The England Topic

zidane has had some good touches but apart from that he really hasnt been close to some of his old performances. i remeber games like the quarter final in 2000 and for me that was basically footballing perfection. hes still the greatest player in the world imo, but i can understand where jacks coming from as he hasnt really been a touch on his old self ... so far.
 
Last night on BBC at half-time, they showed examples of Rooney's all-round ability. They focused on him dropping deep to pick the ball up, and showed 4 seperate occasions he did this in the first half, which is fair enough. Never made much mention that he played a terrible pass in 3 out of the 4 examples shown and the whole move broke down due to his bad play though.

He's a 'good' player, to compare him to Pele is a disgrace and an insult. He's scored against Croatia and Switzerland FFS, get a grip!
 
ClassicD said:
Last night on BBC at half-time, they showed examples of Rooney's all-round ability. They focused on him dropping deep to pick the ball up, and showed 4 seperate occasions he did this in the first half, which is fair enough. Never made much mention that he played a terrible pass in 3 out of the 4 examples shown and the whole move broke down due to his bad play though.

He's a 'good' player, to compare him to Pele is a disgrace and an insult. He's scored against Croatia and Switzerland FFS, get a grip!
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why not compare him to someone like Pele, lol people act like Pele never made bad passes or cocked things up, FFS Rooney started playing in one of the top leagues in Europe at 16, and is now top scorer in the second biggest tourney after the WC.

as for only scoring against Croatia and the Swiss, lol ya man larrson scored a couple against feckin bulgaria and everyone raves about that, so Rooney deserves all the credit he's getting IMO.
 
Yes but Larsson's done it in many tournaments, and he's also played a game less than Rooney so far. Rooney is a good player but he's far, far from one of the top players in the world.

Vonlanthen is even younger than Rooney, and he scored against France, but he's just another player to the people in this country.
 
ClassicD said:
Yes but Larsson's done it in many tournaments, and he's also played a game less than Rooney so far. Rooney is a good player but he's far, far from one of the top players in the world.

Vonlanthen is even younger than Rooney, and he scored against France, but he's just another player to the people in this country.
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How is he far far from being a top player in the world today, he's out performing your Totti's, Figo's even Henry (until he scored last nite) your only as good as your last game, he's on the big stage and doing his thing, that makes him the hottest prospect in Europe right now, trust, if Cassano had performed half as good as Rooney has, the Italians would be creaming themselves.

LOL how the feck do you know what the swiss make of the young player, and there is a big difference between just scoring a goal and knocking 4 goals in three games.
 
This Rooney crap is getting on my nerves. I admit he's one of the start of the tournie, I think Nedved, Poborsky and Zidane have been better IMO. And JB, you better stick to watching 24 mate, because Zidane being 'dire' is a joke. Easy header? It's not his fault the goalie flapped, so can we all blame the Croatia defence and Chocolate wrists in goals for last night's goals?


FD
 
fd1972uk said:
This Rooney crap is getting on my nerves. I admit he's one of the start of the tournie, I think Nedved, Poborsky and Zidane have been better IMO.
FD
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its all relative, Rooney has been just as important (if not more) to England as the players you mentioned have been to their teams so why shouldnt a big deal be made.
 
Yeah your right, but are you trying to say that these countries are going overboard like they are with Rooney. FFS I heard Adrian Durham on radio say he's the best in Europe at this moment. That is bullshit, he did nothing apart from a run against France and has shown well against the Swiss and Croats who for me have been very poor opposition. Maybe I'll change my mind after the other players I've mentioned have played the same amount of games as him.


FD
 
Vannizzlefashizzal said:
How is he far far from being a top player in the world today, he's out performing your Totti's, Figo's even Henry (until he scored last nite) your only as good as your last game, he's on the big stage and doing his thing, that makes him the hottest prospect in Europe right now, trust, if Cassano had performed half as good as Rooney has, the Italians would be creaming themselves.

LOL how the feck do you know what the swiss make of the young player, and there is a big difference between just scoring a goal and knocking 4 goals in three games.
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What's he done Vann? He's scored against Switzerland and Croatia, hardly great teams. He's not been able to play in Europe for his club so he can't prove anything at the highest club stage yet either, and don't say the Premiership because he's not got a good goalscoring record there and it's night and day compared to European club football anyway. He's scored 4 goals and had one good run at the France defense, Nedved, Poborsky, Baros, Zlatan, Larsson, Vicente have all been as good if not better than him, IMO.

Cassano played brilliantly against Sweden, the Italians aren't creaming themselves over him because he's only played one match and he's been doing it over this season with Roma already.

I never mentioned what the Swiss think of Vonlanthen, I said to people in this country Vonlanthen is just an average young player. The press here make as big a deal as possible as they can about Rooney's age, I'm pointing out this boy is even younger and there's hardly a peep. Ok, granted he's only got one goal and Rooney has four, but his goal came against much better quality of opposition, and it's also the only game he's started in.

Comparing Rooney to Pele is a joke because he hasn't got half the technical ability that player had. It's like the whole England team, there's not a player in there who can compare with even the technical quality of someone like Patrick Vieira, who himself is nothing compared to the 'star' players in the world. Rooney has played well so far and of course is one of the stand-outs, but the frenzy over him is way over the top. For example Everton slapping a value of £50m on his head, if he's worth that then Zidane is worth £300m.
 
fd1972uk said:
Yeah your right, but are you trying to say that these countries are going overboard like they are with Rooney. FFS I heard Adrian Durham on radio say he's the best in Europe at this moment. That is bullshit, he did nothing apart from a run against France and has shown well against the Swiss and Croats who for me have been very poor opposition. Maybe I'll change my mind after the other players I've mentioned have played the same amount of games as him.


FD
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im starting to think that there is a HUGE bias against England :) , for you guys that dont think rooney is playing incredible, I dont think you watch the games... he has been superb, he comes back to midfield, keeps possesion, he makes dangerous runs with the ball at attackers, AND he sets up other teamates, oh wait, and he has 4 goals!!!!! Please go back and watch the matches if you can, he is in top form right now..
 
lets be fair Rooney is producing on the pitch which is what matters
all these so called 'experts' and commentators are at fault at going overboard about the guy
its obvious that Rooney is a very important player for england but its also important not to keep building him up too much (i know thats the way the media and press are but this shouldnt be the case)
I just hope that Rooney keeps his feet on the ground and doesnt believe the hype. otherwise it WILL all end in tears and that wouldnt be fair for someone with such a talent
 
Oh I am a bias c**t, you ain't catching me out there. But I still stand by what I say. I forgot to add Baros to that list too, he's been great too. And the Czech's and Swede's have come from a far more difficult group than England. He's been brilliant, I ain't doubting that, but the media are going beserk. CS, sorry mate your in America so I don't think you really have a valid opinion from what is going on the TV and radio, unless your over here?


FD
 
csaunders said:
fd1972uk said:
Yeah your right, but are you trying to say that these countries are going overboard like they are with Rooney. FFS I heard Adrian Durham on radio say he's the best in Europe at this moment. That is bullshit, he did nothing apart from a run against France and has shown well against the Swiss and Croats who for me have been very poor opposition. Maybe I'll change my mind after the other players I've mentioned have played the same amount of games as him.


FD
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im starting to think that there is a HUGE bias against England :) , for you guys that dont think rooney is playing incredible, I dont think you watch the games... he has been superb, he comes back to midfield, keeps possesion, he makes dangerous runs with the ball at attackers, AND he sets up other teamates, oh wait, and he has 4 goals!!!!! Please go back and watch the matches if you can, he is in top form right now..
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Wha.......? Two Scotch boys being biased against England......no. Sorry. You have it wrong there Mr Saunders.

By the way who was top scorer in Euro 2000? Or to put it another way Toto who?
 
I think he is maybe saying being top scorer doesn't make you a great, with the reference to Toto Schillachi? Or else I dunno what he's on about.
 
ClassicD said:
I never mentioned what the Swiss think of Vonlanthen, I said to people in this country Vonlanthen is just an average young player.
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Like said there's been no real hype over Vonlanthen but I see him as hot property next season, especially with him leading the line for PSV in both league and europe.

As for Rooney like I always say overhyped and overrated, it wasn't too long ago(ok it was) that Owen ripped through the Argentina defence and scored one of the best World Cup goals, but look at him now.

Sven: "He is not just a goalscorer, he is a complete footballer."
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HAHAHA good one, yeah.

"There was Pele in 1958 in Sweden but I don't remember anybody at 18 years since then.
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I guess when you're being paid 4 million a year it can do strange things to your memory.
 
ClassicD said:
Comparing Rooney to Pele is a joke because he hasn't got half the technical ability that player had. It's like the whole England team, there's not a player in there who can compare with even the technical quality of someone like Patrick Vieira, who himself is nothing compared to the 'star' players in the world.
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Steven Gerrard is better than Viera and how many full matchs have u seen of Pele CD? also how would Pele fair without all the other Legends around him?

Mmmmmmm
 
Steven Gerrard does not have the technical ability that Patrick Vieira does IMO, I've seen Vieira use lovely dribbling (at times). I've seen plenty of Pele from 1970, and on various shows about his life.
 
So Coopz are you saying he's better than Pele? And Gerrard better than Viera? The shite count is clocking up.


FD
 
csaunders said:
im starting to think that there is a HUGE bias against England :) , for you guys that dont think rooney is playing incredible, I dont think you watch the games... he has been superb, he comes back to midfield, keeps possesion, he makes dangerous runs with the ball at attackers, AND he sets up other teamates, oh wait, and he has 4 goals!!!!! Please go back and watch the matches if you can, he is in top form right now..
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But hes played against teams with woefully poor defences. Switzerland have Bernt Hass, thats right Bernt Hass playing in their defence. This guy is a useless defender, he's a Sunderland reject who can barely get a game at West Brom (who were in div 1 last season). You have to ask yourself the question, would there be that much fuss if he'd scored 2 against say West Brom?? The Croat defence isnt much better than Switzerland... they were playing with a reserve goalie and by the second half had pushed right up the pitch in an attempt to put pressure on the English. This is like watching people type endless comments about how Freddy Adu is the next Pele when in fact hes yet to face anyhting like a decent defence.

Once Rooney scores regularly against decent defences then he might be a world class player. He hasnt faced a decent defence in this tournament, if the French had played Mexes instead of Sylvestre then it might have been different. Put him up against decent clever defenders like Nesta, Cannavaro etc and then see how he does. To be honest put him up against a well organised defence even say like the Dutch or Swedes and how he does when he is properly marked and is closed down quickly.

He is not as good as Gazza was in Italia 90, so comparing him with Maradona, Cryjiff, or Klinsmann isnt really true.
 
Put it this way, so far Wayne Rooney has been playing better than ANYONE in the french team, fact. England have been playing better than France, fact. Rooney is THE best player of the tournament so far, anyone who says otherwise knows they are wrong.
 
yep your right, also black is white, the world is in fact flat and Nedved, Robben, C. Ronaldo and Ibrahimovic dont exist
 
Just love this quote from today's Guardian :D :

The Guardian said:
He made his name as a predator but has not scored any of England's eight goals. Rooney has half of them and gives the impression there are more to come. Owen, once the baby-faced assassin, has had to make way for Rooney, the assassin-faced baby.
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http://football.guardian.co.uk/euro2004/comment/story/0,14584,1244469,00.html

But seriously, for the first time in a long time (My memories surpass me when Gascoigne came into the scene in Italia'90), I'm really excited about the England team. What I really liked about yesterday that even when 1-0 down, they didn't resort to the good ol' long ball hoofing but played patient, possession football. I was pleasantly shocked last night - not by the scoreline but more by the way that they had reacted to the early goal.

The way things stand, Portugal should really be fearing England - I just really hope that the guys don't let this get to their heads before Thursday. Hopefully they can learn from last night that possession play really does play off :mrgreen: 8)
 
ClassicD said:
I think he is maybe saying being top scorer doesn't make you a great, with the reference to Toto Schillachi? Or else I dunno what he's on about.
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Exactly - being Pele will take some time, Sven's point may have been the effect on a tournament from one so young.
 
freddyboy said:
cfdh_edmundo said:
He is not as good as Gazza was in Italia 90, so comparing him with Maradona, Cryjiff, or Klinsmann isnt really true.
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Klinsmann? Who compared him to Klinsmann?
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Well i figured that if people are comparing him to Pele, whom most consider to be the best in the world, then they are effectivly saying he's amongst the worlds greatest players. Personally I think that Maradona was better than Pele, and I think Klinsmann was the best striker of recent (past 15 or so years) football... I was saying Rooney is notas good as him, so why compare him with Pele or any of the other greats.
 
people are missing the point he didnt say Rooney was as good as Pele. Eriksson is saying that he hasnt seen one so young have an effect on a major tournament like this since Pele.
 
stesh said:
England have been playing better than France, fact.
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How do you add that up? England's best game as a team so far was last night...have you been watching the France games? Not exactly playing at their highest level but they've been better than England by far.

Rooney is THE best player of the tournament so far, anyone who says otherwise knows they are wrong.
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When he comes against better opposition then i'll think about that again...
 
Sabac Red said:
stesh said:
England have been playing better than France, fact.
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How do you add that up? England's best game as a team so far was last night...have you been watching the France games? Not exactly playing at their highest level but they've been better than England by far.
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:mrgreen: LOL...........I thought that first one from Stesh was a classic. "England have been playing better than France, fact.", we'll just ignore the bit about them winning the group though. :mrgreen: Stupid c**t.


FD
 
cfdh_edmundo said:
csaunders said:
im starting to think that there is a HUGE bias against England :) , for you guys that dont think rooney is playing incredible, I dont think you watch the games... he has been superb, he comes back to midfield, keeps possesion, he makes dangerous runs with the ball at attackers, AND he sets up other teamates, oh wait, and he has 4 goals!!!!! Please go back and watch the matches if you can, he is in top form right now..
Click to expand...

But hes played against teams with woefully poor defences. Switzerland have Bernt Hass, thats right Bernt Hass playing in their defence. This guy is a useless defender, he's a Sunderland reject who can barely get a game at West Brom (who were in div 1 last season). You have to ask yourself the question, would there be that much fuss if he'd scored 2 against say West Brom?? The Croat defence isnt much better than Switzerland... they were playing with a reserve goalie and by the second half had pushed right up the pitch in an attempt to put pressure on the English. This is like watching people type endless comments about how Freddy Adu is the next Pele when in fact hes yet to face anyhting like a decent defence.

Once Rooney scores regularly against decent defences then he might be a world class player. He hasnt faced a decent defence in this tournament, if the French had played Mexes instead of Sylvestre then it might have been different. Put him up against decent clever defenders like Nesta, Cannavaro etc and then see how he does. To be honest put him up against a well organised defence even say like the Dutch or Swedes and how he does when he is properly marked and is closed down quickly.

He is not as good as Gazza was in Italia 90, so comparing him with Maradona, Cryjiff, or Klinsmann isnt really true.
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Frances defense is woefull??!?!?!?!!?!? Not sure your point mate..... Rooney tore up Frances defense, and croatia are not the swiss, Tudor anyone!?!?!? Simic?!!??! They have some class in the back, not Italy mind you, but they are not the Swiss. Silvestre is a very good defender, not sure your point again....
 
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