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PES 2014 Discussion Thread

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Really, really SPOT ON, one of the few posts I've read here that spots one of the most important problems of the game. Something that's more important that any shiny new rendering engine or ankle tapes. This is of the utmost importance, but Konami hasn't done anything in years about it.

I've been saying the same for ages. For instance, when the opponent is pressing on your half and you start a counter you can ALWAYS pass straight to your strikers, they will be absolutely free of mark near the halfline, and even if you only have 1 striker up, he will receive totally free. 5 meters away there can be 4 defenders not anticipating the move, not pressing him, doing nothing. This totally breaks the idea of positional play and favours counters and counter-counters all the time. And it makes ACCURACY to be much higher than it should, specially in the midfield.

There is as well not enough context on the "passer" of the play: vision practically means nothing as any player can pass to players he would hardly see in real life, when you're pressed or pushed or there's contact passing with an average player should have a LOT more error, and 180º turns shouldn't practically exist... but it's far worse on the other side of the play! There is practically NO CONTEXT AT ALL in the receiver.

In real life if you pass the ball to a striker who has defenders around him the most probable thing, EVEN IF THE PASS IS PERFECT, is that defenders will push the receiver, or try to unbalance him, or foul him. For example: how many times we see an incredibly gifted player like Neymar receive with a defender kicking his ankles from behind? I've never seen that in PES. Truly shocking. We're talking about fundamentals of the play!

That's because the AI managing the positional play is absolutely primitive and hasn't changed in a decade. And all this "new engine" talk is crap if they don't take a new approach on things like this. And they haven't.

I have done this (as the defender) in multiplayer (only against fair opponents) but it rarely (if at all) happens in single player. In single player games it depends on the scenario, the CPU can't be trusted.

It would add another layer to the gameplay and give both players (and or CPU) another thing to think about. It could be a useful tactic to try and rattle the star player, play him tight (not man mark), constant fouling to break up play and not allow the opposition to get into a rhythm etc. They are ways to the latter now but its only because most online want to win at all costs.

Both companies have a long way to if they truly want to create a simulation game.
 
Last few posts hit the nail on the head regarding defensive awareness.

My problem with manual passing is it adds a complexity that isn't inherent in real life. Professional footballers don't have to think about a 10 yard pass, they do it instinctively. The factors that make the pass successful, is like has been said, pressure from the opposition and positioning of teammates.

Ultimately I think standard passing should be assisted, as the intended target is always to feet. The execution should then be determined by stats and the factors previously discussed, and not down to how accurate the user is pointing the analog stick.

However, for through balls manual passing should be enforced. This allows deft passes that aren't possible through CPU targetting, while also devaluing the concept of users online bashing triangle until they break the defensive line with a lazer guided through ball.


Really wish somone would develop a pure football simulation. You get military sims, racing sims, why not a sports equivalent? Clearly there's enough of us that complain about the arcade mechanics of FIFA/PES for there to be a market for it. It'd lack in the graphics and licensing department, but should at least replicate football the way its actually played.
 
demo: has been delayed until date of sale of the game

funny-gif-man-disoriented-crazy-eyes.gif
 
Cool, getting the demo instead of the game than! lol

It happened last year as I good remember. Some PC players had the full version of PRO 13, they even patched it already, but meanwhile KONAMI released the second demo, so stupid.

Lovely turf into PRO 14. It looks realistically, finally! Can't wait guys, can't wait..
 
They should embrace this as their marketing motto..

U know like EA: Its in the game....Konami: Infinite possibilities

2014. should convey the same feelings .. for example, winning eleven 2002 - psx .. simple but tactical game, fun, FLUID, fun.
this generation has lost that magic, that which always differentiated Fifa soccer ..
is so difficult to recover that which has made ​​it so addictive in old times?

I say this now .. is personal, 2014 have to love at first contact

love this game..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Va-NqHQEc
 
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2014. should convey the same feelings .. for example, winning eleven 2002 - psx .. simple but tactical game, fun, FLUID, fun.
this generation has lost that magic, that which always differentiated Fifa soccer ..
is so difficult to recover that which has made ​​it so addictive in old times?

I say this now .. is personal, 2014 have to love at first contact

love this game..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Va-NqHQEc

Just give me PES6 with more animations and next gen gfx and i would be done! (bet many plp would too)
 
Exactly!
I mean,pes 6 with scripting,bugs etc is still FUN! I mean,it never get bored.You can play whole night,and still want to play more.And those NG games (from 2008-2013) are boring.I dont have wish to play more than 2 matches.
Every match is different,so many great stuff there.
 
2014. should convey the same feelings .. for example, winning eleven 2002 - psx .. simple but tactical game, fun, FLUID, fun.
this generation has lost that magic, that which always differentiated Fifa soccer ..
is so difficult to recover that which has made ​​it so addictive in old times?

I say this now .. is personal, 2014 have to love at first contact

love this game..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Va-NqHQEc

100%

How difficult would it be to replicate WE 2002 in something like Unity3D? With added tactical focus, slower pace and improved AI, I'd play that over anything else on the market.
 
Exactly!
I mean,pes 6 with scripting,bugs etc is still FUN! I mean,it never get bored.You can play whole night,and still want to play more.And those NG games (from 2008-2013) are boring.I dont have wish to play more than 2 matches.
Every match is different,so many great stuff there.

Exactly, that old engine of PES6 and the older WE was infinite, i mean u can see toons of diferent things still after all those years... its just incredible.. if u have an emulator on pc get WE4 and pop in a few games, u can still see Batistuta doing his thing, but ull see new types of goals and such...really i miss those days.
 
The old, golden times are gone, but Pro 14 is the first edition since 2006 that I'm really wating for. Unusually this game looks really interesting. Hopefully it going to be the same in practice. Gamescome could be started now, to get more videos, feedbacks, anything else what is linked with Evo 14. Hate waiting for something :CONFUSE:
 
Last few posts hit the nail on the head regarding defensive awareness.

My problem with manual passing is it adds a complexity that isn't inherent in real life. Professional footballers don't have to think about a 10 yard pass, they do it instinctively. The factors that make the pass successful, is like has been said, pressure from the opposition and positioning of teammates.

Ultimately I think standard passing should be assisted, as the intended target is always to feet. The execution should then be determined by stats and the factors previously discussed, and not down to how accurate the user is pointing the analog stick.

I disagree, it should be both ways:

It should need a sort of conecentration and good aim and the defense should have intelligent positional play to intercept passes, so that we have to think more to outwit the defense as it is in real life.

Even highclass players pass awful if they don't invest the proper concentration and focus.

And it's a game, so our input should have some influence and we need to be punished for lazy playing and rewarded for good playing, otherwise you could just as well just stop playing and watch the next match on TV.

But that doesn't mean I'm in favour of total human-control and no stats, far from it. I think stats should define the range of the possible successes, a sort of potential, and human input-capability should determine if that potential can be used to its fullest or lowest.
 
Thank God no one from Konami read this thread... Going back to PES6 gameplay would be tragic, that game is only good because of the 8 way movement, that is the only thing that keeps the balance in that game. A PES6 with 360 movement would be tragic!
 
What Xavi2009 claims has nothing to do with pass assistance, but with positioning, defensive vision and anticipation.

I know, but it's greatly reduced when pass assistance is at 0, so much so that it becomes a non-factor and you rarely see defenders behaving like that, especially is using super cancel effectively.
 
I disagree, it should be both ways:

It should need a sort of conecentration and good aim and the defense should have intelligent positional play to intercept passes, so that we have to think more to outwit the defense as it is in real life.

Even highclass players pass awful if they don't invest the proper concentration and focus.

And it's a game, so our input should have some influence and we need to be punished for lazy playing and rewarded for good playing, otherwise you could just as well just stop playing and watch the next match on TV.

But that doesn't mean I'm in favour of total human-control and no stats, far from it. I think stats should define the range of the possible successes, a sort of potential, and human input-capability should determine if that potential can be used to its fullest or lowest.

totally agree

and im not sure why defensive awareness is being inferred to be of causal relevance to pass assistance? they are quite separate problems, maybe more troublesome when coupled together, but still quite separate in source
 
Thank God no one from Konami read this thread... Going back to PES6 gameplay would be tragic, that game is only good because of the 8 way movement, that is the only thing that keeps the balance in that game. A PES6 with 360 movement would be tragic!

To me the shot variaty, AI, GK AI and lots of other stuff are just perfect balanced in PES6, much better than PES13, heck evan some animations are better in PES6 than 13... its to simplistic to say that the 8 way movement is the key to make PES6 good, strongly disagree, specially since theres no way to really test a so called 360 degree movement in it, but just thinking about it and trying to imagine it, to me it would look good, more animations, more fluidity to a very good game wich already has a great core, exactly what I need.

In the end its all about personal preference, your signature shows exactly where we start to differ opinions... its all good.

About 14, im really excited too, hopefully we will get something trully new that goes the futher away as possible from 13,12,11...
 
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I know, but it's greatly reduced when pass assistance is at 0, so much so that it becomes a non-factor and you rarely see defenders behaving like that, especially is using super cancel effectively.

Actually what I find makes the different when pass assist is set to 0 is that the pass doesn't go right to your striker because it's manual, so both the defenders and striker have to chase.

With pass assistance on, a strong low pass from your box to your striker at the half-way line (especially if you play with just a single striker) goes right to your striker's feet and makes the counter too easy.

With 0 pass assist, the defenders are still giving the striker too much room, but your pass will probably be 5 yards off target so both the defender and your striker will need to run for it, which evens it out a little bit.
 
Official PES Twitter account just asked about predictions for French and German league, which both are going to start this weekend. Is this maybe a sign for a German league without correct names? :P
 
Official PES Twitter account just asked about predictions for French and German league, which both are going to start this weekend. Is this maybe a sign for a German league without correct names? :P

maybe
maybe not

it could be really awesome
 
To me the shot variaty, AI, GK AI and lots of other stuff are just perfect balanced in PES6, much better than PES13, heck evan some animations are better in PES6 than 13... its to simplistic to say that the 8 way movement is the key to make PES6 good, strongly disagree, specially since theres no way to really test a so called 360 degree movement in it, but just thinking about it and trying to imagine it, to me it would look good, more animations, more fluidity to a very good game wich already has a great core, exactly what I need.

In the end its all about personal preference, your signature shows exactly where we start to differ opinions... its all good.

About 14, im really excited too, hopefully we will get something trully new that goes the futher away as possible from 13,12,11...

I agree with you that in the end is all about personal preference.
 
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