WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread

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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

charlievolano said:
Main problem is that there seems to be a little tricks: huge quality close ups but in game graphics go down to last year 360. I have the feeling developers are either getting too lazy or too smart or simply it is still the beginning of the nex gen code so we need to give them some time.

But honestly playing a game where the running animations remind me of some cartoons where a thief is chased by a dog is not funny at all.

PS2 version still better than next gen.
Click to expand...


HOpefully this is a simple LOD thing. On the PC version it was pretty much necessary to use Level of Distance mixer in Kitserver to not make the game switch to low-res models as the distance increases. It doesn't make for an eyepopping difference, but it would make a difference for sure.

Also I hope that with the LOD mixer you might be able to change so that the fuzzy 3D grass layer stretches out much further from the camera. As it is now it fades out just a few meters infront of the camera, which ruins the illusion.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

trance, yeah I noticed the grass, to start with it looks sorta ok (all be it a bit like a Oil Painting) and as it gets further out it looks like a PS2 pitch and then a PS1 pitch :)
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Also, it worries me that he really did feel the game was perfect, when we have had to little control for such a long time. Everything is AI assisted, passes, shots etc. Try and pull that in a golf game and see what the reactions are.

Just replace the man, because with his onboard the game will obviously not evolve in any meaningful way (4 years pretty much proves it).
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Punzz said:
Nooo... :( I still had a glimmer of hope for a more in depth campaign mode but doesn't look like it reading this. Love the fact he mentions 'Glimmer side' of things. How about getting the fundamentals right first before you start 'glamouring' up the ML
Click to expand...
It is not new: We already talked about 'pimping' the ML a month ago.
The only new thing he said was how TeamVision works: Some new details overthere, but still not everything.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

hargreaves4 said:
trance, yeah I noticed the grass, to start with it looks sorta ok (all be it a bit like a Oil Painting) and as it gets further out it looks like a PS2 pitch and then a PS1 pitch :)
Click to expand...

Yeah hehe. Up close the 3D layer works grea,t because it looks like the ball is resting IN grass, but just a bit farther away it looks like it is resting on a green plastic floor. UGH!
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

I think i am gonna put in the old pes2 grass, people complained a lot, i thought it was very good to make the players models look sharp. This green grass give a weird visual to the players.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Han said:
It is not new: We already talked about 'pimping' the ML a month ago.
The only new thing he said was how TeamVision works: Some new details overthere, but still not everything.
Click to expand...

Who said it was new? We've known about it for ages. I was just stating my disappointment in choosing to pimp it up rather than actually sort it out
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

charlievolano said:
I think i am gonna put in the old pes2 grass, people complained a lot, i thought it was very good to make the players models look sharp. This green grass give a weird visual to the players.
Click to expand...
I already stopped taking your negative posts seriously, but this one is examplary for all of them: Yes, of course, maybe we should try purple grass :lmao:
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Han said:
I already stopped taking your negative posts seriously, but this one is examplary for all of them: Yes, of course, maybe we should try purple grass :lmao:
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I like the old design better than this fake photorealistic one. Any problem with that?? All your comments are about this divine team vision. You are getting a bit team visionary aren't you? Or you just buy whatever konami tells you. Typical fanboysm.....
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Ever seen a PES-fanboy buy FIFA08? I did buy it, so that means I am no PES-fanboy ;)
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Trance_Allstar said:
Also, it worries me that he really did feel the game was perfect, when we have had to little control for such a long time. Everything is AI assisted, passes, shots etc. Try and pull that in a golf game and see what the reactions are.
Click to expand...

Dude, there are tons of AI assisting in all golf games.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

What Han is trying to say (i think) Charlie Volano that (to fanboys like us) your comments do not seem very serious or sound (honorous??? incorruptable)...you just shoot wildly around and when somebody points out flaws in your "argumentation" you either ignore them (my comment on what you think about the English licenses) or call people fanboys...

That's a litle easy...that way you never loose in a discussion, which does not mean you have the correct opinion...

PS: like Han i also bought FIFA08 and i really like it...because you see i have been waiting to state opinions until i have bought the retail version of the game...
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

The teamvision sounds like it works in single matches rather than a game by game basis.
At least that was my interpretation of Seabass's comments.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

I love when a buddy defends his sweetheart.....

I just said i like the old visual design better than this one, so what's the problem, this is not even an argument.
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

What i find funny is that some people actually believe you have serious mental problems by liking pes, its people like these that need to leave this thread as they clearly have little to contribute.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

jonestm said:
The teamvision sounds like it works in single matches rather than a game by game basis.
At least that was my interpretation of Seabass's comments.
Click to expand...
Maybe you are right, but I am opposed to that. I think it stores the results of your matches and use it in the next one. I think that works most proper in Master League and maybe other leagues.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

after reading what seabass had to say - I'm gutted that there is no multi-player master league!:(

Oh well lokks like I'll have to do a master league all by my lonesome this year let's hope konami wake up and make the master league multi-player.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Beatts said:
http://www.jeuxvideo.fr/pes-2008-lyon-saint-etienne-en-video-exclu-actu-80894.html

This one here bud, it is more the pace of pes6(ps2) if you view the videos from this and and the previous ones it is almost a different game.


PS. Gomito you clearly need glasses, watch them side by side.
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the pace is slower then the demo but looks faster the pes6, and the gameplay looks bareley changend... i think thats the bigges dissapointment, this version does look better now that im looking at it, but it just looks alot like the same gameplay as last years with alot of new animations, but nothing grounbreaking. It seems you still try and attack the same way and create chances the same way. I remember a time where it seemend like every WE goal was different... i cant say that anymore...
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Isslander said:
Dude, there are tons of AI assisting in all golf games.
Click to expand...


Not in the sense I am referring to. ;)

Obviously it would matter what golf game aswell.

Perhaps I should phrase it like this: THe interaction between you and the game in PES is very much less, and more rudimentary, than a Golf game.


A golf game is all about precision. You need to factor in wind, and aim very precisely. Then you need to correct the players stance. You also need to think about how to spin the ball, and what club and what power to use.

After that comes the stroke part, where you usually need a certain timing or such to make sure the players gets a good hit on the ball.


The closest PES comes to this is Freekicks. There we have free aim, we can curl (only left or right though, not varying degrees). There is no timing factor, so any misshits is completely generated at the game's discretion.

But in normal shooting, you aim in one of 3 directions (middle of goal, lef tof goal, right of goal), and the game decides where the ball goes (no timing factor here either, which would make it so that it is more up to you how inaccurate the shot becomes).

Passes are always autoaimed, and a missed pass is not because of you, it is because of the Automatic aiming. In the golf game you can aim very accurately the direction you want to hit the ball (not in PES, you aim in 1 of 8 dirctions and the game "interprets" who you want to pass to, and selects its own power for the pass aswell), you can decide how hard and how high the ball should go (not in PES). Try that in a golf game ("I am guessing you want to strike the ball to that bunker, so that's where I am aiming").

PES lumps together power and height into one shot meter. You cannot control each separately, as you very much can in real life (where power is a result of how hard you impact the ball, and height is a a result of how much foot you get under the ball, and how you shape your foot). A golf game has different clubs with different angles of the blade, and you can select how hard you want to hit with each of them.



Obviously Golf games are all about static situations, but even in PES's freekicks (similar situation) we don't have completely separate height and power bars, and such.

As for ingame passing, shooting etc, we have 2 analog sticks (analog in direction and tilt angle). They aren't utilized at all, not for height control, or very precise manual aiming. :/
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

uae_sniper said:
every year the same story !!

before release:
the game is do not improve well ... the graphic not like i want ... the gameplay is the same .. bla bla bla (people say that)


after release (4 days or a week):
the best game in the world ... no one can beat this game ... did you see the move of (player) ... the graphic is great .., the gameplay is superb. (people say that)

this year the story will repeat ^_^

note: sorry for my bad english
Click to expand...

just repeat myself ^_^
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Trance_Allstar said:
Also, it worries me that he really did feel the game was perfect, when we have had to little control for such a long time. Everything is AI assisted, passes, shots etc. Try and pull that in a golf game and see what the reactions are.

Just replace the man, because with his onboard the game will obviously not evolve in any meaningful way (4 years pretty much proves it).
Click to expand...

Not only is all AI assisted, also it's still there the randoms gkeeper goalkick. I've heard this lack of control had been solved on PES 2007 CC, but it's still there on PES2008.
Also, I feel less control in GK hand throws too.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

Trance_Allstar said:
Not in the sense I am referring to. ;)

Obviously it would matter what golf game aswell.

Perhaps I should phrase it like this: THe interaction between you and the game in PES is very much less, and more rudimentary, than a Golf game.


A golf game is all about precision. You need to factor in wind, and aim very precisely. Then you need to correct the players stance. You also need to think about how to spin the ball, and what club and what power to use.

After that comes the stroke part, where you usually need a certain timing or such to make sure the players gets a good hit on the ball.


The closest PES comes to this is Freekicks. There we have free aim, we can curl (only left or right though, not varying degrees). There is no timing factor, so any misshits is completely generated at the game's discretion.

But in normal shooting, you aim in one of 3 directions (middle of goal, lef tof goal, right of goal), and the game decides where the ball goes (no timing factor here either, which would make it so that it is more up to you how inaccurate the shot becomes).

Passes are always autoaimed, and a missed pass is not because of you, it is because of the Automatic aiming. In the golf game you can aim very accurately the direction you want to hit the ball (not in PES, you aim in 1 of 8 dirctions and the game "interprets" who you want to pass to, and selects its own power for the pass aswell), you can decide how hard and how high the ball should go (not in PES). Try that in a golf game ("I am guessing you want to strike the ball to that bunker, so that's where I am aiming").

PES lumps together power and height into one shot meter. You cannot control each separately, as you very much can in real life (where power is a result of how hard you impact the ball, and height is a a result of how much foot you get under the ball, and how you shape your foot). A golf game has different clubs with different angles of the blade, and you can select how hard you want to hit with each of them.



Obviously Golf games are all about static situations, but even in PES's freekicks (similar situation) we don't have completely separate height and power bars, and such.

As for ingame passing, shooting etc, we have 2 analog sticks (analog in direction and tilt angle). They aren't utilized at all, not for height control, or very precise manual aiming. :/
Click to expand...


Mate, you're larger than life ;)
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

The accuracy of passes and shoots depend on the stats of the players?
YES. That's why for you the CPU decides...there's also a stat of "collective". If Deco has 85 with Ronaldo it will be a good pass, if he has 73 it will be less accurate.
There's also the pass speed which give you the response of a player. That's why you recognize player styles in PES and not in FIFA.
Lot of my friends when they play PES don't care about stats and then say "Shit why I didn't score my 1on1 play" I answer top that "Your player doesn't have the 1vs1 score star"...
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

yacine said:
The accuracy of passes and shoots depend on the stats of the players?
YES. That's why for you the CPU decides...there's also a stat of "collective". If Deco has 85 with Ronaldo it will be a good pass, if he has 73 it will be less accurate.
There's also the pass speed which give you the response of a player. That's why you recognize player styles in PES and not in FIFA.
Lot of my friends when they play PES don't care about stats and then say "Shit why I didn't score my 1on1 play" I answer top that "Your player doesn't have the 1vs1 score star"...
Click to expand...

The problem is that you can't go through this stats rather that simply undergo them. You know?
You can't live, you can't enact these stats.
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

The gameplay, graphics, and animations all look first class. Can't wait for the world's best football game, PES 2008, on the worlds best console, Playstation 3. 25 days to go.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 09/27/07)

yacine said:
The accuracy of passes and shoots depend on the stats of the players?
YES. That's why for you the CPU decides...there's also a stat of "collective". If Deco has 85 with Ronaldo it will be a good pass, if he has 73 it will be less accurate.
There's also the pass speed which give you the response of a player. That's why you recognize player styles in PES and not in FIFA.
Lot of my friends when they play PES don't care about stats and then say "Shit why I didn't score my 1on1 play" I answer top that "Your player doesn't have the 1vs1 score star"...
Click to expand...

i think this was more true in the previous versions, not so much anymore
 
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