I have started a FL Master league with auxerre real players. Im in last place after 9 games. I'm getting better every game but Im still horrible, LOL. I read klashmans tactics definition and then I watched st etienne vs auxerre for real from yesterday online. I set my team up with there real formation. Against certain teams it worked, others I did not. The most amazing thing was that at first I set them to quick counter, had a guy named Alain traore as my amf, it worked well against one team. Then it got stale, i changed my tactics to closer support and safer passing options. I put ganzo in that position and WOW, now I can play that intricate futbol. Doesn't mean im scoring, LOL. I just am creating better chances. Its all about the team your playing against as well. Cause i was using this tactic then I played a team that was on all out defense, I switched to counter attack and it was a thrilling 0-0 tie. This game really is addicting....
PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......
- Thread starter Jimmy G-Force
- Start date
Sleepwalker
Non-League
- 19 September 2011
And another message from the one that got beaten 9-0 (I plan to take on France with Holland on the first day I feel I'm good enough for professional - then, if they beat me 9-0 again, I really am taking up gardening 
. Things are improving. Just made it to the second round of the CL with Ajax, still no clean sheets, though (much like real Ajax, this season so far).
. Things are improving. Just made it to the second round of the CL with Ajax, still no clean sheets, though (much like real Ajax, this season so far).pes2012gonbegood
Banned
- 16 August 2011
I didn't mean only top team CB's specificaly, actually I didn't even mean only CB's it seems pretty much global that every player has just a tad too short strides while sprinting. But if you think otherwise good enough, I just think its a bit too much perhaps by 5% or so.
curdstar
Premier League
- 19 September 2006
- PES4 Partick Thistle
On the topic that there is no variety to the COM's play - balls I say! The default tactics slider set-ups for each team are not that liberal in the assignment of values, as already mentioned. Once I went in and changed my own, not being scared to go to extremes if required and it suited my team, it seems as though it invites the COM to mix up it's play as well.
Still, it will be fantastic to play this game against the COM with it playing using similarly crafted tactics.
Still, it will be fantastic to play this game against the COM with it playing using similarly crafted tactics.
klashman69
Fight the Power!
- 28 November 2007
Yes, i've noticed that too, the CPU do adapt to how you play. Noticed that Vitoria Setubal where playing possession slow football when i decided to stand off them and put men behind the ball.
curdstar
Premier League
- 19 September 2006
- PES4 Partick Thistle
And it makes perfect sense when you think about it.
If all the set values are a little too samey for each teams defaults, then logically it would mean both teams are too reliant on the individuals doing the work within the system. Change how you play via the tactics sliders and formations would therefore demand the COM adjusts it's own play even if it is using only defaults.
I played a match as Croatia against Germany and the first match saw Germany ruthlessly counter me and have me involved in a game I couldn't match them on. Played the same match again by changing values in keeping with how I believe Coatia can play and the second match ended 1-1 with me feeling as though I wasn't being rail-roaded into playing a specific way and Germany also mixing up their play. Where Ozil was pinging passes for Klose at every opportunity because the pass was on in the first match, in the second both he and Schweinsteiger were playing more patiently and playing back if required and spreading play laterally.
Unlike in FIFA where the gameplay AI is very set in it's ways (yes, that includes FIFA12) and frankly, incredibly limited due to a distinct lack of player individuality and statistical impact, not to mention how form/condition is lacking in that game (and incredibly impacting in PES this year - maybe more so than ever - haven't even touched on off-the-ball movement) the COM AI in PES is very fexible, pro-active and reactive meaning it adjusts and doesn't simply get confused.
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klashman69
Fight the Power!
- 28 November 2007
Yes, i was trying to tell PES2012gbg that, i noticed when playing against Barcelona using different inferior teams if i tried to take them on, the possession stats would be quite even but I'll get totally fucked 6,7-0, they just pass straight through you. Bbut if you sat back, put 11 men behind the ball, you would get beat 3-1, 2-0 etc.. and they would totally dominate possession. It's nice to see the AI that they really think on their feet, it's what making the games still feel varied despite teams having the same tactics!
Individuality is huge and the class difference and between players is a big as ever.
Klashman69, Barça don't do counter-attacks to finalize... if barça have the chance to do a counter, the team do it to lead the ball to the opponent field and pass it back to win field and approach the defense with the attack to play its traditional inteligent passing style. I don't remember Barcelona playing an "Italian's counter-attack style" (very characteristical of Pes2012's AI) since Guardiola's era. When i think to introduce this barça's characteristical move, i feel worry, cause Pes2012's AI is notorious made to be objective, that is, to score more goals that is possible instead of maintain the ball possession. Then, i don't know how i can manage the team's tactic to do things like this in "Pes2012's pragmatic AI".
Things I don't understand that have happened in last 2 matches:
1. Running with my AMF, CF is with last defender. I try a through ball, every time my CF pulls up, and looks around confused as the ball trickles into the space where he should be running.
2. One of my centre backs runs to wide open spaces towards the wings, leaving a huge gap in the middle. It's like the CPU forward has a 5 metre circle drawn around them, which my teammates will move out of so the nice through ball can be played to them.
3. I hit a pass to a teammate with the bar 3/4 full, it goes 1 inch. I hit another pass to a teammate with the bal 3/4 full, it flies out of bounds. This is on 1 pass assist.
4. I hit a cross to a wide open striker, easy headed goal. But, despite standing on the X, and hitting shoot as the ball comes in, the striker completely flops and misses. Alternatively, they try a super speedy bicycle kick.
It saddens me, but despite all the games promise, and good points, it is fundamentally flawed to the point where I just don't enjoy it. I'd say 1 in every 4 goals the CPU scores against me are geninely good, and I applaud them. The other 3 are me unable to player switch in time, the unstoppable cross or a free kick.
Yes, I realise against other humans its fun, but for a 1 player experience, it's another year of not playing football for me. That's 3 years in a row now. Why are Konami and EA so unable to make something decent for single player football fans?
1. Running with my AMF, CF is with last defender. I try a through ball, every time my CF pulls up, and looks around confused as the ball trickles into the space where he should be running.
2. One of my centre backs runs to wide open spaces towards the wings, leaving a huge gap in the middle. It's like the CPU forward has a 5 metre circle drawn around them, which my teammates will move out of so the nice through ball can be played to them.
3. I hit a pass to a teammate with the bar 3/4 full, it goes 1 inch. I hit another pass to a teammate with the bal 3/4 full, it flies out of bounds. This is on 1 pass assist.
4. I hit a cross to a wide open striker, easy headed goal. But, despite standing on the X, and hitting shoot as the ball comes in, the striker completely flops and misses. Alternatively, they try a super speedy bicycle kick.
It saddens me, but despite all the games promise, and good points, it is fundamentally flawed to the point where I just don't enjoy it. I'd say 1 in every 4 goals the CPU scores against me are geninely good, and I applaud them. The other 3 are me unable to player switch in time, the unstoppable cross or a free kick.
Yes, I realise against other humans its fun, but for a 1 player experience, it's another year of not playing football for me. That's 3 years in a row now. Why are Konami and EA so unable to make something decent for single player football fans?
for number one you need to do super cancel, it now works by doing rb and rt at the same time. For the others I think it depends on the players, there attributes and i would suggest zero passing assistance..
kgx2thez
League 2
- 11 June 2010
100% agree. There are times when you are outgunned and you just have to grind out a draw or narrow defeat.
Barca bought Sanchez not only for cover(fear of Pedro running himself into the ground & more pace than Villa) but for his ability on the counter. Same with Cesc who isn't a speed merchant but has more pace than Xavi. When those 2 were in the lineup Barca was playing faster than usual. That's not saying they won't knock it around for a while but you have to respect them when they break.
sincover
Championship
- 16 August 2010
I'm pretty much in the same boat. I've edited some teams to see how they play but no matter how drastic the changes made to their tactics, the CPU plays almost exactly the same (when attacking).
I changed Swansea's tactics to play a very open, flowing passing game and watched two 30min matches, but they almost never used the midfield! Very little time was spent passing in the middle of the pitch. Most times the midfielders did that stupid 'square off' animation and ran right to the edge of the box OR they passed it to the wingers.
Granted I am no tactical genius (like my friend Klash) so I'm going to wait for some proper tactics changes and stats before final judgement. As it stands now, I think PES is a local multiplayer only game for me.
gomito#10 said:
That worked well last year, but super cancel feels very sluggish now. I rarely use it on offense because of that.
Yep - same for me. When I super cancel it tends to stop my player dead, or they take about 10 feet to change momentum.
I love how we're forced to use something called 'super cancel' to break the rails of a game. It was kind of cute on PES on PS2. Less so now.
gerd
Retired Footballer
I've been fair to PEs2012gonnabegood opinions but his last post here seems to show the problem is him, not the game!
No, they are not crap. I said before anyone who expects them to be on FIFA's level is foolish! I know your referring that the animations are bad compared to FIFA. Yet you ignore, totally ignore that is all FIFA is about and the massive financial backing FIFA gets and puts into it's animations. PES dosen't have that. What they have now is good, could be substantially better but to say it's shit, is just plain foolish. Sorry, no other way to put it.
Now, people have been calling you a troll. i don't think you are necessarily a troll. More an insanity negative person, someone who full of so much fear in his life and anger he get's his kicks from being negative. You moaning for moaning sake! Either this or your actually struggling with the game and you Ego cannot take it. The ref's are fine in this game, the commentary is shit, then again, when has commentary ever been good in PES? Does this really need mentioning, i mean for the last 10 years we have been banging on at Konami to improve it.
I've been very fair to your points but your just moaning for the sake of it. You seem to be an attention seeker and you want credit for point out flaws. Thing is, you need to be reasonable with the flaws and properly point out ones and list them depending on what type of player it affects. You also need to get tot he bottom of every 'flaw' you see so you have an understanding if it's an actually game design problem or just you doing something wrong.
Look here:
I'm not angry even though this is highly fucking insulting to be politebut it shows that the premise for you moans are very empty for the most part. You haven't touched on anything which from what i've played is game breaking. You really don't understand anything about how the team individuality works!
Does most teams play the same way in PES 2012 at the moment? Yes? Why is this? Well if you actually looked at the team tactics and understood how they work. you can see pretty much every team has the EXACT SAME TEAM STYLE SETTINGS
So you may say, 'I'm trying to help'. I know you mean well technically but your not help because your ego is making you think you know the game inside out, when clearly you don't know hardly anything about this game! So you calling the game crap and unrealistic, yet you don't even know how the game works. So it's not really helping is it?
You request for sliders to be changed from 1-20 to 1-100 is laughable! It says it all about how little you know about this game. Not just that in PES 2010 this was the case but Konami realized that having 1-20 scale is just a powerful. Go to the PESCoach thread and JustPES threads and website and trying to understand how tactics work. So you can actually help rather than moan and cry broken with ignorence.
I don't like all the ratings either but I'm not too bothered since for the most part they are good and everyone has a different opinions on how good certain players are. also there's certain leagues paying more money that others so they get favorable ratings etc..
So while waiting for the DLC and patches which will bring out the individuality try and LEARN about the game, kill that ego of yours so at least you can criticize the game properly.
I honestly think you are as much biased as you claim he is. His post was actually a very good post. I don't agree with everything he says but there are some very good points in his post.
I strongly agree with a post of drekkard in the FIFA thread: although FIFA is a much more finished game, PES plays like real football. But in that same post Drekkard also says that PES is a game that is broken, that has many shortcomings.
I also think that PES desperately needs sliders, just like NBA2K (which is by far the best sports game available). With those sliders you can make a game that is a simulation but than can also be played by players like me who are not good at games but who still prefer a simulation over arcade (in football, because one of the best games ever -SSX- is pure arcade).
And then there is another point. You attack the poster (i can't remember his name exactly) because he says that all teams play similar. He is right. You say that he don't gets what PES is about because all the teams have exactly the same tactical settings. I think YOU don't get it. This is another fine example of Konami's extreme sloppyness. If i buy a game in a shop, then it is supposed to be finished. You imply that we should take the time to edit all these teams in order to have them play as realistic as possible. That is so wrong. Konami should do that. And either they haven't bothered or they have tried it and utterly failed. At the end it doesn't matter what happened, we have a right to a finished product with individuality in the game...that is the core of the product PES. That is exactly the reason why i still prefer PES to FIFA.
I think it's very unappropriate to criticize the poster for that very balanced and constructive post.
ccshopland
Premier League
- 4 January 2011
Yeah I think a few of you are onto something here with the tactics. And I think the CPU do react to what you have set too. For example, teams that look to play quick counter, I now set a defensive 4-5-1 formation and make them come onto me. I tried playing Man Utd on Top Player with my version of quick counter and it was like Benny Hill - end to end isn't the phrase.
What I want is build up play, with incision if that makes sense!
So I now understand that be altering your formation and slider settings has an effect on the CPU. But I still need to tinker with formations and settings for all teams on here. I may start today and edit the lot, from top to bottom.
Klash, are you doing teams this year like last year? Be great if you were.
I can then compare and contrast what I have to others on here.
Out of interest what would you class Man Utd as. I'm thinking of keeping them as counter attack, but reduce player support. In fact I'm thinking of reducing player support to a maximum of 10 for ALL teams and work from there, it seems THE ALAMO feeling comes from both CPU and player teams over-commitment of players. The AI is already smart in linking up play and getting players to join attacks, so anything more than ten will be crazy. What's your feelings anyone?
PS also agree with above poster though, this should be KONAMI's job not ours. I would have thought they would have some sort of sub team and categorise teams into say ten settings. Perhaps setting one would be for the teams like Arsenal and Barcelona. There wouldn't be many more on this setting. Then as you go down the settings you'd be getting teams closer to the long ball philosophy. It would take probably around a week or so to get near enough perfect settings that we could use for a base and tweak slightly at our convenience. I hope it's the KONAMI are lazy one though and not the KONAMI have tried it and failed one.
What I want is build up play, with incision if that makes sense!
So I now understand that be altering your formation and slider settings has an effect on the CPU. But I still need to tinker with formations and settings for all teams on here. I may start today and edit the lot, from top to bottom.
Klash, are you doing teams this year like last year? Be great if you were.
I can then compare and contrast what I have to others on here.
Out of interest what would you class Man Utd as. I'm thinking of keeping them as counter attack, but reduce player support. In fact I'm thinking of reducing player support to a maximum of 10 for ALL teams and work from there, it seems THE ALAMO feeling comes from both CPU and player teams over-commitment of players. The AI is already smart in linking up play and getting players to join attacks, so anything more than ten will be crazy. What's your feelings anyone?
PS also agree with above poster though, this should be KONAMI's job not ours. I would have thought they would have some sort of sub team and categorise teams into say ten settings. Perhaps setting one would be for the teams like Arsenal and Barcelona. There wouldn't be many more on this setting. Then as you go down the settings you'd be getting teams closer to the long ball philosophy. It would take probably around a week or so to get near enough perfect settings that we could use for a base and tweak slightly at our convenience. I hope it's the KONAMI are lazy one though and not the KONAMI have tried it and failed one.
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dandun_tomas
Non-League
- 23 September 2011
- FENERBAHÇE
I played through 2 whole seasons in master league, 1st on pro, 2nd on TP.
While I noticed during the first season where most of the PES 2nd Div teams to play senseless long pass football, on my second season in 1st Div, teams were playing in a much more sensible way.
When they set out to defend it is extremely difficult to break them, when they get a lead they play possession football, when they need to score they push their fullbacks up, leaving big gaps for me to exploit by quick through passes.
There are obvious shortcomings of this game but the more I play it I also notice depth, and it makes me want to play more.
While I noticed during the first season where most of the PES 2nd Div teams to play senseless long pass football, on my second season in 1st Div, teams were playing in a much more sensible way.
When they set out to defend it is extremely difficult to break them, when they get a lead they play possession football, when they need to score they push their fullbacks up, leaving big gaps for me to exploit by quick through passes.
There are obvious shortcomings of this game but the more I play it I also notice depth, and it makes me want to play more.
Ern Dog
Championship
- 23 October 2009
Now that we are all used to the game, is anyone else finding it incredibly easy? I very rarely get scored against now, it reminds of when in ML you would build your team up with top players and then go unbeaten through the season.
I even went and played as Rangers vs Bayern to see if Robben & Ribery would provide a challenge but there was none. The AI may be a little too good, they will close down on their own and you are left to either fill a gap or double up on the player in possession. Its very easy to cut out passing options because of this and when ever Robbery got on the ball I would box them in and then wait for my players to stick out a leg. They were no danger what so ever.
Because of the AI making space for itself to recieve the ball, I find that as long as you dont try anything too extravagant you can keep the ball all game. Its just a case of turning away from pressure or beating a man with R2 or the amazingly effective shot fake and waiting for a option.
Another thing is that when the stats reach around 80 the player in amazingly skilled in that area. Montenegro for Club America is far too good, he has 80 control, dribble, shooting & passing stats and even when in poor form he is unstoppable. He can recieve the ball into feet in the box, take a touch which glues the ball to his foot and then fire off a deadly accurate and powerful shot into the goal. And if he aint scoring he is providing assists with perfectly weighted passes.
Another CA player, the CF Vuoso has 70 something for shot accuracy and 80 for power and his shooting is like Adriano in PES 6, Its ridiculous.
I am still playing on professional though, but I dont fancy facing the instant reactions and other BS on top player but I guess I might have to. Hopefully the online part of the game is not horrendous this year and there is a challenge to be had there. Although It will get a bit boring facing Barca & Madrid in 4-0-6 formations after a while.
I even went and played as Rangers vs Bayern to see if Robben & Ribery would provide a challenge but there was none. The AI may be a little too good, they will close down on their own and you are left to either fill a gap or double up on the player in possession. Its very easy to cut out passing options because of this and when ever Robbery got on the ball I would box them in and then wait for my players to stick out a leg. They were no danger what so ever.
Because of the AI making space for itself to recieve the ball, I find that as long as you dont try anything too extravagant you can keep the ball all game. Its just a case of turning away from pressure or beating a man with R2 or the amazingly effective shot fake and waiting for a option.
Another thing is that when the stats reach around 80 the player in amazingly skilled in that area. Montenegro for Club America is far too good, he has 80 control, dribble, shooting & passing stats and even when in poor form he is unstoppable. He can recieve the ball into feet in the box, take a touch which glues the ball to his foot and then fire off a deadly accurate and powerful shot into the goal. And if he aint scoring he is providing assists with perfectly weighted passes.
Another CA player, the CF Vuoso has 70 something for shot accuracy and 80 for power and his shooting is like Adriano in PES 6, Its ridiculous.
I am still playing on professional though, but I dont fancy facing the instant reactions and other BS on top player but I guess I might have to. Hopefully the online part of the game is not horrendous this year and there is a challenge to be had there. Although It will get a bit boring facing Barca & Madrid in 4-0-6 formations after a while.
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Orange Gooner
Conference
It's so very sad isn't it? For years now I've been playing NBA2K and MLB The Show and it's just shocking how much better those games are. Those games show you don't have to choose between good AI or good graphics/animations, and that you don't have to choose between arcade or simulation. You can pick them up and start playing straight away and have a blast, or you can endlessly tweak your experience with sliders to play the game exactly the way you want to. And unlike EA and Konami, 2K and Sony actually deliver finished, polished games with little to no significant bugs.
Those games are a sports fans dream, and to be frank I'm sick and tired of having to choose from two flawed products to get my virtual footy fix. The world's most popular sport deserves better.
FIFA having sliders is definitely a step in the right direction though. However, Career Mode and Master League still don't come close to Association/Franchise mode in previously mentioned games.
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Enzo
International
I can tell you, PES2011 without Yair patch is crappy, with yair patch its very very good. Yair patch for PES2012 will make it much better than PES2011.
Enzo
International
I have to say for me BAL even on professional is difficult, 16 games 3 goals, 1 assist. On other hand maybe this is for better, im playing SS with 63* rating and 17 years old, i shouldnt be better than real world stars.
DarthKebab
Fully Assisted Noob
- 11 May 2008
Think the difficulty has been upped slightly since the patch, bottom of the league with 2 points from 7 games but got a last minute point at home to Man City after I literally bullied them with aerial balls in the second half.
You can pick at it's faults all day but for me this is giving the most satisfaction, annoyance and swear jar filling experience in 5 years on next gen consoles.
You can pick at it's faults all day but for me this is giving the most satisfaction, annoyance and swear jar filling experience in 5 years on next gen consoles.
pes2012gonbegood
Banned
- 16 August 2011
I agree with you, I noticed this aswell. Some stats are way too good in the low 80's already, shooting acc, dribble acc, passing acc, technique..
Ive noticed that the way they act and how accurate they are they are acting like pes 11 stats in the mid 90's
Ern Dog
Championship
- 23 October 2009
I think I am going to have to get into basket ball because like you neither PES or FIFA are what I want in a football game in 2011. We need a third contentender, if the media wernt paid to hype FIFA up as being "footballing perfection" or whatever it is they are saying then maybe we would get one. The guys that make this highly praised NBA 2K game need to get on the forums and see that lots of people are unhappy with the football games we have and then go and make one. I guess licensing would be a big issue though. Maybe someone needs to do a Minecraft, make a indy game with terrible graphics that plays amazingly well. I would play a football game with PS1 graphics if it played well enough.
+1
Suuuuupertalk
International
- 17 August 2010
- Luton Town
I agree on one point gerd makes about the need for Konami's customers having to edit teams themselves to get them to play differently. It's a major annoyance of mine. Fair play to those who want to take the time and improve their game by doing so, but I frankly don't have the time or inclination to spend £40 on a product and then spend a massive amount of time going through every team and editing them to change the gamelay.
If the customer needs to spend time altering the teams to change the fundamentals of a game, then the game has largely failed. Sliders, I would argue, are different, they are there to deliberately allow the user the opportunity to alter the way the game plays relatively quickly. Meticulously going through every team's core stats and altering them in a vain attempt at improving the AI, on the other hand, is a failure on behalf of the company making the game.
If the customer needs to spend time altering the teams to change the fundamentals of a game, then the game has largely failed. Sliders, I would argue, are different, they are there to deliberately allow the user the opportunity to alter the way the game plays relatively quickly. Meticulously going through every team's core stats and altering them in a vain attempt at improving the AI, on the other hand, is a failure on behalf of the company making the game.
Chimps-with-quiffs
Champions League
- 11 August 2003
Apparently last years option is upgraded totally to 2012, including any edited stats.
If this is the case, it could save me 2 months of work. That's if they same changes have the same effect with the new game play.
To the people saying they like using the patched game play files for the PC, you should try mine for the PS3 as I edit every player individually to get the best out of each team and player to try and get it as realistic as possible.
If this is the case, it could save me 2 months of work. That's if they same changes have the same effect with the new game play.
To the people saying they like using the patched game play files for the PC, you should try mine for the PS3 as I edit every player individually to get the best out of each team and player to try and get it as realistic as possible.
- Staff
- #10,168
And most likely getting it all reset with every DLC :/
I agree with you. I wonder why so few people ( only me ) react on your post. Are here so few Xbox-users?
I have the French/German version and it is very annoying to play with the second controller all the time.
Apart from that, there is also a problem with selection of the language.
It always uses French in stead of German ( which I understand better) at start-up, dispite saving ( exporting ) the profile-data.
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x_Totti_x
Non-League
- 6 August 2004
Any news on the DLC release date? 