PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

everything from the Q&A (I think it's finished now?) sorry I didn't get the question's asked but you can make them out anyway...

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@amz_ali grass looks more lush. Different cuts for different stadiums promised, and, BIG NEWS, different camera angle for different stadium

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@MBroadhead_ already answered a question about shooting. It feels great, especially with the feeling of the player hitting the ball.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@TGiovani the camera sitting still means less zooming, always giving you a perfect view of the field

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@Jonkirlo running aminations are back! So players like Messi and Ronaldo have their own, and there are tonnes more that you can assign

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@MBroadhead_ crossing is similar, but feel different thanks to new ball physics. Not massive change though

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@RandyKwa we played on the hardest, and it was tough. New defensive AI on top teams is tough to break down, first match, no shots on goal!

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@AsifH90 Shooting is more like the older games. More control, and result make more sense. New shooting animations, and new ball physics

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@Gibreel87 cursor change is indeed fixed. L1 works great, although now you can change player with the right stick ala FIFA.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@TGiovani Player models now look great in widecam. New levels of detail, with brand new lighting for day and night settings.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@Rich_Bach Yes! catch up bug has gone!Quick players stay ahead and can get way from slow players! More on this in the podcast with examples

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
No ones asked, but want to confirm stunbling animation has gone, You always stay in control of players at all times. 100% more responsive

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@ivan1real dribbling massively improved thanks to better responsiveness and more animations. Messi is a joy to control, ask @Suffwan!

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@pes_soccer Players fending off people in off the ball movements,looks more realisitc, but not over physical. Can see collisions at corners

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@lyonsoccer87 yes too early for new game modes. As for formation screen, long tweet this. It has changed when viewing players now. Do you....remember ISS 64? Players now have letter grade for abilities for quick view.I.E. Messi A for dribbling, D for defending etc

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@jameslv1986 Fave player was Xavi. Passing ability was amazing, even on manual.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@mytsharp player runs are now amazing. Also, zero animation lag in PES 2012. 100% more fluid. Big player run announcement coming soon...

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@amz_ali YES! Ball physics are so improved you now see curling and bobbles on passing.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@bulwa11 Nets feel good, not too sure what else to say as happy with the way they behave

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@GordanC Throwins and goal kicks massive change. Now you flick right stick to select who you want to pass to. Big improvement

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@ivan1real similar speed to PES 2011 in gameplay

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@mytsharp yes, finally! Camp Nou felt so different from other stadiums. Amazing preset camera angle

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@skiamakia yes, game speed option still in, although I never changed.

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@KAS259 please check timeline as you re-asked. Yes, brand new penalty system, like older PES games, also camera behind the player now

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@momo_firefox no idea about if they motion captured, but lots of new goalkeeper animations, as stated by @AsimTanvir

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@mooBaka freekicks feel different, again from ball physics. Both crossing and shooting ones have more dip and ball movement

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@bigol83 very easy to hold up play. No more worry about physical contant. No more easy throughball through defence, completely gone!

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@geoyakult Yes, REFEREES ARE FIXED! They play advantage rule, the also (heard from new build) book players after play stops!

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@amz_ali passing very different to PES 2011, feels more satisfying. Bar can be turned on or off

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@MBroadhead_ holdup play has changed to R2 and back. Tackling actually works in PES 2012, although if you commit you can be turned if miss

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@amz_ali jumping volleys are out! no more silly jumping volleys from outside the box. as for shooting, check timeline

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@dulezmaj89 defenders don't let the ball fly past them, they are more aware of where the ball is

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@dairylee yep more choice from goal kicks and distribution, and more responsive is that too

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@helmondpes player runs after one-twos are now diagonal or straight. You have more control on their runs, but I can't announce yet ;)

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@williamgardner we were told the linesman will make mistakes. Still working on this though

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@haha__xD gameplay is just as fluid as FIFA, but animations not close enough

Adam_Bhatti Adam Bhatti
.@Drunkenshaolin only thing I can say with confidence is ball bouncing off players has gone. Totally new ball behaviour and AI awareness

AsimTanvir Asim Tanvir
by Adam_Bhatti
I was told Konami will be revealing other new gameplay features in the run up to release. I can't share info on these though. :( #PES2012
Click to expand...
 
1) jumping volleys are out! no more silly jumping volleys from outside the box. as for shooting, check timeline
2) REFEREES ARE FIXED! They play advantage rule, the also (heard from new build) book players after play stops!
3)Passing ability was amazing, even on manual.
4)defenders don't let the ball fly past them, they are more aware of where the ball is
5)I can say with confidence is ball bouncing off players has gone. Totally new ball behaviour and AI awareness
6)No more easy throughball through defence, completely gone!


Thank you king Seabass....eew salt is not the tastiest thing still got half a bag to go.
 
About the DPad controls, I'm assuming it's a setting. If you read the control sheets posted a while ago (or if not, here: http://bit.ly/jqQPQA), for some moves it says "If using stick controls".

Regarding the short burst, the old ISS games had it - and I think it was exactly the same button mapping :) Looking forward to it!

As for the shot fake, that alone almost makes my day.

Yesterday I took a break of BAL and got back to my ML. Sadly, one thing I did notice is that I have a terrible time controlling the passes - even the short ones - with the analog stick and the default camera, because it is not always a 90 degree angle - i.e. up in the dpad is not up in the field, parallel to the goal line. Since the camera rotates, that just makes me look like a bunch of headless chickens trying to pass the ball around.

I then went back to the DPad - something I hadn't done in a year - and lo and behold, things were much better in the short pass department. Maybe it was my mind playing tricks, or the PS3 actually adjusts something when you're playing with the DPad, but the game worked much better for me that way :(

I'll have to try it again this evening.

Still, it's been a great day for news! And I like it that I also see some of you playing PES2011 again, just to kill the waiting time ;)

Paulo Tavares
 
That list truly is amazing. Almost like someone just announced that every single aspect of the game has been made better. An actual working advantage rule almost brings tears to my eyes.

pjft said:
Still, it's been a great day for news! And I like it that I also see some of you playing PES2011 again, just to kill the waiting time ;)
Click to expand...

I never quit playing it since it came out, but then again I think it's damn good.
 
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Isslander said:
That list truly is amazing. Almost like someone just announced that every single aspect of the game has been made better. An actual working advantage rule almost brings tears to my eyes.



I never quit playing it since it came out, but then again I think it's damn good.
Click to expand...

I don't think I have you on PSN - I probably should :)

Feel free to add me if you have a PS3, though to be honest, I'm not much of an online gamer due to lack of time. ;) Otherwise, I would be all over PEEL!

Cheers,

Paulo Tavares
 
Asim also had his own little Q&A (almost private with me heh). Ignore the large spaces and portuguese tweet details from Chromie Bird. Oh, and read from Above to Top.
Asim Tanvir
@1stclassnoble Both are not exactly the same. As I said in my impressions, tweaked ball physics means you will encounter some differences.
18 minutos atrás em resposta para 1stclassnoble de Twitter for iPhone




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Tola
@AsimTanvir Shooting is still the same, so how about the crosses? #Pes
29 minutos atrás em resposta para AsimTanvir de Snaptu




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos I am part of Kitana Media. Working on a brand new gaming website. Will occasionally do stuff for WENB and FSB, if needed.
24 minutos atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Maybe, unfortunately (again), I can't say. :(
31 minutos atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




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João Pedro Campos
@AsimTanvir Yay, soon. Hopefully still this week?
38 minutos atrás em resposta para AsimTanvir de web


Asim Tanvir
Regarding the questions you guys asked about modes in #PES2012, nothing can be revealed yet. Konami will be revealing stuff soon though.
39 minutos atrás de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@gooners16 Personally at this stage, I prefer the way #PES2012 plays. #FIFA12 is still a good football game though and will have its fans.
44 minutos atrás em resposta para gooners16 de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@wepro7 You mean precision shooting? Seemed a bit more controlled if that makes sense. Not overly powerful either.
46 minutos atrás em resposta para wepro7 de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Bit of both :)
51 minutos atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




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João Pedro Campos
@AsimTanvir All related to gameplay? Is it a complete surprise or something fans have requested? :P
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para AsimTanvir de TweetDeck


Asim Tanvir
@gooners16 A few repeated ones, there always are. It's just the nature of the game mate. More you play, more repeat replays you'll see.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para gooners16 de Twitter for iPhone




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aaaaarrrrsseenaaalll
@Adam_Bhatti @AsimTanvir are there the annoying countiuation of replays?>
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás de web




Asim Tanvir
I was told Konami will be revealing other new gameplay features in the run up to release. I can't share info on these though. :( #PES2012
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@gooners16 That's a toughie. If they tweak AI even more, will be immense. More examples of continuous play would be great too.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para gooners16 de Twitter for iPhone




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aaaaarrrrsseenaaalll
@Adam_Bhatti @AsimTanvir what do you think konami should/can improve in final build for pes 2012
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás de web




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Sometimes, yes. Other times, no.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




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João Pedro Campos
@AsimTanvir Ah nice! And the players stay on the same places they were before the screen wipe?
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para AsimTanvir de TweetDeck


Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Not as blatantly obvious as FIFA 12 per se, but it is there. If I think about it, no black screens.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos You'll see stuff like players quickly picking up the ball on the touchline to take a throw-in after a screen wipe or replay.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Haha, keep firing away dude. If I can answer, I will. Continuous play is there, not blatantly obvious though.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
Just thought I'd add, I had to be told to get off the behind closed doors pods after the sesh with @JonMurphy_PES. #PES2012 #Hogging
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@gooners16 Got to be honest and say I didn't come across any, but that's the kind of thing you see after hours of play.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para gooners16 de Twitter for iPhone




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aaaaarrrrsseenaaalll
@AsimTanvir are there any 1 handed goalkeeper saves in pes 2012? this needs to be implemented
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás de web




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Crosses seemed to be just normal. Konami could be testing the water with this Pass Support setting. Works well.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@JjosecaEOL Yup, thanks to new and improved older animations. Scored a cracking volley with Villa.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para JjosecaEOL de Twitter for iPhone




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Jjoseca1
@AsimTanvir Better volleys in PES 2012?
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Asim Tanvir
@MBroadhead_ Just the general build up play was a joy. Konami have built on PES 2011 really well so far.
aproximadamente 1 hora atrás em resposta para MBroadhead_ de Twitter for iPhone





Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Keepers are very good, even at this stage. Konami are still improving to, remember
aproximadamente 2 horas atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for Android




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Keeper mistake was him just standing there while I rounded and scored. Didn't happen again though.
aproximadamente 2 horas atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for Android




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Stats still very much have an influence.
aproximadamente 2 horas atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for Android




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João Pedro Campos
@AsimTanvir Just because it is fully manual, that doesn't mean stats no longer have an influence right?
aproximadamente 5 horas atrás em resposta para AsimTanvir de web
Click to expand...
 
everyinng sounds promising apart from this.

.@Rich_Bach Yes! catch up bug has gone!Quick players stay ahead and can get way from slow players! More on this in the podcast with examples
Click to expand...

:RANT: fucking kids complaining! Online may descend into the Crisitano up from crap that was FIFA 09! All PES 2011 required was some effort and ACTUALLY tapping R1 and Holing R1 + R2

Now we will see these cheap players just holding the sprint button :RANT:
 
kobayashi said:
everyinng sounds promising apart from this.



:RANT: fucking kids complaining! Online may descend into the Crisitano up from crap that was FIFA 09! All PES 2011 required was some effort and ACTUALLY tapping R1 and Holing R1 + R2

Now we will see these cheap players just holding the sprint button :RANT:
Click to expand...

Nah mate, it had to be done, there's no proper momentumn on sprinting 'cause defenders always catch, even if you tap run, considerable slower players always catch up which is unrealistic imo. And didn't you read the rest, defensive AI is quite tight, still hard to get past the defense, but when you dribble your way past a slow defender he wont be able to catch up so easily.
 
Yeah it depends, if it's a truly slow defender against að "speed demon" then the defender should not stand a chance. But this should not always be the case, when the two players have similar speed stats, the defender should catch up as he doesn't have a ball at his feet to slow him down.
 
_anderson said:
Nah mate, it had to be done, there's no proper momentumn on sprinting 'cause defenders always catch, even if you tap run, considerable slower players always catch up which is unrealistic imo. And didn't you read the rest, defensive AI is quite tight, still hard to get past the defense, but when you dribble your way past a slow defender he wont be able to catch up so easily.
Click to expand...

The only issue for me was when you got ahead of a defender and he was tugging you, you couldn't really break free. if they sorted that out,t hen cool.

but no, i could out sprint slow defenders on PES 2011 with Ratface, Messi, Krasic etc. as long as you had a yard and you kept tapping R1, and held down R1+R2.

In my ML i motor away from defenders with Gyan! the system was good since you actually had to put effort into staying ahead which put pressure on you to score. Adding an element of skill. Now its going to be 'hold sprint'. Wheel away for an easy goal!

These kids just want FIFA 09 back where you just hold down Sprint and fast players motor away!
 
pjft said:
I don't think I have you on PSN - I probably should :)

Feel free to add me if you have a PS3, though to be honest, I'm not much of an online gamer due to lack of time. ;) Otherwise, I would be all over PEEL!

Cheers,

Paulo Tavares
Click to expand...

Same here mate, little time for online, but I'll add you and we'll grab a game sometime. :)
 
kobayashi said:
The only issue for me was when you got ahead of a defender and he was tugging you, you couldn't really break free. if they sorted that out,t hen cool.

but no, i could out sprint slow defenders on PES 2011 with Ratface, Messi, Krasic etc. as long as you had a yard and you kept tapping R1, and held down R1+R2.

In my ML i motor away from defenders with Gyan! the system was good since you actually had to put effort into staying ahead which put pressure on you to score. Adding an element of skill. Now its going to be 'hold sprint'. Wheel away for an easy goal!

These kids just want FIFA 09 back where you just hold down Sprint and fast players motor away!
Click to expand...

I still don't think it's like that. It's just about the first thing you mentioned, you could never get free, and now you can. I doubt we're back to PES08/09 were it was a dribble fest, all you had to do was press R1. It'll probably be just like PES 2011 in that aspect where if you just hold R1 you'll lose the ball real quick, but if you successfully dribble PAST a slower defender you'll get some distance. Just like old PES games, remember them? The defensive AI sounds way to good for a regression on that aspect. But I'll ask nevertheless.
 
Isslander said:
Yeah it depends, if it's a truly slow defender against að "speed demon" then the defender should not stand a chance. But this should not always be the case, when the two players have similar speed stats, the defender should catch up as he doesn't have a ball at his feet to slow him down.
Click to expand...

I think there has to be a least a 20 attribute difference in terms of Sprint Speed for defenders not to catch the attacker when he's just holding sprint!

So a player with 90 sprint speed would be able to stay ahead of a player with 70.

But if my player has say 78-83 with sprint speed. Unless the attacker is tapping R1 like mad and timing his bursts with R1+R2, I'm sorry but he shouldn't just wheel away like that!

You also have to factor in dribble speed.
 
It all sounds fantastic. The best PES yet ? But the proof will be in the playing.

It does look like Konami are really pulling out the stops. :COOL:

And great to see the new goalkeeper animations and hear how they've been improved overall.
 
This is why we need error on ball touches, because football players don't run constant top speed with tight ball control, they can only manage to do that if they do longer touches (and those aren't perfect either in length and direction). The only reason we have speed problems in both games are because of perfect/even touches, it's not realistic.
 
we were told the linesman will make mistakes. Still working on this though
Click to expand...

I wonder if they have the balls (no pun intended) to actually implement this as something the commentators will mention, linesman mistakes happen now, but they are so rare that they could just as well be game bugs. Done the right way this would quite brilliant, but it could turn out to be like handballs in PES3, driving everyone crazy.
 
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kobayashi said:
everyinng sounds promising apart from this.



:RANT: fucking kids complaining! Online may descend into the Crisitano up from crap that was FIFA 09! All PES 2011 required was some effort and ACTUALLY tapping R1 and Holing R1 + R2

Now we will see these cheap players just holding the sprint button :RANT:
Click to expand...

I agree whole heartedly a step in the wrong direction if you ask me UNLESS the stamina system is used this is going to spoil online.
 
Any news on better celebrations, as in not wait five seconds and then wheel away in delight?
 
zeemeister said:
I agree whole heartedly a step in the wrong direction if you ask me UNLESS the stamina system is used this is going to spoil online.
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So if it worked like the pes of old wouldn't be enough? You two are exaggerating a bit if you ask me. And it's not like sprinting whores don't exist already.. It's always about playing the right people.

Asked Asim about it:
"AsimTanvir Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Nope, not the case. Messi is great in #PES2012 but can be stopped. I played with him and against him."

Trying to get a more complete answer from him as we speak
 
_anderson said:
So if it worked like the pes of old wouldn't be enough? You two are exaggerating a bit if you ask me. And it's not like sprinting whores don't exist already.. It's always about playing the right people.

Asked Asim about it:
"AsimTanvir Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Nope, not the case. Messi is great in #PES2012 but can be stopped. I played with him and against him."

Trying to get a more complete answer from him as we speak
Click to expand...

Could you maybe ask him if the crowd has been changed. maybe higher quality, fan scarves, bengal fires, better atmosphere, better, louder chants or sth. like that? would be great to know that.

thanks in advance
 
Adam wrote:No questions guys, most of them will be answered in the write-up.

I know you're eager, but it's worth waiting for.

Someone say shot fake? It's awesome in PES 2012 again. I even dropped the keeper once. Animation is there, and if you press it without direction, player just stops the ball after a shotfake animation.
Click to expand...

So sexy.
wabak said:
Yeah...
Click to expand...

Well, he say exactly the same last year!I remember it very well.
Even now from Konami did not bother to call it "fake shot" and direct it to write "Shot Cancel" in Control Layouts
 
I made up my mind. Tonight I'll play a bit of PES5 and then PES2011, if I can finish all my work stuff in due time. I want to check if it is the nostalgia playing tricks on me, or if indeed there were things that were better in the old days.
 
zeemeister said:
pjft prepare for a rude awakening pal.
Click to expand...

PEs 5 is still an awesome game but SO RIGID compared to PES 2011, i feel this is important since i think a lot of people who bash PES haven't grasped the concept of the freedom and sensitivity PES 2011 provides and instead want a more tired together and smoother game.
 
zeemeister said:
I agree whole heartedly a step in the wrong direction if you ask me UNLESS the stamina system is used this is going to spoil online.
Click to expand...

I'm more worried about the AI in online games.

YouTube - Novo trailer de PES 2012 é divulgado


Watch it from 4:18 to 4:28. If the AI off the ball movement in defence is tatical and inteligent as this i don't think payers will have free spaces to sprint all the time, just in more specific situations like counter attacks.
 
Asim's more complete answer:
Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos I would say it is nicely balanced at the moment, more than its competitor anyway. ;)
13 minutos atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone




Asim Tanvir
@_JoaoCampos Just like in real life, Barca push forward a lot therefore are vulnerable to counters (gaps appears) but you can alter strategy
19 minutos atrás em resposta para _JoaoCampos de Twitter for iPhone
Click to expand...
 
Top player AI in PES 2011 was great and to a very good quality despite it's issues here and there. Best in any football game.

It's regular I'm worried about, if Konami set online matches to Top players there's no issue but leaving it on regular will open up problems!
 
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