PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

It's as simple as this, if the run bug isn't fixed I simply won't buy this game until it is. It's a fucking disgrace.
 
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Ameppe said:
no, online lag and stability is the best from pes 6
it has improved a lot, lag is almost disappeared, what makes it worse is the users who play full assisted
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I said this in the online thread:

Best thing to do would be to make zero passing assistance the online default setting, with the 0-4 choice being mainly for offline. That way people who play online for ranking points have to learn to pass with no assistance. In the friendly player match rooms online you should be able to set it to 0-4, but for RANKED matches and MLO you should learn to play with no assistance. Then it requires skill to get those points!

You could argue about too many parameters eg. unassisted and semi-assisted player switching, but those are more down to taste, passing is the bread and butter of the game and should require skill.

The really irritating thing is that before Konami tried to ape FIFA's pass assistance settings, everyone was homogenized, it was one system that was stat dependent. Konami need to return to this one system, but choose the hardest one. Forget about complaints from the moaners, trust me, it will be for the greater good of online play. The ping-pong-punks would actually have to think about their passing, not play like skilless automated robots with their Messis and Ronaldos.

This is PES, not FIFA. Konami should be aiming for the hardcore, not the casual gamers. It is the hardcore that have kept buying the game even when FIFA is getting critical accalim.
 
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only1ronaldo said:
dunno if this has been posted before, but it remains in retail version and is pretty much major gamebreaker :FAIL:

unstoppable knuckle freekicks

YouTube - [PES2012] Knuckle Ball Free Kicks
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Those ball physics just look all kinds of wrong. The ball moves in a straight line for a while and suddenly deviates massively. In real life Ronaldo's freekicks are often a combination of insane power and subtle swerve/dip.

I think you were suggesting that the keepers are bad in their reactions but i'm going to say that i think the physics look unrealistic. I don't think any goalkeeper should save shots that suddenly swerve that much the moment they get towards the keeper regardless of range.
 
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sincover said:
Exactly. Of all the goals I've conceded in the ML, only 1 or 2 of them are the result of well worked play from the CPU. As you've said they're usually from deflections or hail mary long balls/crosses that are pretty much indefensible. I actually have a clip that i'll upload later that shows me dispossessing a CPU player legitimately only to have the game decide to take away my control of the defender AND have the CPU player clip through the defender's geometry like he wasn't there. Utterly infuriating.
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http://flic.kr/p/atdwkv
 
Agree on the whole online assist setting issues. About the knuckle freekicks, does moving the goalkeeper to the destination of the ball stop it from going in.

People need to pressure Konami with ferocity right now as the game is still fresh and recently released. Pressure them to create patch to just nerf the freekicks and whatever else the community needs.

Right now is the time, any later in the release cycle they are going to stop caring about any gameplay improvements, go ahead and inundate jon murphy`s twitter and facebook with demands, same for konami. They will be able to make adjustments just like Gran Turismo has been doing for over a year now. We buy their products so better keep supporting the communities, create a filter for online matchmaking for different assist levels, its all such basic stuff it bogles the mind as to how they struggle with things that are industry standards for some franchises and games.

People i asked last time if anyone can tell me what exactly Jon Murphy does besides relaying information between konami and the community, surely he has other duties like following through with demands, and pushing for patches the community asks for.

KONAMI give me his job, lol.
Jon just sounds like regular PR person, but i also understand that maybe he doesnt have the freedom to demand things from his employers. But Still.
 
only1ronaldo said:
no clue, but if this sort of crap happened online I'd jump off the nearest bridge
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i think it seems okay nothing really wrong Cristiano dribbling skill there, at least many on occasions the defenders are wrong footed not with many skill moves/tricks as in other game. Although, hope Konami take the "player collision" to a new level, so we can see more impact to a player who is dribbling.
 
shorty alien said:
I said this in the online thread:

Best thing to do would be to make zero passing assistance the online default setting, with the 0-4 choice being mainly for offline. That way people who play online for ranking points have to learn to pass with no assistance. In the friendly player match rooms online you should be able to set it to 0-4, but for RANKED matches and MLO you should learn to play with no assistance. Then it requires skill to get those points!

You could argue about too many parameters eg. unassisted and semi-assisted player switching, but those are more down to taste, passing is the bread and butter of the game and should require skill.

The really irritating thing is that before Konami tried to ape FIFA's pass assistance settings, everyone was homogenized, it was one system that was stat dependent. Konami need to return to this one system, but choose the hardest one. Forget about complaints from the moaners, trust me, it will be for the greater good of online play. The ping-pong-punks would actually have to think about their passing, not play like skilless automated robots with their Messis and Ronaldos.

This is PES, not FIFA. Konami should be aiming for the hardcore, not the casual gamers. It is the hardcore that have kept buying the game even when FIFA is getting critical accalim.
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completely agree
i suggested Adam on twitter to report Konami to make -1 as default speed and 0 passing assistance as default, but he said no. Instead he is suggesting Konami to put online filters to find 0 assistance players, or lobby.
 
Lol you guys only think of yourselves make it -1 and 0 passing assistance some people like -2 some people like +2 some just like a more fast paced game does that mean we should punish them?

Some people use 4 and some use 0 stop crying you've made a choice on your passing assistance it is 100% fair because if you want to you can go to 4 or 0 dont get mad. The best feeling IN THE WORLD is beating a noob that is on 4 pass assistance with 0 or 1.

You made a choice to do 0 he made a choice to do 4 you cant go on about "majority" because konami has to please all how would you like it if konami decided " hmmm i think the majority of players use 4 pass assistance online lets make everyone in the world HAVE to use 4." How you just felt is exactly how those noobs will feel.

I agree konami should add different groups for game speeds and pass assistance but saying that konami should make everyone HAVE to play on 0 is absurd and makes me feel like punching babies(Dane Cook).

Noobs: Every game has em every game hates em live with it or cry to your mommy how it's not exactly how you want it.
 
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So what of a casual gamer who enjoys PES offline with an assisted pass setting but is bored and wants to play a game online in MLO. Should his difficulty be ramped up to a forced zero assistance so he can have a go at MLO or ranked matches? If you play against someone with decent skill but still chooses to use 4 bars, switch over yourself.

I played full manual FIFA vs assisted players in FIFA world cup and initially for FIFA 11 when I had it. I copped a few beatings but it was my choice as to what settings I used and I had to at the end because manual to manual matchmaking was just too hard to find sometimes.

Even guys with full manual tried playing unrealistically. So even if people are forced to go zero bars on pass assistance for MLO, doesn't mean they'll turn into gentlemen or play the game properly.

What is the issue anyway with the difference in pass assistance? Full retail game not out in Australia so I haven't experienced any online games yet with PES 2012. I didn't think that offline was that much of a disadvantage to play with zero assistance versus the AI. Is it really the pass assistance or the lag factor that doesn't allow you enough time to charge up the passes?
 
Ameppe said:
completely agree
i suggested Adam on twitter to report Konami to make -1 as default speed and 0 passing assistance as default, but he said no. Instead he is suggesting Konami to put online filters to find 0 assistance players, or lobby.
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That sounds like a much better idea. Although they should maybe have a couple of groups. If you can pick from all assistance settings and all game speed settings then the filter might not give you any matches for a while. I had a hard enough time getting games sometimes on PES 11.
 
Some of what you guys are saying would make sense if it wasn't for this fact:

THERE NEVER USED TO BE ANY PASS ASSISTANCE settings in PES, IT WAS ALL ONE SYSTEM.

What is so wrong with returning to that one system for online ranked play, and making it the one that requires the most skill to earn those ranking points.

I'm not talking about the optional manual override, I'm referring to the normal passing system. I'm also not saying anything yet about the speed of the game as that is another issue (although using a slower speed would make the game more tactical and skillful as well), I'm talking of passing assistance.

Remember when Konami built PES 2011 to be engineered for freedom, with 360 degree free passing? They did well, but they never quite FULLY managed it.

Now they have managed it with PES' zero assistance play, properly free passing but also utilizing stats. I feel they have actually achieved their goal in PES 2012, with this being the most natural form of play, but they have unfortunately BOTTLED IT and added pass assistance levels because they are afraid too many casual gamers will find it too hard, and want to copy FIFA's system so they can lure in more casuals.

What they've done now is make the game unbalanced. It used to be up to the stats and the skill of the gamer, now gameplay online will be directly influenced by the level of assistance you have. I've been here before with FIFA 09's manual vs assisted. It does not make for fair play at all. One player has to use skill, the other play plays like a robot but can still take points off you without using skill.

A non-assist lobby would be the next best thing, but it is still undesirable unless there is a separate leaderboard and MLO, and that's never going to happen.
 
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shorty alien said:
I said this in the online thread:

Best thing to do would be to make zero passing assistance the online default setting, with the 0-4 choice being mainly for offline. That way people who play online for ranking points have to learn to pass with no assistance. In the friendly player match rooms online you should be able to set it to 0-4, but for RANKED matches and MLO you should learn to play with no assistance. Then it requires skill to get those points!

You could argue about too many parameters eg. unassisted and semi-assisted player switching, but those are more down to taste, passing is the bread and butter of the game and should require skill.

The really irritating thing is that before Konami tried to ape FIFA's pass assistance settings, everyone was homogenized, it was one system that was stat dependent. Konami need to return to this one system, but choose the hardest one. Forget about complaints from the moaners, trust me, it will be for the greater good of online play. The ping-pong-punks would actually have to think about their passing, not play like skilless automated robots with their Messis and Ronaldos.

This is PES, not FIFA. Konami should be aiming for the hardcore, not the casual gamers. It is the hardcore that have kept buying the game even when FIFA is getting critical accalim.
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+1 great post.
 
Isn't it possible to see what Pass Assistance setting your opponent has before you accept/play?

I haven't played online yet, probably won't til it gets officially released in my country
 
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klashman69 said:
Thats stamina mate :WORSHIP: Trust me, the CPU will substitute and put a fresh player on (striker, winger)he will tear your tired players to streads if he has decent stats. I noticed in the epic 4-4 draw vs Nacional, when i put Meyong on, i could just tap R1 or Rb, run at their tired defenders and easily pass them.

It's harder to do, well everything at the end of the game when tired.

Also those jammy goals the CPU score from rebounds, anyone else think it's cheating?
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Yes! Especially when you get chance after chance (incl rebounds) but cannot score, they get 1 random rebound BOOM goal!
 
gameklip said:
One thing that shocked me in the demo... Defoe is 69%! WTF? I know he's been off form but wow. His shooting acc ain't bad though. I had to put Pav up there for the height. can't wait til the full game so I can put Adebayor upfront :D

nice post btw JG
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He's pretty good though, screw his overall rating ;)
Got decent stats in all the 'right' departments and he feels/plays like Defoe
 
mattwakeman said:
Can anyone confirm that has the full retail version of the X360 version still has the stutter step bug which was in the demo?
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It's in the final game.

It's Konami, what did you expect?

Also, unless we go back to a unified pass system for all the game modes, online will never be fair. So either stop buying these unfinished games (FIFA as well) or just accept it.
 
shorty alien said:
Some of what you guys are saying would make sense if it wasn't for this fact:

THERE NEVER USED TO BE ANY PASS ASSISTANCE settings in PES, IT WAS ALL ONE SYSTEM.

What is so wrong with returning to that one system for online ranked play, and making it the one that requires the most skill to earn those ranking points.

I'm not talking about the optional manual override, I'm referring to the normal passing system. I'm also not saying anything yet about the speed of the game as that is another issue (although using a slower speed would make the game more tactical and skillful as well), I'm talking of passing assistance.

Remember when Konami built PES 2011 to be engineered for freedom, with 360 degree free passing? They did well, but they never quite FULLY managed it.

Now they have managed it with PES' zero assistance play, properly free passing but also utilizing stats. I feel they have actually achieved their goal in PES 2012, with this being the most natural form of play, but they have unfortunately BOTTLED IT and added pass assistance levels because they are afraid too many casual gamers will find it too hard, and want to copy FIFA's system so they can lure in more casuals.

What they've done now is make the game unbalanced. It used to be up to the stats and the skill of the gamer, now gameplay online will be directly influenced by the level of assistance you have. I've been here before with FIFA 09's manual vs assisted. It does not make for fair play at all. One player has to use skill, the other play plays like a robot but can still take points off you without using skill.

A non-assist lobby would be the next best thing, but it is still undesirable unless there is a separate leaderboard and MLO, and that's never going to happen.
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exactly my opinion
but it's hard to obtain one only passing assistance setting set at 0, if not everyone agrees
in this topic there is someone saying we are selfish because everyone should choose what they want, and not what we want
Well, i don't think so
If Pes wants to be an hardcore simulation it must be a 0 assistance for everyone in Online Master League

or maybe they should give much more money to people playing with 0 assistance passing
it's the same system Forza Motorsport uses, but it's experience points there
 
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