PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

CalcioCalabrese said:
Running: it made more sense to me last year. If I held the sprint button I would get one speed and if I tapped it I would get the little knock on happening. I've tried that this year and it seems more random. The long knock on sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. And I can't work out when it uses bursts or when it doesn't lol.
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I assume you mean dribbling with the ball? Noticed that players with better dribbling skills/speed do this more naturally and easier compared to the average joe
 
CalcioCalabrese said:
Running: it made more sense to me last year. If I held the sprint button I would get one speed and if I tapped it I would get the little knock on happening. I've tried that this year and it seems more random. The long knock on sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. And I can't work out when it uses bursts or when it doesn't lol.
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I get what you mean there.. It's annoying me alot because I used this often in pes2011, it seems it only works if there's a good amount of space ahead of you. Tested it when I'm through on goal alone and it worked 100% of the time. Still seems stupid though that it only works in that scenario, I hope I'm wrong. :P
 
Román said:
Here's a highlights from a match me América vs Inter on Top Player, the game is amazing indeed, but i hope that konami fix a little more the keeper, just look at my goals, all from longshots. I think konami didn't put good stats to Libertadores teams's keepers. :CRY:
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I don't think the keepers are the problem anymore. In real life, no keeper would save those, except maybe that low shot from the right side.

The problem I think , is that the shot accuracy is too high. Even playing with Tottenham, I can get shots on target all the time from many angles. Headers are also too accurate.

In the end, this 2nd demo is much better than demo #1. I still think FIFA's trick system is better but PES 12 is overall the better game this year.
 
I felt the demo is quicker on 0 tbh. I've went -2 but it's more likely I'll be using -1 later. Good thing is, even on -2 everything is still responsive compared to 2011's.
 
Lami said:
I felt the demo is quicker on 0 tbh. I've went -2 but it's more likely I'll be using -1 later. Good thing is, even on -2 everything is still responsive compared to 2011's.
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I tried the demo on -1 for a game but hard to tell so far as I was watching Champion's League highlights last night :P

I will try in the next few days and see how it goes.

Has anyone noticed that sometimes the opposition does that weird clearance where the ball skews straight up in the air even though they kicked the ball under no pressure?
 
Xbox360 Demo 2. My demo stutters every once in a while during games. Anyone else having this issue?

And why are the graphics so crap on this version. PES11 graphics were far better than this year's graphics. Again, who the hell came up with the idea of making the nets so invisible on night games only. The pitch just looks like crap. Why can't they make the pitches luscious green as in some of the patched PC videos i've seen.
 
jflores said:
Xbox360 Demo 2. My demo stutters every once in a while during games. Anyone else having this issue?

And why are the graphics so crap on this version. PES11 graphics were far better than this year's graphics. Again, who the hell came up with the idea of making the nets so invisible on night games only. The pitch just looks like crap. Why can't they make the pitches luscious green as in some of the patched PC videos i've seen.
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I have that stutter on 360 also. Have been told it's a demo only issue because of the compression applied. Probably the same for the graphics. Although my pitch looks pretty good, even if the sharpness all round is a bit lacking.

Noticed it in particular when you go to pick the strips. Looks a tad duller than usual.
 
CalcioCalabrese said:
Did you think the cursor highlight was bright enough? I couldn't tell half the time lol
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Yep, can see it fine, although I see what you mean about the cursor, it's darker at the Allianz arena because of the shadow, try playing the Copa teams and see if you can see it better there, as it's open stadia so the pitch is brighter.

If not, Specsavers or lay off the Fosters mate ;)
 
After playing a few games, I think we could finally say goodbye to PES 6 gaming PES6 RIP

And according to Konami "According to your feedback on the first demo, we have worked on the following"

Where do we leave this feedback?

Club America Uniforms aka Kits are from last year and players from last season that where released or trade are still there, come on really is this so hard to change.

Here is some changes this Season

IN
2 Mexico DF Ismael Rodríguez (loan return from Querétaro)
5 Mexico DF Jesús Molina (from Tigres)
11 Ecuador FW Christian Benítez (from Santos)
15 USA DF Edgar Castillo (loan return from Puebla)
16 Mexico MF Isaac Acuña (loan return from Querétaro)
20 Mexico GK Leonín Pineda (loan return from Tijuana)
22 Mexico DF Paul Aguilar (from Pachuca)
26 Mexico MF Juan Carlos Medina (loan return from San Luis)

OUT
1 MEX GK Guillermo Ochoa (to Ajaccio)
9 MEX FW Enrique Esqueda (to Pachuca)
13 MEX MF Pável Pardo (to Chicago Fire)
16 MEX DF Diego Cervantes (on loan to Puebla)
27 MEX FW Tony López (on loan to Puebla)
-- MEX DF Guillermo Cerda (on loan to San Luis)
-- MEX DF Lampros Kontogiannis (to Tigres on loan)
-- MEX MF Juan Carlos Silva (to Pachuca)

Is Konami really that lazy....look Manchester United Kits are the same one's Club America are using this season as well just a few different brands and logos...really annoying
 
eL MaTaDoR said:
Club America Uniforms aka Kits are from last year and players from last season that where released or trade are still there, come on really is this so hard to change.

Here is some changes this Season

*info removed*

Is Konami really that lazy....look Manchester United Kits are the same one's Club America are using this season as well just a few different brands and logos...really annoying
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Is the Club America lineup old, even for the Copa Libetadores, when it happened? You have to remember the Copa Libetadores is the 2011 competition, so the squads are going to represent how they were in the competition at the time, not now. I expect they'll update Copa Teams in the DLC like they have done before.
 
Just tried the PES 2012 Demo 2 on PS3 after playing the WE Demo 2 mostly on PS3 and I got spanked 1-4 at home by Club America on......REGULAR :/ wtf? lol :|
 
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Simcut said:
Just tried the PES 2012 Demo 2 on PS3 after playing the WE Demo 2 mostly on PS3 and I got spanked 1-4 at home by Club America on......REGULAR :/ wtf? lol :|
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Too many Fosters' mate :SMUG:

But yeh - the AI is darn lethal haha.

:OT: but how many people are enjoying more time on the ball on the FIFA demo? I've only played a few games on that but it did seem less manic than usual. Although that friggin finesse shot is still as easy as ever :FAIL:
 
Simcut said:
Just tried the PES 2012 Demo 2 on PS3 after playing the WE Demo 2 mostly on PS3 and I got spanked 1-4 at home by Club America on......REGULAR :/ wtf? lol :|
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Which one do you like better Sim?

I think PES demo feels a tad faster, but not really sure. Overall it feels the same except for the speed. I'd say WE on 0 plays like -1 on PES 12 .

Some AI complaints, in the first demo i found that the CPU was doing more in possession, passing it back and forth more on their half etc.. trying to find the free man. Now, it's still there but less apparent.. seems a bit more rushed, or just maybe i really buffed up my gamestyle
 
love the demo, it plays so smooth,decent pace, just having hard time dealing with the new tackling system, the AI just seem to be smarter than you everytime you try to steal the ball off them even if you jockeying and waiting for the right moment to press x they just seem to better than you.The graphics are just awfull...I mean I cant describe its seem like the graphics are okay but the resolution is just awful...I dont understand konami current situation on this problem.

and that silly video when you start the game that last forever and no way to skip it is annoying =p
 
After playing 10 or so games of demo 2, I cannot agree with some here saying that this is the best PES ever.

While there is undoubtedly potential for a superb game with what they have here, a few things ruin it to a certain extent and put it more in the 'close, but no cigar' territory.

First major problem is defensive AI, particularly positioning. Defenders do not keep a flat line, no matter what settings you play with. They track opponents deep into their own half, making the defensive structure fragmented, and thereby too often creating unrealistic gaps and space for the PC AI to play with (And it actually goes both ways). As a result, you almost never see any offsides (I've seen one). It also leads to lots of 1v1 chances from nothing...just have your CF make a run, the D will track him the whole way back, making it a 1 on 1 (CF-CB), put in a through ball and more often than not you get a scoring chance.

The next issue is the overpowered dribbling, particularly star players with the speed merchant card. Play with Bale and you can run past and through an entire defense with ease, much like Fifa of old and PES2008. While there is more balance than demo 1 for average players, the superstars are just too good. Add to the fact that there is more error built into passing and that passes generally move slower, the game rewards direct dribbling rather than creative build up play. With it also being more difficult to tackle players and with referees calling more fouls, there is no doubt in my mind that online/multi games will be dribble-fests.

Other smaller issues, like super potent FKs, so-so Gks, slow reaction times and relatively poor agility of players without the ball (seems like players are faster and more agile with the ball than without), players lifting their feet rather than blocking weak passes... are things I can live with. But the above two points really take the realism out of the game.

And its a shame really, cause Konami have been on the right track for 2011 and 2012. Oh well, like every other year....maybe next time they'll get it right.
 
Master Kush said:
After playing 10 or so games of demo 2, I cannot agree with some here saying that this is the best PES ever.

While there is undoubtedly potential for a superb game with what they have here, a few things ruin it to a certain extent and put it more in the 'close, but no cigar' territory.

First major problem is defensive AI, particularly positioning. Defenders do not keep a flat line, no matter what settings you play with. They track opponents deep into their own half, making the defensive structure fragmented, and thereby too often creating unrealistic gaps and space for the PC AI to play with (And it actually goes both ways). As a result, you almost never see any offsides (I've seen one). It also leads to lots of 1v1 chances from nothing...just have your CF make a run, the D will track him the whole way back, making it a 1 on 1 (CF-CB), put in a through ball and more often than not you get a scoring chance.

The next issue is the overpowered dribbling, particularly star players with the speed merchant card. Play with Bale and you can run past and through an entire defense with ease, much like Fifa of old and PES2008. While there is more balance than demo 1 for average players, the superstars are just too good. Add to the fact that there is more error built into passing and that passes generally move slower, the game rewards direct dribbling rather than creative build up play. With it also being more difficult to tackle players and with referees calling more fouls, there is no doubt in my mind that online/multi games will be dribble-fests.

Other smaller issues, like super potent FKs, so-so Gks, slow reaction times and relatively poor agility of players without the ball (seems like players are faster and more agile with the ball than without), players lifting their feet rather than blocking weak passes... are things I can live with. But the above two points really take the realism out of the game.

And its a shame really, cause Konami have been on the right track for 2011 and 2012. Oh well, like every other year....maybe next time they'll get it right.
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I think the man mark settings (player/cpu) negate offside traps/high defensive line lack of fuckups causing those defensive players to track down 'attackers' when going through. For example my defenders barely do it because i won't allow them to do it, i'm almost sure i wouldn't even have to 'not allow' them if they didn't all have a fixed man mark (which cannot be turned off for some odd reason)
 
The defensive line I agree on - though I don't find it really wrecks me when I'm defending - it is a definite issue. Mainly it's the fullbacks not coming into line. To me, it seems that the game plays a zonal marking system but the players who don't have anyone to mark in their zones don't fall into line properly.

The other major issue with defensive AI at the moment is the way it deals with the 'Off-the-ball-control' runs - they seem to cover the run far too tightly, especially on set pieces, to the point where it could clearly be massively exploitative because you can completely break down the defensive line.

As for dribbling, I'm not that unhappy now. Feels a lot better balanced in demo 2 and while it could do with a tweak it's not a gamebreaker. So, to the question of whether this is the best PES ever - well, for me, it is. Not because it's flawless but because it's so much more advanced on many levels than PES 5 and 6 were (which must be what is being compared). PES5 and 6 were great, and for their time they are way beyond where 2012 is for its time - but assuming the major bugs are scratched out of 2012, it will be the best PES game ever, and the best football game ever.

I only wish that meant more.
 
Rodelero said:
The defensive line I agree on - though I don't find it really wrecks me when I'm defending - it is a definite issue. Mainly it's the fullbacks not coming into line. To me, it seems that the game plays a zonal marking system but the players who don't have anyone to mark in their zones don't fall into line properly.

The other major issue with defensive AI at the moment is the way it deals with the 'Off-the-ball-control' runs - they seem to cover the run far too tightly, especially on set pieces, to the point where it could clearly be massively exploitative because you can completely break down the defensive line.

As for dribbling, I'm not that unhappy now. Feels a lot better balanced in demo 2 and while it could do with a tweak it's not a gamebreaker. So, to the question of whether this is the best PES ever - well, for me, it is. Not because it's flawless but because it's so much more advanced on many levels than PES 5 and 6 were (which must be what is being compared). PES5 and 6 were great, and for their time they are way beyond where 2012 is for its time - but assuming the major bugs are scratched out of 2012, it will be the best PES game ever, and the best football game ever.

I only wish that meant more.
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The run tracking thing is pretty random, i've tried to abuse it.. but lots of times the cpu follows you and just drops half way. He shouldn't follow period i guess, but not exploitable i'm sure (i hope)
 
The thing is that you can do some really dodgy stuff with it. Like, on a goalkick if you move your guy into their penalty area, you can actually manipulate their entire defensive line. If not fixed online will be a disaster.

General appeal for thought: are blocks (the CPU making blocks) happening too often?
 
Rodelero said:
The thing is that you can do some really dodgy stuff with it. Like, on a goalkick if you move your guy into their penalty area, you can actually manipulate their entire defensive line. If not fixed online will be a disaster.

General appeal for thought: are blocks (the CPU making blocks) happening too often?
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Think it only works vs CPU if someone does it vs human, you can just walk away (if the AI would make the run for you)
 
Rodelero said:
The thing is that you can do some really dodgy stuff with it. Like, on a goalkick if you move your guy into their penalty area, you can actually manipulate their entire defensive line. If not fixed online will be a disaster.

General appeal for thought: are blocks (the CPU making blocks) happening too often?
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Getting a shot blocked? If that's what you mean then I'm finding it's happening quite often. Having said that, I'm liking some of the blocks and deflections this year.

One thing I haven't seen but saw in the first demo (on PC) was the CPU trying to engage you in a 1 v 1 battle by stepping on the ball and doing some stepovers or feints.

Maybe it's just the players in this demo but the CPU seems a bit too eager to move the ball on. But maybe I haven't played it enough.
 
Off the ball marking is really bad. I went down and stood next to the keeper on a freekick and the defender still kept me onside.

Seems like they have fixed an issue though with defenders as far as I can tell, and that is that you can't fool them as easily by faking to come short and then make deep run. You can only see this when playing fixed player.

Shots are better but still produce backspin 99% of the shots. Most shots feel the same to me, more spin variation would fix this. It's like when I saw the finish from Pato against Barcelona, can't replicate the look in PES and it makes me sad, all because of the spin on the ball not being affected by how the player strikes it. Sweeping upward motion in real life equals top spin, in PES it magically spins backwards :(

Don't you guys see how sexy freekicks are in PES, how great it look with the top spin? Imagine having that spin and arc on shots in gameplay too.

Pato top spin finish between legs of keeper: http://www.101greatgoals.com/videodisplay/alexandre-pato-barcelona-15403695/
 
Rodelero said:
The defensive line I agree on - though I don't find it really wrecks me when I'm defending - it is a definite issue. Mainly it's the fullbacks not coming into line. To me, it seems that the game plays a zonal marking system but the players who don't have anyone to mark in their zones don't fall into line properly.

The other major issue with defensive AI at the moment is the way it deals with the 'Off-the-ball-control' runs - they seem to cover the run far too tightly, especially on set pieces, to the point where it could clearly be massively exploitative because you can completely break down the defensive line.

As for dribbling, I'm not that unhappy now. Feels a lot better balanced in demo 2 and while it could do with a tweak it's not a gamebreaker. So, to the question of whether this is the best PES ever - well, for me, it is. Not because it's flawless but because it's so much more advanced on many levels than PES 5 and 6 were (which must be what is being compared). PES5 and 6 were great, and for their time they are way beyond where 2012 is for its time - but assuming the major bugs are scratched out of 2012, it will be the best PES game ever, and the best football game ever.

I only wish that meant more.
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I agree to a certain extent that it is more 'advanced' when compared to PES5/6 days, but that should be a given considering its been how many years now.

However, I am more concerned with the overall balance of the game. What I feel is missing is the feeling of joy or accomplishment when scoring a well crafted or realistic goal. I just don't feel it anymore. The problems I mentioned are essentially exploits that negate any chance of this feeling. Say back in earlier PES's, you wouldn't dream of trying to dribble past 3-4 players like you can now. And I know that it happens in real life but here it seems, with the right player, you can do it all the time.


Another point, does anyone else feel that technique is essentially a useless stat now since even clumsy DMs seem to have perfect and instant control every time?
 
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