PES 2019 Discussion Thread (PS4, XB1)

mehuk said:
To suggest that Konami or any company put a code in that automatically makes the AI score by denying the user any control in a game, is ludicrous.
Click to expand...


play lots and lots of PES....i guarantee you will see its not ludicrous at all

Madmac79 said:
SO I played some more in these past days.

For the rest.. at least from this still first 15 hours or something of play, this game is much better than 2018. Finally, while there still is much to be done here, I can feel some good individuality, both from pace (but only if I leave the game at zero speed.. at -2 or even -1 I feel like pace differences tends to flatten out) and from big players feeling more physical and capable of defending the ball. I think some massive stat editing would surprise us way better than last year.
The game is generally more random, there is a decent number of fouls, varied situations arise in the field. Stamina is finally a thing too, characterizing well the last quarter of matches.

IA has a lot of problems but at least it isn't the idiotic overpowered and unrealistic thing of 2018. There is of course momentum, scripting or whatever you want to call it, but I feel that if I pick Brazil and I play against a small nation in superstar I can actually win if I concentrate enough because I have stronger players.
Click to expand...

One of the problems I had in PES 2018 was I was finding I was playing PES for over an hour but I was maybe getting just 5 mins of joy (or sometimes not even that). That could be due to matchmaking problems or switching on and then losing myself in scout spins/weekly comps. There was always this yearning to get more GP to build my MyCLub squad. I also got the feeling I had to lose a certain amount before I could be allowed to win - like its pre-written in the plan - a similar feeling to master league.

With FIFA, I switch on, play a game and overall get enough enjoyment. Its a quicker reward (just as long as I don't get sucked in).

I'm still dabbling over whether PES at its current discount is worth it....but I tell you what - the last 2-3 years most of my gaming time has been in PES - this year I am exploring loads more games and it feels good.


PRO_TOO said:
Like WHAT?! So I am not aloud to express what “I feel is over the line”, like you said? Did not feel I was commenting towards “over the line”!!! Sure I am not banning users, not a mod, you guys do that. It just feels so “out of nowhere”!
Tell me please, what’s Wong with my latest post?! It’s still me, PRO_TOO! :)
I have that feeling you coming at me. Not sure, mate. I’m good minded, you know that!

Edit: I may be wrong using that word pathetic when I thing about it. if it is that, I need to learn better English. :D
Search for posts where I included the word pathetic! Shouldn’t be too much! ;)
Click to expand...

Some bromance going on here:BOP::LOVE:
 
Dennis_87 said:
Well...on PC the last guy in the standings has a rating of 82 and he has played more than 600 matches also.
If scripting actually exists,it surely hasn't done a great job of helping the poor guy a bit.
Or maybe he's so bad at this game that even scripting in his favor realised that and abandoned him.:LOL:
Click to expand...
I believe in offline AI boost or momentum or whatever you want to call it, but I dont believe in scripting as such. I dont believe that the result is set in stone.
And as the proof Im sending you guys to our familiar Spoony Pizzas on youtube. If you find clips from his ML, in most cases he doesnt have any lost games. Might have few draws, but no loses. And I also seen few of his ML playthroughs where he had all matches won.
So yeah, AI might be getting a boost or be harder to beat (like in derby matches) but they are not unbeatable.
He never goes below Superstar when he plays.
Im far from that - im usually getting hammered left right and centre, but it is always possible to beat AI.
 
I'm a member on another forum also.
Some guy there was saying that the game is complete shit and that 9 of his 10 passes are wrong.
I replied to him that he must learn how to play the game first before saying shit and stop blaming the game just because he's a bad player who can't make 3 correct passes.Especially with how assisted the passing remains on assisted.
So...where exactly am i wrong in this reply?

Because from what i'm seeing here i should be threatened to be banned just for telling him that he should learn the game's mechanics first and how to play it correctly to have good results(which is the case for any game in any category) before starting to say that the game is shit and that all passes are wrong.

It's just strictness for not a serious reason.
You can't say that everyone can have an opinion here and then when someone says that his opinion is that you actually have to learn how the game plays first(even if that means to take advantage of it's exploits sometimes,this is an issue in every game)before properly judging it,he's being threatened to be banned.How this works exactly?

I agree that dribbling is indeed a bit underpowered this year in favor of pressuring especially online and it can be frustrating at times.But still you can dribble effectively in many cases if you use the movement momentum correctly.
I don't know if i would want it much more effective.In real life there are just a few superstars who can dribble pass opponents like they're not even there.Most plays must be patient and rely mostly on good passing and combinations to be effective.So with that in mind,i think the game tries to be more realistic in this regard instead of being a dribble fest and i prefer that.I don't think that all the flicks and tricks i see on the other game are any better or more realistic in this regard.

Again,all of the above,is just my OPINION.
 
Last edited:
@Dennis_87. Reasons why dribbling is rubbish:

Movement limited to 8 directions.
Skill moves take too long and are not intuitive.
AI defenders are still overpowered. Eg. Yesterday Steve Cook of Bournemouth caught my 96 paced winger within 2 seconds from a 5 yard head start.
AI defenders can take the ball from ridiculous angles such as when you run directly across them which should always result in a foul or no contact.
AI defenders react to controller input, not player movement, so generally know what you're doing in advance.
Not enough shielding or use of body to hold off defenders if you ever do get the right side of them.

Dangerous counter attacks and one on ones should see desperate lunges every now and then and professional fouls. Never seen a single one.

All of the above is also my opinion.
 
tosser said:
@Dennis_87. Reasons why dribbling is rubbish:

Movement limited to 8 directions.
Skill moves take too long and are not intuitive.
AI defenders are still overpowered. Eg. Yesterday Steve Cook of Bournemouth caught my 96 paced winger within 2 seconds from a 5 yard head start.
AI defenders can take the ball from ridiculous angles such as when you run directly across them which should always result in a foul or no contact.
AI defenders react to controller input, not player movement, so generally know what you're doing in advance.
Not enough shielding or use of body to hold off defenders if you ever do get the right side of them.

Dangerous counter attacks and one on ones should see desperate lunges every now and then and professional fouls. Never seen a single one.

All of the above is also my opinion.
Click to expand...
The movement is actually closer to 16 directions if you look close enough.
This 360 degree movement is more of an eye illusion in the other game.
If you look closely it's still the same 16 direction there also.
It's just because it has a more flexible and less rigid feel there that gives this impression,but this comes with other negatives like light weight feel and no movement momentum.You nearly never can pass dribble a defender there except if you use tricks and flicks.At least in Pes you can pass them if you use the movement momentum correctly and you don't need to use tricks for that.

I mostly play online so i don't see much of these issues you mention because they're related more to CPU AI.
Dribbling online can also be frustrating at times because of all the pressure whores and the potential lag but can also be effective if you know how to use it wisely and with the correct timing.
Last year dribbling may have been more effective but then we were complaining that the game lacks physicality and ''tightness''.This year they tried to sort out these complaints so dribbling became more difficult.
It's a difficult thing to achieve a balance.All these things are connected to each other and when you change something
then probably something else is gonna be changed too.
Personally i don't mind it much with how it is.And it helps also to have realistic scorelines most of the time which i like.
Having something overpowered like dribbling,headers etc would just lead in ridiculous scorelines.

I would also prefer them to make the R2 button a manual shielding command instead of this ugly close control animation that we have now.As long as it would be nice balanced and not op.It would help with the physicality even more.Also these professional fouls as you say would be cool to see also,things like shirt pulling etc.
They have no choice but adding some new things each time so hopefully we'll see some of these things in the near future.
 
I think this game is better than FIFA at current state no doubt, but that's not saying much. I think, there is a big chunk of ageing players like me who'd only get back to playing regularly if they'd release a game that'll make us say ''Wow ! I haven't played anything like this before !''. Last that happened was when i played the first Pro Evo on PS2, and quite surprisingly, i got the same feeling when i first played Red Dead Redemption 2, ''This feels amazing !''. The feeling, despite being two separate genre, was eerily similar in a sense that both games are random. Each exhibition game/aimless journey results in a story of its own. You don't know what will happen next, and the entire time, it keeps you engaged while staying close to reality. As futuristic as it sounds, i hope 2020 brings back this bygone feeling that has been missing from our footy games since, forever.
 
Dennis_87 said:
Last year dribbling may have been more effective but then we were complaining that the game lacks physicality and ''tightness''.This year they tried to sort out these complaints so dribbling became more difficult.
Click to expand...
That is very true. Last year there was no such thing like physicality. Very few fouls. When players were clashing, most of the times they were just tripping and never falling. It was driving me up the wall. So unrealistic.
This year we really have a huge improvement in that regards. And as much as they decreased power of skill moves, they increased power of left stick dribbling. With that alone you can pass the defenders IF you take advantage of their momentum.
Its very realistic and I really like it this way.
 
tosser said:
@Dennis_87. Reasons why dribbling is rubbish:

Movement limited to 8 directions.
Skill moves take too long and are not intuitive.
AI defenders are still overpowered. Eg. Yesterday Steve Cook of Bournemouth caught my 96 paced winger within 2 seconds from a 5 yard head start.
AI defenders can take the ball from ridiculous angles such as when you run directly across them which should always result in a foul or no contact.
AI defenders react to controller input, not player movement, so generally know what you're doing in advance.
Not enough shielding or use of body to hold off defenders if you ever do get the right side of them.

Dangerous counter attacks and one on ones should see desperate lunges every now and then and professional fouls. Never seen a single one.

All of the above is also my opinion.
Click to expand...

I agree.
The whole dribbling system needs to be ditched and re-worked on from scratch.
The contextual dribbling they introduced in PES 2018 is nice and all, but it's all too samey and not very stat based.
When you're on the ball with Neymar or Messi, it feels too frantic, like they've been electrocuted, not as smooth and fluid as one would expect from that kind of players.

I insist, PES 2013 had GREAT dribbling mechanics.
 
Emroth said:
That is very true. Last year there was no such thing like physicality. Very few fouls. When players were clashing, most of the times they were just tripping and never falling. It was driving me up the wall. So unrealistic.
This year we really have a huge improvement in that regards. And as much as they decreased power of skill moves, they increased power of left stick dribbling. With that alone you can pass the defenders IF you take advantage of their momentum.
Its very realistic and I really like it this way.
Click to expand...
dribbling is great. You can tell good players v bad players. Every time I'm tackled I know it was either me trying to dribble with a poor player or I decided to dribble in a poor situation. When you do it right you can skip past people with ease
 
Chilleverest said:
The feeling, despite being two separate genre, was eerily similar in a sense that both games are random. Each exhibition game/aimless journey results in a story of its own. You don't know what will happen next, and the entire time, it keeps you engaged while staying close to reality.
Click to expand...

Just a little offtopic. Did you read about the huge complaints coming from players because Rockstar decided to go the realistic way? Rockstar could try this gamble because they knew Rdr2 was going to sell a lot.
People just don't want realistic playing games, they want just fun games, they dont even care if those fun games are too basic, they want immediate reactions to their input.

So, in a sense that's why Pes is still criticized by many people so used to Fifa more immediate input reaction that when they play Pes for the first time call it "unresponsive". Also, the same people that when Fifa tries to put a bit more realism being a bit less immediate call it trash and unplayable forcing EA to react and please them.
 
Ameppe said:
.....
People just don't want realistic playing games, they want just fun games, they dont even care if those fun games are too basic, they want immediate reactions to their input......
Click to expand...

Such an important sentence.

In essence this is precisely what divides FIFA and PES at the moment.

On the pitch, PES offers realism, FIFA is left wanting
Off the pitch, FIFA offers realism, PES is left wanting.

So which game is better depends on what the gamer is seeking.

I am enjoying applying my imagination to FIFA when I play (in a way like I would when I play sensi soccer). I have control over the limits of my imagination so I leave satisfied.

With PES, I use less of my imagination because realism is served by the game. SO when I see problems in PES, I seek improvements but that improvement cannot come from my imagination - it must come from the game devs/patches etc.

Damn man......

This is an important post for me. I feel enlightened to be able to structure my thoughts about PES and FIFA like this after about 4 years of solid footy gaming. It took a while but I got there in the end.
 
Dennis_87 said:
Well...on PC the last guy in the standings has a rating of 82 and he has played more than 600 matches also.
If scripting actually exists,it surely hasn't done a great job of helping the poor guy a bit.
Or maybe he's so bad at this game that even scripting in his favor realised that and abandoned him.:LOL:
Click to expand...
I am talking about players the matchmaking finds for me with or without filters. I can not make an opinion from some random guys from a leader-board who i do not have seen playing or i do not know ,especially in pc ,if they use farming GP bots etc.
Also for someone being extremely good or really bad, the script/handicap existing or not does not make any difference. I said that in can only affect a little bit players who are close to skill/ability.

The "mechanism" for stats intervention exists already in PES League ,if you read the rules of PES League, except pace the rest results can be flattened in a way so all teams are close to equal. So stats boosting/handicapping can be present in all modes and can not be a measurable value.The same applies for TS.

You can not tell for sure how much and what affects every point of TS. Does it affect something %?,is it flat boosting/handicapping stas? Are these stats the known stats or are they hidden stats like the combined ability stats that where visible before PES 2015? Or some mental stats that where present before PES 2013?

These are complicated issues that nobody knows so we can only make speculations.But it is too easy to make fun on someone's opinion just presenting his opinion so flat as he said that SCRIPTING just vanishes the ball, from the midfield in your possession, and teleports it in your goal post instantly resulting a goal, which nobody has stated until now.

VS com it is annoying cause it makes me feel that i never progress. VS Human i do not have any problem. If i feel that there is scripting/handicapping/boosting that makes the game "unfair" and cheats me secretly or not ,i just do not play online and problem solved.
 
Bearwithit said:
It’s not a fact for goodness sake.

There is clear scripting in PES and there always has been for years now.
Click to expand...

Of course it is a fact. You can prevent any goal you concede.

If you cant, why even play the game?

Im assuming you have never won a game or kept a clean sheet?
 
If cpu presses real hard just play hard and ditrty in those last few mins. Dont try to go all out too or do a nice build up. Just keep the ball in the back if you have the quality defenders/or just kick the ball forwards, take it into the croner. The cpu is in full red attacking mode most of the time during the last few mins.
 
Alx1234 said:
Such an important sentence.

In essence this is precisely what divides FIFA and PES at the moment.

On the pitch, PES offers realism, FIFA is left wanting
Off the pitch, FIFA offers realism, PES is left wanting.

So which game is better depends on what the gamer is seeking.

I am enjoying applying my imagination to FIFA when I play (in a way like I would when I play sensi soccer). I have control over the limits of my imagination so I leave satisfied.

With PES, I use less of my imagination because realism is served by the game. SO when I see problems in PES, I seek improvements but that improvement cannot come from my imagination - it must come from the game devs/patches etc.

Damn man......

This is an important post for me. I feel enlightened to be able to structure my thoughts about PES and FIFA like this after about 4 years of solid footy gaming. It took a while but I got there in the end.
Click to expand...
Agree 100%. Pes has realism on the pitch and Fifa off the pitch.
 
Im missing the arguments here. Why is PES more realistic?

Really think the two games has it's areas where its more realistic. PES lacks compactness in general. Way to many situations where you can just sprint through the midfield. FIFA is the opposite.
PES though has better ball physics and feeling on the ball in general. The players stand out a little more.
 
mehuk said:
like i said every goal you concede you can prevent.. fact.
Click to expand...

hell no.

Filippo-Inzaghi said:
Im missing the arguments here. Why is PES more realistic?
Click to expand...

I refer to the fluidity and graphics of PES on the pitch vs the roboticness and some okay-but-not-great graphics of FIFA.

E.g. when I see an in-game cut scene of Defoe on PES, I going to think its Defoe. If I see Defoe on FIfa, it may as well be my local bus driver
 
Alx1234 said:
hell no.



I refer to the fluidity and graphics of PES on the pitch vs the roboticness and some okay-but-not-great graphics of FIFA.

E.g. when I see an in-game cut scene of Defoe on PES, I going to think its Defoe. If I see Defoe on FIfa, it may as well be my local bus driver
Click to expand...

You're right - to some point.

Because I still want to challenge you a bit. It's the graphics making PES realistic now? Ten years ago that argument wouldn't give anything in EA's favor.

Personally Im making the usual mistake. Playing both games without really settle with none of them.

PES stand out in terms of dribbling with players who can make a difference in real life (Suso fx) but in general there is way to much space in my opinion, so I really don't feel anything while doing it. Also a simple thing as heading goals is non existing. That, for example, is not very realistic.

FIFA is more compact and I enjoy that, but I really don't feel my players. It's more quick/not quick than good at dribbling/not good at dribbling and after some games it's just gets repetitive and a bit boring.
 
Hey guys, I am a regular reader but a seldom poster.
Im in my mid-thirtiees now, which is probably the reason, why
i haven´t bought PES at release for the first time since PES 2 (and the ISS-Series).
Due to the nice offer on the German PSN-Store, i left the beautiful wilderness of New Hanover,
to give my old love a new chance. While i thought, that (especially) 17 and 18 were some decent attempts,
it just wasn´t enough for me to keep playing through the year and buy this years contender from the start.

I had a couple of games now, and my first imperssion is really really good.
These old PES Moments are certainly back. I´ve only played friendlys. Because i want to find a nice
and complete OF until i start a Master League. Any suggestions here? :BYE: I got a bit rusty and lost the overview.
Should i apply Clashmans Tactics? I´ve read and expirienced, that scripting ist still existing in the ML. That doesn´t suprise me at all - it was always there. It´s existence in the ML is because KONAMI roughly thinks that way:

ML should be a "from zero to hero" story:

Let´s torture the player in his first season (Even harder if you play with the default ML Players).
It get´s better in the second (hard work´n progress)
Even better in the third, where you probably play EL or CL.
Then it´ll be harder in the European Competitions.
As your team get´s better players and chemistry (which was also always there but unvisible or hidden - in older versions there were chemistry lines between players) you will progress, and some day win titles.
It´s a pretty simple formula, why you should´t rage too much about scripting in ML.

I recognized, a lot less scripting in friendlys (in earlier versions) compared to the ML. In this case you got/get some really good matches. The couple of matches i played felt really free, great attacking possibilities, fluid gameplay, lots of fouls, better shot variations (ball flies over the bar :ROCK:), physicallity is there (could be even more), various playing styles. Great football game for me on the first sight! :WORSHIP:
I didn´t play pre patch, but it seems that KONAMI made all lot of things better and reacted to the suggestions of the community. :TU:

I played with PA1, Superstar, mostly Gamespeed -1 and 12 Minutes. Still got to checkout Full Manual,
which i often used in previous versions.


However, scripting in Online matches is a different thing.

I am past Online playing, because there is definetly strong momentum involved (in all of the previous games).
Of course you can even adapt to this, but i want a more or less a fair challange, and i am ready to take a battering,
if that´s due to my skill. But of course, Konami (same goes for EA), are not willing to scare (or rage) off their regulary paying costumers and so they implement mechanics, which leads to a certain and unfair (un)balance.
So I don´t care and support about MyClub or FUT, because it´s just made to take your money and offers no competition value in my humble opinion.

Well, i hope we can enjoy this years PES, like i did back in the old days :)

Cheers and sorry for my bas English. :BYE:
 
Ameppe said:
People just don't want realistic playing games, they want just fun games, they dont even care if those fun games are too basic, they want immediate reactions to their input.
Click to expand...
Everyone has a bit different view on realism and different things trigger the feeling of realism for them.
Little off topic, so apologise, but its an important one to the discussion.. I think..

Fifa18 was realistic for me (sic!) It was fluid, smooth, had plenty of fouls and injuries, you could do so much more if you mastered advanced controlls, tactical defending was tough but so rewarding. Not to mention presentation. But it was unresponsive.

Fifa19 is not. Its very responsive, but has no fouls, ball goes from one penalty area to another like in Tennis match, timed finishing is like some minigame where you can have Tsubasa shot and the amount of overkick shots is ridiculous. Results are also often double digit if you add all the goals.

Pes is unresponsive (as players have to go through all animations before they do stuff).
But its smooth, player movements, animations and clash engine are very realistic, we have stamina that matters, quite a few fouls, nicely ballanced shooting power and ball physics that is unbeatable at the moment.

Edit: sorry, Im after nightshift and I forgot I was getting to a point there..:LOL:
My point was - Im ready to sacrifice responsiveness in order to achieve realism

Pes lacks (for me. Lets remember this is my personal point of view):
- interesting ML, where we should be able to do MUCH more
- atmosphere
- penalties
- stadiums
- presentations
- cut scenes where we could see manager or bench
- natural match fluidity (thst FIFA has), where match doesnt stop/pause and restarts like a new scene of the movie
- more player ID, where superstar could stand out more
- (still) more variations from AI attacks
- more variations of shots from AI

Thats my view on the realism in football games. And Im all for that. I love realism (re: I love RdR2) and the more realistic game, the better it is for me. But I understand that Im in minority and a lot of players prefer arcade, fast gsmes where they just press shoot button and dont have to think and worry about anything else.
So, for the likes of me, its difficult to get a game that I would really like, as I know thst developers will have more income creating braindead games where you just have to pull the trigger and game does most for you.

Its not easy to find a middle ground here. Developers know that fanbase is divided like that. And I believe they are trying to keep everyone happy, which is hard.

EA itroduced sliders to keep the likes of me happy.

Pes should focus on edit mode much more and let people bring it as close to reality as possible (like on PC where you can edit basically anything, from score boards, through stadiums up to turf)
 
Last edited:
I just purchased the game from PSN on Thursday as it was reduced by £30, and it's still a tenner too dear as I am finding out. All the other indy games go for between £5 and £14.99, and this one is not worth any more that that either.

The level of amateurism is astonishing as well, more on that later.

I have started a Scottish Premier season and I am about a quarter way through and I am still waiting for a free kick to be awarded to me around the opposition penalty box in spite of being tripped, punched, barged, assaulted and all sorts and as for a penalty, well I think you'd need to get your head chopped off and be permanently disabled to get one of these.

On the other hand, the opposition gets awarded several free kicks in the 'D' and other close areas around my penalty box, even though I didn't even put in a tackle.

The free kicks I do get are always in the centre of the pitch, where there is really no need to stop the play at all and no danger of getting a goal or a shot away, and then I have to endure 3 bloody cut scenes of the 'non foul' thereby disrupting the game flow.

No injuries, no or very little bookings, especially for the AI teams, and no red cards to either human or AI team.

As someone else has already pointed out already, the European games are played in daytime and you can't even change it to night yourself, as it's locked down and not available for selection, this is the amateurism I mentioned earlier.

They must know this has happened and any decent gaming company that is professional in it's approach to its product and customers, would have apologised and patched it by now as an urgent fix.

Probably though being Konami, this will either not be fixed at all, or it will be done around end of February 19 when they eventually update the January 19 transfers.

The game is poor off the pitch, the least said about that the better.

The scoreboard on the PS4 version, that you can't update with an option file is like several years backwards from what we had recently, its goddamn ugly and totally out of place in a supposedly modern fourth gen game.

The lack of any new modes, like 2 legged friendlies, challenges like starting a goal down with just 20 mins left and such like or real life comebacks and other interesting challenges is a disappointment.

Again and for many years, we have no fixture lists unless you go hunting for them, no score updates during games, no half time scores, half cocked, half baked weather effects.

All the stadiums in game look the same, so there is no perception of playing in different sized grounds, the camera angle is the same across the board and you see very little of the stadium environment you're playing in.

The sound and commentary...er I don't need to say anything here do I?

Confusingly though, even given all the above, there is a decent bit of gameplay in there, and with an option file applied its passable.

It does look quite stunning in places at times as well, but I will still get pi$$ed off with it by the end of November due to it's lack of modernity and up to date features, and knowing that I think £19.99 is too much to pay for game of this quality and lack of staying power.
 
Last edited:
I am struggling with Lyon im ML. On pro I can't win any game :D Maybe becouse I opted for Challenge and team spirit is around 60. Will do my best if I am not fired until mid season :D
 
Could the scripting be a thing in MyClub but not (that much) in Divisions? I only play Divisions and rarely experience what you guys describe (I'm not ruling out me being stupid though...). But since MyClub don't want to lose people because of the money- crap the scripting is ramped up?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom