PES2010 discussion thread

Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Isn't FIFA on PC still last-gen?

And I just watched the gameplay for 2010, it doesn't look much different from 09 to be honest, the animations still look the same, the passing still looks the same.

Anyone arguing that they've still got 6 months left needs to realise they aren't going to fundamentally change the game and it'll still be pretty much exactly like that video on release.

Dang, I was looking forward to 2010 for some reason as well.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

They still look the same, because the motion capture hasn't been implemented in it yet, how many times does it have to be said... already heard that only what a fifth have been added and they are probably simple little animations that have been done!

Graphics though look awesome, dunno how they make you think of PC fifa haha!
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

I think it's just the style of picture that made him think FIFA PC, as it looks a little similar to the FIFA cutscenes.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Chris Davies said:
I think you have to have spent serious time with the "other" game to really notice its shortcomings Zeemeister, the passes all go to the wrong men for the first ten games or so after getting used to FIFA. You have to learn to press a different direction from what you would in FIFA (i.e. not straight at the man but in a 45/90 degree angle to absolutely make sure it gets there, otherwise it can go to a man 45 degrees away from who you wanted it to go to). But once you get used to it you wouldn't think twice about it.
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Yeah I only had it for 2 days and it was great. But this year I'm getting both.
Edit:
I'm definitely getting FIFA 10 and maybe PES2010 if the animations and Mo cap are in the final build.
 
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Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Seraphs21 said:
They still look the same, because the motion capture hasn't been implemented in it yet, how many times does it have to be said... already heard that only what a fifth have been added and they are probably simple little animations that have been done!

Graphics though look awesome, dunno how they make you think of PC fifa haha!
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Motion capture won't affect the fact that the game looks to play exactly the same as PES2009.

And who said they haven't implemented the mo-cap yet, have Konami themselves said it?
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

vitalic said:
Yeh, because new animations for one player is going to radically change the game.

*rolls eyes*
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it's not like if you capture messi the animations only apply to him...

plus they stated that a number of japanese players were called in for mocap aswell.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Chris Davies said:
I'm really enjoying my ML at the minute, more than my MM game I have to admit .
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Chris,try looking to buy or loan Lavezzi from Napoli,Gouffran, not sure where he is now, French player, young kid, just do a search. Giovinco the Brazilian kid is also a cracking player. They all have great feet, vision,
passing,first touch and some special moves and animations. Wheater from Boro is brilliant but getting him is tough as he is very loyal to Boro but well worth a buy, he is solid as a rock. They all have superb potential and really improve massively during their career mate.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

matherto said:
Motion capture won't affect the fact that the game looks to play exactly the same as PES2009.

And who said they haven't implemented the mo-cap yet, have Konami themselves said it?
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I asked the same question earlier but nobody reply:PIRATE: Give me a source that KONAMI said about not impemented mo-capture animations in this stage of game:BOP:
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

it's not like if you capture messi the animations only apply to him...

plus they stated that a number of japanese players were called in for mocap aswell.
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Right, so you think it will look good with every player running around like Messi? It's obvious they are putting too much focus on him, even in the developer video you could see the guy showing off one of the Messi motion capture animations, but we've seen NO evidence of them actually adding the motion capture of other players to the game.

They say andom Japanese players were called in, but we have no idea how extensively their animations will be used, especially when they also said that if the animations "weren't good enough" the art directors would touch them up. So who knows how it will end up, it's a lottery at this stage. Everything is up in the air, it's all guess work, like the last two years - we are all hoping for a miracle but it's not going to happen.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

lons_pl said:
I asked the same question earlier but nobody reply:PIRATE: Give me a source that KONAMI said about not impemented mo-capture animations in this stage of game:BOP:
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every single preview...
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

so you want to see some lower league japanese players perform motion capturing exercises?

of course they only show messi, he's their coverboy. what would you do?

and of course devs touch up animation, no matter how good they are recorded, that's for every single game ever created with mocap. there is no way you can port something straight out of the capturing software into the game.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

OPM said:
so you want to see some lower league japanese players perform motion capturing exercises?
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I'd love that. Think how distinct the feel between the players would be if they'd use some not so good players also, would give it a far wider range and add to the realism.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Urban said:
FIFA's Drogba?


ShrunkenHeadGuy-1.jpg
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hahaaaa.....:APPLAUD::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL::LOL:
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Animations that have been mo-capped, refined etc can be implemented into games within days/weeks, based on the amount.

Imagine them adding 10 new run animations for normal, medium and dash runs, not that time consuming once the initial work is done. Trust me, when i've worked on games, adding in animations, matching them up, timing them correctly etc is a matter of days/weeks.

Even with better animations it won't mean squat unless the game plays great football.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

sindii said:
Animations that have been mo-capped, refined etc can be implemented into games within days/weeks, based on the amount.

Imagine them adding 10 new run animations for normal, medium and dash runs, not that time consuming once the initial work is done. Trust me, when i've worked on games, adding in animations, matching them up, timing them correctly etc is a matter of days/weeks.

Even with better animations it won't mean squat unless the game plays great football.
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That's good to know and hopefully a few people on here take not of this.:TU:
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

sindii said:
Animations that have been mo-capped, refined etc can be implemented into games within days/weeks, based on the amount.

Imagine them adding 10 new run animations for normal, medium and dash runs, not that time consuming once the initial work is done. Trust me, when i've worked on games, adding in animations, matching them up, timing them correctly etc is a matter of days/weeks.

Even with better animations it won't mean squat unless the game plays great football.
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This is what I was wondering. The reviewers were all impressed with the game but said it was similar to PES2009 as a result of the animations and movement.
I personally don't want manual passing if it's going to mean that Xavi is going to pass like Adebayor because I picked the direction and pace of the ball.

What I do want though which wont be there is more than 8 way movement.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

As far as I know, Jon Murphy, PR of Konami UK, says that (about mo-cap animations not implemented and will be added later). But dont quote me on that,,,
 
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Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

What games have you worked on, can you please give a few examples and explain technically why it only takes days to add animations which have to be integrated to the core engine so that the animation only occurs at the correct times and also work seamlessly with the physics engine and react differently depending on the situation, legs stretching for passes when the ball is further away (inverse kinetics etc.) - especially when there is not going to be a flexible framework in place for adding motion capture animation (they've only had a couple of months to do what FIFA took years to get right).

It sounds to me like you are over simplifying the process, unless you've worked on sports games specifically then I don't think your vague assertions hold much stock. Running animations is one thing but shooting, passing, heading, jumping for example are intrinsic to the way every element of the game reacts to any given situation.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

vitalic said:
What games have you worked on, can you please give a few examples and explain technically why it only takes days to add animations which have to be integrated to the core engine so that the animation only occurs at the correct times and also work seamlessly with the physics engine and react differently depending on the situation, legs stretching for passes when the ball is further away (inverse kinetics etc.) - especially when there is not going to be a flexible framework in place for adding motion capture animation (they've only had a couple of months to do what FIFA took years to get right).

It sounds to me like you are over simplifying the process, unless you've worked on sports games specifically then I don't think your vague assertions hold much stock. Running animations is one thing but shooting, passing, heading, jumping for example are intrinsic to the way every element of the game reacts to any given situation.
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What games have you worked on Vitalic?
Have you worked on sports games specifically, or are you just making vague assumptions about the process?
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

Common sense - so god damn rare it's a super power.

No but seriously, anyone with a remotely technical mind can appreciate that animation in sports games is not straight forward. Animation has to be dynamic, it's not just record it and drop it in to the game, every animation has to react differently based on how the player is positioned and where the ball is in relation to the player at the very moment the animation is initiated.

This is the common sense view, therefore the onus is on someone who is challenging that view to provide some technical evidence to be at least moderately convincing. I'm aware that he might just be "dumbing down" his comments to suit the breed of intellect that peruses these boards but I'd like to know exactly why he thinks it's so trivial to add in animations which could potentially affect the core gameplay dramatically - and not only that, if it's such a walk in the park and takes a matter of days/weeks why has it taken them so many years to even contemplate it?
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

zeemeister said:
This is what I was wondering. The reviewers were all impressed with the game but said it was similar to PES2009 as a result of the animations and movement.
I personally don't want manual passing if it's going to mean that Xavi is going to pass like Adebayor because I picked the direction and pace of the ball.

What I do want though which wont be there is more than 8 way movement.
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Agreed

slow it down, add new graphics,lighting, sound, online,ML etc, but it all meand diddly squat if they do not get those animations in.

The smooth flow of good transitions between animations give it a reality look and a perception of a different game.

I think we will see a diiferent game to 09 in almost every waybut come Gamescom, if those animations are missing then they will have lost the plot...........................................I doubt it though.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

vitalic said:
Common sense - so god damn rare it's a super power.

No but seriously, anyone with a remotely technical mind can appreciate that animation in sports games is not straight forward. Animation has to be dynamic, it's not just record it and drop it in to the game, every animation has to react differently based on how the player is positioned and where the ball is in relation to the player at the very moment the animation is initiated.

This is the common sense view, therefore the onus is on someone who is challenging that view to provide some technical evidence to be at least moderately convincing. I'm aware that he might just be "dumbing down" his comments to suit the breed of intellect that peruses these boards but I'd like to know exactly why he thinks it's so trivial to add in animations which could potentially affect the core gameplay dramatically - and not only that, if it's such a walk in the park and takes a matter of days/weeks why has it taken them so many years to even contemplate it?
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So you are making vague assumptions about the process, thanks for answering.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

No assumptions are needed when you have the power of common sense.

Try it sometime, you might look more intelligent.
 
Re: PES2010 News & Rumours thread

I've worked several times adding mocap data to rigged models, and having these models prepared to certain variables of movement. Nothing as complicated as it is in a football game like PES or FIFA, of course, where it has to interact with the physics engine and the collision detection and you have to take into account a lot more variables or even integrate the data to procedural animation processes or inverted kinetics.

And I can tell you adding the ammount of animations they seem to be adding (we're talking about 100 animations to say something) is very time consuming because you have to test and refine them and that means a lot of time generally to make sure thngs work as expected.

It's not a simple copy / paste. So I think adding all the animations, testing them and refining will take them a LOT of the time they have left and they will need to streamline the process.

So it's not a matter of days, nuts! It's a matter of months, I think they will spend 2 months on implementing animations and it's not that much time to do it. But it all depends on HOW are they implementing animations and at which level they let the animation take some variations or procedurally blend to another animation.
 
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