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Liverpool Thread

Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

I made a rather serious spelling mistake in "squeeuzed"...sorry (is it "squeezed"? difficult word).

Mathewss you and i seem to agree on a lot of things about Liverpool. We should take over from Dalglish...
 
Capello?! No thanks!! When I've caught highlights of England they were shit. My lowly Wales outplayed them and made them look the shit team they are. Yes they beat us but very lucky.
I would not want that bloke anywhere near Liverpool. Back to the boring style of football. No thanks. Sod that!

I still say give Dalglish more time. It's no good chopping and changing every 5 minutes. Don't people realise this?

He had 3 seasons. For Christ sake, will a clubs board give stick to their word and give somebody a bit of time.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

As a United fan I'm in complete agreement. Let Kenny stay at Liverpool forever as far as I'm concerned.

;)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

beachryan said:
As a United fan I'm in complete agreement. Let Kenny stay at Liverpool forever as far as I'm concerned.

;)
Click to expand...

as most of young united fans you don´t know what it means if the club you love fails or struggles, but trust me that time might come.. you will know what it feels for Liverpool´s young supporters who are unhappy.. from united perspective it´s obviously deserved success, but it came with time..

Ferguson had luck he stayed in the club after long years without success and bad luck.. the rest is history..

i´m not the one who will bow down to Dalglish or consider him a messiah, but i am old enough to understand that to build something you need patience and time..for years, it´s like with raising a child...

once you understand probably ;)
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

so it´s vs. Everton in Wembley...

big crowd for a big derby.. can´t wait.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

Id love david moyes to be the next liverpool manager.imagine what he could do with owners that would back him in the transfer market,what he has done with everton with no money has been amazing
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

Although i fairly like Liverpool, i always support Everton in the derbies. So i hope Everton wins it, but i know better. We will see at least one red card for an Everton player and television images will show that the sending off will not be correct...like usual in those derbies.

About the patience pipa: i fully agree with you. It takes years to build something. That is exactly the same thing i was saying when Roy Hodgson was Liverpool's manager. Fans are irrational: Hodgson never had a fair chance while Dalgish isn't doing any better and gets lots of chances. Is this right? One never knows.

I remember Ferguson starting with United, if hadn't won the FA CUP he would have been sacked too...i said exactly the same thing in this thread when everybody here attacked Hodgson (you may well remember dags, i know you read every single post in this thread).

Until now i haven't seen a single reason why Hodgson is a bad manager and Dalglish the right one. But credit goes to the new owners that they give Dalglish time. That is the way things should work for every manager not only for club legends. In all fairness one should say that Chelsea can learn something from the Liverpool owners.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

Hodgson was a manager who was appointed by people who ended up at court, he was appointed during period of time where the owners chainged and people felt he was not right for the job..

he did so many way´s wrong things i can´t argue with you if you look on him and dalglish point wise only...not looking on everything else..

it´s useless to defend Dalglish on this one..
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

@ Gerd - It's important to remember who the audience/ stakeholders are in any argument about King Kenny. It's not a rational, logical group that make decisions based on the facts available to them. It's the 'most passionate fans in the world'. It's a group of grown men that happily acknowledge that they'll support their players no matter what they do on or off the pitch. It's a fan base that every year claim to have the best squad in the league, and every year claim that every other team (including the eventual winners) are overrated, and that only Liverpool fans know what is going on.

Every club has a few mentalist fans that refuse to see logic or reason when it comes to football, but my experience has been that the vast majority of Liverpool fans fall into that kind of description. Which is kind of admirable.

But it also means that trying to apply logic or common sense won't work. Almost by definition, any argument about their team to a Liverpool fan is an emotional one. And King Kenny is the emotional choice.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

PIPA23 said:
Hodgson was a manager who was appointed by people who ended up at court,
Click to expand...

What a weak argument. The fact that he was appointed by people who ended up in court does not say anything about Hodgson. That moral stance is rather bizar for the one evo-web member who still defends Luis Suarez for his behaviour on the pitch.

Jospeh Goebbels asked Leni Riefenstahl to make propaganda movies for the Nazi's. Yet Riefenstahl is seen as one the best movie directors ever. Same goes for Eisenstein who worked for Lenin in Russia. He is also seen as one of the greatest movie directors ever.

You are a nice guy Pipa, but you often seem brain washed. Of course it's not the end of the world it's only football (Shankly would not agree with me).
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

oh boy.. i don´t want to argue about that anymore..those previous owners were a nightmare for me and i don´t even live in Liverpool, i just support the club from big distance.. they sacked Benitez and appointed Hodgson who had no clue how to deal with the likes of Reina, Torres, Aquilani..all this players except Reina were gone and Torres was not motivated to play under this coach.. this are world class material that Hodgson didn´t knew how to deal with.. He bought Konchesky, Poulsen and Cole.. Jovanovic and Wilson were Rafa´s signings... Hodgson didn´t even played Jovanovic mostly.. or played him out of position..

Hodgson had a big mouth in his interviews and a great friendly relationship with Ferguson who was realy happy with the fact Hodgson is our coach, maybe the same way he was angry at Rafa playing mind games the second he knew we were to close to league title in 2008...

i realy don´t want to discous how we played under Hodgson, most boring football ever, i didn´t felt i need to watch our matches at times..for the first time i support the club i didn´t gave a damn..i felt so sick from us..

Dalglish has similar points or less now (?) he spended, but heck he get rid of more than 10 players with also a profit, he cleared the club and brought players who in my opinion are a good bunch of squad players or players who could be playing around Suarez, Lucas, Gerrard, Skrtel + Agger and Reina, who i consider our spine.. Only player who didn´t worked out is Downing, i don´t say Carroll, becouse for Carroll to work out he needs to play.. we won most of the matches he started btw. + he is young and can become a big striker for us in future, just like Drogba became for Chelsea after he transfered there after he was 26 (!) he played in second France division in the same age Carroll is now.. but people have no patience especially seeing his price tag..

Only thing that realy worries me about Dalglish is the fact we didn´t respond to the scoring problem, the squad is good now, we will be stronger after summer i belive..but the football we played this season, despite points was realy not so bad, i would say very attractive at times... our defence if healthy is rock solid, we lost Lucas - our most important player..but we invite young blood to play and i see the progress... Kelly, Coates, Spearing, Sterling, Flanagan all can become first team players for us at some point..

those fans who look on LFC from neutral point of view will criticise Dalglish, but those who live with the club and see how things are atm, despite us being unlucky loosing or draw mathes in wich we were dominating and having X chances - this fans know that with some adjustments in cruicial areas we can push for better place next season...

we still have FA Cup to play for + European competition next season... we already won the same "Mickey mouse cup" that City and not sure what other teams we beaten to win it... they would like to win it as well... Not to mention the vibe around the team is much more positive.. untill the owners belive in Dalglish, there is no need to panic.. we all hoped we can push for fourth place but teams like Tottenham and Newcastle had this team building going on season - two before LFC..they had the basics already, now they eat the fruits...

we have to wait for that...
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

If I look at our managers in the last 10 years...

I would rate in this order

1. Rafa (5 seasons)
---Champions league winners, runners-up, Semi-finals, Q-finals
---Europa League semi-finals
---FA cup winners
---2nd in league...top-4 in 3 seasons out of 5.
---Bought Torres, Alonso, Masch, Agger, Skrtel, Reina, Kuyt
---Bad mistakes: Josemi, Nunez, Keane, Voronin, Babel, Pennant,
selling Bellamy, Crouch, Alonso, alienating players like Benayoun.
---Operated under terrible owners but managed to still keep
Liverpool as top-4 team in England and top-8 team in Europe

2. Houllier (5 seasons)
---UEFA cup winners
---CL quarters
---1 FA cup win
---2 League cups
---2nd spot once, top-4 in 3 out of 5 seasons
---Bought Hyypia, Henchoz, Babbel, Hamann, McAllister, Litmanen
---Bad mistakes - Diomede, Meyer, selling Fowler, not buying Anelka
negative football, no wingers, alienating Litmanen.
---Sacked after failure to improve on 2002 season where
we reached CL q-final and finished 2nd.

3. Dalglish (1+ seasons)
---6th spot after Hodgson's disastrous reign in 2010-11.
---Carling Cup winners
---Football has been better than Hodgson's....but still
not good enough tactically...can't see Dalglish doing
anything in Europe to be honest.
---Bad mistakes: Carroll for 35m...(to blame with Comolli),
Downing for 20m, Henderson for 17m...none of them are top-4 players
Alienating Maxi, Shelvey, Aquilani, Meireles, Kuyt..
stupid support of Suarez, terrible press conferences,
constant excuses for defeats.
---Current form is worse than Hodgson...but surviving on legend
status and Carling win.

4. Hodgson (0.5 season)
--- Signed Meireles
--- Bad mistakes : Konchesky, Poulsen, Cole, terrible press conferences,
negative sterile brand of football,
lapping up to Ferguson, took us close to Relegation.
--- Sacked but not given time....highly unlikely to have done much
given lack of success in any major league.....and his lack of experience
with any top team in Europe or England.

The way I look at it....Rafa was clearly the best manager we have had in terms
of results in the last 20 years....since Dalglish left in 1991.

Dalglish just is not going to magically roll back the years and repeat
what he did in 1988-90 for us...
time has moved ....football is not the same anymore.....there are lot more foreign
players and managers in the English league.....British players are'nt that great...
neither are British coaches.....the game is very tactical .....with a great onus
on skilful players....

We need someone who can stand up against player power
and is tactically strong and modern....who has a good eye for players
especially abroad...since british players are just too expensive and over-rated

To me Rafa Benitez is our best choice....
and if not him....it would be someone like AVB / Ancelotti / Van Gaal.
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

i would like to disagree with the sentences about Dalglish, he bought some britihs players that´s true, but he also bought Enrique, Coates (yeah we wanted Jones from Blackburn as first choice) and Suarez was also bought in his reign... in other side United (for example) bought also england players in Jones, Young and they added Wellbeck to their lineup.. those players are not overrated at all... but for me the fundamental problem is by comparing how United use Young and how we manage to use Downing for example, both Aston Villa wingers - probably both on same level of points there... still Downing doing worse here than Young for United.. but i bet it would still be the same if we swaped them right now.. unfortunatelly for us i belive so..

this is our problem.. we were moaning at Rafa making us a spanish team or foreign team at some point, without not enough english players, now that our spine is mostly british, even if it isn´t becouse we play for Dalglish mostly with this lineup: Reina, Johnson, Skrtel, Agger, Enrique, Lucas, Gerrard, Adam, Kuyt, Downing, Suarez as best lineup possible..only 3 players out of 11 are english and 4 out of 11 are British.. so it´s a not worse number of british players as other teams ABOVE us use in their lineups, refering mostly to Man. United again of course..

It´s more about finding QUALITY and geling them together, this takes time and from results you might think Dalglish failed, but i saw us play great football this season, sometimes even without Gerrard in the team, or the ban where also Suarez didn´t play, and i consider them our best players...

We need to have also british players for the squad to have lads who understand what LFC means, but sometimes i have the feeling our abroad players like Agger, Skrtel, Kuyt have more LFC spirit then the home grown players.. especially Gerrard who can be a phenomenal player one game and a shadow of himself in another.. or Adam, Downing, Henderson...who are NOT SHIT players but they lack a push up in the arse by someone or lack self belief or simply think they made it by wearing this shirt, but if for United players wearing United shirt the fun just started, i have a feeling for our players the fun is over and they think they now are granted great player status just by moving here....

this needs to chainge, becouse we are not as bad as the results show... we had bad run and very bad luck sometimes.. we barely scored this season, something i can´t remember for long time...
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

PIPA23 said:
Hodgson had a big mouth in his interviews and a great friendly relationship with Ferguson who was realy happy with the fact Hodgson is our coach, maybe the same way he was angry at Rafa playing mind games the second he knew we were to close to league title in 2008...
Click to expand...

So a good Liverpool manager cannot have a friendly relationship with Ferguson?
I actually think that this is one of the things Hodgson did really well.
You cite Rafa as a good example. I should say he's the worst possible example, because if i remember well he did loose those mind games. He had an outburst similar to the infamous Keagan outburst when he was Newcastle's manager. After Raffa's outburst it went all downhill for Liverpool. This is actually the worst possible way to deal with Ferguson. One of the biggest mistakes Benitez made.

Maybe Hodgson understood the fact that Liverpool is a huge club and doesn't need to compare itself all the time with Man Utd. It seems most Liverpool fans in here are as obsessed with United as Everton fans are obsessed with Liverpool...With that mentality a club will always loose to that opponent (and i'm not talking about matches against each other, it may well be possible that the underdog club wins those matches).

About the football. Do you actually think Liverpool played exciting football under Benitez? They did when they ended as runners-up behind Man Utd.

Actually the best football i remember from Liverpool (in recent times) is the football that was played under Dalglish at the end of last season. That was great football and all credit for that must go to Dalglish. But the current Liverpool team sadly comes nowhere near that level.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

Benitez's greatest moments (other than the rather flukey CL final) were in a 3 week span when they beat United 4-1 and Real Madrid similarly. Those are the games held up by Rafites as his 'typical' performances.

I hated watching Liverpool under Benitez. It was safety first, 9 men in your own half hoof the ball at Torres football. The key was that for 1.5 seasons, Torres really was good enough to do it himself. Before and after that period, Rafa's tactics were shown up as too negative to achieve much in the league.

I actually think Pool are playing better now overall than with Rafa. They just can't quite finish chances or be clinical when it matters. A world class striker could make all the difference, but strikers don't tend to do well when they transfer to Liverpool in the last decade (aside, of course, from the aforementioned El Nino).
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

beachryan said:
Benitez's greatest moments (other than the rather flukey CL final) were in a 3 week span when they beat United 4-1 and Real Madrid similarly. Those are the games held up by Rafites as his 'typical' performances.

I hated watching Liverpool under Benitez. It was safety first, 9 men in your own half hoof the ball at Torres football. The key was that for 1.5 seasons, Torres really was good enough to do it himself. Before and after that period, Rafa's tactics were shown up as too negative to achieve much in the league.

I actually think Pool are playing better now overall than with Rafa. They just can't quite finish chances or be clinical when it matters. A world class striker could make all the difference, but strikers don't tend to do well when they transfer to Liverpool in the last decade (aside, of course, from the aforementioned El Nino).
Click to expand...

While I do admit that Dalglish has had us play superbly in the last
season....but this season he has destroyed that by
bringing in his players...and not buying a good finisher.
There was no need to disturb the axis of Lucas-Meireles-Kuyt-Maxi-Suarez.
We had Aquilani, Spearing and Shelvey in midfield as backup...with Gerrard back to fitness.
and voila...he goes and buys Adam, Henderson and Downing....who have added zero value
compared to previous season's midfield....
No need to panic buy Carroll....when we could have waited in the summer and got 2 strikers
for half that price who are better.

But to say that Rafa had us playing with 9 men in our half with
hoofball to Torres.....I think that's a huge exaggeration...

I must say I cannot remember us playing under Rafa
like that at all.....we always passed the ball....and yes we
were defensive against stronger teams away from home...
sure we were not as fluent as Barca....but we did play well...
and the results are there to be seen.

It was Hodgson who had 9 in the half...and played hoofball to Torres.
Even Houllier played a long ball game to Heskey....and was very
defensive...but Houllier was more effective than Hodgson !

So I dont think you are being accurate or fair here.....

Benitez for all his flaws has given Liverpool the most success
in the last 20 years.....he also got his Valencia team to play
pretty well...and they were very effective with decent passing.
You can call Istanbul a fluke....or even beating Real and Man Utd as flukes...
but Rafa firmly established Liverpool in the top-8 teams in Europe
taking them to 2 Finals....1 semi and 1 Q-final of the Champions League...
and top-4 teams in England.......

...something Dalglish is never going to do....nor was Hodgson capable of doing.
 
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Liverpool, apart from the odd occasion, played terrible football under Benitez. I agree with that. Pointless mentioning how he had Valencia playing as Liverpool played nothing like that. They played like a bunch of robots. No flair. Just effort. Boring to watch.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

f**k off kenny for dont bring Raheem Sterling on 1st 11 or at the last on bench !

Carroll goes down when have open goal ? stupid idiot hope he'll be ban for this so i will not him for few matchs
 
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Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

either still a Newc agent or on the take! no way did he dove to be cheeky, he didnt want to score a tap in OPEN NET!
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

Thought carroll having pretty good first half, although still don't understand why he went down, maybe because would have had to took it on his right? should've had a penalty when simpsons arm took the ball off the line.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

I quit watching the match since the minute Cisse scored his second goal.
I'm really pissed off with those awful performances lately and if we don't win FA Cup, this season will be a huge failure(it'll still be a failure whatsoever). I think Kenny should be sacked and take with him all the trash he bought except Henderson and Enrique.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

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:SMUG:
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

When you're 2-0 down and you bring on Downing, Kuyt and Henderson with 10 minutes to go... :FAIL:

Anyone else think there is problems behind the scenes? I know Reina has been v angry of late with the dodgy defending but for him to do that...something's not right.
 
Re: Liverpool Thread(I've Had Enough!!)

We have Relegation form.....

I think our 2012 record is probably WORSE than Hodgson's
run last year...

I read somewhere that Ranieri and Benitez were sacked from Inter
for far better records than what Dalglish is overseeing at the moment.

AVB....what an unlucky guy he is...

Dalglish....hanging on by his legend status...
but he's making it very hard for fans to give him
anymore benefit of doubt.

Hope FSG see sense and end this nightmare in the summer
 
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