PES 2017 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread
- Thread starter ThomasGOAL
- Start date
Perfect analysis, perfect. Horrible how the French midfielder runs away from box when they're threatening the German defence. Just proves what some guy here said, that tactics override context. Gameplay is definitely too end to end and teams show too much urgency and aggression.
A lot of people bringing up PES 2014, I remember it having the potential to be absolutely brilliant around demo time, but they messed that somehow, I played it most of the year like I always do, but it never really felt right. 2015 and 2016 have both been better for me.
Also some mention of the passing assistance being different between games... seriously, put it on no assist and never look back. It's not actually no assistance, you need the button modifier for that. It's just the right amount of passing being good/bad. On one bar assistance the game often decides you want to pass to some other dude than you intended the pass for. It is utterly unplayable for me. I even have my mates who play casually play on no assistance and they make the odd shit pass but they really don't mind it. I tell them they actually have to think about where they are passing the ball and they have no problems.
Manual shooting, I admit I'm still on the fence for, and I go back and forth. So I wont make any rants about manual shooting being the only way to play... for now...
(seriously though, hitting a long ranger in the top corner with manual shooting is bliss)
Also some mention of the passing assistance being different between games... seriously, put it on no assist and never look back. It's not actually no assistance, you need the button modifier for that. It's just the right amount of passing being good/bad. On one bar assistance the game often decides you want to pass to some other dude than you intended the pass for. It is utterly unplayable for me. I even have my mates who play casually play on no assistance and they make the odd shit pass but they really don't mind it. I tell them they actually have to think about where they are passing the ball and they have no problems.
Manual shooting, I admit I'm still on the fence for, and I go back and forth. So I wont make any rants about manual shooting being the only way to play... for now...
(seriously though, hitting a long ranger in the top corner with manual shooting is bliss)
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gabe.paul.logan
Retired Footballer
Grear vid
zeemeister
foxy engine
You made a video of someone else's play?! 
Do you know settings and tactics etc?
I will watch it later.
Do you know settings and tactics etc?I will watch it later.
i mean cmon, you need to play it. Why waste the time?
- Staff
- #2,947
- 16 July 2004
- LUFC O.K.
I mean cmon , do we need another negative trollworthy comment.
People want to see the gameplay analysed until such a time as demo is released.
Dont do it, I mean it.
DuduBR9
Champions League
- 25 July 2010
bobfifalas
Championship
- 15 March 2004
Don't you dare ever review or critic any premier league or even sunday league game you never played
DuduBR9
Champions League
- 25 July 2010
Excatly. I've said that so many times, including on twitter directed to Adam/Asim.
Pes 2015 was fine and still responsive.
shez
League 1
- 19 August 2005
Only one foul all game
Identical headed goals
No offsides, Not listed in the match stats screen as well!!
Every touch is perfect, The only wrong passes are the scripted ones from the user right to the feet of the AI
Hope Konami or their reviewers can read this
PESBUL
Championship
- 11 June 2016
Great video . Well done .
DuduBR9
Champions League
- 25 July 2010
Agreed.
Lets make it clear: PES 2015 is not on PES 2014 level when it comes to realism of animations/player movement physics, but on the other hand, it doesnt look nowhere as unrealistic as PES 2017 and SPECIALLY PES 2016 wich is ridiculously bad on this aspect. Well, but wich game is on PES 2014 level on this aspect ? No one. Even EA with their unlimited budget couldn't ever produces a game in wich players moved so realisticaly. Thats a fact.
But it seems that all the amazing work done on PES 2014 on the tech aspect came with a price: bad control reponse for many. Maybe with more time under development they could have managed to fix control responses while keeping at least almost the same level of realism ? Who knows...
I think Konami had the wrong plan. It was clear for me that PES TEAM wanted to show the true potential of Fox Engine right away, to make everyone excited about what the future holds, and as it takes much time to really make that adaptation of a new engine to a sport game, in the end what we really got was nothing more than a tech demo.
Imo, what we could have as PES 2014 should actually be PES 2015/6. And PES 2014 should be the hidden project to be release on nextgen. In other words, PES 2017/2018 should be the finished, very well polished PES 2014 with all the technical evolution the "new consoles" could offer.
Pes 2014 should be their hidden project known now by the name of PES 2017. But they wanted to blow peoples mind right away releasing a rushed failed product on old consoles. Its a matter of having no vision, thats main Konami problem:
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Matt I appreciate you taking the time and the effort to put up the video and I realise your point is that by default the settings are wrong and too gappy etc. . . . the way I look at football is . . as in reality sombody has to make an error of judgment for somebody to score against them. . that's a fact otherwise it would be all perfect and nobody would score. We can't have a militarised robotic defence that marches backwards and forwards and has every gap covered . .there has to be some leeway allowed for the user to score as well as the a.i. .. in Pes 2016 we could make the defence more compact or less . . have three at the back .. have a high defence line or sit back .. be aggressive or conservative . .all of which the a.i uses as well and y'know players can get pulled out of position or run into each other especially when using fluid formation.. . a little problem I CAN see is the idea of two or three players shepherding a top player away from goal and leaving huge gaps but that's probably a tactic that the a.i can compensate for anyway. A lot of results can be down to the user as well unless scripting kicks in and there's nothing you can do either way. I'm pretty sure if the a.i defences were left the way you're saying then the game would be too easy which goes against what some experienced players have said.
We must remember Konami are trying to sell the game as a fun filled entertaining game. .they're not going to showcase a hard fought tactical draw at the playtest.
So to sum up I wouldn't be losing any sleep over it, we'll get a fair idea from the demo.
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I agree with most of what you have said there Dudu.
You guys are analyzing a match that ended in a 2-1 score. That's laughable, if there is no more space then many matches will end in a 0-0 fashion. Most people play 10-15 minutes, if you get no enjoyment of that then you will upset most people. Also if you look down the screen you will see the AI is playing on a red bar which means they are on a attacking position. Yellow means balance. Blue means defense.
Edited: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RpLeYwZ39U
Also check this, the AI is playing on a blue bar, which means they are in a defensive position that's the style of AT Madrid. There was hardly space given. I think poeple aren't realizing that, every team might have a different style of playing.
Edited: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RpLeYwZ39U
Also check this, the AI is playing on a blue bar, which means they are in a defensive position that's the style of AT Madrid. There was hardly space given. I think poeple aren't realizing that, every team might have a different style of playing.
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gabe.paul.logan
Retired Footballer
no high score because of the keepers so far
That's kinda what I was getting at.
As TBB pointed out today, if you are playing at Superstar you expect the the cream of the crop not this lame excuse that if the game is too hard people won't score and they will be sad about it. If you can't handle top difficulty play the game on professional or below.
This idea that a good fought match that ends in 0-0 can't be fun is ridiculous, reminds me of americans saying eggball is better than "soccer" because there are no goals.
Matt10
International
- 5 February 2004
Deco, I love the post, and I hear you. My challenging question though is that they had the balance of this in PES 2010 to PES 2013.
Why are they reverting now? It feels like reinventing the wheel of football to achieve that fun filled entertaining game. Guess what? They already had it...why is this even a difficult concept to grasp?
Like Lami said as well, they could've built off of PES2015, which was one of the better FOX engine bases, but instead it was reinventing the wheel. 2016 was made more complicated than it needed to be, and that's why we are left with fixing PES 2016 issues onto PES 2017.
From what I can see in PES 2017, it's one or two tweaks away from being highly entertaining - and playable even for the sim crowd. That's the most frustrating part about it, so close - but yet it feels so far, and it's such a logical change. FWIW, Tactics are supposed to be a compliment to proper play, not a crutch to validate poor decision making that would get any real life manager sacked.
Matt10
International
- 5 February 2004
Even though I'd find personal adjustments to match the "hardcore" sim approach - this default gameplay, for PES 2011. It worked fine...this is why I can't accept excuses of needing space to get proper gameplay. Please.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wnMKJlEM0o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wnMKJlEM0o
talucchesi
League 2
- 2 March 2015
talucchesi
League 2
- 2 March 2015
Is anybody going to talk about the constant "rocket shots" that are consistently coming off of every players foot regardless of positioning of body or ball? Or nah?
I have seen some 0-0 scores in PES 2017 tbh. But when was the last time you watched a 0-0 score recently? Barcelona just lost 4-0 from Liverpool. Again the game is giving you the choice whether you want to be defensive or offensive, I think what they are trying to do is please everyone. Just because you saw a video of someone playing doesn't mean he played the way you gonna be playing. But again I don't see how 0-0 scores means it's difficult. It might also mean AI is not effective on offense.
talucchesi
League 2
- 2 March 2015
And man how could you watch this and tell me that today's Pes is better in terms of gameplay
Remarkable
Bond!JamesBond!
PS2 PES Greatness
just curious, what does the amount of time you play have to do with opening up the game.
if you play less time should see less goals.
I've seen very few can you give a link of PES 2017 games played against the AI that ended nil nil? Well, Portugal just won an Euro with mostly draws.
I don't see much of a choice, TBB broke down 2 games against superstar and both Atletico and France played the same type of end to end football with no build up play. This is also due to passing being so assisted, why pass back and regroup if you can't ping pong 180 your way into the box?
You claimed that 0-0 games weren't fun and I refuted it. I made no claims about ONLY 0-0 games being fun or difficult.
DuduBR9
Champions League
- 25 July 2010
Thanks, mate!
Let me tell you how I see things right now: people have been presenting some valid negative points, things that I agree with btw, but a few are overeacting and making sound like the game will be rubisb and not a good improvement over PES 2016 wich Im 100% sure its NOT true.
Do you know how I see things right now ? Its almost EXACTLY the same scenario with PES 2012/2013. Who in their right mind can say PES 2013 is not a very good improvement over PES 2012 ?
Just like in PES 2016, thers no doubt that Konami went FULL ARCADE mode with PES 2012. PES 2013 was the slower, more proper and tatical football game, and yet, it shares the same "dna" of PES 2012, wich didnt prevent Konami from making a great game out of PES 2012 that many of you guys enjoyed a lot called PES 2013.
Now we basically have the same scenario. PES 2016 is pretty much like the PES 2012 of our era, and PES 2017 will be very much like the PES 2013 of the past, it will share that same dna of its predecessor (pes 2016) just like PES 2013 did, but it will be a very good evolution, more tatical, slower and harder like PES 2013 was.
Im pretty confident about PES 2017. Im pretty sure many wil be addicted to PES 2017 demo playing on lower pass assistance level.
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rockstrongo
Retired Footballer
What's important to you,might not be important to me.
Right?
If you break down every little detail,of course things will "look" arcade like.
And that's the main point viewing this discussion.
"Looks"
Most games "looks" very bad when you watch them on YouTube,twitch and so on.
But do they "feel" arcade like?
Two very different things,"looks" and "feels"
And until it's out,we can't really judge a game based on just "looks"
So think/feel/express thoughts and concern about it,but until it's out,in full,does this "discussion" really matter?
To me a few things are important when I play,either FIFA or PES.
Am I entertained? does the game play well? am I more happy than annoyed?
Getting a real football simulator won't happend,period!
Why,first of all I think it's damn near impossible,second of all,there's thousands of opinions on what's "simulation".
As long as I'm cheated in to believing I'm playing sim football,and being more happy than pissed of.
That goes a long way for me.
What I wish for this game,and the "other" game ( don't wanna get banned for not being on point) from the previous games,are small things,the things that bug me,that makes me being annoyed instead of happy playing them.
In PES,sort that M...F schedule out,realistic schedule,no winter games in leagues where's there's no winter games.
And home and away fixtures realistically,last season on my ML,I had one home game my first seven fixtures.
Hopefully they build on what's was very good in 16.
Guess will have to wait and see,or "feel"
Right?
If you break down every little detail,of course things will "look" arcade like.
And that's the main point viewing this discussion.
"Looks"
Most games "looks" very bad when you watch them on YouTube,twitch and so on.
But do they "feel" arcade like?
Two very different things,"looks" and "feels"
And until it's out,we can't really judge a game based on just "looks"
So think/feel/express thoughts and concern about it,but until it's out,in full,does this "discussion" really matter?
To me a few things are important when I play,either FIFA or PES.
Am I entertained? does the game play well? am I more happy than annoyed?
Getting a real football simulator won't happend,period!
Why,first of all I think it's damn near impossible,second of all,there's thousands of opinions on what's "simulation".
As long as I'm cheated in to believing I'm playing sim football,and being more happy than pissed of.
That goes a long way for me.
What I wish for this game,and the "other" game ( don't wanna get banned for not being on point) from the previous games,are small things,the things that bug me,that makes me being annoyed instead of happy playing them.
In PES,sort that M...F schedule out,realistic schedule,no winter games in leagues where's there's no winter games.
And home and away fixtures realistically,last season on my ML,I had one home game my first seven fixtures.
Hopefully they build on what's was very good in 16.
Guess will have to wait and see,or "feel"
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