PES 2017 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread

Isslander said:
I'm thinking of sending Adam að strongly worded tweet... Not a big deal I suppose but
WHY ON EARTH DID THEY CHANGE THE FORM ARROW COLORS???????
Some of them are even exactly reversed from before. Why? Why would they do that?
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:D
I asked myself the same ;)
Nevertheless, played about 20 matches with different settings and difficulties.
Really enjoy this Demo. Hopefully the final game will be the same.
 
Finally I had some more time and played around 7, 8 games on PA 1, -1 speed, professional.

First of all, I really like it!
It's a really good game and I see myself playing ML again which I have skipped for two years.
Just mentioning that I didn't like PES 2015 and 2016.
Came back to 2016 many times until I understood that it just isn't my game.

But this one feels so right. This should have been PES 2016.

It looks like that the unpredictability is back!
The variation in CPU goal shots is outstanding!
Germany scored such a nice header against my France team: Müller crossed the ball to Podolski and he headed the ball in a high bow over my keeper.

And fouls are there! CPU fouled me 6 times in one match. It was almost annoying...cause at times the AI plays very agressive.

Mostly I admired the AI goals as I barely have scored any :D.
The ones I've scored haven't been really rewarding.
One was a ball that came to me strikers feet after deflection and the other one...I'll get to it.

Finally the replays are beautiful again! And they put a specific filter on it that some of them look like they're from a real match.

The ball physics are great too - except for ground passing.
I see nice trajectories and I made a lobbed throughball to Torres which he didn't get, but in the replay you saw the curve of the ball...looked great!

I also checked the shooting.
In fact I'm quite fine with it.
Müller took a long distance shot with his weak foot, Khedira had one out of the box with a kicking power of 73, Sanchez had a volley with his weak foot and all those didn't feel powerful.
On the other hand I had a strong shot with Girouds strong foot and he has a kicking power of above 80 if I remember right.
What's also nice...shots miss the goal more often and that on basic setting.

Really realy good but I have two things that annoy me:
PA level 1 is too assisted.
Often the ball gets to a player I didn't aim to.
In fact I have that problem since PES 2012 when they started with that assistance levels.
I've never found one that I was satisfied with.
I want it to be like th3 passing of PES 2011.
That was great for me.

Then R2 shots. If you shoot from a specific angle, the ball makes the same curve and it's a guaranteed goal.
Seen that in the former releases too.

I haven't had that bumb-my-fist moments yet but the potential is there.
And I hardly scored anyway.
I'm really fine with it.

Btw,
on the german official PES Facebook page are comments about rants of the ref being too strict and they want it to be like last year.
I hope KONAMI doesn't pay attention.
 
SxBtc00.png

That's what I like to see.
 
Redhat said:
SxBtc00.png

That's what I like to see.
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Yes, Please don't screw up this magic!

& I actually like the new arrow and stat colours even though im so used to the old ones.

Red is a negative colour, so a red arrow down should represent a bad form. Red stat numbers represent bad stats.
Green/blue represents positivity. Good form and good stats.

I always saw Red as someone being ''on fire'' with form though. But I like the logic of these colours right now as they seem easy to understand for everyone. Lots of not hardcore players can see orange/red as something NOT so good.
 
Matt10 said:
Once it is seen, it can't be unseen. Honestly, it's still "magic" and is a really fun game, but there needs to be a proper transition from Attack to Defense from the AI:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-dbZLvB8qE
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When i played my first game againat arsenal ibwas worried because they offered literally nothing and my first half possession was 82℅. I can see that for other teams its not so bad
 
Not asking this to disprove anything, just out of interest (sorry if you cover this in the vid, I've not got sound on):-

- What are Arsenal's defensive settings? Line settings, quantity to commit to defence, pressing etc?
- Do Boca do the same? (I noticed the striker stayed up there - Boca play a 4-3-3, as do France. Is it the midfield retreating too readily but they'd stay up if they were attackers?)

It's annoying that Gegenpress is greyed out - I'd hope that fixes this problem in a way, even though it'd be overkill.

This is a bit of a problem with football games in general, off the top of my head - especially when teams don't really understand whether a loose ball is going to be won by the attacker or the defender. There's something really infuriating about a pacy winger latching on to a loose ball into no man's land but his teammates are jogging all the way back to defend - or when a defence doesn't realise they're in serious trouble until the striker gets onto the ball.
 
Deluxe said:
Red Card for elbow charge!

https://youtu.be/5pOk5oOxg0I
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Well to be fair it was his second yellow and Boateng was doing a mis-timed tackle (double "X") which resulted in him hitting Payet with his arm so well deserved if you ask me.

Having played 3 games of the X360 demo I can say: You cannot apply pressure just like in PES16 (which was "all day any day") and expect it to work in PES17. This will result in a lot of cards and players being sent off.
 
Matt10 said:
Once it is seen, it can't be unseen. Honestly, it's still "magic" and is a really fun game, but there needs to be a proper transition from Attack to Defense from the AI:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-dbZLvB8qE
Click to expand...

I actually like that a lot for difficulties sake. & Just now I am 1-0 infront of France and I got their ball in my half and they stayed in Orange line attacking mode and they kept pressuring me with all their players without retreating at all. Orange line stayed even when I had the ball
 
103SpooKy said:
I actually like that a lot for difficulties sake. & Just now I am 1-0 infront of France and I got their ball in my half and they stayed in Orange line attacking mode and they kept pressuring me with all their players without retreating at all. Orange line stayed even when I had the ball
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Yes, they will adjust, usually towards the end of the match. That's the game scenario recognition kicking in. This is why it's important to address it now, during the first half for example. Noone can argue that Arsenal look frightened in that video. It's just not logical.
 
I can't find right words how aweaome this game is.the depth od the game is incredible, even even you play rematch right after the match is totaly different than the previous one. Shooting is very good also, for the next year they should add more animations for variety. only two things that needs to be adressed:
1. when playing through balls in space(ground passes) ball stops very fast, should have longer trajecory
2.shooting with weaker foot should be less precise and weaker.
I hope Konami doesn't screw with final release becouse this game shows potential from last 10 years of production. with every pes until now we all know the magic is in the game but they find a way to screw it. finaly when you take the controller in your hands it just feels right, like you playing football, not a game. thank you Konami
 
Sorry to chime in with more negativity (but it's a great video Matt and I hope Konami take notice, please tweet Adam to death about it)...

I got in from work absolutely dying to put the PlayStation on and get back into the game - almost like in the days of chipped PS2s and discovering all the hidden joy of a new Winning Eleven.

I played as Germany against France, in wet weather (my first wet game), Superstar.

Something felt off from the start. I conceded a penalty by pressing tackle at the exact same moment that the player switching gave me a player standing on the penalty spot, next to their striker, when the ball wasn't even in the box yet...

But all game, I felt like my hands were tied and I wasn't quite in control - I didn't feel like that once yesterday.

Then, these things happened.

https://youtu.be/wwDckalzydw

You might see the first one as an animation problem, and not a cheat. Okay. (It seems like a cheat to me, jumping over the ball when it was in my possession, and not the kind of thing I've ever seen happen to the AI.)

But the second one - I'm holding "pressure" (though I tried letting go, and then tried super-cancelling). The player is locked on to a course where he can NEVER get to the ball. If he wasn't, he'd ABSOLUTELY get the ball. Control was taken away from me.

I'm trying to move the guy to where the ball is going, and he's carrying on towards the half-way line LONG AFTER the ball has gone past there.

I even saw my first instance of the "stun-gun" reaction to being tackled, leaving my player locked in an animation far enough away from the ball so that the AI could take it off me.

I'm gutted - because it's that stuff, more than the same-old-goals etc., that makes me dislike 2016, and over 10+ games yesterday I didn't see this stuff once, not once. So I'd convinced myself it had gone.

(Still a beautiful game, but for someone who plays the AI like I do, I'm worried the ML will be full of this stuff now...)
 
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Chris Davies said:
Sorry to chime in with more negativity (but it's a great video Matt and I hope Konami take notice, please tweet Adam to death about it)...

I got in from work absolutely dying to put the PlayStation on and get back into the game - almost like in the days of chipped PS2s and discovering all the hidden joy of a new Winning Eleven.

I played as Germany against France, in wet weather (my first wet game), Superstar.

Something felt off from the start. I conceded a penalty by pressing tackle at the exact same moment that the player switching gave me a player standing on the penalty spot, next to their striker, when the ball wasn't even in the box yet...

But all game, I felt like my hands were tied and I wasn't quite in control - I didn't feel like that once yesterday.

Then, these things happened.

https://youtu.be/wwDckalzydw

You might see the first one as an animation problem, and not a cheat. Okay. (It seems like a cheat to me, jumping over the ball when it was in my possession, and not the kind of thing I've ever seen happen to the AI.)

But the second one - I'm holding "pressure" (though I tried letting go, and then tried super-cancelling). The player is locked on to a course where he can NEVER get to the ball. If he wasn't, he'd ABSOLUTELY get the ball. Control was taken away from me.

I'm trying to move the guy to where the ball is going, and he's carrying on towards the half-way line LONG AFTER the ball has gone past there.

I even saw my first instance of the "stun-gun" reaction to being tackled, leaving my player locked in an animation far enough away from the ball so that the AI could take it off me.

I'm gutted - because it's that stuff, more than the same-old-goals etc., that makes me dislike 2016, and over 10+ games yesterday I didn't see this stuff once, not once. So I'd convinced myself it had gone.

(Still a beautiful game, but for someone who plays the AI like I do, I'm worried the ML will be full of this stuff now...)
Click to expand...

The first should be a free kick, but the game tried to play on because it thought you still had the ball. The problem was that, as the player sorted his legs out following the challenge, he also stepped past the ball. If you'd got a free kick then there wouldn't be a problem. It's not cheating, it's just a case of both the ref and the animation getting it wrong.

The second looks like dodgy pathfinding. I think what the game's doing there is it's trying to get you to tackle from a goal side position, assuming the opponent gets the ball first - so you don't just run at the ball as the crow flies, otherwise you'd clatter through the back of the player. Again, it's not a cheat. IMO in that sort of position you should probably just run without holding pressure, otherwise you run the risk of something going wrong with the pathfinding (which generally won't happen, but occasionally might).

I don't know whether PES has quietly reintroduced Contain (by pressing away from goal + press)? Might be worth checking the command list...
 
romagnoli said:
Not asking this to disprove anything, just out of interest (sorry if you cover this in the vid, I've not got sound on):-

- What are Arsenal's defensive settings? Line settings, quantity to commit to defence, pressing etc?
- Do Boca do the same? (I noticed the striker stayed up there - Boca play a 4-3-3, as do France. Is it the midfield retreating too readily but they'd stay up if they were attackers?)

It's annoying that Gegenpress is greyed out - I'd hope that fixes this problem in a way, even though it'd be overkill.

This is a bit of a problem with football games in general, off the top of my head - especially when teams don't really understand whether a loose ball is going to be won by the attacker or the defender. There's something really infuriating about a pacy winger latching on to a loose ball into no man's land but his teammates are jogging all the way back to defend - or when a defence doesn't realise they're in serious trouble until the striker gets onto the ball.
Click to expand...

I'm not in front of the game right now, but Im' sure in my livestream archive it can be found somewhere :) .

My approach with the settings/tactics, etc. is that it is great they exist. I do not think that they are the #1 controller of the attack/defense level. This may make it more clear, if you didn't have the sound on...

Best case scenario, with proper transitioning:

Team1 attacking, Attack level = 4 (1-5 scale)
Team1 dispossessed, Defense level = 3 (1-5 scale)
Team1 defends in defensive third to 18-yardbox, Defense Level = 2 (1-5 scale)

What happens in PES, and needs to be fixed.

Team1 attacking, Attack Level = 4 (1-5 scale)
Team1 dispossessed, Defense level = 2 (1-5 scale)

*As you can see, they jump straight from Level 4 to Level 2, bypassing Level 3. That results in the ultra-retreating and ultra charge. This makes it more end to end, and makes the CPU offense passive when they've lost possession, or even a 50/50 ball occurs.
 
romagnoli said:
The first should be a free kick, but the game tried to play on because it thought you still had the ball. The problem was that, as the player sorted his legs out following the challenge, he also stepped past the ball. If you'd got a free kick then there wouldn't be a problem. It's not cheating, it's just a case of both the ref and the animation getting it wrong.

The second looks like dodgy pathfinding. I think what the game's doing there is it's trying to get you to tackle from a goal side position, assuming the opponent gets the ball first - so you don't just run at the ball as the crow flies, otherwise you'd clatter through the back of the player. Again, it's not a cheat. IMO in that sort of position you should probably just run without holding pressure, otherwise you run the risk of something going wrong with the pathfinding (which generally won't happen, but occasionally might).

I don't know whether PES has quietly reintroduced Contain (by pressing away from goal + press)? Might be worth checking the command list...
Click to expand...

I agree on that first one, looks like a free kick and then the animation just carried him past the ball in a strange looking way... but id not be overly bothered by that, bar not getting a free kick (thats football though).

The 2nd, ive not seen or should I say if thats happened its not stuck out to me. I dont often hold pressure though, im more of a position guy and look to cut off angles that way, so thats possibly why ive not seen it.

Fair points though.
 
The randomness is back, it what set it apart in the past and now it has returned. The deflections look so natural and the fight for the ball in the air is no longer predetermined, you have to fight for it and even if you win it, it can still end up anywhere!!

The passing animations with the laces looks smooth and fluid, so natural. Don't get me wrong some of the animations are still dated, but it gets lost in the game, because it is such a joy to play. Players react more now to goals, missed chances, fouls and referee's, so many great animations that makes it feel real time as it is in real life.

Get this game patched with the licences etc and it really is going to be amazing. I have also noticed how the adaptive AI changes if you overuse a certain tactic!! I played a lot down the wings, but they changed the shape which forced inside, and I had to adjust my game. It is clever, rewarding and a challenge on the higher settings.

I also like the shot and passing variety displayed by the AI now, no longer is it predictable, like all low scuffed shots in to the corners. They shoot when the opportunity presents itself, which gives that no game is the same feeling.

I have played football games for about 25 years and this is the best first impression I have had of any other football game before it.
 
lol, just bought a prepaid month card for xbox360

but still can't download the freaking demo

:RANT:


maybe a fellow xbox360 user can help me out

gamertag DDEES
 
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First impressions.

Improvement, but:
-AI is still making too few fouls, in 10 games, 3. But I see others have different experience.
-Shooting is more varied, but still not enough. Keepers much better, but still happy to stay on their lines if you are crowded with some defenders.
- passing speed is too much and looks strange regarding the animations

Based on regular, full manual, PS4, played as barca against Atletico and Arsenal.

Do you think that on Professional I will get more fouls?

Still not sure if it will be enough against Fifa this year..
 
bonyi said:
First impressions.

Improvement, but:
-AI is still making too few fouls, in 10 games, 3. But I see others have different experience.
-Shooting is more varied, but still not enough. Keepers much better, but still happy to stay on their lines if you are crowded with some defenders.
- passing speed is too much and looks strange regarding the animations

Based on regular, full manual, PS4, played as barca against Atletico and Arsenal.

Do you think that on Professional I will get more fouls?

Still not sure if it will be enough against Fifa this year..
Click to expand...
Regular.. You're lucky you get any foul, and get any enjoyment out of this game.
 
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