The Retro-PES Corner

[geeeeee]

It's the sign of a good manager that you are making your players accountable for their decisions. Seriously though that was very unlucky to miss out on the final, especially with that last chance. Wolves look far and away the best team in this league, how they got relegated I don't know, makes you wonder how tough D1 is going to be when you get there!

Believe me, he ( I ) had hero all over his (my) mind when he ( I ) took that shot.

Yeh Wolves are so good and they hardly pick Adama Traore. I would love the chance to buy him. In my ML tester as Leeds he was excellent for us.

By the time we get promoted Liverpool, Man City, Chelsea etc would have all been relegated by then

 

[Ermolli91]

I’ve been playing PES 5 again after so many years. I’m having a blast from it, even more than before since I only played with a keyboard and without patches.

I’m considering starting a Master League but I’m kinda turned off by the league restrictions, having only four leagues and sixteen teams per league. What I don’t understand is how you can play a proper full league in League mode but not in Master League. Maybe it’s a programming restriction, I don't know.
I’m glad that those things have been improved and now we have several second division teams, every league available from the game and so on.

Maybe I’ll just play a league and so be it.

 

[slamsoze]

While i am searching a way to play Football Kingdom, i dropped on this beautifull game, back from 2002 according to PCSX2 wikia! Seems that @MafiaMurderBag commented on this video, so he knows about this game. It seems to have some very good points, given its age, like ball physics and movement fluidity and also some very bad points like net physics, from a quick watch!
The body movement detail AND ONLY this, seems superior to FIFA and ISS/PES of the given age, 2002! Also an angle camera 9 years prior pes2011 and 18 years prion to pes2020!!

 

[Marlon Anthony]

While i am searching a way to play Football Kingdom, i dropped on this beautifull game, back from 2002 according to PCSX2 wikia! Seems that @MafiaMurderBag commented on this video, so he knows about this game. It seems to have some very good points, given its age, like ball physics and movement fluidity and also some very bad points like net physics, from a quick watch!
The body movement detail AND ONLY this, seems superior to FIFA and ISS/PES of the given age, 2002! Also an angle camera 9 years prior pes2011 and 18 years prion to pes2020!!

Yup, Fantastista is notable particularly for being not only one of the first PS2 football games in development but also for being one of the first half sophisticated ones other than Pro Evolution Soccer. FIFA 2001 isn't even a discussion.

Squaresoft have always been techincal wizards and obviously make good use of their budgets regarding visuals and authenticity. Much like Konami, Squaresoft had a perversion for detail. While it's no PES it's still ambitious and ground breaking for it's terrific motion capture animations which is still a luxury in 2002. Even more staggering is that this game isn't even on the PS2's DVD format, It's actually CD ROM so it's impressive they were able to store all that animation data and textures on such a tiny format.

Squaresoft as we know are associated with legendary JRPG's but their unorthodox foray into sports didn't just end with World Fantastista - They flirted with Pro Wrestling. And not just settling for the bishy bashy for a quick buck arcade type either, They went all out with simulation out of respect & admiration for "The Sport of Kings".

 

[geeeeee]

In my struggling ML Canvey Eagles career I have been looking for solutions on how to defend better.

Simple things are helping, in no order of importance.

1. Having at least one CB with the Defensive Line skill.
2. Keeping the SB's slightly further ahead of the CB's as they tend to be the ones that are responsible for failed offside attempts.
3. So far, playing Defensive Line A and Offside A.
4. Whack the ball with the square button when defending.
5. Balance, Header, and Jump stats are more important than the Defence stat for CB's.

I got all these tips from this forum...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/940561-pro-evolution-soccer-2008/42428264?page=1

Matches 12 and 13.

12. Huddersfield Town v Canvey Eagles

Spoiler: The Score

Huddersfield 1 v Canvey 0, defended much better in this one until injury time

The top 3 now look like this with 2 games to go.

1. Cardiff 26
2. Wolves 24
3. Aston Villa 21

Canvey v Cardiff
Wolves v Aston Villa

Will we have a say in the promotion battle?

13. Canvey Eagles v Cardiff City

Spoiler: The Score

Canvey 1 v Cardiff 1, we frustrated Cardiff with our stronger defending although we were helped with the surprise penalty miss by Cardiff's top scorer, Omar Bogle. Cardiff's fist pumping at the end indicated that they were promoted, and they were as Wolves beat Aston Villa 1-0, so Wolves are promoted too with one game to go.

 

[slamsoze]

Yup, Fantastista is notable particularly for being not only one of the first PS2 football games in development but also for being one of the first half sophisticated ones other than Pro Evolution Soccer. FIFA 2001 isn't even a discussion.

Squaresoft have always been techincal wizards and obviously make good use of their budgets regarding visuals and authenticity. Much like Konami, Squaresoft had a perversion for detail. While it's no PES it's still ambitious and ground breaking for it's terrific motion capture animations which is still a luxury in 2002. Even more staggering is that this game isn't even on the PS2's DVD format, It's actually CD ROM so it's impressive they were able to store all that animation data and textures on such a tiny format.

Squaresoft as we know are associated with legendary JRPG's but their unorthodox foray into sports didn't just end with World Fantastista - They flirted with Pro Wrestling. And not just settling for the bishy bashy for a quick buck arcade type either, They went all out with simulation out of respect & admiration for "The Sport of Kings".

I played a littile bit Fantasista, as for some reason the game is glitched and unplayable in Emulator, it shows the opponenet players shattered.

I felt amazed from the general tempo, it is slow and realistic, something very rare for early 00's!!!As reminder, all footies back then except for some PES/ISS versions, were running like Road runnder, FIFA, TIF, Ronaldo V Football, etc, etc.

Also extremelly amazing, and although i played with keyboard arrows, i felt imidiatelly the inertia and the weight of the player movement, really amazing. Ok there are bad spots, like rigid 4-direction or at best 8-direction movement in rails combined with an anchor, or some passing withhout the ball touching the foot of the player, but considering the year it was produced, they have all excused of the world!

 

[slamsoze]

And i think i found the worst clone of PES for PS2. It is a shame that it was created by SEGA, who gave also Virtual Striker!! The whole game is like they saw the first 3 minutes of PES 5 and tried to copy it in one day's effort. Even the cursor is copy-paste, where they forgot to make the backgournd trasparent! Only good thing in all this, the dynamic fatigue bar, inside stamina bar! That's a cool detail! The whole pace, tempo, physics is completelly inconsistent!

 

[Madmac79]

And i think i found the worst clone of PES for PS2. It is a shame that it was created by SEGA, who gave also Virtual Striker!! The whole game is like they saw the first 3 minutes of PES5 and tried to copy it in one day's effort. Even the cursor is copy-paste. Only good thing in all this, the dynamic fatigue bar, inside stamina bar! That's a cool detail! The whole pace, tempo, physics is completelly inconsistent!

Feels like the Bizzarro version of Pes 5 indeed.

Just look at the net physics, I can hardly think about a more anticlimatic way to see a goal

 

[MadbaLL]

it looks interesting.

i like those graphics with lens flares, cool cutscenes, players' info.

 

[slamsoze]

it looks interesting.

i like those graphics with lens flares, cool cutscenes, players' info.

If you are talking about Virtua Pro, unfortunately only the details and the dynamic fatigue/stamina system look interesting.
The gameplay is really bad.

 

[slamsoze]

Anyway and in any case I finally succeed to emulate Football Kingdom thanks to a very good YouTube channel, that has very interesting info for football games, modern and retro. Just to give you a tip, if anyone interested, in the retro ps2 games videos, he usually pins a comment with very usefull " information"
https://www.youtube.com/user/sussuworldbr

 

[mattmid]

4. Whack the ball with the square button when defending.

The technical stuff is always the best

 

[miguelfcp]

@Ermolli: Retro-PES titles were so prescient and ahead of their time that their MLs reproduced a reality that didn't (and doesn't) even exist, but I bet it will before the next decade: the European Superleague. (Plus, in the future the licensing laws will be even stricter, so strict that not even real players will be allowed to use their real names, hence going for Roberto Larcos, Radolno, Ponto Vera, etc to avoid a lawsuit).
Think about the PES Points instead of real money on the ML: it foreshadows the predicted collapse of the dollar and the rise of a new, virtual currency - bitcoin?

@geeeeee: Interesting ideas there. I totally agree with the 4th point; in fact it was my PES08 PS2 experience that convinced me to stop trying to build-up play from the back everytime I got possession back, rather do as you say and -it away.
Though your 3-striker formation looks great offensively, have you tried replacing a striker with a SMF/CMF to strengthen your midfield, particularly when defending? To me it looks like you don't have enough men to help your defense.
I don't agree with the guy who says Def is not as important as it's thought to be. I remember getting Jackson the newgen CB (who later on evolved to a whooping 95-Def, but started off as being already much better than any of the Defaults on my team) and he single-handedly transformed our team from D2 garbage to D1 and WEFA Championships-winning side.
I also remember going up against +95 DEF players like Maldini/Barth and the like and they were defensive Gods on the pitch. DEF to me is the player's defensive-IQ, a hugely important stat.

Anyway, this is what's great about PES08 PS2. There is no winning formula: you have to study your players' stats carefully and then figure out a way to tie it all together in a collective strategy that works.

@slamsoze: Ah, the Wild West Era of the PS2 football gaming scene. Lots of newcomers trying to emulate PES' success, going for a piece of the pie. Yes, that gold rush produced some spectacular, laughable failures, though some like Football Kingdom actually were able to implement some interesting ideas; but most of all, there was variety, which kept FIFA and PES on its toes. How sad is the scene nowadays: the only two football games left have swallowed up the whole market: but 'victory has defeated them', for their success left them lethargic, now decaying, and that's fine for them because there's no one else around to challenge them.
Very interested to hear your thoughts on Football Kingdom by the way. I was impressed with it after playing the game for the first time ever recently; had they built upon it, a couple of iterations later and it would definitely be able to compete with its contemporary FIFA and PES.

 

[mattmid]

I have got back to my Bronshoj league (within ML) on 2013 this week and I'm now playing rather than just acting as coach. An excellent 4-3 win after coming from 1-2 and 2-3 down was dampened slightly as I had mistaken the team I was playing, Vejgaard, for VSK Aarhus who were first at the time compared to Vejgaard who were bottom. Still a win is a win and the manner of it was great. With the lads buoyant from the win we followed this up with an embarrassing 3-0 home defeat. Words were said in the dressing room. Most of them had four letters.

Next up was a very difficult midweek first round cup tie against Fremad Amager, a decent side in the league above. With the fatigue just beginning to show and another tough game against a top 3 team to come afterwards it was time for some of the fringe players to get their chance.

The writing was on the wall after 2 minutes when they went 1-0 up with their first attack. However on 10 minutes a nicely clipped ball into the box by captain Mads Ronne evaded the defender and Therkildssen got his foot to it at the far post steering it home for the equaliser. Within five minutes Fremad Amager were ahead again. With a bit of keystone kops defending it was soon 3-1 and two minutes later a second yellow card for Norrestrand ended his outing after just 31 minutes. Two more yellow cards swiftly followed and one of them was very lucky not to get a second, with an awful challenge just after his booking that fortunately was so late it missed!

It's fair to say Fremad got on top from this point (if they weren't already anyway!) but personally I thought we were in it until their 6th went in.

Spoiler: Final score/stats

I did have my reserve keeper in goal but there wasn't a lot he could do with most of them and made a couple of decent saves too. I did way too much pressing early on, not only wearing out my players but also getting punished by leaving myself open. They were too good compared to my team to be doing that as recklessly as I was. Once I went down to 10 it was just a case of keeping the scoring down. Something as you can see I did rather well at!

Anyway, I've kept up my ML tradition of not winning any cup games (even if this effectively just a league mode) so that's nice! Next up away to Holbaek.

Spoiler: Table

 

[rockstrongo]

I have got back to my Bronshoj league (within ML) on 2013 this week and I'm now playing rather than just acting as coach. An excellent 4-3 win after coming from 1-2 and 2-3 down was dampened slightly as I had mistaken the team I was playing, Vejgaard, for VSK Aarhus who were first at the time compared to Vejgaard who were bottom. Still a win is a win and the manner of it was great. With the lads buoyant from the win we followed this up with an embarrassing 3-0 home defeat. Words were said in the dressing room. Most of them had four letters.

Next up was a very difficult midweek first round cup tie against Fremad Amager, a decent side in the league above. With the fatigue just beginning to show and another tough game against a top 3 team to come afterwards it was time for some of the fringe players to get their chance.

The writing was on the wall after 2 minutes when they went 1-0 up with their first attack. However on 10 minutes a nicely clipped ball into the box by captain Mads Ronne evaded the defender and Therkildssen got his foot to it at the far post steering it home for the equaliser. Within five minutes Fremad Amager were ahead again. With a bit of keystone kops defending it was soon 3-1 and two minutes later a second yellow card for Norrestrand ended his outing after just 31 minutes. Two more yellow cards swiftly followed and one of them was very lucky not to get a second, with an awful challenge just after his booking that fortunately was so late it missed!

It's fair to say Fremad got on top from this point (if they weren't already anyway!) but personally I thought we were in it until their 6th went in.

Spoiler: Final score/stats

View attachment 47373

I did have my reserve keeper in goal but there wasn't a lot he could do with most of them and made a couple of decent saves too. I did way too much pressing early on, not only wearing out my players but also getting punished by leaving myself open. They were too good compared to my team to be doing that as recklessly as I was. Once I went down to 10 it was just a case of keeping the scoring down. Something as you can see I did rather well at!

Anyway, I've kept up my ML tradition of not winning any cup games (even if this effectively just a league mode) so that's nice! Next up away to Holbaek.

Spoiler: Table

View attachment 47375

This means you're Michael Madsen!
I'm reaching here,but you might get the reference

 

[mattmid]

This means you're Michael Madsen!
I'm reaching here,but you might get the reference

I know the guy but I'm struggling to get it, going to need some help! By the way you might like this OF when I've finished it, it's Scandinavian based, both Swedish leagues are in, including some team called Hammarby you might have heard of.

 

[rockstrongo]

I know the guy but I'm struggling to get it, going to need some help! By the way you might like this OF when I've finished it, it's Scandinavian based, both Swedish leagues are in, including some team called Hammarby you might have heard of.

Aah,Hammarby!
A tall Swedish has trained with us all spring,not very talented though,Zlatan is His name I think!

Cool optionfile,sounds promising.

Yeah Michael Madsen is their current manager (Brunshöj) not to be confused with the actor.

 

[mattmid]

Ah ok now I get it. There's me trying to tie the actor to it That striker's name rings a bell...

I suppose he'll want to end his career there now he part owns the club? Does that mean he'd be paying himself?

 

[Madmac79]

Regarding old Playstation titles, do you guys remember Uefa Champions League by Eidos? Back in the days, when I still had to get a Psx, I ended up playing a bunch of games with the 98/99 one at a friend's home and being absolutely shocked at how good it felt, my impression being like it was almost on par with Iss Pro 98.

Between yesterday and today I gave a small go to the whole saga (2 Psx game and a Ps2 one, although this last one was made by Taito) just for the sake of it and well, of course my judgement wasn't remotely clear headed as, no need to say, between the two titles there are galaxies, however 98/99 does still have a remote charm to me.. maybe that as a simple, unpretentious arcade it has a decent feel, maybe the weather that influences the field or the fact that you can tweak a referee leniency slider (the irony of having this in an average football game more than 20 years old and not today.. meh). Far from being the masterpiece I thought it was as a kid, but still worth to re-try it.

Bonus: had no idea Turk from Scrubs played for Inter before becoming a doctor!

Spoiler

The other two titles were more disappointing, especially the Ps2 one, that felt super soulless to me. The Wild West Era (loved this definition, Miguel!) produced a lot of monsters and very little to remember, indeed.

 

[slamsoze]

Regarding old Playstation titles, do you guys remember Uefa Champions League by Eidos? Back in the days, when I still had to get a Psx, I ended up playing a bunch of games with the 98/99 one at a friend's home and being absolutely shocked at how good it felt, my impression being like it was almost on par with Iss Pro 98.

Between yesterday and today I gave a small go to the whole saga (2 Psx game and a Ps2 one, although this last one was made by Taito) just for the sake of it and well, of course my judgement wasn't remotely clear headed as, no need to say, between the two titles there are galaxies, however 98/99 does still have a remote charm to me.. maybe that as a simple, unpretentious arcade it has a decent feel, maybe the weather that influences the field or the fact that you can tweak a referee leniency slider (the irony of having this in an average football game more than 20 years old and not today.. meh). Far from being the masterpiece I thought it was as a kid, but still worth to re-try it.

Bonus: had no idea Turk from Scrubs played for Inter before becoming a doctor!

Spoiler

View attachment 47399

The other two titles were more disappointing, especially the Ps2 one, that felt super soulless to me. The Wild West Era (loved this definition, Miguel!) produced a lot of monsters and very little to remember, indeed.

Nice info mate. Always though those CL titles were some EA products, aka FIFA 99 rip-off. Now that I know it is Eidos, I will give them a go.
@miguelfcp your blog, libero magazine is down?

 

[rockstrongo]

Ah ok now I get it. There's me trying to tie the actor to it That striker's name rings a bell...

I suppose he'll want to end his career there now he part owns the club? Does that mean he'd be paying himself?

Free meals and Wunderbaums for his Ferraris I think?

 

[fernando]

While i am searching a way to play Football Kingdom, i dropped on this beautifull game, back from 2002 according to PCSX2 wikia! Seems that @MafiaMurderBag commented on this video, so he knows about this game. It seems to have some very good points, given its age, like ball physics and movement fluidity and also some very bad points like net physics, from a quick watch!
The body movement detail AND ONLY this, seems superior to FIFA and ISS/PES of the given age, 2002! Also an angle camera 9 years prior pes2011 and 18 years prion to pes2020!!

I did a very basic translation of this game like 4 days ago, but it doesn't work properly on PCSX2 :/

 

[slamsoze]

I did a very basic translation of this game like 4 days ago, but it doesn't work properly on PCSX2 :/

Hello Fernando. For Fantasista or for Football Kingdom?
If you are speaking about Fantasista, yeah shamme anyone I have asked until now says the game is glitched in PCSX2. Unfortunately all Opponents are displayed like Shuma-Gorath.

If you are referring to Football Kingdom, although I browsed the most dark and questionable places of the internet to find it, at least I can confirm that everyone credited you as the translator. I hope it is truelly your work and not use you for click bait.

 

[fernando]

Hello Fernando. For Fantasista or for Football Kingdom?
If you are speaking about Fantasista, yeah shamme anyone I have asked until now says the game is glitched in PCSX2. Unfortunately all Opponents are displayed like Shuma-Gorath.

If you are referring to Football Kingdom, although I browsed the most dark and questionable places of the internet to find it, at least I can confirm that everyone credited you as the translator. I hope it is truelly your work and not use you for click bait.

I was talking of World Fantasista, but FK patch is coming along nice. I'm sorry for taking so long. I'll try to make it happen this month. Yeah bout credits, thank you mate! really really appreciate it!!


edit: btw hahah the glicth in WF is like Dhalsim mode all the players are distorted and fu...ed up

 

[slamsoze]

I was talking of World Fantasista, but FK patch is coming along nice. I'm sorry for taking so long. I'll try to make it happen this month. Yeah bout credits, thank you mate! really really appreciate it!!

Ah OK. Nice that you worked on Fantasista, I appreciate that we share similar football taste!
As for your FK project, it is OK and cool, don't push your self or feel pressed. Take all the time you want and be comfort. Either way, after reading about your projects on the early Winning Eleven games, you are already a living legend for the community

Even if you never finish it, it is still OK. Additionally we can always "exploit" your knowledge on Japanese and request you to make some translation for historical JRPGs that were never localized for West, like Mother 3, Digimon Story Lost Evolution, etc... I'm just kidding here!

 

[Early PES footy fan]

I've recently begun playing Pro Evo 5 again. Bought it for PC again last year, having played it a lot in 2005 before moving onto 6. I love it, but there are a few frustrating things that have bothered me from the start and sometimes drive me spare- as others have mentioned, there aren't enough yellow cards, so that computer teams will regularly foul me repeatedly, disrupt my play and not pay a meaningful price for it (often I wish the ref would just play advantage, I struggle to even keep possession from free kicks much of the time). It can be as many as 20 fouls against me in a match, with perhaps one yellow card! It is so rare to see a red card in this game that I cannot remember the last time the computer even received one.

The other thing is the stadiums, always virtually empty even if you are top of the league (running down the byline, scrolling past rows of empty seats is really bad for my immersion). I may be slightly exaggerating, do they get fuller for cup finals? I don't take enough notice, perhaps.

I've seen others on this forum talk about altering stats for players so that everyone is much slower, has lower agility or other alterations, and also changing the crowd graphics and introducing new camera angles. Is there an idiot guide to making these changes? I have struggled to find much on the internet and also I am years out of practice in installing mods etc. (used to be quite good as I had more practice).

Anyway, I've done a few seasons of a Master League. I created my own team called Garda Sportiva, giving them a vaguely AC Milan style kit of red and black stripes coupled with white shorts. Regretfully, I chose a rather garish blue for the away kit which I try not to use! I created a team because I am not keen on most of the standard kits, and I also wanted to try bolstering the meagre starting squad with more players to mitigate the problem of fatigue, while jettisoning many of the squad which I didn't like using much (interestingly, I notice loads of people speak highly of Macco. Despite some good stats, he never really captured my imagination and I didn't play well with him). I tried not to add anyone too exceptional, but to be honest I picked up a very important player in Barcao. Having always been fond of the original line up, I did in any case find it hard to replace a lot of the starting eleven with these slightly superior imports. I am not sure if all the players I brought in are even real, but certainly they are not from top clubs. They are, with primary positions and nationalities indicated:

GK- Como (Ita)
SB- Balestri (Ita)
SB- Ziliotto (Ita)
CMF- Colucci (Ita)
AMF- Parravicini (Ita)
AMF- Iujimano (Ita)
CF- Ruagelo (Ita)
CF- Barcao (Bra)

As you can see I tried to go with mainly Italian players since my club has an Italian name (I also went with a modest ground of a design which reminds me of many smaller Italian grounds such as those used in the 1990s by Cagliari and Bologna; I think it is one of the training grounds but cannot recall the name). Barcao, who I think normally plays for Sao Paolo in the game, was my flair player, a generic South American forward who could play on the wing as well. I recently have been paying more attention, when assessing players, to their special abilities (if they have any) as well as the normal stats. Barcao has dribbling, one touch passing and outside (which means how well he curls it with the outside of the foot). I like to buy Barota and did so halfway through the first season at 17 years old, as he was a huge favourite of mine from my first Master League experiences with PES 3 on the PS2 (which I no longer have). Interestingly, his special ability is scoring, which perhaps explains why he seems to perform better than his stats would lead one to expect.

I'll save you the details (of which I cannot remember many), but I am in my fifth season now. After a slow start I recovered to gain promotion (think I did the Div 2 league and cup double), with my top scorer Barcao on 6 league goals. I came about third in my first Div 1 campaign, with Barcao playing mostly on the wing and only netting twice in the league, though he was instrumental to my play and only Minanda was more of a stalwart of the side (my primary penalty taker, he also managed to add some non-set piece goals and was my top scorer in the league with about 9). In that year, I reached the Div 1 cup final against Rangers, and after going 2-0 up early doors, managed to squander the lead with some really careless defending. I lost on penalties, frustratingly. It was a fine year though and included a memorable 6-0 thrashing of Peloponnisos (who have been something of a bogey team for me since, sadly). The following year I won the title and Div 1 cup, with Barcao finishing as top scorer with 18. I made a good first go in the Champions League, but went out to Juve in the quarters. Last season, I won the title again and the Champions League, having bested Real Madrid, Roma and finally Bayern Munich. I failed to reach the final of the Div 1 cup though. Barcao again managed a good tally with 14 league goals, but Barota went one better with 15 and was the top scorer in the league (though he hit a dry spell in the last quarter of the season).

I talked about Macco earlier and favourite players. My favourites are Stremer, Ceciu (both quite reliable), Valeny (versatile, quite quick at CB), Espimas (power shots, decent stamina and strength making him helpful on attack and defence), Ximilez (good dribbler and crosser), Minanda (the orchestrator!), Castolo (good in the air, decent pace), Barota (good height, strength and a scoring knack that is hard to beat) and Huylens (excellent shooting accuracy and- crucially- good response, so he is quick off the mark to reach passes and loose balls).

 

[fernando]

Even if you never finish it, it is still OK. Additionally we can always "exploit" your knowledge on Japanese and request you to make some translation for historical JRPGs that were never localized for West, like Mother 3, Digimon Story Lost Evolution, etc... I'm just kidding here!

I did some stuff but its way over my little knowledge and skills. I admire the teams at romhacking doing the rpg translations.

 

[Flipper the Priest]

Aah,Hammarby!
A tall Swedish has trained with us all spring,not very talented though,Zlatan is His name I think!

Cool optionfile,sounds promising.

Yeah Michael Madsen is their current manager (Brunshöj) not to be confused with the actor.

That name takes me back. In one of the EA manager games (they had their charms, and also their major flaws) about 20 years ago, players attributes would literally change overnight. Michael Madsen was one who would go from mediocrity to superstar in 24 hours. You could take him from Bari for about £1m and his overall rating was about 68. A few months down the line, bang: 95, worth about £20m. There were a few players affected by it but none more pronounced that him. My mate and I would toss a coin at the start of our two player games to see who had first dibs, or make a gentlemen's agreement not to sign him at all.

Other flaws in that game:

• If you agreed a swap deal with a club and personal terms with your transfer target, you'd get them for free if the outgoing player couldn't agree terms with the other team.
• Clubs would have two keepers, tops. Hence the CPU playing Steve McManaman in goals for Real Madrid in the Champions League final one time.

Still didn't stop us being up to 4am on a Friday night/Saturday morning high as kites off Danish wingers and Irn Bru.

 

[Flipper the Priest]

Looking at @Chris Davies's PES 2014 thread, I'm compelled to ask: what's the best jumping off point for PES on PS3? No doubt the completist in me means I'll buy them all at some point, but for now, to play, where's the best place to start? It seems that 2012, 2013 and 2014 are held the most dear.

Of course, this is my return to the PS3. I started in 2007 with PES 2008...

 

[Chris Davies]

Looking at @Chris Davies's PES 2014 thread, I'm compelled to ask: what's the best jumping off point for PES on PS3? No doubt the completist in me means I'll buy them all at some point, but for now, to play, where's the best place to start? It seems that 2012, 2013 and 2014 are held the most dear.

2013 is great. It's fun, PES-style. I wouldn't say it's the most realistic, and it's a little fast (and a little end-to-end with the ball glued to your feet too often for my liking). But, individuality really shines in terms of how attributes are applied to passes and shots - and tactically you can see the changes they make. Tactics do have genuine importance, and planning out your strategy helps. The ML is fun too, although the AI can be a little cheaty.

For me, 2014 (v1.13 and v1.16) takes all of that, slows it down, applies real physics to it (which introduces some funny bugs, but not often) and removes most of the scripting, whilst keeping tactics important (if I don't man-mark real dangers, I tend to lose badly).

*** Major caveat - on PS3, you can't connect to the servers to download the DPs any more (including the "Road to World Cup" mode I mention). I'm not even sure if you can download the latest gameplay patches, but I'm assuming they're hosted on Sony's end rather than Konami's. Could be wrong. ***

The best bits are simply the things I'm not used to having in football games any more. Which is fucked up, when you see how basic this list is:

I love getting such a variety in results. I love that I can (and need to) rotate my squad for a match against some bottom-of-the-league team, and still win. Normally with PES, you get punished incredibly harshly for that. I love that with the physics it has, sometimes I have to stretch to win a ball, and with the wrong player (and if the attacking player turns at the last second), you could end up getting a red card. I never get red cards any more, unless it's on purpose.

I love that, as Fulham, I get humped by Man United, and I hump Norwich, but when I play Stoke, they hit me with long balls, score, and then keep the ball out of danger. In modern games, it would be reversed - and it would all be accomplished with the same patterns (long ball from defender to striker, chests it, 180-turn-shot, goal). In the modern games, players have more individuality when you control them, than when the AI controls them.

On top of all that... I love love love the Road to World Cup mode, or as they've called it for legal reasons, the World Challenge. That really takes me back, but also, it's great to play as (and against) a variety of different teams (with a variety of different qualification styles for each continent).

What I don't love...

It's buggy. You'll see the odd, crazy own goal, and the odd player running out of touch for no reason. Response times are genuinely (IMO) the same as 2020's - but not always. The catch-up bug is mad (but can be modded on PC). Individuality could be much better (again, can be modded on PC).

The ML is so barebones it's sad. There's one bit I really like, actually - there are no scouts or anything like that, but there's one giant list of "players it would be realistic for you to sign". If you limit yourself to that list alone, your transfers are pretty realistic. But the values are absolutely tiny (even though you don't get tons of money, so it's not a broken financial system).

There are barely any stadiums. Atmosphere is better than 2020 in some cases (the national teams seem to have their own, real chants), but largely it's pretty poor. The real, recreated faces are honestly dreadful, but the "generic" faces are 100x worse. Like a playschool kid made a clay model of their teacher, then sat on it by accident, then tried to remake it, then took it home, the dog ran off with it in its mouth, the kid wrestled it off the dog, rebuilt it again, and the dad went "I'm going to import that into my 3D modelling software and spruce it up maybe 10%". Then he ran out of time.

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And if I'm going off on a tangent here... Their representation of black players, is "a white man painted black".

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