PES 2016 News & Discussion Thread

[TommyC0ckles]

Apologies for this, I'm about to do a shameless plug and it doesn't sit right with me. But this seems like a fairly active forum for pes fans that hasn't degenerated into a field of insults unlike some others.

We recently went live with a football website and gave PES16 our hands on review impressions, if anyone would like to read our thoughts (well my thoughts actually) it's on the link here

http://www.fanformation.com/pes-2016-review.html

Sorry.. I know.. I feel dirty and cheap.. like one of my suits.. spoiler alert, I love pes.. just maybe not this pes.

 

[Chris Davies]

It's a good review.

 

[robbieryan]

Honestly, that is the best thing I have seen written about this game. It reflects pretty much 99% what I feel. It's also fair, reasonable and is able to get across the points which need to be fixed without any bile. Send it to Adam/officialpes or whoever because that's gold

 

[gerd]

Tommycockles, that is a great review.

I agree with almost everything you write. IMO the scripting is a much bigger problem than what you think. To me it is the biggest problem of this game in both ML and BAL.

This is also the way to do things: stressing that you are a fan, that basically you like the game, but that despite all this, you are not satisfied. I wrote a similar (but shorter and less detailed) "open letter to Adam Bhatti.

This is the kind of feedback that should be given to Konami and other people should make similar reviews or letters.

You write very well, congratulations!

To end my reaction.
When reading your review i might have found an explanation for the raving reviews and 9 or 10 scores.

There might even be two explanations.

1. the reviewers played the demo. To me the PES2016 demo was the very best PES game i ever played. It was the first time i played it for weeks in a row.

2. the reviewers played the retail version, but only played the exhibition mode. I still find that the exhibition matches are the most satisfying ones.


PS: and off-topic: to people who wonder why this thread is such a mess, if everybody could write about PES like this review, this thread might be a joy and might have an impact.

If i would be a mod (i was once asked, but declined), i would ban all people who post bile in this thread. Or at least i would delete their posts. The thread would be 85% shorter, but would be interesting. This is not criticism to the mods, it isa message to quite a few very negative posters.

 

[Ameppe]

Again this comes down to player ID, the ability to carry the ball at pace shouldn’t be applicable to all players, Kurt Zouma isn’t a player that can travel 50 yards, beating players with ease, but in PES this is easy to pull off.

This is exactly what i showed in my last video, completely agree.

There seems an over reliance on the hard working, unpaid, PES community to fill in the gaps of the game, every year it seems the game is released in an increasingly unfinished state, this shouldn’t happen. Pride in the product is lacking, you cannot rely on your consumer to fill in the blanks, you should put out a game that still looks polished to a customer without the need to edit.

This is so true it hurts. I can understand fixing player names, but having to edit team tactics and player abilities to have a good and balanced gameplay is something that really needs to go. The game has been released unfinished every year: one year it's database, another is gameplay, another year it's lack of basics functions, the following is the lack of licenses that are only added along the year.

 

[P34SEMM]

Ive stopped playing as I now have Star Wars. Will probably sell this as I havent touched it for months

 

[Ameppe]

Thanks everyone for your kind words, I love pes, it gets under your skin and causes emotions to boil over at times. Thanks again for reading, really appreciate it

About forwarding to the official channels, I'm not totally convinced they want to read anything other than praise these days. Maybe I'll just send over the nice parts

i already linked your review to officialpes on twitter, at least we are trying to let them know our opinions about the game.

 

[TommyC0ckles]

i already linked your review to officialpes on twitter, at least we are trying to let them know our opinions about the game.

Thanks, 'opinions' is the key word there, as paying consumers and loyal customers, opinions should be at least heard. They may think our opinions stink, but letting us air them doesn't cost a penny.

 

[Chris Davies]

Maybe the game is intentionally moving into an area that I'm not comfortable with, what I see as 'arcadey fun', may just be seen as 'the future of PES' to others. So my view of how the game should be played, and what should be offered in a PES title is different to what they think I guess.

Of course, it's all subjective. I think PES is trying to recapture those very early days (the ISS days even), aiming at recreating old-school gameplay for an older crowd who want to pick up a controller and play, rather than developing a more modern game with more "things to worry about" (attributes, for example - giving all players the ability to dribble with success).

Perhaps that's the best strategy given FIFA's popularity (everywhere outside of this forum) - let FIFA be one thing, and PES be another. Two different games for two different audiences (except it leaves those of us who dream of a more realistic football game in a bit of a hole).

However, I was talking to Asim about how none of the reviews mentioned the transfer data being from the 14/15 season at the time of release - including his own review, which he wrote for GamesRadar, without mentioning the fact that he's very close to Adam and works for WENB, which Adam founded (not that I brought that up).

My personal opinion is that calling a game "2016" and shipping it with 14/15 data was - I can't think of a nicer way to say this - really, really shitty. My point was that none of the reviews were edited to say "hey guys, we gave this 9/10 without realising how out-of-date the squads are, don't expect to be playing with this season's teams".

He made it personal (despite me repeating that I respected him and his opinion), and blocked me pretty quickly.

I understand they both had death threats etc. and those who made them were condemned pretty much unanimously, on here and on Twitter. But if you're going to tweet things about other games (he was talking about how Fallout 4 "should be given low scores everywhere or it's bullshit" due to how broken it was, and didn't like me pointing out that PES got high scores despite shipping with what I would call a serious issue) - you have to be prepared to debate your point, without being childish about it.

I've seen so many letters written to Konami, and Adam, and the only thing that's ever discussed by them, or retweeted, is those "PES is the best, you're the best, don't ever change the game" messages. Or tweets about their awards. Including ones from WENB and its sister-blogs...

 

[TommyC0ckles]

My personal opinion is that calling a game "2016" and shipping it with 14/15 data was - I can't think of a nicer way to say this - really, really shitty. My point was that none of the reviews were edited to say "hey guys, we gave this 9/10 without realising how out-of-date the squads are, don't expect to be playing with this season's teams".

Yeah the high scores for such an unfinished product were surprising to say the least, I remember loading it up on release day, looking at the state of it and half hoped that I'd bought a preview copy by mistake.

And you're right about Fallout, that took a lot of flack for being broken or unfinished whereas PES got off a little lightly in my opinion for similar offences.

I don't know if it's just me, but the last few years I've felt the gaming community has been desperate for PES to shine, we as fans obviously do, but reviewers too. It's as if the industry wants to look cool and say "PES is back, better than FIFA", raving about PES has become hip again, hating on EA and backing the underdog, great if it's true but I'm not seeing that in the actual end product. Maybe that's just me being old and suspicious though

 

[angus]

Of course, it's all subjective. I think PES is trying to recapture those very early days (the ISS days even), aiming at recreating old-school gameplay for an older crowd who want to pick up a controller and play, rather than developing a more modern game with more "things to worry about" (attributes, for example - giving all players the ability to dribble with success).

This is pretty much the opposite of what I see. PC sports games 10-15 years ago were complicated. They were SIM games. Gamers today DON'T WANT that, they don't want complicated, they want pick up and play. Half the ratings and settings in PES no longer work or matter because Konami has shifted to an arcade game-design vision for the series. That's were the money is and where and the unit sales are. Konami obviously realizes this is the only way they have any hope of surviving.

And if you doubt my comments about arcade gamers these days, just look at what today's gamers and even all the game sites focus on when these games are about to come out: quality of graphics and player faces, and which player has a higher overall rating than whom. These games have become shiny toys for kids, and pretty much all because of the popularity of console gaming (another whole topic).

 

[P34SEMM]

if i sell mine how do i know if the day one code has been used?

i know i havent used it but my son might have. How would I know?
thanks

 

[Ameppe]

This is pretty much the opposite of what I see. PC sports games 10-15 years ago were complicated. They were SIM games. Gamers today DON'T WANT that, they don't want complicated, they want pick up and play. Half the ratings and settings in PES no longer work or matter because Konami has shifted to an arcade game-design vision for the series. That's were the money is and where and the unit sales are. Konami obviously realizes this is the only way they have any hope of surviving.

And if you doubt my comments about arcade gamers these days, just look at what today's gamers and even all the game sites focus on when these games are about to come out: quality of graphics and player faces, and which player has a higher overall rating than whom. These games have become shiny toys for kids, and pretty much all because of the popularity of console gaming (another whole topic).

Maybe they are doing good with sales, but for me this Pes has been the last i bought at release or near release period. They lost me when playing Pes 2016 i understood they are simplifying the game too much. They should reach a balance between arcade and simulation, but this year game is dangerously near to arcade.

Just now i won 9-0 in Master League Superstar difficulty. Yes, i have a great team full of champions but these kind of scores are too frequent in Pes 2016 and show that this is not the game for me. Next year Fifa will be my game of reference, EA at least tried to make a more balanced game in response to Fifa 15 critics. KONAMI on the contrary seems to be deaf to his hardcore fans, the people who bought their game every single year since Iss pro evolution 1 on ps1 to Pes 2016.

 

[Chris Davies]

This is pretty much the opposite of what I see. PC sports games 10-15 years ago were complicated. They were SIM games. Gamers today DON'T WANT that, they don't want complicated, they want pick up and play. Half the ratings and settings in PES no longer work or matter because Konami has shifted to an arcade game-design vision for the series. That's were the money is and where and the unit sales are. Konami obviously realizes this is the only way they have any hope of surviving.

That's a great point - but then look at how the likes of Star Wars Battlefront has received so much criticism for "dumbing down" and for lacking content, and look at how games like NBA 2K are revered, every year, for being pretty complex and for making an effort at attempting simulation.

Review scores are important, too - I know some believe they aren't, but I've seen and heard what the high-ups at places like EA think of Metacritic scores, and how they use them to make very real and game-changing decisions. So, what the reviewers think can help shape a game (and reviewers aren't usually looking for a dumbed-down experience, though admittedly those reviewers who wanted PES 2016 to be the best football game ever have kind of shot themselves in the foot with their review scores).

I see where you're coming from and there's certainly a market for a "streamlined" (i.e. simpler) experience - e.g. all those who think the simplicity of Battlefront is a good thing - but I would argue that there's a correlation there between the old-school gamer and a simpler, "reduced" gameplay experience ("reduced" in the sense of providing less content, less options, less to master).

Battlefront is simplified so that it pleases a wider age range (this has been admitted to I believe), including the guys who think FPS games have all been downhill since Quake or Unreal or whatever it might be, and PES is simplified for those guys who think football games have all been downhill since ISS PE2 (who are casual gamers looking for a purely fun experience, and don't say things like "how has John Terry just dribbled past that defender and scored a pearler").

They then bolt on all the ripped-off Ultimate Team stuff to generate much-needed additional income, and also to try and get the kids addicted in the same level that they are with FIFA (and the simpler gameplay and utterly mental online scorelines is something I imagine would appeal to them, or at least Konami might believe that it would appeal).

That's my belief, anyway, but I certainly see your point!

I base this off the fact that there's a few guys at work who like this year's PES, and they have all used the following phrases when describing it (and they're all over 30):

• "It reminds me of the old games"
• "It's easy to get into"
• "I can play it with my son"
• "There's no trick stick"
• "I don't have the time to play it like I used to so I don't want it to be any more complicated"

They all like Battlefront, too...

So, is it that modern gamers want a dumbed-down experience, or that older gamers want a dumbed-down experience because they "haven't got the time / patience / concentration that they used to have"?

I'd argue the latter, because the younger guys I know who play FIFA aren't wishing for it to be simplified.

 

[Ameppe]

if i sell mine how do i know if the day one code has been used?

i know i havent used it but my son might have. How would I know?
thanks

Try to redeem it, if it says that it has already been redeemed then you know it's been used.

If it has not been used PSN will ask confirmation before redeeming the code.

 

[P34SEMM]

Try to redeem it, if it says that it has already been redeemed then you know it's been used.



If it has not been used PSN will ask confirmation before redeeming the code.

Thanks

 

[Ameppe]

• "It reminds me of the old games"
• "It's easy to get into"
• "I can play it with my son"
• "There's no trick stick"
• "I don't have the time to play it like I used to so I don't want it to be any more complicated"

They all like Battlefront, too...

So, is it that modern gamers want a dumbed-down experience, or that older gamers want a dumbed-down experience because they "haven't got the time / patience / concentration that they used to have"?

I'd argue the latter, because the younger guys I know who play FIFA aren't wishing for it to be simplified.

Pes on Ps2 was never difficult to play, you could play it like a casual gamer, but if you wanted there was another layer of complexity behind the apparent simplicity of its gameplay. It was literally easy to play, hard to master.

Pes 2016 is easy to play but it doesn't have the depth of old games. By just playing Real Madrid you can score lots of goals, even on Superstar difficulty so nobody is forced to learn more about the game. Pes 2016 has no sense of challenge, you can score tons of goals,most of them completely similar, but not a single one can be so satisfying like some i scored with the past Pes.

Do you know why i like Pes 5 and i think it's the best Pes ever? Because it's extremely balanced, every match was a battle, referee definitely was good, not every shot on goal was a danger for the keeper, keepers saved, and when i scored it was a great feeling. Besides i remember how good was to rewatch those goals with that replay system, it was so great compared to what we have now...

So, the fact they are saying it's easy to get into shouldn't be a negative, the negative is that KONAMI is not able anymore to reach that balance between arcade and simulation that was the key point of Pes.

 

[Chris Davies]

Pes on Ps2 were never difficult to play, you could play it like a casual gamer, but if you wanted there was another layer of complexity behind the apparent simplicity of its gameplay. It was literally easy to play, hard to master.

Pes 2016 is easy to play but it doesn't have the depth of old games. If by just playing Real Madrid you can score lots of goals, even on Superstar difficulty, nobody is forced to learn more about the game. Pes 2016 has no sense of challenge, you can score tons of goals,most of them completely similar, but not a single one can be so satisfying like some i scored with the past Pes.

I absolutely agree with you, and there's no doubt that the game should flow easily (and it does this year, at times it flows beautifully).

But I guess it's easier to focus on the "easy to play" bit than the "hard to master" bit, and there's an audience there that doesn't really care to the level that we do (make that 90% of the audience), who don't really care if there's any difference between two players, and just want a fast, smooth, fun experience that's easy to get into whether you play every day, or once a week (and there's a lot of those old-school gamers who are now in the latter category).

Without starting a debate that goes into the specifics, I feel like PES is going down that "pick up and play, no need for depth" road (I imagine it's easier to put that together from a code perspective, too, therefore quicker to put together, and potentially cheaper), whereas the FIFA guys tried to add depth (perhaps without knowledge).

With PES's great review scores, I think they'll happily carry on down that path for years to come, now, and sadly, with FIFA's poor review scores, I think FIFA will try to copy them.

My worry is that PES 17 and FIFA 17 will both be 100mph 5-5 funfests...

 

[Ameppe]

I absolutely agree with you, and there's no doubt that the game should flow easily (and it does this year, at times it flows beautifully).

But I guess it's easier to focus on the "easy to play" bit than the "hard to master" bit, and there's an audience there that doesn't really care to the level that we do (make that 90% of the audience), who don't really care if there's any difference between two players, and just want a fast, smooth, fun experience that's easy to get into whether you play every day, or once a week (and there's a lot of those old-school gamers who are now in the latter category).

Without starting a debate that goes into the specifics, I feel like PES is going down that "pick up and play, no need for depth" road (I imagine it's easier to put that together from a code perspective, too, therefore quicker to put together, and potentially cheaper), whereas the FIFA guys tried to add depth (perhaps without knowledge).

With PES's great review scores, I think they'll happily carry on down that path for years to come, now, and sadly, with FIFA's poor review scores, I think FIFA will try to copy them.

My worry is that PES 17 and FIFA 17 will both be 100mph 5-5 funfests...

I don't know how Pes will be and it's difficult to say, i can only say will buy it only if people here on evo web will praise it as a return to balance. I'm tired to be disappointed.

 

[tinpanalley]

I'm sorry if this has been answered a billion times but searching for only two or three characters isn't possible (PC, PS4, etc).

Ignoring graphics and online play (so just focusing on the single player modes) how different are the PC and PS4 versions really? Are they fundamentally different, like they're basically two different games? Or just graphically and frame rate?

 

[dubcity]

I'm sorry if this has been answered a billion times but searching for only two or three characters isn't possible.





Ignoring graphics and online play (so just focusing on the single player modes) how different are the PC and PS4 versions really? Are they fundamentally different, like they're basically two different games? Or just graphically and frame rate?

Gameplay is the same on all consoles and PC. Only difference is PS4/XB1 have the advanced graphics, animations, colors, etc.

 

[saintric]

Find it hard to disagree with what most of you are saying and its true the target audience seems to be ppl who want a quick pick up and play arcade type and judging from people i know who are casual gamers its worked

I play for a div 2 pro club on fifa with around 7 other ppl in their early 30s and most of them play pes when it comes to playing alone offline because its 'more fun' thats not to say they havent noticed the flaws like refs gks ect just they find FIFAs gameplay a slog everything feels laboured to quote them i sort of agree but think PES wears thin pretty quick as you have see the same goals and outcomes after a playing it a fair bit also its not difficult enough vs CPU

 

[zeemeister]

That review is a good read. Agree with alot especially the daft trick system. When you pull off a move you lose momentum and the defender is able to recover quicker and take the ball off. It makes no sense.

 

[klashman69]

Apologies for this, I'm about to do a shameless plug and it doesn't sit right with me. But this seems like a fairly active forum for pes fans that hasn't degenerated into a field of insults unlike some others.

We recently went live with a football website and gave PES16 our hands on review impressions, if anyone would like to read our thoughts (well my thoughts actually) it's on the link here

http://www.fanformation.com/pes-2016-review.html

Sorry.. I know.. I feel dirty and cheap.. like one of my suits.. spoiler alert, I love pes.. just maybe not this pes.

Cool

The attacking style of the CPU AI is one of the biggest concerns among the PES community, the majority of teams seem to play the same way, it feels as though player and team ID is not having the affect that it should be. Does this mean that player stats are not being utilised properly, there seem to be more stats than ever before but PES games in previous years felt like player and team ID had more impact than they do now.

There actually less stats than compared to previous games, infact the reason why there seems to be more is they added more goalkeeper stats.

Also the AI attack is ruthless, very often it’s a case of 1 shot, 1 goal, always low and always into the corner. Variety is a huge issue here, I have no problem conceding a 20-yard goal in the top corner, or a beautifully worked move to knock it past the keeper, but it always seems the same, ball into striker, defence doesn’t react, low shot into the corner, goal. It has the player shaking his head in frustration at the game, which brings me onto another frustration.

Yes. The problem is variety when the AI shot, its terrible in 2016 the AI always look to shoot low.

The problem with Team AI is the same exact problem with the shambles off the pitch with the outdated squads however, if Konami made an effort to setup teams properly you will see huge variety like every year from AI teams.

The problem is the people who make the big decisions at Konami just do not care anymore about video games and see the game as a cash cow, they have also tapped into the bribing of reviewers which FIFA had been doing for years.

That review is a good read. Agree with alot especially the daft trick system. When you pull off a move you lose momentum and the defender is able to recover quicker and take the ball off. It makes no sense.

Trick system is unfinished! The concept is perfect but the animations just don't work because the movement system isn't fluid or responsive enough for it to work.

 

[tinpanalley]

Gameplay is the same on all consoles and PC. Only difference is PS4/XB1 have the advanced graphics, animations, colors, etc.

I've found people arguing that because animations are different, it stands to reason that that would have required gameplay and physics improvements. Not sure about that.
Anyway, just got an opportunity to pick up the PS4 version for very cheap (20€) and thought it might be nice despite not relishing the idea of having to import all my own uniforms and logos. Plus, hard to compete with the level of detail in the PTE Patch. I don't play ALL the leagues, only Ligue1 and Premier League, but it's nice having real uniforms and logos for all the Champions League teams.
So, if they're the same game under the wrapper, I'm not gonna bother getting the PS4 version.

 

[dubcity]

I've found people arguing that because animations are different, it stands to reason that that would have required gameplay and physics improvements. Not sure about that.


Anyway, just got an opportunity to pick up the PS4 version for very cheap (20€) and thought it might be nice despite not relishing the idea of having to import all my own uniforms and logos. Plus, hard to compete with the level of detail in the PTE Patch. I don't play ALL the leagues, only Ligue1 and Premier League, but it's nice having real uniforms and logos for all the Champions League teams.


So, if they're the same game under the wrapper, I'm not gonna bother getting the PS4 version.

Well I've played the game extensively on both the Xbox 360 and the PS4, and the matches play out the same on both. PS4 looks better, smoother, and presentation elements are enhanced, but gameplay-wise it's the same to me.

 

[tinpanalley]

Well I've played the game extensively on both the Xbox 360 and the PS4, and the matches play out the same on both. PS4 looks better, smoother, and presentation elements are enhanced, but gameplay-wise it's the same to me.

The PC may be another story though, no? It isn't the 360/PS3 version, nor is it the PS4/XBOX1 version.

 

[B-Man]

100% agree, down to the fact that FIFA 15 was criticised in some reviews for being "too fast" and "too end-to-end" (it definitely was), and then in their PES 16 reviews, those same issues were listed as plus points.

Spoiler

Just in the same way that needing to use build-up play to get anywhere in FIFA 16 (thus improving it in comparison to FIFA 15) was listed as a bad thing by GamesRadar - the same website Asim wrote his PES review for... Coincidence?

SOURCE: GamesRadar

How do I multi-quote? Tried using the multi-quote button but wasn't able to include Tommy in this...

I practically agree with pretty much everything that has been written on this page of the thread. Chris I agree with you and Tommy I agree with a lot of your review. I tweeted it out.

Frankly, I feel the game was fundamentally flawed in its design. Let's take a look at defending as an example...

Defending in PES is essentially "tackle, tackle, intercept through ball behind the backline because the passer didn't time the pass correctly, tackle, tackle--rinse and repeat." That is not football. Defending in football fundamentally is about cutting off passing lanes and closing down space. Surprisingly FIFA 16 does this quite well. It took me days to get used to FIFA's defensive style. I HATED it at first and became really frustrated because I was so used to defending in PES where you can double and triple press all over the pitch and face no repercussions. While not perfect, does a better job of replicating real football and PES could learn a thing or two from it.

There is a risk/reward with pressing in FIFA. If you try to press all over the pitch space opens up that can be exploited so you have to be conscientious of when and where on the pitch to press and when to be moving guys around behind the ball to cut off passing lanes. FIFA does a good job of defending space like in real footy where as with PES its all about 1v1 defending all over the pitch. In PES you can double and triple press all over the pitch without having any worry about space opening up because players recover so quickly.

I honestly was enjoying FIFA 16 before the last few patches that ruined the game and made it hockey on grass again. Online, I was beating the Man Citys, PSGs, Madrids, Barcas with Italy (no fast players and stats in high 70s low 80s) by outfootballing my opponents. You are not rewarded for playing football in PES and now in the current state of FIFA, I feel like the full on press counterattackers give it to a fast player and beat 4 dudes are the ones rewarded.

Thats not football to me, and that was never PES to me.

In PES, teams don't defend as a unit. If your opponents Right Winger has the ball out by the right touchline 25 yards from your goal. Your left back shifts over to defend the RW but your CB's don't shift with him fully leaving space. Even more obvious is when you look at the radar and see your opponents Left Winger all the way on the opposite side of the pitch 5 yards off the left touchline being marked by your Right Back. leaving gaps between the outside backs and the center backs. In real football, the entire defensive line should shift as a unit over to ball side of the pitch. Same with the midfield. But in PES this doesn't happen leaving unearned and easily exploitable space.

Step back and watch PES move when defending. Each player has this imaginary 3-5 yard circular sphere around them and only become aware of an attacking player when that player enters that sphere. Which is why we as a community have been harping on the defensive A.I. awareness issues for a number of years. I'll give you another example:

This has happened to everyone who has played PES the last few iterations. Your opponent is in your final third and has pushed your backline back to around the penalty spot. Your opponents attacker is in midfield and beats your defensive center mid 20-25 yards out from goal. The attacker is about to dribble into the penalty box. You press the player switch button frantically to switch to a CB and you are pressing the double press button frantically so one of your CBs steps up and challenges the attacker. Your CBs though stand flat footed and only step up to challenge the attacker when the attacker enters the CB's invisible "sphere." But a lot of times it doesn't get that far. The attacker dribbles into the box and shoots low corner uncontested. Leaving you throwing the controller or cursing.

I'm not saying FIFA's defensive ethos is amazing, it has flaws, but it is clearly a better representation of football if you take the time to learn how to defend. Hopefully PES notices their defensive deficiencies and we get something different for 2017 but I'm not holding my breath. EA has taken so much from PS2 PES why doesn't PES see what good FIFA is doing and replicate it themselves? My fear is the awards and reviews cloud Konagi's mind and PES 2017 is 2016 with subtle tweaks

I'll save attacking philosophy for another post

 

[Jimi_Zuko]

@ B-man, when are you doing the next wenb podcast, should mention all that in the podcast.

 

[B-Man]

@ B-man, when are you doing the next wenb podcast, should mention all that in the podcast.

Tomorrow I believe.