PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

kouroux said:
I think you're confusing it with the right stick being able to make you choose which angle you'd hit your pass,lob pass and shots.
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No I am not, have you played the game? You can hold down a button and start controlling other players. I don't have the game on this computer so I can't record a video of it, but it's there, I just don't remember what button you press. Also you don't pass manual with the right stick in FK, it is manual default for high passes and through balls.
 
Thespeedster84 said:
lol, i mean by controlling off-the ball player during dead-ball situation having been announced officially, it has cancel the purpose of "tactical awareness" but it is not much mentioned before.

However, at the current state of throw-in system both FIFA and PES, different individuality of player has not yet to be seen in this situation.

This feature, whether it works as i thought is interesting. :))

And for those who concern with this feature for online, just ask seabass to turn it off. lol
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Oh I see. Well but the problem with free kicks and corners in the first place is that players were (and are if you don't use the system) very static in the first place. So there I'm sure it's a welcome decision for everyone. This one is really much more subjective, since the AI is supposed to be really inteligent.
 
Gab_ said:
No I am not, have you played the game? You can hold down a button and start controlling other players. I don't have the game on this computer so I can't record a video of it, but it's there, I just don't remember what button you press.
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Yes I play and I have the game.It's the first time I'm hearing this haha
 
Im just gonna relate a brain to a computer. Lets say your doing something on your computer and its using up x amount of your resources. Lets say your palying pes and your using all your brain power 100% on that ONE guy. If you try and control 2 people while still only focusing on that ONE Guy you will have 0% left to control the other guy. Thus you will have to take off some brain power off the first guy to say 50% and the second guy 50%. Splitting your thinking power in HALF making it harder to notice if some defender is coming on strong trying to get the ball you may not notice and get the ball stolen.
 
Christ this is much a do about nothing. We dont even know the full story yet!

Wait to see what konami says when they are ready not some half arsed leak.
 
Being too specific about it doesn't make much sense anyway since we don't know how passes and stuff will be done in the first place. If you're using the two sticks, how do you pass the ball and run? This is some complex shit lol. Hope the video is indeed coming tomorrow.
 
kouroux said:
Yes I play and I have the game.It's the first time I'm hearing this haha
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Have you changed any controller settings? I mean since you said you use the right stick for passing? Or can you use the right stick when charging up the pass (since as soon as you charge it up you can't change direction with left stick)?

I've only played on the default settings. Just try out some of the shoulder buttons, I know you have to hold it down, and when you release it you go back controlling the player with the ball again.
 
I use the right stick to direct the little white thing on the ground which directs the passes and shots
 
_anderson said:
Being too specific about it doesn't make much sense anyway since we don't know how passes and stuff will be done in the first place. If you're using the two sticks, how do you pass the ball and run? This is some complex shit lol. Hope the video is indeed coming tomorrow.
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i hope the video will show someone doing the move with the joypad in a corner while showing its effect ingame
i really want to know more
 
_anderson said:
Being too specific about it doesn't make much sense anyway since we don't know how passes and stuff will be done in the first place. If you're using the two sticks, how do you pass the ball and run? This is some complex shit lol. Hope the video is indeed coming tomorrow.
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lol you guys are overthinking this. What can an off the ball player do besides run and call for the ball? NOTHING. Calling for the ball is taken care of because your controlling him. Then you just use the right stick to decide where he goes. Then press A,X, or Y to pass to him. While the on ball player has the same controls as before except tricks.
 
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kouroux said:
I use the right stick to direct the little white thing on the ground which directs the passes and shots
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Alright I get what you are saying now. If you can it would be nice if you could record the secondary player control in the game to show other people, that is if you figure out how to do it. Could be holding down both trigger same time, just try out a lot of things and you'll find it, I've done it loads of times.

If you play, or watch videos, you can see a secondary arrow over another player, that is the indicator on what player you can control (I think).

Edit: Oh man why did I have to watch a clip of that game... those beautiful nets, they can make a grown man cry.

Edit 2: What is actually interesting is to see if we will have a secondary cursor now in PES 2012 too, how else would we know what player to secondary control?
 
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Curry - the point is that you can't pass and run at the same time. We only have one thumb on our right hand, usually, so passing to someone who isn't standing still at the point of passing seems undoable.

Which in a sense is at least a positive - it's counterbalanced by its own impracticality.
 
romagnoli said:
Curry - the point is that you can't pass and run at the same time. We only have one thumb on our right hand, usually, so passing to someone who isn't standing still at the point of passing seems undoable.

Which in a sense is at least a positive - it's counterbalanced by its own impracticality.
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Well for anyone who doesnt have two thumbs on their right hand(freakish one thumbed people xD). It will probably be directional like you push the right stick in a direction and he keeps going there after the stick is released.
 
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CurryWasShott said:
Well for anyone who doesnt have two thumbs on their right hand(freakish one thumbed people xD). It will probably be directional like you push the right stick in a direction and he keeps going there after the stick is released.
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That was my initial thought, but apparently not.
 
sort of interesting, although there is no way to see exactly how this works until a video comes our way. Worst case scenario is that this will be something I don't use at all. Sort of like that cursor setting when you always press L1 to switch players, also in attack. That was a neat feature, but I never mastered it. That new defending thing last year seemed like a pretty big deal when the game was previewed but I admit I didn't find a reason to master that either. Manual goalkeeper, don't use it. So I'm not worried this will damage the gameplay, but I will still follow it with interest, for now.
 
That Fifa 2004 introduction is so similar by design to the new Fifa games - the introduction and the talk about realism and what they've added and how it's a revolution etc. It's nice to see i'm vindicated in my decision not to listen to what the new videos have to offer in complete knowledge at how they used to overexaggerate the strengths in the old ones too. The only difference is that people fall for it now.
 
This new addition does concern me a little. Anything that overrides player individuality and team character should surely not be welcomed by any true PES purist. Seeing as Konami have clearly worked very hard on intelligent and dynamic AI, which constantly provides options for the player in possession, I'm kind of left asking why this new system is needed at all, as it is essentially a form of run trigger at heart.

I see this new system as a more useful asset when defending rather than attacking e.g. being able to track a runner off the ball or re-organising the positioning of your defenders.

There's so many questions with this new control option that I sincerely hope Konami do a satisfactory job of answering them. Konami do have a habit of providing more questions than answers with their promotional videos.

Ultimately, as long as this new feature is not integral to the experience and can be overlooked at no detriment to the player then I'm happy to ignore it completely. I play almost entirely offline so it wouldn't be a game-changer for me.
 
Wow, looking at that horrible FIFA 2004 video just makes me realise just how good PES3 must have been at the time, unfortunately I stuck with FIFA until I tried PES4...

YouTube - PES 3 Goals

About that feature where you control two players - I think it could be great if you're subtle with it... So many times your teammates don't peel off their markers to find space, or halt their runs abruptly. Anything to reduce such unrealistic and annoying occurrences is welcome.

I don't really think it reduces individuality either - you could argue that even controlling just the one player takes away individuality as you're making decisions that the actual player wouldn't make... And it's not like the way teammates behave in PES 2011 (and most likely 2012 to some extent) is that individual/believable.
 
You wont be able to control the second player as well though, you will be concnetrating more on the person with the ball. So the movement of the second player will be slight. so it might just be backing off a marker to make a bit of space etc.

You couldn't control both players the same, unless you were super human.

But I do agree, the way it sounds is just like a fancy run trigger button. But lets see how it is implemented.
 
Like I tried to explain earlier, a player who is shit, I am comfortable with that, if he is shit and doesn't do simple things right and that is translated into the game then great, however when you can manipulate a player who is shit to start making intelligent movements then that will kill the experience, granted it is being said that you don't have to use it but lets face it, losing 1-0 needing to win the cup you are going to be tempted.

Now if a player was to start dropping back from his marker similar to what Berbatov does, or Fabregas drops back a little to make space for you to pass to him then that should be the ultimate goal for the AI to do on its own accord, that has to be aim.

I realise we are jumping the gun in negativity but when all we have to go off is a few lines of hinting then this thread is as good as any for discussing it, throwing up some good conversation too, was harder to express myself fully on a ipad on a 15 minute work break.
 
romagnoli said:
The movements you make with the player you control are based on what he can do. That's the individuality manifesting itself through you, which is why it's such an absorbing experience.

Controlling two players at once is a different kettle of fish. If you can make players make runs they otherwise shouldn't then the terrorists win.
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I see where you're coming from regarding the player on the ball, but I still think that you can make a farce of the individuality if you want to, making Barca play long ball tactics, Messi doing tricks all the time, Stoke playing quick short passing etc.

I'd agree with your second point, that off the ball movement should all be automated, if the AI was actually smart and realistic enough in the first place - until that point, there will be a frustration when your players fail to perform seemingly obvious movements. This proposed new feature could help eliminate that.
 
In the attack, if the AI is that good as i expect, there's no point to use this feature, maybe only in very specific situations. I suppose that it will take time to learn and use it properly, and during the game, maybe even before you try to use it the AI will aready start the run in the direction you want.

I will personally just use it to make a teamate drops 2 steps back to pass the ball to him in a safe place, and this happens a lot in real football but not videogame football. I will aso use it to make my teamate get closer to the ball carrier, very needed if you wan to replicate barceona or spain passing style (but maybe a proper tatics make it useless for this).

All I hope is that this new feature is useful without the ball too. Imagine how good it can be to close spaces. The midfield battle may be epic.
 
I wont be suprised if it turns out that when your player has the ball you can at any time click down on your right stick and it selects a different player

each time you click then you can move your selected player,but surely maybe the ball carrier is only under a semi assisted control as in only the direction.

Otherwise it just seem too convaluted. I hope this makes sense.
 
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