PES 2019 News Discussion Thread (INSULTS/DIGS = INSTANT BAN)

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RockyJJP said:
I agree with both of you guys. For me it was a sim. My best PS3 PES game.

But in PES2011 you could backheel all day long, could shoot from anywhere, and could overhead kick/bicycle kick from anywhere outside the box and get it on target. The gamespeed wasn't slow either.


So what makes something a SIM?
The only notable thing about PES2011 was the passing assistance, it's default wasn't very assisted at all, it was almost manual, it was lovely.
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PES disqualified itself for me by the horrendous CPU defensive AI which made it easy to trick yourself through on goal with easy, repetitive one-two´s.
 
I think the game looks OK - I worry about the lack of the modes in the game - but until you play it you have no idea if you'll like it.
Some peoples posts here are crazy. Its a game. If you dont like it dont play it. Play the other game.
You know what youre getting with PES - Yes, Konami have said this and that and as usual its bollocks. But theyve been doing that for 10 years.
Two weeks until demo and then you will know for sure if you like or not.
 
There are clear signs that this game is still too assisted compared to what we would like it to be. Maybe it will end up being slightly less assisted than Pes 2018 in best case scenario, but there is no doubt that we will be forced to play manual if we really want a more realistic game. The problem is, as long as i play against CPU, hoping the CPU will be more human this time, we can have a somehow realistic game. But, when you play online and you know people will 99% play PA3, you will face the most arcade game ever. There is no skill whatsoever and Pes 2019 doesn't seem to have adjusted that.

Talking about Pes 2011 i wish they went back to the universal passing system that was in that game. Semi assisted for everyone with the option to make it full manual. Just two settings: universal semi assisted or manual, that's it. That would be great.
 
P34SEMM said:
I think the game looks OK - I worry about the lack of the modes in the game - but until you play it you have no idea if you'll like it.
Some peoples posts here are crazy. Its a game. If you dont like it dont play it. Play the other game.
You know what youre getting with PES - Yes, Konami have said this and that and as usual its bollocks. But theyve been doing that for 10 years.
Two weeks until demo and then you will know for sure if you like or not.
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I agree and disagree with you here.

What I agree with is we'll only know whether we like it when we play it ourselves. If I enjoy the game then I'm happy with it. It doesn't, however, detract from the analysis people are making from the videos they're viewing. Whether or not someone likes the game and whether or not the game has massive flaws aren't mutually exclusive.

Most will not like the game because of the massive flaws and some will like it despite its massive flaws.

It doesn't detract from those flaws being there and you don't need to play the game to see them.

We also shouldn't just accept Konami's lies time and again, we should be calling them out on them. If that means you're considered to be rude or disrespectful then so be it. The firefighting will start soon amongst the community and I expect the "new and improved" PESFan forums to be heavily policed against negativity.

Sounds a bit dramatic but that's where things are. The distrust between producer and consumer has never been higher.
 
P34SEMM said:
I think the game looks OK - I worry about the lack of the modes in the game - but until you play it you have no idea if you'll like it.
Some peoples posts here are crazy. Its a game. If you dont like it dont play it. Play the other game.
You know what youre getting with PES - Yes, Konami have said this and that and as usual its bollocks. But theyve been doing that for 10 years.
Two weeks until demo and then you will know for sure if you like or not.
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No, we will only be sure after being told that

1) main elements in tactics and gameplay are only accessible in the retail
2) the retail version is an old build
3) but there is a #monsterpatch coming to fix everything

...which changes traditionally nothing.
 
thombhoy said:
Is the Glasgow event open to the public Daniel or is it just for the press and people with an invite ?
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it is invite only and there has been a mad scramble of people trying to get a invite, the list is huge and if there were dropouts then the next person on the list were invited.

philla said:
So the youtube compression makes passes from wayward body positions executed by "good guys which want a PES like us" going perfectly from player to player? Must have missed this jump in video technology between E3 and now.
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Playing on a higher PA level does that, and some players did use the higher PA levels
 
PES_Danielrh said:
it is invite only and there has been a mad scramble of people trying to get a invite, the list is huge and if there were dropouts then the next person on the list were invited.



Playing on a higher PA level does that, and some players did use the higher PA levels
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Could u use PA1 and record it? Would love if u could test just to bash the pass- button without direction to see how the assistance helps on that level.
 
klashman69 said:

You know honestly I'm am a little disappointed in a few people here. This video for me shows some people aren't analysing things properly and looking to feed their disgruntlement. This is nothing like the PES German Livestream or the PES NewEra videos. This seems like a better more refined E3 version. Pace in this video is the same as E3, its not manual, its clearly on PA1 and your seeing a number misplaced passes but not manual where every pass is worked, the game finished 1-1 with a penalty which i think should have resulted in a red unless this new rule change thing is actually implemented into PES, i'm not sure'. This game is looking very good and if i can play offline like this i will be more than happy.

@Dennis_87 it seems as if they did what you just asked and there is a giant difference between PA1 and PA3 becuase honestly this video and the the PES Livestream one along with PES NewEra ones showed there is dynamism in this game and there is a giant change with the passing between the settings and thankfully improved upon the last 3 versions.

My only concern now is fouls, that's it, i'll see how this holds up with tactics, passing will only be a problem online in competitive matches for PES League with people using PA3. I could see this from some of the reactions to some of the previous videoshow completely unaware some have been in understanding especially the PES NewEra videos with the Barca vs Liverpool and ARG vs FRA matches. At half time in the ARG vs FRA game, just look at their strategies. it was quite clear what they where doing was carbon copy of how PES League 2018 online was and shouldn't concern you much if your playing offline and paying on Manual or PA1 with mid level teams or what have you.

This is why i thing something i will speak heavily about in regards to feedback is people understand how much awareness they have on the game and their level of ability on it. This is huge for me, this something I've noticed over the years, some people really want a I'm experience but aren't actually really great at the game or play in specific ways and so on so what they define as a sim will be very different to what others want and so on. If anyone remembers Gerd a long time great member here, one thing i really liked about him is his honesty about his level at the game wasn't the best but i really helped understand him all the time from his point of view. I have this feeling that some think wanting a sim experience makes you seem 'better' than those who want an arcadey experience, but the issue is to what level of sim can you handle?

The whole point about PES and FIFA and games is to enjoy the experience and have fun but i get the feeling some people don't know what they want anymore and almost come here to find comfort in others who are also disgruntled rather than find something which they enjoy and suits them. This is the most important thing and i feel this is slowly over time being lost. I think to tackle this we need to be more honest in how we play and what suits me as the individual. PES 2019 wont be for everyone but for future games, not just honest feedback but better understanding in how people play specifically can really help things i feel. I feel many of these people want and are waiting for something to happen and do want a new game to fill that void.
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While that video looked good compared to others, I think it's mostly down to playing style. These guys hardly attempt to make any first time passes, but when they do the passes are pretty much perfect, for example at 3:13. Now, that is Busquets and Iniesta so of course they should be able to make such passes, but - as Dennis said - we don't know what settings these players are on most of the time, so our judgement is of course based on the stuff we see (a lot of ping pong games) and what we hear (that play testers say the assistance is upped even on PA1). We will have to wait for the demo to really know, I guess.

To come back to the video, we don't know if they refrain from first time passes out of choice or out of necessity, i.e. if their experience tells them that blind folded passes will lead to loss of posession. But then, to get into your other point about people's skill level and sim definition, I think, that most pro-sim guys just want that:
A realistic passing game where not all teams and players can play perfect passes without regard to body position and the nature of the oncomming ball (if you receive a ball at fast pace from just a semi-akward angle you can't just immediately pass it perfectly on to a teammate - you have to control it first. Konami even acknowledge this in their description of PES 2019, see my earlier quote).

And then all other parts of football represented in a more "naturalistic" matter as well: shooting, pace, positioning, dribbling, tackling (incl. closing down and being physical which also leads to fouls).

Of course individual people stress these elements to different degrees and their desire of the level of assistance in passing and shooting will also differ a bit, but basically I think sim guys just want a game that respect the basic elements of football and what is physically possible to do for different players (stats). This adheres to the AI as well by the way.

This might be a too simplistic description of the sim crowd and of course there's more nuances. Maybe also it would be better to say that people want a game that is simcade (a term sometimes used to describe Gran Turismo), because people aren't playing 90 min. games that resemble real games of football on a 1 to 1 scale, but just want PES to respect the basic physics of the game like GT respect that you have to slow down comming into a tight corner compared to Need for Speed where it's just pedal to the metal all the time.

Anyway, I don't think it has to do with people's skill level and how they play the game, because classic PES was always about representing real football (except maybe pace) and people had to adjust their play style and skill level to that. For example I had a friend who didn't play nearly as much as me and wasn't as good at the game so he would adjust to a long ball, counter attacking style and could sometimes scrape a win without it feeling cheap, because he had Crouch up there as a target man for Liverpool so you could never rule out that some chances were created for him to score, much like in real life, you can never completely rule out the underdog - but the underdog isn't playing like Barcelona!
 
Volun said:
@Ameppe Yeah. We weren't sure if we were loosing concentration or our players were. We suddenly constantly lost possesion because of bad passes or ball control. The last ten minutes were like nobody wants the game to be (Ping-pong, too much room in the midfield) but as long it's result of the visable fatigue and leaving your exhausted midfielders and strikers on the pitch I'm fine with it.

I usually use my striker as a support player (in German it's Wandspieler. I don't know the Englisch equivalent) who holds the ball and passes it back to midfielder. In the last minutes it was useless because Milner and Henderson didn't even make it past the halfway-line.


In this case I hope his opinion isn't heard because the visable fatigue isn't only about the cramp animation (We had one in about 15 games. I guess that makes more of an appearance in ML).
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Fatigue or scripting?
 

Why no neon colors in PES ?

Real color
V3_1_Main_0269240.jpg
 
fefepes said:
Why are high PA players invited to hardcore PES fan events?
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What's a hardcore PES fan? The people who log the most hours on the current game, usually on myClub. You could argue "hardcore" equals eSports. None of these guys are going to play without max assistance.

I don't think we can be classed as "hardcore" fans. Buying the game up to about five years ago doesn't mean anything, because we're not buying it now (or at least, not playing it), judging by a lot of the posts on here.

But others are, and they're liking what they see (and it's the stuff we're hating to see).

We're old, we're fuddy-duddies, we expect things that aren't realistic any more. We don't matter.

Are we prepared to spend $5,000 a year on microtransactions like this guy did, "accidentally"?! No? Then who cares if we want stray passes and mishit shots?

Seriously. They're running a business, and football games aren't simulations any more - guys like us have to rely on modders to get the most out of the latest creations. That's where we're lucky - we still have a pretty big, dedicated community.

I would imagine the honest dev response to our thoughts would be "we've included a manual mode for you old farts, what more do you want". With no recognition that the AI "plays" on PA3 so what's the point in it (offline).
 
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We had crappy E3 videos as well, hadn´t we?

I don´t deny that there might be a change from E3 build to the demo which isn´t very pleasing and in most of the newer videos, I surely also saw stuff I didn´t like.
But I´m not writing off the game...not yet.

The thing is: I don´t care much about the assistance anymore since I play full manual (Yeah, I know another full manual bla bla talk, but wait), as I can´t go back no more to assisted passing or shooting.
It would be better yeah, if PA1 was less assisted, like PES 2011´s passing, cause that would make it more fun and bearable to play FM against a PA1 player.

I totally understand if someone doesn´t wanna go full manual. It takes a learning curve, a lot of patience and a lot of frustration until you get there to play good passes, let alone passing combinations.

All I can say is though: full manual provides a whole different game feeling. Been playing a lot PES 2018 lately and I get so many WOW-situations. It´s not only the rewarding feeling when you score, it´s also those narrow missed shots, specially when you hit the post and go like "AAaarrrghhh, if only I had moved the stick a few mm´s more to the left!!".

What I´m trying to say is: I´m still waiting until I can get my hands down, set PA and SA to 0 and check for myself.
I can´t even watch any more videos, as I hardly ever know what settings these guys are using...let alone their playing style.

Oh and about the guy who doesn´t wanna have that visible fatigue system in the game:
Usually I´m a pacifist.
But please, someone make him shut the fuck up, by any means necessary!!!
That´s one of the few things I´m really looking forward! Don´t screw that up!

These frigging Progaming League players also been a big reason why there have been such a huge jump from PES 2014 to PES 2015!
 
Chris Davies said:
What's a hardcore PES fan? The people who log the most hours on the current game, usually on myClub. You could argue "hardcore" equals eSports. None of these guys are going to play without max assistance.

I don't think we can be classed as "hardcore" fans. Buying the game up to about five years ago doesn't mean anything, because we're not buying it (or at least, not playing it) now. Judging by a lot of the posts on here. But others are, and they're liking what they see (and it's the stuff we're hating to see).

We're old, we're fuddy-duddies, we expect things that aren't realistic any more. We don't matter. (In the eyes of gaming companies.)

Are we prepared to spend $5,000 a year on microtransactions like this guy did, "accidentally"?! No? Then who cares if we want passes to go astray?

Seriously. They're running a business, and football games aren't simulations any more - guys like us have to rely on modders to get the most out of the latest creations. That's where we're lucky - we still have a pretty big, dedicated community.

I would imagine the honest dev response to our thoughts would be "we've included a manual mode for you old farts, what more do you want". With no recognition that the AI "plays" on PA3 so what's the point in it (offline).
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So it can be confirmed that these events and the game are for the new breed of fans, not real football fans. Thus no defending Konami anymore as their focus is on making kiddy arcade games with micro transactions. Why should a PES forum created for fans of the old style have to stop being negative about the new direction?
 
fefepes said:
So it can be confirmed that these events and the game are for the new breed of fans, not real football fans. Thus no defending Konami anymore as their focus is on making kiddy arcade games with micro transactions. Why should a PES forum created for fans of the old style have to stop being negative about the new direction?
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exactly, if you and me are all time pes fans since the old iss evolution, than we have the right to say that this is not the game that should be, in 2018, it s not acceptable the direction they are taking, with all due respect to the new generation of gamers.
 
(PH1)

I didn't play that well though. Lost many balls at dribbling attempts in the midfield. Maybe it's a good thing because I didn't expect the opponent to tackle me that quickly.

*Perfect backheels galore before Embolo's goal

I also tried to play a FM game but I haven't done that in about 20 months (I think it was also my first time playing manual through balls). It went horrible wrong :CONF:Does anyone want to see that horrific gameplay?
 
Lobbedball said:
exactly, if you and me are all time pes fans since the old iss evolution, than we have the right to say that this is not the game that should be, in 2018, it s not acceptable the direction they are taking, with all due respect to the new generation of gamers.
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I don't think it's got anything to do with a "new generation of gamers", or esports etc... I think Konami just don't know how to create the right code and make a good football game anymore. They got lucky on the PS2 and milked that code for what, 5 years. But ever since they have struggled on the last 2 generations of hardware.
 
Volun said:
(PH1)

I didn't play that well though. Lost many balls at dribbling attempts in the midfield. Maybe it's a good thing because I didn't expect the opponent to tackle me that quickly.

I also tried to play a FM game but I haven't done that in about 20 months (I think it was also my first time playing manual through balls). It went horrible wrong :CONF:Does anyone want to see that horrific gameplay?
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Oh yes, i would like to see it. There is no manual assistance passing video coming from these playtests. Could you compare manual passing in Pes 2019 to Pes 2018?
 
Volun said:
Because I haven't played it for 20 months I can't compare it :D
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Then compared to Pes 2017? You remember that, if you don't, not a problem. :))

Your Passing assistance video even set at 1 shows that when you make quick passes they are too perfect and it becomes a ping pong with the ball rebounding from one player feet to the others.

Look at 12:25, six consecutive quick and precise passes including two backheel passes.

 
I just had to give my thoughts here. A bit disappointed, to say the least, of the videos. The midfield is lacking, the defensive positioning has seemingly lost its focus, backheels are...back..., ball physics are still good, nets nice. However, overall, it just reminds me a lot of PES 2018's gameplay and the elements that contributed to what made that a poor experience. Granted, the video I analyzed was P1 v P2, and unknown context of PA and tactics, etc. Here's my video with my thoughts:

 
Matt10 said:
I just had to give my thoughts here. A bit disappointed, to say the least, of the videos. The midfield is lacking, the defensive positioning has seemingly lost its focus, backheels are...back..., ball physics are still good, nets nice. However, overall, it just reminds me a lot of PES 2018's gameplay and the elements that contributed to what made that a poor experience. Granted, the video I analyzed was P1 v P2, and unknown context of PA and tactics, etc. Here's my video with my thoughts:

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You should watch the latest video, it's passing assistance 1 vs Superstar CPU. You can see if there are positioning issues.
 
@Ameppe Yeah ik. I don't like it as well. In the next video there are some inaccurate passes when I tried to play the ball into the box. But in general it's way to assisted.


Trying to find solutions and openings against park the bus. In the last 20 minutes COM played more offensively but it still didn't look like they wanted to win.
 
Volun said:
(PH1)

I didn't play that well though. Lost many balls at dribbling attempts in the midfield. Maybe it's a good thing because I didn't expect the opponent to tackle me that quickly.

*Perfect backheels galore before Embolo's goal

I also tried to play a FM game but I haven't done that in about 20 months (I think it was also my first time playing manual through balls). It went horrible wrong :CONF:Does anyone want to see that horrific gameplay?
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I like all red sector Milan supporters. Good presentation.
 
One positive thing: it doesn't seem there is scripting or innatural behaviour in CPU gameplay at Superstar. I am not going to be too happy about it because exhibition mode generally doesn't have scripting, it kicks in while playing Master League and low rated teams.
 
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