PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

For the sake of sanity, offline against the CPU on long term has to be played in Professional. It's the most balanced of all levels, AI is still very good but at least they don't make perfect tackles at all times and have a 100% shot/score ratio.

If this scaled well with the quality of the players it would be alright, but it isn't, not so good teams still turn every chance into a goal...
 
henrys hand said:
I learned how to play the game the hard way, version 1.00 is so full of bias and cheating that gives much more opportunities to the CPU that I was forced to play much more concentrated to defeat the cheating.

I've read that the cheating is less in 1.06 but still here are the techniques learned from Jimmy and Blanco here:

1. Use a lower defense-line. This prevents the through-ball-attacks by the CPU that lead to 1 on 1s.

2. When the CPU is attacking don't just concentrate on the ball-carrier but keep a second eye on all other players. When the cheating kicks in, your defenders suddenly want to leave their marked attackers in crucial situations. So you have to keep it in check and reposition your defenders. It's even better to concentrate on these positions than on the ball-carrier.

3. R2-button is a blessing! With it you can when timed well bring the CPU-dribbler out of balance or steal the ball. Single biggest weapon against the superdribblings of the CPU.

4. When the superdribbling happens, don't freak and keep a player in front of the dribbler without going left or right, just in the middle and balanced, then when time is right... R2 or nothing. Containment helps to gain a bit time and balance. It can be combined with other methods.

5. Sometimes you need to commit a foul to interrupt play, best to do it away from your own goal, even risking a yellow card, but don't do it from behind as last defender, it causes a red card.

6. Should a freekick happen near your goal, take control of the goalkeeper. It's not possible in 1.00 but in 1.06 I read from someone, that is possible. It will increase your opportunity of preventing the goal.

7. Cornerkicks are also dangerous when you do nothing, keep your players near the attackers and then jump and try to head the ball away, it will disturb the attackers enough.

8. Get your tactic-plan in shape. The standard-formation is mostly completely bad.

9. In order to break the parking-the bus-defenses of some teams: Use your best players and dribble and use bursts sometimes, that way you will eventually be able to create the space you seek or draw two or more defenders creating space for your other attackers. It's also nice and convenient to get into their goal-area and provoke them to foul you there.

10. Don't trust your goalkeeper, he is nothing but a fieldplayer forced to take the gloves on, during the cheating-phases he is even playing for the opposite team, causing own-goals, fouling your own defenders... to make goals happen.

10. Superstar is a bit easier than top-player regarding cheating, at least it is so in 1.00.

11. Don't give up.:JAY:
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Thanks for the tips! I really aprecciate your help!

When the CPU is on those crazy fast counter attacks, i have nott been suffering that much when the CPU makes a long ball pass to the an attacker, I aways press Super Cancel and in 95% of the time and don't let the CPU go to 1-1 with the keeper, even when playing with a high line defence. For my surprise, INternacional's default formation/tatics (Brazilian team) plays with defence line a bit high on the field, and I was not having much problem. But I chose to change the defence to play lower on the field and set compactnes around 4, and players positioning on defence was more organized.

But the problem with those counter attacks are the 1-1s. I find CPU AI to be too individualistic and selfish on the ball regardless of the player who's with the ball under controll, there's too little emphasis on passing, that's one of the reason why CPU can't keep the ball possession for a long time.

Anyways, as i said, my biggest problem is to deal with these 1-1s situations, so i'll be trying to practice these tips.

Those free kicks with almost 100% of success are enough to put on professional dificulty. Come on... :TTTH:
 
_anderson said:
Guys, have you guys tried to go on training mode with a top team and do some shots on the new patch? The difference is really noticeable there, shots are much stronger and you can actually pick the direction of the shot. Keepers stop nearly all shots from outside the area but a well driven shot with the right player sends in a stunner!

If only the height was a touch less sensitive... It's too easy to just go Ramos on the ball.
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Yes... next time i play pes 2012 i'll drop the dificulty level to professional (i have been playing on Top Player since I bought the game for the second time). To my surprise, some people are saying that in Top Players there is even more cheating than on Superstar.

The fact that the CPU can score 100% from free kicks is enough for me to drop the dificulty level. I really like challenging, but i like a realistic and fair challenge. I want the game to test my skills, not my patience. LOL

And btw, how is the CPU defence on Professional ? I find that in TOP Player, with some teams the defence not only has ten men around the area (and all they are able to close every space and make all my teammates marked), but furthermore they can also pressure your player who's on the ball like a magnet. This pressure is a CLEAR CHEATING because when i played against a team that was playing fairly, I instantly noticed that I could turn around the one who was pressuring and I saw him loosing momentum quite often, so I could go forward, something that DID not happened when I played against Tolima with their unrealistic defence.
 
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As I said earlier, I've not noticed any obvious differences with this patch. However, I've played six or seven matches since the patch and found that I'm enjoying the game a little more.

Maybe the relentless pressure of the AI has been toned down a little? Also I've noticed AI defenders making the odd mistake here and there. All in all the game feels better but I can't quite put my finger on why.
 
Jamezinho said:
As I said earlier, I've not noticed any obvious differences with this patch. However, I've played six or seven matches since the patch and found that I'm enjoying the game a little more.

Maybe the relentless pressure of the AI has been toned down a little? Also I've noticed AI defenders making the odd mistake here and there. All in all the game feels better but I can't quite put my finger on why.
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Yeah im with you on this, im really not seeing all these amazing improvements everyone is going on about.

The AI defence dont run straight back to their own 6 yard line anymore and they are far more cinical in front of goal but really that's about the only difference i see.
 
Lami said:
I'd like to know what platform everyone's playing the latest patch on. Plus game speed and difficulty. I'd like to compare.
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360 version, Pro difficulty, zero game speed. And I genuinely don't notice any differences at all. None whatsoever other than like I said earlier, the CPU seems to suddenly be spamming the through ball as its main means of attack, which is annoying.

Other than that, I'm enjoying the game just the same as before but genuinely can't see any real alterations.
 
ccshopland said:
It's hard to explain, whereas before you could win 2 or 3 games, kind of getting the feeling that you deserved it but never quite sure if the scripts were going for you, and then BHAM, Bolton would be like Barcelona and destroy you 4-0 or something with some strange shit happening; now it's more a neutral feeling of generally light scripts may be.
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Funnily enough, I went on a 2 match win streak in my ML post patch, then lost 4-0 to Bolton...

They didn't play like Barca though :P
 
Also, I'd like to thank Konami for updating the Copa Libertadores with the 2012 teams. They really didn't have to do it.

Lesser companies would have left it for the next game and/or charged for it.
 
Jamezinho said:
Also, I'd like to thank Konami for updating the Copa Libertadores with the 2012 teams. They really didn't have to do it.

Lesser companies would have left it for the next game and/or charged for it.
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It's PES 2012, would of been cheeky just giving us the Copa Libertadores with the 2011 teams.

Jamezinho said:
Lesser companies would have left it for the next game and/or charged for it.
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You realise that same company charged £15 for 1 league (J-League) DLC for Japanese customers? When you have very little leagues in the game already charging 15 quid puts them in with those lesser companies you speak of.
 
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I couldn't resist anymore, the usual sites haven't uploaded yet the 1.06-patch for download so I carried my 42"-plasma and xbox360 to the room with the internet-connection and usedxboxlive to get the patch and DLC.

This has the disadvantage of losing 1.00, so I could only directly compare version 1.03, which I have on my usb-stick, and 1.06. The experience of 1.00 will have to be through my memory. So here are my findings after two hours comparing back to back:

I can't believe the people that say that there is no change in gameplay. It is blatantly obvious, within the first two minutes of gameplay I could feel it. So what changed?

The feeling of the players is way better, as if there were some additional small animations put in to make the player's feel more like real players. It's a bit like it was in PES 2011, and maybe even better.

The feeling for the players is best felt with gamespeed -2 and imho definitely the way to go for the most realistic experience. The best thing is that the ball is a bit faster than it was on 1.00 for gamespeed -2, so it is exactly what the doctor ordered.

The ball-physics seem to be also better. In 1.00 when players ran, the ball would stick unnaturally to their feet so that it looks ugly and ackward, with 1.06 the ball would leave a bit the foot with every touch which is much better.

When making highballs to the front-runner, he wouldn't stop and return anymore, that was a bug in 1.00.

The goalkeeper is way better than in 1.00, and a little better than in 1.03. I would say now he is perfect and natural, ie. holding to the ball when it can be expected. He is not anymore the enemy he was in 1.00 and you can rely on him.

The only problem is with the reaction to loose balls, but that problem is shared with every player on the pitch. Players should normally react much faster to loose balls, to get it as quick as possible before the opponent gets it, but their reaction is delayed.

Way less cheating going on on top-player in 1.06 than in 1.00. In 1.00 the cheating is so heavy that you can easily lose a match 1:8 if you are not 110% concentrated. Every little mistake, every little space, every goalopportunity gets 100% exploited. In 1.03 and 1.06 the CPU-AI is much more humanised to make mistakes and coupled with the better goalkeepers, it is more relaxing to play.

Verdict: 1.06 is like a best-of of all the patches before and more. It combines the freedom and fluidity of 1.00 with the less cheating and more competent goalkeepers of 1.03 (actually the goalkeepers are even better in 1.06) and improves ballphysics and AI all around, but the best thing is the feeling of the players on gamespeed -2, it feels very satisfying and real and thanks to a little bit faster ball it is now just perfectly realistic. To judge the shooting I will have to play much more.
But seriously, this is the version of PES 2012 that should have been released on day 1. Instead we obviously paid for an early beta.
 
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Flaw3d Genius said:
It's PES 2012, would of been cheeky just giving us the Copa Libertadores with the 2011 teams.
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They didn't do it with PES2011 though, which was stuck with 2010 teams if I remember right.

Flaw3d Genius said:
You realise that same company charged £15 for 1 league (J-League) DLC for Japanese customers? When you have very little leagues in the game already charging 15 quid puts them in with those lesser companies you speak of.
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Don't really care to be honest. :)) As far as I'm concerned they could charge us for the Champions League and Copa Lib modes but they don't, so that's all that matters to me.
 
Jamezinho said:
As I said earlier, I've not noticed any obvious differences with this patch. However, I've played six or seven matches since the patch and found that I'm enjoying the game a little more.

Maybe the relentless pressure of the AI has been toned down a little? Also I've noticed AI defenders making the odd mistake here and there. All in all the game feels better but I can't quite put my finger on why.
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I can't put my finger on the effects of 1.06 either. The differences are subtle but noticeable in every aspect of the game play. I am now playing on Superstar in Seria A, with my PEEL team A.C.Siena - the Robur.
I have two 0 0 draws against Genoa and Cesena, lost one against Juventus 1 0. This would not have been possible on 1.03. Absolutely no way.
Great job Konami for freshening things up so late on.
0 passing assistance, all other assistance off, game speed 0.
 
many people say gameplay differs in ML mode, more cheating and stadium related.
I wouldn't know because I don't play ML, but when I read the patch notes of 1.06 I see this:

* Changes to the game in order to accomodate the new "Copa Santander Libertadores 2012" mode.
* Fixes to text chat. Now customers can use text chat during Master League Online competitions too.
* General improvement to the gaming experience in various modes.
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hmmm
 
Something has seriously gone wrong for me since this 1.06 patch. I've conceded 13 goals in 4 games,the hold up seems to work only sporadically,the CPU is scoring almost at will on every attack,my defenders are not man marking and leaving huge gaps for attackers to run through, it's a complete disaster for me at the moment. I don't know what's happened.

Does anyone know if it's possible to revert back to the 1.03 patch on the PC?
 
You don't need to reinstall the game, just look for the 1.03 patch on google and you'll have plenty to choose from. Or just download the no-dvd version of it, for the sake of simplicity.
 
Evil Heat said:
Something has seriously gone wrong for me since this 1.06 patch. I've conceded 13 goals in 4 games,the hold up seems to work only sporadically,the CPU is scoring almost at will on every attack,my defenders are not man marking and leaving huge gaps for attackers to run through, it's a complete disaster for me at the moment. I don't know what's happened.

Does anyone know if it's possible to revert back to the 1.03 patch on the PC?
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Im convinced my defence AI is far worse.
 
Strange, that there are these diverse perceptions of the patch. For me it is the best thing since the PS2-PES-games, the fun and addiction is back.

The PS2-PES-games are outdated now, but what they did great was to keep you immersed in the game, you felt the individuality of the players and everything is balanced and the game-mechanics worked reliable so that nothing stood between you and the football.

Never since PES 5 this balance was there, there was always something wrong, but this patch 1.06 on xbox360 using as manual as possible and zero-assistance (except for clearing), playing on gamespeed -2, 30 minutes, top-player and widecam really did the trick. It's just awesome!

Defense is really not difficult anymore due to much better player-control and more reactive teamplayers as well as a very good goalkeeper (there was a situation where the goalkeeper went down to stop a shot, the ball reflected somehow from his tummy and went up again, he immediately stood up and took hold of the ball in his hands, for a PES -goalkeeper that was an amazing reaction).

You just have to set a lower defense-line and the problems with the throughballs and running through of opponents is history. The other thing you can do is take control of your defenders and make them follow the opponent.

And then you can use R2 to intercept balls or steal the ball from the dribblers.

Even the need to use supercancel is greatly reduced. And the scripting in top-player is compared to version 1.00 negligible.

Konami really outdid themselves with this patch. There are still a few problems with playerswitching and deciding who should be the recipient of a pass. But otherwise it's just ace.
 
henrys hand said:
Strange, that there are these diverse perceptions of the patch. For me it is the best thing since the PS2-PES-games, the fun and addiction is back.

The PS2-PES-games are outdated now, but what they did great was to keep you immersed in the game, you felt the individuality of the players and everything is balanced and the game-mechanics worked reliable so that nothing stood between you and the football.

Never since PES 5 this balance was there, there was always something wrong, but this patch 1.06 on xbox360 using as manual as possible and zero-assistance (except for clearing), playing on gamespeed -2, 30 minutes, top-player and widecam really did the trick. It's just awesome!

Defense is really not difficult anymore due to much better player-control and more reactive teamplayers as well as a very good goalkeeper (there was a situation where the goalkeeper went down to stop a shot, the ball reflected somehow from his tummy and went up again, he immediately stood up and took hold of the ball in his hands, for a PES -goalkeeper that was an amazing reaction).

You just have to set a lower defense-line and the problems with the throughballs and running through of opponents is history. The other thing you can do is take control of your defenders and make them follow the opponent.

And then you can use R2 to intercept balls or steal the ball from the dribblers.

Even the need to use supercancel is greatly reduced. And the scripting in top-player is compared to version 1.00 negligible.

Konami really outdid themselves with this patch. There are still a few problems with playerswitching and deciding who should be the recipient of a pass. But otherwise it's just ace.
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Totally, totally agree.

I'm playing on Superstar, 15 mins, -2 gamespeed. I find using -2 gamespeed really accentuates things like acceleration, turning speeds (or slower speeds) etc, and a more weighty player. I also have no troubles with the ball physics/shot power at all on -2.

I believe that this just highlights how difficult it is for KONAMI to make the perfect game. For me, this is now just about it.

Like Henry said, remember that the defensive line issues seem to have been fixed, SO, if you're playing Arsenal for example, then the last thing you want to do is play a high defensive line, or indeed any team with fast strikers. With increased player individuality remember things like speed will be represented better. I believe that even in 1.03 there was still the element of the catch up bug whereby the game would like slow down for a second and the attacker would check his run slightly giving the defender, even though he was slower than the attacker, time to tackle and even keep up with a faster striker. Not any more. Walcott feels like Walcott, and he will speed past you if you have defence too high.

Also bear in mind that through balls must be played from somewhere, so are you playing enough in midfield for example?

My only fear now is that this game gets dumbed down tons for PES 2013 if the outcry about this patch being too hard is noted. I don't want to be dominating games and winning most matches with Liverpool on Superstar FFS.

As for the keepers, I am really, really impressed. The saves, the animations etc, the response. Some of the soft goals that would seem to lob, stay in the air forever or just trickle in are greatly, greatly reduced. If seem a whole range of new shit that wasn't there before. Reina at last feels like Reina, and not some Sunday league spaz who I'm holding my breath with every shot. The highlights of yesterday who a parried save on the line, then a double save rebound, and a lovely contextual slightest touch over the bar from a CPU power shot, you know the ones where the ball just deviates off the glove a fraction and almost skims the top of the bar. Excellent stuff. SO, even if PES 2013 is a disaster, at least this 1.06 version will be kept in my collection forever.
 
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