WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread

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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

The Black Sheep said:
The time ratio is still 1:1 yes, but the frame ratio will be out. SO the example of recording and playing back 40 frames is incorrect. If the tv display was 40FPS and the camera recorded 1 sec, the camera would only play back 29 frames (pal), but still take 1 second to do so.

The conversion of these videos to the web may also have an effect, if they are record in pal and converted to ntsc (framerate wise, not resolution) this will also effect some videos.

We need Raw HD output.
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Yeah, but if the time ratio is 1:1, then there will be absolutely no difference in speed.

As you say, there will be a de-synch in the frame recording (the video camera won't record frames in synch with the TV, but that doesn't matter since the TV frames are fairly seamlessly overlapping. SInce they aren't synched the recorded image will flicker slightly since the video camera will sometimes capture a frame just as the TV "frame" displayed at that time has started to fade, but this will not affect the playback speed, it will only introduce flicker due to the unsynched framerecording that will cause certain frames fall between the cracks.


BUT, if they converted between PAL and NTSC; that is a very valid error source.though I don't understand why they would need that converting for web videos, there isn't PAL and NSTC for computer monitors right? That only applies to TVs and such that have a fixed refreshrate or fixed videodecoders etc. Anyone with a graphicscard and a computer monitor will be able to watch a video great regardless of what "region" it's specifications such as framerate follows, correct?

I can only see it happening for specific video encodings that are for iPods or limited playback devices.

But I am no expert. ;)
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

does anyone know if there is any slowdown on the wide camera ?






.
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Interesting comment from Suff on the WENB blog. The demo is most likely an earlier build and the mags have been playing a fully featured and more recent build, and they say the ps3 version is better in graphics and controls.

That is promising as if that is true then the 360 and pc versions from the demo are also early builds. Then at least we can all hope for better versions of ps3, 360 and pc by release time.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Trance_Allstar said:
BUT, if they converted between PAL and NTSC; that is a very valid error source.though I don't understand why they would need that converting for web videos, there isn't PAL and NSTC for computer monitors right? That only applies to TVs and such that have a fixed refreshrate or fixed videodecoders etc. Anyone with a graphicscard and a computer monitor will be able to watch a video great regardless of what "region" it's specifications such as framerate follows, correct?
Click to expand...

Theres not a pal or ntsc for computer monitors, but there will be a standard framerate for the web files, i'm guessing its ntsc... not the refresh rate, as this can potentially be different on everyones monitor, but the framerate.

So your right, anyone can watch it fine even if their monitor is running at 60hz or 120hz. The key being if it was recorded in in one FPS (pal) and re-encoded in another FPS (ntsc), the refresh rate is irrelevent.

This is like the pal speedup issue on dvd players that dont compensate for the one frame missing from NTSC films, resulting in a 4% difference in the speed of the film, this jerkyness that not everyone notices was only recently fixed on PAL PS3s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telecine

man, we need some proper HD vids!
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

can someone post the big versions of the scans so i can read them
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

- Only 1 vs. 1 online for all consoles. They haven't been able to achieve a stable enough service with more participants.
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\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/\\:o/:applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause::applause:
:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

The quick free kicks are actually quick, no more black screen
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

The Black Sheep said:
Theres not a pal or ntsc for computer monitors, but there will be a standard framerate for the web files, i'm guessing its ntsc... not the refresh rate, as this can potentially be different on everyones monitor, but the framerate.

So your right, anyone can watch it fine even if their monitor is running at 60hz or 120hz. The key being if it was recorded in in one FPS (pal) and re-encoded in another FPS (ntsc), the refresh rate is irrelevent.

This is like the pal speedup issue on dvd players that dont compensate for the one frame missing from NTSC films, resulting in a 4% difference in the speed of the film, this jerkyness that not everyone notices was only recently fixed on PAL PS3s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telecine

man, we need some proper HD vids!
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Cheers for the info, I wasn't aware they might handle in "standard" frame rates or such. :)

Yeah, I agree, proper HD vids with direct video streams.


Also, I don't like the way they are running either. It looks odd to say the least. That "Kick-Off" game reference looks pretty suiting. I wonder if they mocap at all. Now I am no fan of using all mo-cap, but for basic things like running etc they should use it, and definately someone who runs more normally than that.
What was wrong with the running animation in PES6, and why do they always change now and then. Is it simply a case of "let's change it so they won't get bored as fast"?
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

samba2 said:
Interesting comment from Suff on the WENB blog. The demo is most likely an earlier build and the mags have been playing a fully featured and more recent build, and they say the ps3 version is better in graphics and controls.

That is promising as if that is true then the 360 and pc versions from the demo are also early builds. Then at least we can all hope for better versions of ps3, 360 and pc by release time.
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It amazes me how indulgent you are with konami, all the time we get the "pre beta" "beta" "early build" "75%" etc.

Now would you tell me why on earth they would go to the most importante european event of the year with a shitty version when they atually have a stunning one. Some sort of marketing suicide instinct???

That's the game, that's the engine, that's how pes2008 is gonna look like.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

charlievolano said:
It amazes me how indulgent you are with konami, all the time we get the "pre beta" "beta" "early build" "75%" etc.

Now would you tell me why on earth they would go to the most importante european event of the year with a shitty version when they atually have a stunning one. Some sort of marketing suicide instinct???

That's the game, that's the engine, that's how pes2008 is gonna look like.
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Actually it takes weeks to develop demos, they have to be specially developed so it is quite plausible that the version shown at Leipzig is from an older build, however do agree that the final version of PES2008 is not going to look drastically different to what we have already seen. They will use the time to get rid of bugs, slowdown and just give it a graphical polish.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

charlievolano said:
It amazes me how indulgent you are with konami, all the time we get the "pre beta" "beta" "early build" "75%" etc.

Now would you tell me why on earth they would go to the most importante european event of the year with a shitty version when they atually have a stunning one. Some sort of marketing suicide instinct???

That's the game, that's the engine, that's how pes2008 is gonna look like.
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We understand the way it looks but some of us still like the series, even if it isn't grpahically impressive. The referal to Beta etc. is about the addition of the smaller touches which make pes what it is.

Were not all fan boys but neither are we pesimists.

And most importantly we are also entitled to our opinions as well as you are.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Beatts said:
We understand the way it looks but some of us still like the series, even if it isn't grpahically impressive. The referal to Beta etc. is about the addition of the smaller touches which make pes what it is.

Were not all fan boys but neither are we pesimists.

And most importantly we are also entitled to our opinions as well as you are.
Click to expand...

I agree with you, you understand that other things will be added, but some refuse to believe that what we have seen is the core game, and that 75% means a massive amount will be changed.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Massive amount of teams will be added and massive amount of rosters will be updated.

That's the damn 25% they are talking about. Maybe some small gameplay changes like better goalkeepers, but that's it.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

I couldn't care less about which version has the better graphics. Its always the same, PC gets the best graphics, end of.

My concern is the running animations. They look so unrealistic (on the ball) and its very worrying for a massive part of the game
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

charlievolano said:
It amazes me how indulgent you are with konami, all the time we get the "pre beta" "beta" "early build" "75%" etc.

Now would you tell me why on earth they would go to the most importante european event of the year with a shitty version when they atually have a stunning one. Some sort of marketing suicide instinct???

That's the game, that's the engine, that's how pes2008 is gonna look like.
Click to expand...

Not indulgent, just optimistic. It looks like at the very least we shall have a "fixed" version of PES6 of the Xbox360 for all formats. THat in itself is not such a bad thing. Agreed not the dramatic leaps that we were expecting/hoping for, but better nonetheless.With regards to the versions.builds etc, hey dont shoot the messenger dude, I am only going by what Suffwan posted on his blog that his mag contacts said they played what appears to be a later full build and it seemed better.However the only way to find out is to get WENB both the demo and full beta and for them to test side by side. I think Suff said he is trying his damnest to get his hands on this beta so lets see.If that IS true, then great, as we can all enjoy an even better version for ps3, 360, pc, but if not and the demo is the final build, then fine, as it seems very playable, but just not the big change we wanted. I am sure it will kep us busy until WE11 comes out and we find that is THE version we had been waiting for!!!
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

cactuz said:
:lol:

All the news about PES2008 is pretty much available now.

And it is quite clear that PES2008 is

PATHETIC


But hey, at least they have aimed high and "captured" the licenses for a 3 or 4 of the all important Swedish clubs.

:lmao:
Leave and never come back.
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Ferraritim said:
Massive amount of teams will be added and massive amount of rosters will be updated.

That's the damn 25% they are talking about. Maybe some small gameplay changes like better goalkeepers, but that's it.
Click to expand...

Sorry my post was not clear, I was referring to the gameplay and the fact that not much more will be changed, maybe keepers like you have said.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

I don't believe about the 75% developement.
I slowly tend to believe that things are worse than we expected in the first place. The Swedish article did it. If it is true about no change in the ML and about the 1 vs 1 online mode, than Konami did a bad job for the second time in the last two years. The 75% developement and the NDA aparently not lifted about a lot of this game, makes me believe that this 25% left to develope is an excuse to cover how worse it actually is.
How can you need another 25% to develope in one month, where they worked about 17 months for the first 75% ? I know, tweaking things is what happens now, but that is NO 25%
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Han said:
I don't believe about the 75% developement.
I slowly tend to believe that things are worse than we expected in the first place. The Swedish article did it. If it is true about no change in the ML and about the 1 vs 1 online mode, than Konami did a bad job for the second time in the last two years. The 75% developement and the NDA aparently not lifted about a lot of this game, makes me believe that this 25% left to develope is an excuse to cover how worse it actually is.
How can you need another 25% to develope in one month, where they worked about 17 months for the first 75% ? I know, tweaking things is what happens now, but that is NO 25%
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Han, dude, I have been thinking the same thing it does not add up.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

heck, I am just as disappointed as the next person that PEs2008 isnt that dramatic jump in everything, but just as most of us here will, I'll still buy it and play it to death and no doubt enjoy it until the next version or maybe until I buy fifa08 and maybe that is better.
Doesnt matter, I will play the better game,maybe even play both, who cares, but I am not going to get all stroppy over it and throw my toys out of the pram. I will still buy Konamis next installments as well as fifas next ones as they both have good points and bad points and to be honest always will.......
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

maltonfc said:
cactuz said:
:lol:

All the news about PES2008 is pretty much available now.

And it is quite clear that PES2008 is

PATHETIC


But hey, at least they have aimed high and "captured" the licenses for a 3 or 4 of the all important Swedish clubs.

:lmao:
Leave and never come back.
Click to expand...

I guess best PS3 game of GC isn't good enough for you?

Oh I guess you've played it for hours and hours?

haha just go away to the FIFAGGOT forums
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

samba2 said:
heck, I am just as disappointed as the next person that PEs2008 isnt that dramatic jump in everything, but just as most of us here will, I'll still buy it and play it to death and no doubt enjoy it until the next version or maybe until I buy fifa08 and maybe that is better.
Doesnt matter, I will play the better game,maybe even play both, who cares, but I am not going to get all stroppy over it and throw my toys out of the pram. I will still buy Konamis next installments as well as fifas next ones as they both have good points and bad points and to be honest always will.......
Click to expand...

so honest great post that is exactly how i am feeling, but as you said i will have some fun with it on the 360 and maybe ps3 when i get it.
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

samba2 said:
heck, I am just as disappointed as the next person that PEs2008 isnt that dramatic jump in everything, but just as most of us here will, I'll still buy it and play it to death and no doubt enjoy it until the next version or maybe until I buy fifa08 and maybe that is better.
Doesnt matter, I will play the better game,maybe even play both, who cares, but I am not going to get all stroppy over it and throw my toys out of the pram. I will still buy Konamis next installments as well as fifas next ones as they both have good points and bad points and to be honest always will.......
Click to expand...


Well said, sir. :applause:

And Konami will once again profit from releasing a substandard product that plays almost identically to last years, but actually has fewer features overall.

18 months in development? They didn't even manage to port all the features of PES6, let alone add any improvements.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Perhaps PES2009 will be the complete port of PES6. Perhaps PES2010 will finally have some new features.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

Konami stealing Swedish licenses? Oh ffs, I was looking forward to finally be able to play with my Hammarby in a good FIFA game, and then Konami pulls off their first exclusive license ever? Awesome.. :(
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

cactuz said:
Well said, sir. :applause:

And Konami will once again profit from releasing a substandard product that plays almost identically to last years, but actually has fewer features overall.

18 months in development? They didn't even manage to port all the features of PES6, let alone add any improvements.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Perhaps PES2009 will be the complete port of PES6. Perhaps PES2010 will finally have some new features.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
Click to expand...

Sounds like you're describing EA lol
 
Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

cactuz said:
Well said, sir. :applause:

And Konami will once again profit from releasing a substandard product that plays almost identically to last years, but actually has fewer features overall.

18 months in development? They didn't even manage to port all the features of PES6, let alone add any improvements.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Perhaps PES2009 will be the complete port of PES6. Perhaps PES2010 will finally have some new features.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
Click to expand...


*sigh* see its that kind of sarcastic comment that just ruins this once great forum. :roll:

At least get facts straight if you are trying to be sarcastic. PES2008 is clearly an improved product over PES6 360 (which had no edits, a freaky gameplay feel, crappy online mode full of cheaters, and cut back goals) we know for a start that PES2008 has a fully featured edit mode, and plays like a "fixed" pes6. And that is what we do know at this time.

We all suspect that the chances are that PES2008 will offer marginal improvements on PES6 360 in gameplay etc, but better nonetheless. Just get over the fact that Seabass has a "if it aint broke dont fix it "policy.
Maybe we have to wait until WE11 or PES2009 next Oct before we really see the major changes.

Having said all that, there is a tiny niggling feeling that the final retail version will surprise us. Why on earth would PES2008 win the PS3 game of the Leipzig convention. The demo shows nothing to suggest it is that special. Plus what the mags told Suffwan, that their beta versions were better to play than the demo...

hey HomerSimpon. lets sod these neersayers and meet you online for a game of PES2008 when it is out! and leave them to cruise the forums to vent their distaste for all that is not fantastical, whilst we just enjoy the game for what it is- a game.
 
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Re: WE/PES 2008 Next Gen - Discussions Thread (Last Update 08/25/07)

cactuz said:
Well said, sir. :applause:

And Konami will once again profit from releasing a substandard product that plays almost identically to last years, but actually has fewer features overall.

18 months in development? They didn't even manage to port all the features of PES6, let alone add any improvements.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

Perhaps PES2009 will be the complete port of PES6. Perhaps PES2010 will finally have some new features.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:
Click to expand...

Must say I agree with this guy.

They were probably too busy developing the mobile and Wii version of the game. Look at what they've done the past 18 months. We have gone backwards in features and the gameplay only has slightly improved compared to the previous generation.
 
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