Jamezinho
Golden Boot Winner
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
I see what you've done there.
OMG, they boot Adam!
I see what you've done there.
PES 2013 Discussion Thread
- Thread starter AntrAcsA
- Start date
Just got it!
gabe.paul.logan
Retired Footballer
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
probably Adam didnt sell the magical boot idea to the fans very well
probably Adam didnt sell the magical boot idea to the fans very well
Jamezinho
Golden Boot Winner
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Konami are their own worst enemy most of the time.
Konami are their own worst enemy most of the time.
Ipswich69
Banned
- 25 July 2011
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Hope so. PES has essentially been shite since he started badgering Konami 5 years ago.
OMG, they boot Adam!
Hope so. PES has essentially been shite since he started badgering Konami 5 years ago.
avok23
Championship
- 12 July 2005
Ern Dog
Championship
- 23 October 2009
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Not sure I have completely missed the point. You said that the CPU team would use the individual instruction options that I said would be of no use to the team you can control. I would not want to play Fulham and have the CPU tell Berbatov to often run with the ball, rarely play through balls, do not hold up the ball, do not roam from position and not play as a deep lying forward. I dont see these actions being massively stat effected, is there a stat that determines how often the player will play a through ball? Is there a stat for holding up play? Is there a stat for running with the ball and taking players on? To me these things are part of the players personality. No doubt Berbatov has the skill to run and dribble past a few players, does he though? No because hes Berbatov, when he has a few players around him he will use his skills differently. Does he have the ability to not hold up play and rarely play a great through ball, sure he does but he does this because hes Berbatov.
I understand that giving John Terry instructions to be a goal poacher is pointless because of his stats. I am not talking about skills I am talking about players Behaviors, which is why I earlier said that I appreciate what Konami are trying to do with their removal of individual options and the reliance on AI or Player ID as its now called.
i dont think you quite grasp the concept...
if you instructed berbatov free license to roam then his ABILITIES of movement, anticipation, positioning etc. would determine how well he carries out that instruction.
why would a manager want berbatov to be trying sexy through balls and dribbling through 6 defenders if he is bad at through balls and dribbling ? its an option sure, but if his ABILITES are bad then you don't instruct him to do tasks which relate to them.
you're not going to make john terry your poacher just because its availablein the instructions... because he quite obviously doesnt have the stats/abilities for that role
i think youre completely missing the point...
Not sure I have completely missed the point. You said that the CPU team would use the individual instruction options that I said would be of no use to the team you can control. I would not want to play Fulham and have the CPU tell Berbatov to often run with the ball, rarely play through balls, do not hold up the ball, do not roam from position and not play as a deep lying forward. I dont see these actions being massively stat effected, is there a stat that determines how often the player will play a through ball? Is there a stat for holding up play? Is there a stat for running with the ball and taking players on? To me these things are part of the players personality. No doubt Berbatov has the skill to run and dribble past a few players, does he though? No because hes Berbatov, when he has a few players around him he will use his skills differently. Does he have the ability to not hold up play and rarely play a great through ball, sure he does but he does this because hes Berbatov.
I understand that giving John Terry instructions to be a goal poacher is pointless because of his stats. I am not talking about skills I am talking about players Behaviors, which is why I earlier said that I appreciate what Konami are trying to do with their removal of individual options and the reliance on AI or Player ID as its now called.
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goalgerd
File Maker
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
if you all keep giving them money for a shite product then the cycle will never change,there have been no great PES games on this generation of consoles and that wont change this year,do yourselves a favour and keep your money in your pockets lads
if you all keep giving them money for a shite product then the cycle will never change,there have been no great PES games on this generation of consoles and that wont change this year,do yourselves a favour and keep your money in your pockets lads
Jamezinho
Golden Boot Winner
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
To be honest I'm seriously contemplating doing that. Sometimes you have to vote with your feet (or wallet in this case).
The way Konami behaves pisses me off. The boots thing, no second PC demo, no release date.....perhaps I'll pass on this game and pick it up second hand in November or something.
To be honest I'm seriously contemplating doing that. Sometimes you have to vote with your feet (or wallet in this case).
The way Konami behaves pisses me off. The boots thing, no second PC demo, no release date.....perhaps I'll pass on this game and pick it up second hand in November or something.
Ern Dog
Championship
- 23 October 2009
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
To be fair some real players (Glen Johnson, Kieran Gibbs) do not understand when to make runs and when to stay put. If you are having trouble with this in the game isnt there a player with higher defence stats that will not run off and then you can get them to run manually either with a 1 - 2 or using the off ball runs command?
If Benzema is dropping deep then cant you move his player marker higher up to stop this? I am pretty sure it will work.
Also with the DMF do the same, either move the CBs back or move him forward or do both, I think it will stop the problem(worked for me in 2012).
You need to used the player switching to select that CB and move him manually, pressure the winger with the secondary pressure button.
I know the game isnt perfect but alot of it can be worked around. It would be nice to have more managerial options but it doesnt ruin the game not having them.
To be fair some real players (Glen Johnson, Kieran Gibbs) do not understand when to make runs and when to stay put. If you are having trouble with this in the game isnt there a player with higher defence stats that will not run off and then you can get them to run manually either with a 1 - 2 or using the off ball runs command?
If Benzema is dropping deep then cant you move his player marker higher up to stop this? I am pretty sure it will work.
Also with the DMF do the same, either move the CBs back or move him forward or do both, I think it will stop the problem(worked for me in 2012).
You need to used the player switching to select that CB and move him manually, pressure the winger with the secondary pressure button.
I know the game isnt perfect but alot of it can be worked around. It would be nice to have more managerial options but it doesnt ruin the game not having them.
Simcut
BF3 Addict
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Tempted to do the same to be honest, they havent got a clue what they are doing, its so frustrating. It's almost as if they want EA to win more sales lol....
I don't like Adam much, but he did the honourable thing telling people about this unrealistic boot bollocks, fair play to him.
Tempted to do the same to be honest, they havent got a clue what they are doing, its so frustrating. It's almost as if they want EA to win more sales lol....
I don't like Adam much, but he did the honourable thing telling people about this unrealistic boot bollocks, fair play to him.
2k does this with player tendencies...
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
yes. all teams should have these instructions. then when AI is controlling said team they will behave accordingly, whilst when human controls the team obviously some of those options dont happen anymore - as it is up to the player to act.
why would fulham do that? thats like saying you dont want a tactics board at all because you dont want to see barcelona playing 5-4-1. fulhams tactics would match their tactics of realife, as the games tries to do now with every team.
no, instructions determine that. stats determine how well a player can play through balls, which in turn should determine how often a manager wants that player to choose a through ball.
yes, several. strength, positioning, balance, anticipation (of incoming pass), awareness (of what team mates to lay the ball off to) etc.
yes, several. dribbling, pace, technique, first touch, balance, agility etc.
their stats are, the instructions given to them are not. and ALL players are given instructions.
you think a real manager just says "you know what, screw it, today berbatov, since you are berbatov, i will not give you instructions on how to play in my team, instead you shall play like how berbatov should play, as you are he"
yes. all teams should have these instructions. then when AI is controlling said team they will behave accordingly, whilst when human controls the team obviously some of those options dont happen anymore - as it is up to the player to act.
why would fulham do that? thats like saying you dont want a tactics board at all because you dont want to see barcelona playing 5-4-1. fulhams tactics would match their tactics of realife, as the games tries to do now with every team.
no, instructions determine that. stats determine how well a player can play through balls, which in turn should determine how often a manager wants that player to choose a through ball.
yes, several. strength, positioning, balance, anticipation (of incoming pass), awareness (of what team mates to lay the ball off to) etc.
yes, several. dribbling, pace, technique, first touch, balance, agility etc.
their stats are, the instructions given to them are not. and ALL players are given instructions.
you think a real manager just says "you know what, screw it, today berbatov, since you are berbatov, i will not give you instructions on how to play in my team, instead you shall play like how berbatov should play, as you are he"
gabe.paul.logan
Retired Footballer
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
thats the problem with this nowdays ; u have to buy the product or service to decide is it good or not...here is the another example, hollywood is keep making trash movies because with a title for example/no offence Superman a billions will go to the theater excepting a good movie even though the previews instalments sucked big time...then hollywood get the lot of money and it starts all over again, endless loop, and ofcourse with avoiding the critics because what they have done eariler worked
but a real life example for me: Prometheus (im a big fan of Scott and everything about him)....but the movie sucks, still it bought a lot of money to hollywood, enough for a sequel and that says something....though almost all the fans hated it
now...the Pro Evolution Soccer saga is the same, every year... since influenced by the money, since it became a top competitor of Fifa ...sucks
and its not gonna change im afraid....just wish for the days when the articles said Pro Evo 5 is a really good game but not for the mainstream public, etc,etc like Fifa wich is better in this, in that etcetc...
yeah...at least everyone got a good game...now there is out there two equal shity game
thats the problem with this nowdays ; u have to buy the product or service to decide is it good or not...here is the another example, hollywood is keep making trash movies because with a title for example/no offence Superman a billions will go to the theater excepting a good movie even though the previews instalments sucked big time...then hollywood get the lot of money and it starts all over again, endless loop, and ofcourse with avoiding the critics because what they have done eariler worked
but a real life example for me: Prometheus (im a big fan of Scott and everything about him)....but the movie sucks, still it bought a lot of money to hollywood, enough for a sequel and that says something....though almost all the fans hated it
now...the Pro Evolution Soccer saga is the same, every year... since influenced by the money, since it became a top competitor of Fifa ...sucks
and its not gonna change im afraid....just wish for the days when the articles said Pro Evo 5 is a really good game but not for the mainstream public, etc,etc like Fifa wich is better in this, in that etcetc...yeah...at least everyone got a good game...now there is out there two equal shity game
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tc811
Resident Evo-Web Retard
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
A great example - The Dark Knight Rises. It was an utter piece of shit movie that tarnished the Batman series. It's just my opinion.
A great example - The Dark Knight Rises. It was an utter piece of shit movie that tarnished the Batman series. It's just my opinion.
gabe.paul.logan
Retired Footballer
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
yeah with avoiding the main concept of the whole batman idea wich was the first 2 movie about and with a storyline of a b category movie
but
blame me
yeah with avoiding the main concept of the whole batman idea wich was the first 2 movie about and with a storyline of a b category movie
but
blame me
avok23
Championship
- 12 July 2005
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Some players do this and it should be based on their stats no everyone. A manager should also be able to influence the players behaviour (Why is there a manager in the first place?). I fully understand how pes stats work and that is a terrible way to implement it.
That is a hack and not a natuaral fix cos he auto matically stops being in the areas you want him in and now would verture more into offside position and fail. Basically its a hack not worth considering in a "sim" game.
That is another hack. With Konami's terrible player switching and un-intuitive right stick switching your run the risk of pulling me out of position. Player switch also allow that cpu phantom through ball that no one tries to intercept.
We need managerial options if we want a truly sim experience not a gamers fix that requires finger dexterity and not brains.
Some players do this and it should be based on their stats no everyone. A manager should also be able to influence the players behaviour (Why is there a manager in the first place?). I fully understand how pes stats work and that is a terrible way to implement it.
That is a hack and not a natuaral fix cos he auto matically stops being in the areas you want him in and now would verture more into offside position and fail. Basically its a hack not worth considering in a "sim" game.
That is another hack. With Konami's terrible player switching and un-intuitive right stick switching your run the risk of pulling me out of position. Player switch also allow that cpu phantom through ball that no one tries to intercept.
We need managerial options if we want a truly sim experience not a gamers fix that requires finger dexterity and not brains.
sincover
Championship
- 16 August 2010
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
I've already chosen to skip PES 2013. Player ID and the other improvements are too minor for me to drop yet another $60.
Back in the day all of my friends played PES; All I had to do was walk down the street and I'd be guaranteed a couple great games. Now that they've all fled to FIFA, my only choice is to play online or ML. Given that PES online is a crock of buttery brown shite, I have spent 99% of my PES time for the last 4 years playing ML exclusively. ML had many problems as it was, but instead of fixing the existing problems, they pile on more rubbish to the heap.
The PES series needs to be the subject of a cautionary post-mortem, instructing future developers how not to destroy their own franchise. I will sit back this year and watch. If PES 2014 is not the second coming of raptor jesus, I won't have the patience to 'wait for next year' again.
I've already chosen to skip PES 2013. Player ID and the other improvements are too minor for me to drop yet another $60.
Back in the day all of my friends played PES; All I had to do was walk down the street and I'd be guaranteed a couple great games. Now that they've all fled to FIFA, my only choice is to play online or ML. Given that PES online is a crock of buttery brown shite, I have spent 99% of my PES time for the last 4 years playing ML exclusively. ML had many problems as it was, but instead of fixing the existing problems, they pile on more rubbish to the heap.
The PES series needs to be the subject of a cautionary post-mortem, instructing future developers how not to destroy their own franchise. I will sit back this year and watch. If PES 2014 is not the second coming of raptor jesus, I won't have the patience to 'wait for next year' again.
zeemeister
foxy engine
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Every fix ern dog has mentioned you label a hack. Would you rather spit out a formation and the players do exactly everything to script? There are managers gameplans and players that don't always respond as they should you see it week in and out. They don't respond to instructions which is due their ability and concentration
With the on the fly controls you can infact stop your SBs overlapping and revert to another formation with the touch of a button.
Unintuitive player switching?! Total bollocks! I hardly ever have issues with player switching and I promise you I play a shiteload of PES. maybe layoff the R1+x and try and use some of that intuition to pre empt the CPUs attacking pattern rather than blame the game for your inadequacies.
PES strategically is far ahead of the competitor and has depth that I don't think players have been able to comprehend.
As for the folks thinking about not buying the game its konamis own fault for the boot thing cos its seemed to have turned a few which is a pity. I have been playing a bunch of 5 minute games every night to get a fix of The greatest PES that has been made and that's only the demo.
Every fix ern dog has mentioned you label a hack. Would you rather spit out a formation and the players do exactly everything to script? There are managers gameplans and players that don't always respond as they should you see it week in and out. They don't respond to instructions which is due their ability and concentration
With the on the fly controls you can infact stop your SBs overlapping and revert to another formation with the touch of a button.
Unintuitive player switching?! Total bollocks! I hardly ever have issues with player switching and I promise you I play a shiteload of PES. maybe layoff the R1+x and try and use some of that intuition to pre empt the CPUs attacking pattern rather than blame the game for your inadequacies.
PES strategically is far ahead of the competitor and has depth that I don't think players have been able to comprehend.
As for the folks thinking about not buying the game its konamis own fault for the boot thing cos its seemed to have turned a few which is a pity. I have been playing a bunch of 5 minute games every night to get a fix of The greatest PES that has been made and that's only the demo.
CalcioCalabrese
Weekend warrior
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
OK - I'll be the better man here and apologise for name calling. But I don't appreciate avok23 jumping in with "ignore him" comments when all Matty and I had was a difference of opinion. No arguments were there? It's not the first time avok23 has jumped in to knock down one of my comments without me talking to him directly.
Now, I'll go back and respond to Matty's response in my next post.
OK - I'll be the better man here and apologise for name calling. But I don't appreciate avok23 jumping in with "ignore him" comments when all Matty and I had was a difference of opinion. No arguments were there? It's not the first time avok23 has jumped in to knock down one of my comments without me talking to him directly.
Now, I'll go back and respond to Matty's response in my next post.
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
I need to be up in 6 hours, but I'm pouring out a large Jim Beam for my fallen Japanese comrades. Given the new game a lot of thought and even though I like the gameplay a lot, it's not looking good for the only mode I play. Don't want to try the other game. I'm not sure I could live with myself playing a game I hear my deplorable teenage neighbour play day, every month, every year to the grunts of pubescent devilment. I share the thoughts of sincover regarding ML and can't see myself being swayed from this initial feeling of disappointment.
Some pet heads might do it.
I need to be up in 6 hours, but I'm pouring out a large Jim Beam for my fallen Japanese comrades. Given the new game a lot of thought and even though I like the gameplay a lot, it's not looking good for the only mode I play. Don't want to try the other game. I'm not sure I could live with myself playing a game I hear my deplorable teenage neighbour play day, every month, every year to the grunts of pubescent devilment. I share the thoughts of sincover regarding ML and can't see myself being swayed from this initial feeling of disappointment.
Some pet heads might do it.
CalcioCalabrese
Weekend warrior
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
You obviously didn't read, or perhaps fully understand everything I said. What I said was that player stats + formation + team tactics settings should all work in harmony to give you various permutations and outcomes. You simplified that down to me wanting dots on the pitch????
The highlighted parts in the 2nd paragraphs are the main thing I have a problem with. You're talking about AI vs AI whereas most people play the game Human vs Human or Human vs AI.
Like you said, that would look good, BUT I'm not buying PES to watch the AI play.
Konami made a point of the Barca triangles when they showed off the dynamic 1-2 feature. So they're trying to build the team AI then give us options like that plus off the ball control as extra tools in the kitbox.
If you don't understand my other point - I'll write it again without resorting to pig pictures - I didn't say the tactics are totally overwritten by controlling the players. But unless you're watching the AI vs AI, there are times during a game when your controller input is obviously overriding specific player instructions at that point in time. Pretty simple concept I thought.
I don't really have a problem with some of your ideas - but I do bite back because whenever someone tries having a sensible debate you keep shutting them down as stupid or not knowing football.
You obviously didn't read, or perhaps fully understand everything I said. What I said was that player stats + formation + team tactics settings should all work in harmony to give you various permutations and outcomes. You simplified that down to me wanting dots on the pitch????
The highlighted parts in the 2nd paragraphs are the main thing I have a problem with. You're talking about AI vs AI whereas most people play the game Human vs Human or Human vs AI.
Like you said, that would look good, BUT I'm not buying PES to watch the AI play.
Konami made a point of the Barca triangles when they showed off the dynamic 1-2 feature. So they're trying to build the team AI then give us options like that plus off the ball control as extra tools in the kitbox.
If you don't understand my other point - I'll write it again without resorting to pig pictures - I didn't say the tactics are totally overwritten by controlling the players. But unless you're watching the AI vs AI, there are times during a game when your controller input is obviously overriding specific player instructions at that point in time. Pretty simple concept I thought.
I don't really have a problem with some of your ideas - but I do bite back because whenever someone tries having a sensible debate you keep shutting them down as stupid or not knowing football.
Ameppe
International
- 23 December 2007
- SSC Napoli
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Marvin from Prorevo already played Master League 2013 and he said that
Marvin from Prorevo already played Master League 2013 and he said that
I prefer to believe Marvin who showed to be very balanced in his opinions about every pes games till now.
Ameppe
International
- 23 December 2007
- SSC Napoli
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
yeah, i hope that will be my opinion too after playing Master League
Well that's a good sign
yeah, i hope that will be my opinion too after playing Master League
Jamezinho
Golden Boot Winner
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
Depends on the individual's stance on 'bootgate'. If you like authenticity, i.e. players wearing their correct boots, then this is bad news. If you are a purist and don't agree with stat boosting, more bad news. If you dislike both of these things, then ML could well be destroyed for you.
It's a big enough issue for some people that they can't ignore it. Others don't care so much. Whether it destroys ML or not is down to your personal outlook on football games.
Depends on the individual's stance on 'bootgate'. If you like authenticity, i.e. players wearing their correct boots, then this is bad news. If you are a purist and don't agree with stat boosting, more bad news. If you dislike both of these things, then ML could well be destroyed for you.
It's a big enough issue for some people that they can't ignore it. Others don't care so much. Whether it destroys ML or not is down to your personal outlook on football games.
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
firstly, dont you are put your hand in my face
anyway..
stats + formation + team tactics.... soooo, basically... what we have now? which is absolutely no team individuality because all teams play the same ? yeah, sounds great. i dont understand why you wouldnt also like stats + formation + team tactics + player tactics... you know, like real life.
it was an example. you missed my last sentence. read again.
AI vs AI should be watchable and look like 2 real teams playing. that is the BASIS.
then, when its AI vs Human, it'll be super fluid because of what its based on (TACTICS!)
why cant player tactics and these tools work together
yes, i know that. but whats that got to do with anything? whats your point here? we override AI things now when we play, obviously (things like a player with crap vision or bad dribbling will be over ridden if the Human is good at spotting team mates or good at dribbling), but with player instructions we just get more fluid and intuitive team mates and tactics.
firstly, dont you are put your hand in my face
anyway..stats + formation + team tactics.... soooo, basically... what we have now? which is absolutely no team individuality because all teams play the same ? yeah, sounds great. i dont understand why you wouldnt also like stats + formation + team tactics + player tactics... you know, like real life.
it was an example. you missed my last sentence. read again.
AI vs AI should be watchable and look like 2 real teams playing. that is the BASIS.
then, when its AI vs Human, it'll be super fluid because of what its based on (TACTICS!)
why cant player tactics and these tools work together
yes, i know that. but whats that got to do with anything? whats your point here? we override AI things now when we play, obviously (things like a player with crap vision or bad dribbling will be over ridden if the Human is good at spotting team mates or good at dribbling), but with player instructions we just get more fluid and intuitive team mates and tactics.
I don't really have a problem with some of your ideas - but I do bite back because whenever someone tries having a sensible debate you keep shutting them down as stupid or not knowing football.
Ameppe
International
- 23 December 2007
- SSC Napoli
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
I know my tastes. I read every info about this bootgate and i don't think it will annoy me so much, not more than playing in a fake d2 league, with fake teams, fake players (Castolo and co.) and fake regens after only three or four years in a master league.
Gameplay will keep me playing and i will continue enjoying the game. (That is if they don't destroy gameplay with a patch as they did last year)
I know my tastes. I read every info about this bootgate and i don't think it will annoy me so much, not more than playing in a fake d2 league, with fake teams, fake players (Castolo and co.) and fake regens after only three or four years in a master league.
Gameplay will keep me playing and i will continue enjoying the game. (That is if they don't destroy gameplay with a patch as they did last year
)CalcioCalabrese
Weekend warrior
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
That post just shows your lack of maturity. I'll refrain from engaging in any discussion from here on.
That post just shows your lack of maturity. I'll refrain from engaging in any discussion from here on.
CalcioCalabrese
Weekend warrior
Re: PES 2013 Discussion Thread .......
The only issue left to resolve re the boots is whether everyone on the pitch, including your opponents is playing in generic black boots. Not sure why the opposition needs to unlock them also?
The only issue left to resolve re the boots is whether everyone on the pitch, including your opponents is playing in generic black boots. Not sure why the opposition needs to unlock them also?