PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

I haven't bothered to read back, but there seems to be talk of new off the ball controls?

Am I right in thinking this was already attempted in PES 2009? I never played it so wouldn't know, but from what I recall you'd press L1 or something to controller the runner then a button to play the pass. Obviously never caught on as it wasn't included in future editions.

I know the Wii version also utilizes a similar concept, but it's not something I'd really want in the proper version in all honesty.
 
goalgerd said:
YouTube - PES 2012 Gameplay Video 06 - Off the Ball Controls

looking at this again i think it will really only be used by everyone with set pieces, if the cpu ai is really as good as konami are saying using dummy and off the ball runs then the using the 2 players at the same time wont be necessary,it will be very useful though for defenders covering space more effectively
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There wouldn't be a need for actively using the second control stick as in deadball situations the player taking the kick/throw cannot move. If true, this feature has to be in open play.
 
I guess the counterpoint (which a couple of people have tried to point out) is that shit players are more likely to need micromanagement and lots of it in order to offer 'good' movement, whereas Barca and the like will be floating around, constantly on the move and pulling the opponents around. If the RS movement is difficult enough to use then it means you can't use this to create anything like the same effect across the team and the run your man makes is easier to pick up.

Still against the concept but it really does hang on the info we receive tomorrow.
 
sincover said:
There wouldn't be a need for actively using the second control stick as in deadball situations the player taking the kick/throw cannot move. If true, this feature has to be in open play.
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I think he's saying that most people won't use this feature in non dead-ball situations. It can be used in both.
 
romagnoli said:
I guess the counterpoint (which a couple of people have tried to point out) is that shit players are more likely to need micromanagement and lots of it in order to offer 'good' movement, whereas Barca and the like will be floating around, constantly on the move and pulling the opponents around. If the RS movement is difficult enough to use then it means you can't use this to create anything like the same effect across the team and the run your man makes is easier to pick up.

Still against the concept but it really does hang on the info we receive tomorrow.
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I agree, also this is the part where player individuality goes out the window, because if like you say Rom Barca are constantly on the move then obviously the stats and AI are doing their job but,when you have to start using this system for the lesser teams the players under your control are not really playing how they would. Maybe i am just being picky but it does seem a bit Fifaesque.
 
Having seen the light and come across from FIFA to PES about 3 years ago
I am amazed to hear that this 'new gameplay feature' is something everyone has been asking for. Over the past 3 years I can't actually recall seeing anyone ask for it... On any PES forum?
 
Without having seen how this feature will work, I don't buy into this "losing individuality" business by being able to get a player to make a run he wouldn't normally. At the end of the day, it's still a game and has user input. Making a run with a bad player is not the crime as that player still has to do something with the ball.

THAT is where individuality still applies. If you manage to get an average player into scoring positions all the time but their shooting stats/technique/form make them miss the target often, then it's still simulating their individuality isn't it.

Are people trying to say that they ONLY score goals or play EXACTLY as that player/team would play in real life?

Given the user input element, it's a gamers right to play whatever footballing style they want with the team they are controlling - it's the game's responsibility to ensure that whatever the output is, actually represents that player's individual stats. I think PES does the latter well.

As it stands, you can play people out of position, choose stupid formations, or have Puyol coming forward to score shots from 18 yards - as shown in the PES 12 gameplay testing video. That does not represent proper individuality - but it's a game after all, and people will try things that are not true to real life regardless.
 
Buzzyhead said:
I agree, also this is the part where player individuality goes out the window, because if like you say Rom Barca are constantly on the move then obviously the stats and AI are doing their job but,when you have to start using this system for the lesser teams the players under your control are not really playing how they would. Maybe i am just being picky but it does seem a bit Fifaesque.
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I remember reading somewhere someone mentioned that whenever we are under control of player either on or off the ball, we remove his playing style/stats to certain extent.
 
...what about the International Cup? (or what was that mode's name, in PES6, where you would play through the qualifying stage of an international competition?)
 
since they have the license for CL, i would want the feature where we could play 2 legs against human opponents, to be back plzzz
 
I would love it to be challenge training! I think the difficulty level with the new PES' means it would be a valuable addition to help people get into it and learn its subtleties.
 
Marvin_RonsdorfMarvin R. (mrbasket)





Next #pes2012 news comes in 30min (14:00 CET) @prorevo - yeah!!!
 
Hopefully the AI doesn't just let you waltz your other players around without any form of marking / covering being done on them. The vids most likely were recorded using low-difficulty AI as usual. This system does sound good I must say, I'm definitely looking forward to doing some bad-ass defending jobs with it.

In other news, Messi is no longer the PES cover star. Jon Murphy hints in his description there that Nicklas Bendtner has been lined up as the successor.
 
To me, riculous improvements both of them. Do you really talk about the new fantastic AI and then include a way of overtaking it??? No sense at all
 
I'm sorry but this new system is going to screw every improvement Konami have made in the past few years to make PES a simulation. Prepare for FIFA 10-esque 'basketball' score-sheets at the end of every game. What I can tell you from the videos and having played the E3 code myself, is that defending is going to be hell in 2012. And not in a good way.

Looks like it is going to be a sad year for football gaming.
 
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So the 1st one is manual, and the 2nd one is basically triggering a run. I don't really know what to say about this. Isn't the AI doing that anyway?
 
A lot of people are against this on some pseudo-philosophical level. For me, as long as it's balanced, I don't mind it. The AI in PES 2011 is nowhere near good enough to provide the runs I want, and this is, whether people in here agree or not, one of the things that a lot of more casual gamers HATE about PES 2011. I'd be happy with them not having this system and making the AI good enough to not need one, but I don't see anything inherently wrong with having some control of other players to make runs.

The worry for me is whether it's balanced or not. If this becomes a crucial part of scoring, or usable for an exploitative way of scoring (which you wouldn't think it would be, because it's really no different to playing 2v2, or 3v1, which works fine). I do see why it annoys some people though, who feel that player runs are a big part of player individuality, which it undoubtedly is... just don't think it's really a question of right/wrong.
 
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