 18 month loan deal :LOL: Cheers. We'll take him back now, thank-you very much.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

From the BBC...
Apparently Liverpool have rejected the Newcastle approach
since it was too low

......typical low-balling by Ashley/Llambias
....they first sell him
to us for a ridiculous price
...and now probably want him on the cheap..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

it´s fair to give this player another year, becouse as i know our transfers, he start´s banging goals for Newcastle....

Drogba was unknown in his age, i bet he will still develop to a quality player, but if Rodgers don´t want him, he will go for sure...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

mathewsss said:
From the BBC...
Apparently Liverpool have rejected the Newcastle approach
since it was too low

......typical low-balling by Ashley/Llambias
....they first sell him
to us for a ridiculous price
...and now probably want him on the cheap..
Click to expand...

This has been bugging me for ages. How come you're sentences never go across the whole screen, you end the line manually after X amount of words?
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

LIVERPOOL FC have rejected an approach by Newcastle United to take record signing Andy Carroll back on loan.

At this stage the Reds are only considering offers for the permanent transfer of the £35m man and so the bid from the North East was given short shrift.

Contrary to widespread reports, the St James’ Park side had shown no intent to make the deal permanent at the end of the season-long loan, with Liverpool only receiving an approach to take the 23-year-old England forward until the end of the campaign.

The ECHO understands Newcastle’s bid was not particularly enticing anyway with Alan Pardew’s men not ready to pay all of the player’s wages over the course of the proposed deal.

Liverpool were not commenting on the story last night but by rejecting the bid they have made it clear that loan moves for Carroll are unlikely to be entertained.

As it stands, the 6’3” targetman remains a Liverpool player and still plans to join the squad in Boston next week for the second leg of the Reds’ North American tour.

Carroll joined Liverpool from the St James’ Park side for a club record £35m in January last year but has failed to convince in his short stay on Merseyside.

The striker found form towards the end of last season, a run which included the winning goal in the FA Cup semi-final against Everton and a blistering performance as a substitute in the final, but new manager Brendan Rodgers has hinted Carroll may not necessarily be part of his plans.

And last week’s signing of Italian forward Fabio Borini was an indication that the Gateshead-born forward could find his chances limited at Anfield this term.

With 11 goals in 56 games, Carroll has found it hard to live up to his huge transfer fee but has shown the real desire to make his big money move work.

Newly promoted West Ham United and Aston Villa were also thought to be interested in Carroll but with Liverpool not entertaining loan bids, they may now cool their interest.

At this stage it is unclear what the Reds’ asking price for Carroll would be.

7.30pm

NEWCASTLE UNITED are understood to have launched a bid to take Andy Carroll back on loan – with reports saying they hope to make the deal permanent at the end of the season.

The 23-year-old striker joined Liverpool FC from the St James’ Park side for a club record £35m in January last year but has failed to convince in his short stay on Merseyside.

Carroll hit form towards the end of last season, which included an FA Cup semi-final winning goal against Everton, but new manager Brendan Rodgers has made it clear he would consider releasing the England man on a short-term deal.

With 11 goals in 56 games, Carroll has found it hard to live up to his huge transfer fee but has shown the real desire to make it work at Anfield.

But a loan spell back at his boyhood club could entice Carroll and offer him the chance to prove to Rodgers that he should be part of the new era at the club.

At this stage it is unclear what Liverpool’s asking price would be, if they were looking to offload the striker on a permanent deal.

Newly promoted West Ham United and Aston Villa are also thought to be interested in bringing in Carroll on loan but a return to the North East for the Gateshead-born forward is certain to be the more appealing option
Click to expand...

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/live...arroll-from-newcastle-united-100252-31400775/
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

daikirai said:
Me as well haha. And the .... reminds me of the guy from Office Space. "That's my stapler.."
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Actually I like smaller lines, so I end up manually going to next line
dont know why I add those dots .... :-)
Maybe indicating a pause
just a habit i picked up in the last few years

Office space was a great movie BTW

Carroll should be sold if they get a decent bid of 15m, that would effectively mean that we sold Torres for 30m which is not too bad.
 
PIPA23 said:
it´s fair to give this player another year, becouse as i know our transfers, he start´s banging goals for Newcastle....

Drogba was unknown in his age, i bet he will still develop to a quality player, but if Rodgers don´t want him, he will go for sure...
Click to expand...

Drogba unknown? Wtf are you smoking, he was a stud at marseille
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Marseille was later when he was like 25. At 22 which is when Liverpool splashed the cash on Andy, Carroll had just turned 22! Didier was a nobody at that age! it took him next 3 years to become the monster he did. Not saying, he has anywhere near the potential of Drogba but it's amazing how he's being completely written off now badly too soon. The boy can be deadly in the air and even if you want to play beautiful ground-passing football, players like him can always provide an option B and 'surprise' the opposition if brought on as a sub or rotation if nothing else. He still has a part to play in Liverpool if given the chance.

Andy Carroll got too hyped up for his own good too soon. He can still become a very good striker and is already quite a handful as we saw towards the end of the season when he's playing with more confidence. And the way him and Gerrard combined at Euro's was great to watch at times. Stevie's magnificent crosses (Downing's too who will be better this season if they don't sell him) finding Carroll's head = Goal against Sweden!

It'll be stupid if Liverpool offload him without a good price. First they buy him for MUCH more than he's worth and now I have a feeling they will sell him for LESS than he's worth! The definition of bad business! :LOL:
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

bebo said:
Downing did f'all it was gerrard that fed the ball to carroll. This is twice you said :LOL:
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Downing didn't even play for England in Euro's. Obviously it was Gerrard's crosses. I know that. Read what I posted again.

Gerrard's crosses to Carroll's head = Goal against Sweden and numerous other chances for England.

I was just saying that Downing is capable of crosses like that as well.

I think those are 2 players whom IF given chances and backing, will do much better next season than last.

But we'll see if they even get that chance.
 
PLF said:
Marseille was later when he was like 25. At 22 which is when Liverpool splashed the cash on Andy, Carroll had just turned 22! Didier was a nobody at that age! it took him next 3 years to become the monster he did. Not saying, he has anywhere near the potential of Drogba but it's amazing how he's being completely written off now badly too soon. The boy can be deadly in the air and even if you want to play beautiful ground-passing football, players like him can always provide an option B and 'surprise' the opposition if brought on as a sub or rotation if nothing else. He still has a part to play in Liverpool if given the chance.

Andy Carroll got too hyped up for his own good too soon. He can still become a very good striker and is already quite a handful as we saw towards the end of the season when he's playing with more confidence. And the way him and Gerrard combined at Euro's was great to watch at times. Stevie's magnificent crosses (Downing's too who will be better this season if they don't sell him) finding Carroll's head = Goal against Sweden!

It'll be stupid if Liverpool offload him without a good price. First they buy him for MUCH more than he's worth and now I have a feeling they will sell him for LESS than he's worth! The definition of bad business! :LOL:
Click to expand...
Drogba scored 17 in 35 apps in league 1 before Marseille... I think it's a bad comparison mate
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

gomito#10 said:
Drogba unknown? Wtf are you smoking, he was a stud at marseille
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i´m not smoking anything mate..
and i would be happy if we could stay here at least without ofensive tone.. everything i write i write my option and i respect everyone´s option as well..

Drogba moved from Guingamp to Marseille when he was 25, before that club he played in Ligue 2 in Carroll´s age...
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Drogba is also just about the only example in modern era European footballer of a striker going from nothing at 25 to world class at 28.

If that's the odds your pinning your hopes for Carroll, well, erm, that's longer odds than I'd be comfortable with.

Give him back to Newcastle - it's where he wants to be, he's appreciated and Liverpool can move on with a better, more complete forward.

Liverpool are deluding themselves if they believe:
1. Andy Carroll will pull a 1 in a thousand turn around and become class after 25
2. Any club other than Newcastle is going to offer > 15m for him
3. That LFC wouldn't be better off without him playing, particularly given the system they're likely to employ under Rodgers
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Well first of all Drogba was already very good at 25. That's why he played for OM, became top Ligue 1 scorer and helped the club reach UEFA Cup final where they lost to Valencia if I recall correctly.

But he wasn't as good as Carroll was when he was 21-23. That's what I was saying and that's a valid point. Of course being good at a certain age is no indicator of how good you'll turn out later. Some players peak early, some late, some in the middle so you never quite know.

And he's not the only one. Van Nistelrooy is just another example and there are more. Before joining Man Utd, he had terrific couple seasons with PSV like Drogba did with OM although Didier only had 1 season at Marseille but again, he wasn't a star or anything great at 21. At that point, he was on very few people's radar, but then he started doing better and showed glimpses at Heerenveen and got picked up by PSV where he became a star and United signed him.

But at 21, if someone had signed him for $40M, these two GREAT players (For me, definitely two of the best forwards over the last decade) would've probably failed too! The burden and weight of expectations on them and at a huge club like Liverpool where pressure was bigger than PSV and OM, and at 21, they just weren't the men they became. They were nowhere near as mentally strong nor as accomplished, confident or even competent. It was between 23-24 years old that they started showing promise, then got good moves to PSV and OM where things worked out great for them and they went onto become stars.

If Liverpool had signed Drogba when HE was 21, I'm sure he would've been called a donkey, disappoint, have EVERYONE write him off and get sold. Hell, I actually remember a very good finisher Drogba signing for Chelsea after already proving to rest of us that he's now a great forward, and there were still idiots calling him 'donkey' in his FIRST season at Chelsea where he hadn't fully established himself yet and missed some chances. I remember it quite well, soon after being given a bit of time, he went on to silence everyone.

Anyway, again, I must repeat, I'm not saying all this to say Carroll is ever gonna become even 3/4 as good as Drogba or van Nistelrooy did. Personally, I don't think he will. BUT, I'm just saying, let's talk facts and let's not be so harsh. People want to KILL this guy for having been bought for so much when it's hardly his fault is it? It was Liverpool's stupid decision! It put an enormous amount of pressure on him and a kid who had just TURNED 21 caved under pressure and lost confidence in himself.

And as soon as we saw him regain some confidence like towards end of season, we all saw (even those who didn't want to admit) that he CAN be quite effective and a real force to be reckoned with.

If I were Liverpool right now and any club offered $20M (US) or more, I'd accept. Anything less, I wouldn't. Because not only does he still have a lot to offer the club but at the very least, his value can rise back up a bit before selling him off.

gomito#10 said:
Drogba scored 17 in 35 apps in league 1 before Marseille... I think it's a bad comparison mate
Click to expand...

He had one good season with Guingamp before moving to Marseille and that at age of 24.

Would Carroll not have scored 17 out of 35 playing for Newcastle at age of 21 instead in EPL?! He already scored a few less than that in half a season which is when Liverpool decided to splash the cash. He probably would have and that's in a tougher league and at a younger/more raw age.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

What I'm saying is I don't believe Drogba or Van Nistelrooy would've succeeded at Liverpool IF they had been signed as soon as they turned 21 either and for very simple reasons. Not ONLY were they NOT the players they became later (Around 23-24 years old compared to 2 years before that) and so lacked the ability and were very raw, but even more importantly, they lacked the confidence and maturity and composure that they had at 24 compared to 21.

This is why I said on last page that Carroll got TOO hyped up and TOO early! And he's suffering for it now. Too much media attention, less than a good full season, and end result was a crazy $40M transfer deadline day purchase that left us all scratching our heads. But this was Liverpool's mistake, it doesn't mean he's a donkey and useless. He'll do well wherever he goes next I think and at a club like Aston Villa or West Ham, I think he'll prove everyone wrong and show that he can be one of EPL's top marksman.

EDIT: Again, my only reason for comparison with Drogba and van Nistelrooy to just name two was to emphasize how IMPORTANT it is to get the RIGHT moves/transfers at the RIGHT Age. Too early or too late and it can KILL your career! Wrong club and it can kill you! Those two were lucky that they got the right moves when they were READY for it and had developed enough. Carroll clearly hadn't developed enough yet for such a big move and so much expectations. He was just a promising 21 year old forward who suddenly had his world turned upside down. SO much so that he couldn't handle it anymore. The big money move and price tag was even hard and still is for a vastly internationally experienced 26 year old Fernando Torres who was a much better player! He's to this day struggling with that... Let alone some drunkard Geordie kid!
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread

IMO Drogba was already very good at Guingamp where he formed a sucessfull attacking pair with Dagano...

Carroll will never, ever, be half the player Drogba was, is or will be. I really don't understand why Newcastle would want him on loan, they have perhaps the best forwards in the EPL.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

PLF said:
Again, my only reason for comparison with Drogba and van Nistelrooy to just name two was to emphasize how IMPORTANT it is to get the RIGHT moves/transfers at the RIGHT Age. Too early or too late and it can KILL your career! Wrong club and it can kill you!
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indeed. i agree with Sina on this one. sure, chances are carroll won't ever be the next drogba or the next ruud or the next toni.... but he will most likely improve his game and develop into a good player (perhaps a very good player, who knows).

and even if he wouldn't, what do u guys have to lose at this point? loaning him would be just plain silly (as many of u seem to realize)... selling him is virtually impossible right now (which club would buy him and at what price?).
signing carroll for that ridiculous pricetag was a monumental mistake... that transfer will probably go down in history as one of the biggest fails on the market.
but selling carroll right now would be an even bigger mistake (and would also make liverpool owners look like complete idiots). u don't sell your assets when they're worth absolutely nothing. u wait until their value goes up a bit (and by "a bit" i mean "as much as possible").
no one would ever do something that stupid. and if liverpool owners would even consider such a possibility right now, that would make them the biggest clowns in european football. they're newbies, okay, and it seems they still have a lot to learn about how to run a football club..... but they're certainly not that stupid or naive... to put carroll on the market right now.... i just refuse to believe they would really consider such a move.

carroll has the potential to become a good player. it might never become a world class player, but he certainly will do better than he did last season (and his pricetag will grow accordingly).
besides, like i already said, what have u got to lose at this point? u already lost everything u could possibly lose on this guy last summer (when u signed him). it's not like he's on such a heavy contract, so why not give him a chance to grow and prove himself... right now u ain't gonna get any serious money for him anyway, so u might aswell keep him.

u liverpool fans are a very passionate bunch (wich is nice), but u're way too intense in the way u feel about your club, and u let that passion cloud your judgement far too easily.
i know, this could be said about millions of fans over the world, but u guys really bring this thing to a whole new level!!! just look at the way u guys seem to rate your players: u either massively overrate them (turning an average player into a great player and a good player into a world class God), or u hugely underrate them (carroll and downing being the first examples that pop into my mind right now).
take the drama down a notch will ya?!! ;)

i'll tell u what, i actually believe carroll will do better than borini this season. i'm not gone mad, i realise borini is a better player than carroll... and i also realise fabio probably won't have any adaptation problem (as he's already been in EPL), but i just don't see how he could fit into liverpool's football.
fabio is a particular kind of player... he relies a lot on his teammates passing game. he's much more dependant on his teammates than, say carroll and suarez. borini doesn't have suarez's ability to go past his marker with dribbling, and he also doesn't have carroll's build and body balance. in order to deliver borini needs some accurate vertical passers at midfield with above average vision; liverpool has only one player with theese abilities (aquilani), and he's one of the most fragile (therfore unreliable) players in europe.
so if u ask me who's gonna score more goals this season, between carroll and borini, my money is on andy.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

PLF said:
I don't think so. How much would they be able to sell him for? Not all that much. Who would pay big bucks for a 32 year old who's past his best and also has had numerous injury problems recently? Not to mention he'll want big wages because of fame/reputation and that again makes him inaccessible for a lot of clubs.
Click to expand...

Easy. He can go to the USA.

;)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Lo zio - Carroll to do better than Borini? You only have to watch a video compilation of how Swansea played last season to know that Fabio will favour more than Andy in the new system.

As for Gerrard, he has been over rated his entire career, he can't be a playmaking midfielder because he's too wasteful in finding a final pass and wants to force things, his decision making is awful.. He shoots when he should pass and passes when he should shoot, he has a untouchable mentality and believes that because a he is captain he can't do any wrong.
He would fail as a holding midfielder because that mean making a tackle and working defensively, something which (some how) no one has noticed he can't do.
The only reason he would start is because Liverpool lack any other midfielder with a starting place ability, no offence to Henderson, Spearing or Shelvey they have potential but not as much as they've been hyped to have.
You could probably salvage £10m for him, enough to pick up a young potential star in the making, give the new boy Shelvey, Spearing and Henderson some game time and allow them to develop their abilities instead of live in the shadows of Gerrard, they still have time to become technically refined, something Gerrard never had, his game was always about physically out lasting his opposition.
Something which his injuries will limit these next couple of seasons.
I'm sure some Chinese Super Team will pick him up.

As for the Drogba vs Carroll arguments, Carroll is not half the player Drogba was at this age, and as for developing he will never be as good as Drogba.
Just look at the difference in technical abilities, Drogba is quicker, more agile, has a much better forst touch and ball control whilst dribbling, while Carroll basically can't move with the ball.

In short, Gerrard is past it sell him and make Lucas or Agger captain. Carroll will never make it, cut your losses while you can still get more than a pint and a bag of chips for him.
Fabio and Alberto will be brilliant next season under Rodgers, next season will see Coates push for a starting place specifically Skrtels place.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

I'd imagine Coates getting more games due to Agger being made of glass.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread

Will Carroll stay anyway?Hope not really.And his comparisons with Drogba... pathetic.
 
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