PES 2016 News & Discussion Thread

Started ML lastnight after creating the championship.

I sat up till 230am not wanting to stop. Enjoying so far and have plenty of day games BTW so not sure what people are complaining about.
 
zeemeister said:
Started ML lastnight after creating the championship.

I sat up till 230am not wanting to stop. Enjoying so far and have plenty of day games BTW so not sure what people are complaining about.
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Played 8 games in a row on the demo last night up til 2.30am lol. By and large, they were superb. Now I can defend a little better after that prolonged CPU possession cutting out their cheap goal which they work to the wings on Superstar, I'm finding a real balance. It's also critical I think that the keeper form is decent. Blue arrow for example will see them save the grand total of....nothing. So I always check that first.

Coming close to a decision and I may just opt for PES. I think it's a grand effort from FIFA this year in fact I must say, but I think I'll find more variation (and frustration) with PES.
 
ccshopland said:
Coming close to a decision and I may just opt for PES. I think it's a grand effort from FIFA this year in fact I must say, but I think I'll find more variation (and frustration) with PES.
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That is just what I can't get in FIFA. I admit it is a great football simulation, but I don't get overjoyed when I score and I don't get angry when I concede, it makes the game quite boring for me. Unlike PES which is sometimes very exciting and sometimes frustrating.
 
ccshopland said:
I think it's a grand effort from FIFA this year in fact I must say, but I think I'll find more variation (and frustration) with PES.
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I've been switching back-and-forth between the two over the last few days to come up with a list of the things that each does better than the other in my mind.

One of the biggest (and most positive) things PES does differently, I've found, is just... Letting you make risky passes.

I realise the FIFA guys have stamped down on letting silly passes get to their target because otherwise online matches would be awful (and the PES games I've played online have all had a minimum of five goals - I've long-since given up on playing this PES online).

But I play primarily against the CPU, and when I'm playing against a lower league team in FIFA, I still have to pass the ball around to beat them - because if I try hitting a long pass to a forward, it's usually intercepted, and if it isn't, it's because the forward is well-marked enough for the pass not to be a threat.

You play the same match over and over, and it's a slog, even though there's satisfaction in grinding out wins.

On PES, I'll hit a pass instinctively, and because of my FIFA conditioning I'll think "shit, that's going straight to their midfielder", but then the pass is hit with enough pace and at enough of an angle that it actually makes it through, because the midfielder can't see into the future and know exactly where to be.

I find that much more realistic, and much less frustrating.

The downside, for me (and my experience is with the Master League because I want to play a career mode), is that even though the matches do provide variety, some games are just insane. If your team chemistry is over 30 points different from the opposition, you're either going to destroy them with no effort, or be destroyed with no control over the result. In my experience.

I played as Liverpool yesterday against Norwich (team spirit 85), and set up three formations - one with a team spirit of 97, one with 85, and one with 50.

On the first formation, Norwich misplaced a ton of passes straight to me, and every player stood off me. I was 2-0 up at half time and they had a pass accuracy of about 65%. For the second half, I switched to the last formation, and at the end of the game, their passing accuracy was around 90% (which is a figure for both halves combined, so imagine how many passes they made in the second half, and how accurate they were). They were passing around like I wasn't there.

It finished 2-2, and for both of their goals, my defensive line - despite being set to the lowest setting, and despite me pushing it all the way back using the D-PAD literally 10 times - kept sitting on the half-way line and letting through for easy one-on-ones.

They started outperforming me by magically boosting their passing accuracy (there was no tactical reason, they just suddenly became more intelligent because of their "team spirit" advantage), and by taking control of my defence.

So, when you pick a team with a bad team spirit... You don't have control over your results - and that's what always makes me switch off the game, the feeling of "if you're going to take control off me, just don't give me control".

I've said it before and I'll say it again - thank God for Football Manager. Always good for that digital football fix...
 
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Deco said:
Chimps. . would Konami be able to tweak the game somehow when we're connected online without us knowing about it?. .. . because there's different things happening in it every other week. I'm going through a really stodgy time on it right now and that includes when restarting competitions as well.
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I think they change the game play every time they release patches, but there is also something else happening where other things affect how responsive the game is, which are probably bugs in the game. Maybe turning on different modes or restoring backups over writes code from updates or affects the memory used on the game

I was winning all my games by so much that the game lost it's fun, then I accepted a job as England manager in the master league and after playing my first game the game play changed again and has since been more difficult and I am enjoying it again as my games with Milan are now challenging

It also doesn't help that I don't think they have nailed the how the teamwork rating affacts the game (or whatever they call it now) and this changes the difficulty of the game all of the time as it goes up and down
 
"The downside, for me (and my experience is with the Master League because I want to play a career mode), is that even though the matches do provide variety, some games are just insane. If your team chemistry is over 30 points different from the opposition, you're either going to destroy them with no effort, or be destroyed with no control over the result. In my experience."

Absolutely. And this has the ability to destroy a game. The game I played yesterday, 2-6 as Juve v Corinthians, I mean the game went nuts. Literally nothing I could do about a period of play which saw them bang them in from everywhere and find outrageous lobbed through balls time after time.

But then you'll have a sequence of balanced games whereby win, lose or draw, the game feels awesome. I suppose I can put up with the one errant game playing balls if the majority play nicely. I just wish the chemistry stuff was more subtle, more organic over a period of time. Having a keeper on blue arrow for example is just car crash stuff. Whereas on red it's like having a wall there. Now the difference shouldn't be so dramatic. Having a little less confidence as a keeper shouldn't make you not stop anything.

If they just nerf the shooting accuracy too, it will go a low way in cutting down these outrageous scores.
 
ccshopland said:
I just wish the chemistry stuff was more subtle, more organic over a period of time. Having a keeper on blue arrow for example is just car crash stuff. Whereas on red it's like having a wall there.
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Yeah, I know I'm repeating myself now but it's these archaic bits of code that frustrate me, and many others, the most. It's like the PL games being played at night - you don't know whether they'll fix that next year, or never.

Benteke is the top scorer for me at the moment, and in the league (which is an entirely separate realism issue). He scored a hat-trick against Crystal Palace, with a "balanced" morale, and next game, his morale was a blue down arrow.

Why attempt creating realism with one hand ("team spirit") and crush it with the other (completely non-contextual morale)? Last year was the 20th anniversary of PES and this is something that hasn't been looked at over the course of those 20 years! Isn't that even slightly disgraceful?!

ccshopland said:
If they just nerf the shooting accuracy too, it will go a low way in cutting down these outrageous scores.
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I just feel like whenever my shot misses the target, it's not because of the situation (not because I was on the wrong side, too far from goal, under pressure from a marker or whatever), it's because the game has randomly decided I'm going to miss. I don't feel in control of some crucial areas of gameplay, and so when I score, I feel no emotion whatsoever (because it feels to me like the game just decided to let me score - it wasn't my accuracy with the stick and/or power-bar).

Rather than just nerfing shots to keep the scores sensible, I'd rather that shooting was more manual by default, and that the defensive AI was better (but not so far as to make it impossible to complete a pass in the final third).

Is it asking too much, is the CPU power not there? To have a half-way point between the flow of PES and the AI of FIFA?

I think it's entirely possible, but creating a better game just isn't a priority when everyone will buy your game regardless (and everyone plays it online anyway), because it's the latest version and has the latest teams.
 
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Chris Davies said:
Yeah, I know I'm repeating myself now but it's these archaic bits of code that frustrate me, and many others, the most. It's like the PL games being played at night - you don't know whether they'll fix that next year, or never.
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Loads of good points again Chris this one especially, and just highlights the frustration of PES fans. This is 2016 now, how long have we had THIS issue in the game? Like what, 7 years or something?!?

I mean this may seem like trifling little issues that people say 'oh but it's all about the gameplay lolz', and to extent the gameplay IS the most important. But all the stupid frustrating niggling things that have held PES back year on year are getting ignored and keep getting ignored. I mean just fix this day/night thing FFS. Why has it been ignored for over 2000 days!??!

You have a game, which looks great in day, and then you purposefully play the vast majority of games at night. This is just....unforgivable. They do themselves absolutely no favours at all for some of the staunchest most loyal fans in the history of gaming.
 
quaqua said:
Slide values are not proportional.
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the way i have seen it after lots of testing if you have a FT error of say 60 and a cross error of 69 then the majority of crosses will go wide - reduce FT to 18 and they dont..like wise if you have a FT error of say 60 and high pass speed the touch is more evident
 
ccshopland said:
Loads of good points again Chris this one especially, and just highlights the frustration of PES fans. This is 2016 now, how long have we had THIS issue in the game? Like what, 7 years or something?!?

I mean this may seem like trifling little issues that people say 'oh but it's all about the gameplay lolz', and to extent the gameplay IS the most important. But all the stupid frustrating niggling things that have held PES back year on year are getting ignored and keep getting ignored. I mean just fix this day/night thing FFS. Why has it been ignored for over 2000 days!??!

You have a game, which looks great in day, and then you purposefully play the vast majority of games at night. This is just....unforgivable. They do themselves absolutely no favours at all for some of the staunchest most loyal fans in the history of gaming.
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I started a thread about this on WENB and apart from the main topic about the game, it was the most popular thread as people felt it was important to fix. Me and a few others literally hounded Adam and PES Official on twitter about it and they just never replied to them. In all there were hundreds of people saying the same thing and they didn't address it

The best option would be add the ability to set time of day in the master league for games as this would allow people to play the game how they like and realistically to their league.

The problem is worse if you select to play in the premier league as the ratio of day and night games is the same, but the ratio of sunshine and rain is different, so you have less chance of getting a game in sun light in the league. Add cup games and champions league games being all at night and you can end up with having 2-3 games per season in sun light

The game looks and feels at it's best in sun light on one of the darker green pitches. Allowing your customers to select this for the majority of their game play would seem sensible.
 
Chimps-with-quiffs said:
I started a thread about this on WENB and apart from the main topic about the game, it was the most popular thread as people felt it was important to fix. Me and a few others literally hounded Adam and PES Official on twitter about it and they just never replied to them.
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Absolute madness.

They give off this aura of "we know what's best for you, shut up everybody".

It reminds me of the way they locked the "select a side" screen in tournaments, so that you weren't allowed to select the CPU side and try to knock your mate's team out of a cup. That's how I played football games for years.

Suddenly, they lock you out from doing that. Why? To stop you playing against yourself, scoring 10 goals a game and unlocking a load of trophies? Who cares if someone does that? They've paid for the game, it doesn't affect me, so who cares? What possible reason is there to stop us playing multiplayer tournaments the way we want to?

But Konami know best... "You must sit and watch your friends play against the CPU, or you must play random friendlies against each other, and you will learn to appreciate it... Now, begone..."
 
Chris Davies said:
Absolute madness.

They give off this aura of "we know what's best for you, shut up everybody".

It reminds me of the way they locked the "select a side" screen in tournaments, so that you weren't allowed to select the CPU side and try to knock your mate's team out of a cup. That's how I played football games for years.

Suddenly, they lock you out from doing that. Why? To stop you playing against yourself, scoring 10 goals a game and unlocking a load of trophies? Who cares if someone does that? They've paid for the game, it doesn't affect me, so who cares? What possible reason is there to stop us playing multiplayer tournaments the way we want to?

But Konami know best... "You must sit and watch your friends play against the CPU, or you must play random friendlies against each other, and you will learn to appreciate it... Now, begone..."
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:WORSHIP::WORSHIP::WORSHIP:
 
zeemeister said:
Phew what an absolute rocket. Well done. I seldom he the back of the net and can't remember a ball blasting at that height.
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I was saying i could not pull this shot off on FIFA keeping the ball a foot of the ground with max power without it rising or losing speed dont be a nob all your life
 
Can someone else try this possible solution to excessive night games set your exhibition matches to night games and in ML you will get a lot more day matches

I tried it back and forth seems to work for me just had 4 day games in ml in a row reloaded after changing exhibition to day and had 3 night games
 
Really liked the idea of some pal from this forum about that the passing shooting crossing etc etc, animations have to start when the bar is fullying. Maybe the power bar must fill much faster, or the speed can change from player to player maybe. I dont have this problem that you guys are saying about AI low shots. My problem is that, I dont see the AI passing the ball incisievely. They pass the ball well in midfield but thats it. When they score its my mistake or some bug in my defenders or some bad clearence or something, its vary rare to see the AI scoring goals from a good build up, you now? It feels like cheated most of time.

Sorry for the bad english.
 
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To be honest in regards to the conversations above i think Honome made a fantastic post a few pages ago which are are forgetting regarding to enjoy the game don't read the discussion here. The discussion is good but I think when looking at the identifying the issues and moving forward for 2017 its like we are going round in circles.

PES 2016 has be disappointing which is clear. Thing is we are missing is its dam obvious what the problem with the game is. Its not lack of sliders, or old coding at all. Its like some people want the baby thrown out with the bathwater.

The movement and dribbling system is too basic and presents a lack of variables with shooting and passing. This creates the 'Tron running' effect as we see with the looped sprinting animation. Its PS1 basic its that bad

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0Lf4br6_lQ

Look especially at 7:25 and the third goal when i start running with the ball with the goals i score and how the animation loops over and over. Thing is i foresaw this problem which has been present in both PES 2014/15 since the Fox Engine came in. Compare that tron running to this in 2013:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuQQ4m-hDoU

look at 4:37 and the run with Agbonglahor. look how dynamic and responsive that run is.

Now you see the issue with PES between 2014-2016. They created a base in 2014 which was all about animations and physics for basic shooting, passing and jostling. They did little to no work on the sprinting/running at all.

No fouls? Lazer guided passing? Too easy to score? Its quite clear that the basic running system causes these issues due to lack for enough variables affecting the players velocity which creates the action. Every time you shoot and pass, notice how its so rare you player will be 'off balance', hence why its so easy!

Playing PES 2014-16 you know what i swear i cannot remember seeing one genuine 50/50 tackle, something that was so defined in PES 2013 i can do a whole compilation of 50/50' just in one match.

As me and Honome discussed PES is built in 3 year blocks and this is the last year of the 3 year block so for PES to move forward the key and by many miles the most important thing for PES 2017 is for Konami to work and build on the movement/run/sprint model. Lack of fouls, easy shooting and lazer passing will all be sorted when more variables are present

In theory this should not be a problem, one thing which is also abundantly clear PES 2015 or 2016 has no in any way utilize the PS4 power, graphically or in technology, the PC version is exactly the same as the PS4 version bar lightings being a bit better on the PS4, hell even more similar than last year and the spec needed to run it are the same as the PS3 games before it.

My big concern really is Konami's head office who don't give a dam about video games, rather than this pathetic hate of Adam and Asmir who are just two guys paid to promote the game, what they say is rather irrelevant to how you see the game. I think if either where honest about the game they would be sacked since its their job to promote Konami.

My concern with the record reviews and 9/10 is the head office will do a EA sports and demand to keep the game the way it is which would truly be a disaster. this year for PES 2017 it is crucial for PES Productions to focus heavily on evolving the game with the movement/dribble/run/sprint model.In theory all they need to do is recreate what was done in PES 2013 so the hope is there and they have proven themselves before, they must focus on it now.

lastly I feel here that we don't express ourselves and the love we have for football. For example Chris Davies says that he doesn't even understand the PES community anymore, if i can say, I'm a graphic designer, I love and enjoy creating things for people to share and enjoy, I spend happily more time editing PES or other things than using them. There are many others like this, and others who just enjoy playing. We all have things we like and dislike and we should focus on expressing what we like about whatever game and not being afraid people will disagree. This forum seems to be obsessed with 'realism' when the truth is it's all about what you enjoy and you shouldn't feel as if the way you play needs to be justified by anyone else.

Its why I said about people posting more videos as personally I see and take in a lot more about games from what I actually see rather than what is written.
 
One thing i will rant about a little bit is the AI always shooting in the bottom corner.

No excuse for lack of variety here, so poor. Easily the worst thing about single player.
 
anyone else notice how for pes 2016 they've only started to refer to official team websites for player's height and weight. prime example kolo toure from pes 5 to pes 2015 is 183cm in height. this is the same figure stated on sites like wikipedia etc (but now has since been corrected). in 2016 he has the correct height of 1.78 which is what the official liverpool website states.
 
klashman69 said:
One thing i will rant about a little bit is the AI always shooting in the bottom corner.

No excuse for lack of variety here, so poor. Easily the worst thing about single player.
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Or only defending 1 AI cross in 10 matches... if you're lucky.


After it was a major problem last yr, and it was supposedly looked into and fixed for this yr, all I can say is good luck for AI shooting in '17
 
Lami said:
The one thing that's killing it for me.
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for me whats killing it other than this, is the illogical moves the ai makes and scores goal with one touch even if it's a high sliding shot, it's totally illogical, keepers slow motion is driving me crazy.
 
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