- Thread starter
- #7,771
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
Speak for yourself. See LT's post. Also, he tends to have a history of it.
PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......
- Thread starter Jimmy G-Force
- Start date
Speak for yourself. See LT's post. Also, he tends to have a history of it.
danyjr
Banned
- 23 July 2010
Apparently you aren't either. Stuff like a CB beating a player with ease or crossing with their weaker foot to perfection, that would never ever happen in real football or old school PES. Now people like you try to turn things around by giving poor (I'm being polite here) explanation to existence of such deficiencies. No offence but you sound so so so biased in your arguments that sometimes I wonder whether you are biased in your views of the game per se or just plain stupid, but I'll exclude the latter out of argument because of your use of fancy words.
I could have already made an hour long video worth of dribbling with Vidić and Ferdinand making a fool of AC Milan players. Or them doing perfect ping-pong and/or flair passes and crosses. And what were you saying about faster reaction times have lead to slower game play? Do you even read what you write?
That weaker foot thing has always been buggy even more so in old skool PES. I think it's actually less apparent in this version.. then again maybe it's just me.
How do you play 30 mins Amier?
It feels better than PES 2011. If the guy is saying that it's too easy to cross with no error margin then yes absolutely. In previous games there was error and the ball could spin off your foot and go out but that doesn't happen now really. You can overhit it but that's about it. I'm not going to be overly critical about crossing though. They have made heading very contextual so it requires specific timing in order to achieve a good connection. So whilst the crossing may have little error margin, with any player and with any foot, the result is debatably fine if scoring remains difficult. For instance in PES 2011 i found it far too easy and unrewarding to score from crosses.
zeemeister
foxy engine
Congrats you just topped your last brain fart.....I know I am feeding you now as you like the attention but I find your perceived common sense mildly entertaining
- Thread starter
- #7,777
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
Make that video, we all want to see that. I dont believe a word of it.
danyjr
Banned
- 23 July 2010
That is exactly the problem. Back in the days when you had Beckham on the ball you would have thought about crossing instantly, while now you can whip in one with pretty much everyone. Making heading (as you put it) contextual is really a poor hotfix to the crossing issue and Seabass has shown he has no fear of doing so: instead of fixing the cause he tries to fix the outcome. Therefore what you get is not a simulation experience. Ever played racing games where your AI opponents speed up unrealistically when you're ahead, only to slow down unrealistically when you're trailing? I have, and they remind me of Seabass.
_anderson
Retired Fanboy
Flair passes and crosses? What? 
mdma11
European Champions
- 23 April 2006
- Solo Milan
How is that now? The downfall of the game? Pretty big claim for someone who does not know how to play or defend.
How is it that we all ask for a more realistic game and yet the more real it gets, the more complaining people like to do. Tell me, at which real life game have you seen players actually not pass by the opponent when the opponent is running straight at him in full speed? Or how come all of a sudden professional players all of a sudden can't pass by the opponent who can't be smart when defending? Tried playing the "space between me and you" game?
Try it out, it will work. I beat top player 90% of the time. It has got to be YOU who can't get it right!
Is this the case for all skill levels of the game Jimmy?
Playing on top player would hopefully reduce the effectiveness of the trigger runs.
sincover
Championship
- 16 August 2010
Not trying to get involved in this spat but can you humour us? In reality Ferdinand/Vidic and any other high quality CB can skip past a player or two at times, their priority is to pass the ball and return to covering their zones. I haven't seen any CB in PES 2012 dribbling like Robinho or Neymar and there is also a clear difference between the dribble speed of a CB compared to a decent MF. A video would do well to explain your concerns.
Last edited:
- Thread starter
- #7,784
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
What I want to know is how the CB got to the byline to cross with his weaker foot.
Not sure of it's effectiveness on Top Player, I've been mainly playing Professional as I personally find it challenging playing with Penarol, also, I'm not sold on the balance of Top Player yet. Zee on the other hand, will have played it on Top Player, and he has echoed my views. So I guess it's still apparent there to.
danyjr
Banned
- 23 July 2010
Actually I can defend in PES. I am a defender IRL myself.
No shit.
It's funny how Jimmy Eat World doesn't believe it when I say I dribble with Nemenja or Ferdy, while you believe it and say it is fine. To conclude, yes, they can't dribble like Robinho or Neymar. But they are still good dribblers. See the problem? It is like simulating a Nissan Micra to go 150 mph (it can't and shouldn't), but because it can't beat a Ferrari it is fine. No it's not.
Last edited:
I didn't particularly mean Pes 2011 but rather (oldskool Pes as in ps2) as he was referring to i guess.
I do know that in Pes 6 for example crossing was sometimes (read a lot [better]) with weaker foot. Heck it was even better the lower the weak foot accuracy was. I still play it sometimes so that's not a legitimate argument imo..
Defenders could skip past players as well in old skool Pes (ps2) The way they feel is slightly different, i think they had some more weight to them. But that to me personally is still in the game just not as pronounced.
That 'ease' which is referred to has all to do with users playing with
+
otherwise you can't be dribbled 'easily'.. i've never had that happen once, only by the occasional random MF which i don't have problems with.The other way around is complete bollocks i think as in, dribbling AS that or those specific players and beating 2 or more so guys. I don't buy it til i see it
Maybe it's simply due to differentiating human playing styles. Who knows right..
Because i've read quite a few: "Gattuso skipped past 3 my players" which i find so hard to believe.. i find it quite humorous tbh with all do respect to 'their playing style'
What makes it even dumber is the fact that, when Gattuso has the ball I'm actually happy because he can't do shit so i try to cut off his passing options or 'best options' it's actually more of a win situation than a bad one
I try to emulate real life playing style instead of 'oh he can't dribble so lets knock him off the ball AS EASY AS POSSIBLE'
sincover
Championship
- 16 August 2010
So what's the issue then? You agree that they aren't nearly as agile or efficient when dribbling as Neymar/Robinho. It retains the sense of individuality without exaggeration.
If we use your analogy, PES 2011 was simulating a Nissan Altima as a Lada. PES 2012 is closer to reality.
Last edited:
I said 'a' downfall. Not the downfall to imply it is the major downfall holding the game back. I didn't realise i was on WENB all of a sudden where criticism of the game is blown out of all proportion. Something seems to have been lost in translation. You seem to think i'm complaining about the game being too hard on top player. I'm not. I'm complaining about the game having unrealistic qualities, in this instance the ability to dribble round opponents very easily with players that would usually never be able to do so. That in my opinion is a downfall. It's not gamebreaking. I'm not saying the game suffers tremendously because of it either.
Anyway really the issue is a case of close control. I don't know what happened on this forum but this was very much the topic of debate a week or so back but it seems to be controversial now and i don't know why. Obviously defenders can go around players in real life but they should struggle more with keeping the ball close to their feet because of their lesser dribbling ability than attacking midfielders or side midfielders for instance. Currently the only difference i see in close control is between Robinho/Ibra who have insane close control and then every other player who seems to have a really similar level of control whether it be defender or midfielder. I feel as comfortable trying to dribble with Vidic as i do with D. Fletcher. There's not enough difference there for my liking. I will extend kudos to Konami and say that Goalkeepers are incredibly poor at dribbling and you cannot take it round players easily with them at all, as they should be.
Last edited:
The biggest problem with defending, it's team defending. You are tracking say Anderson, then Rooney makes a run and Anderson uses the lob through ball, but because of the AI my CB keeps chasing Rooney instead of staying online with the rest of the defenders, playing Rooney onside. It's hard to do anything about that because, you can only control one player at a time, which is typically the guy tracking/defending Anderson.
Sometimes defenders track runs too deep, when all they needed to do was stay in line with the defensive line and the guy would have been offside. The CPU has scored quite a few goals on me because of that. That is my only gripe with defending. I do think dribbling could be toned down a bit, but it's certainly not game breaking, it's just sometimes the individuality that was so loud in PES 2011 is not as easy to catch, its a bit more generic.
Sometimes defenders track runs too deep, when all they needed to do was stay in line with the defensive line and the guy would have been offside. The CPU has scored quite a few goals on me because of that. That is my only gripe with defending. I do think dribbling could be toned down a bit, but it's certainly not game breaking, it's just sometimes the individuality that was so loud in PES 2011 is not as easy to catch, its a bit more generic.
It's funny how Jimmy Eat World doesn't believe it when I say I dribble with Nemenja or Ferdy, while you believe it and say it is fine. To conclude, yes, they can't dribble like Robinho or Neymar. But they are still good dribblers. See the problem? It is like simulating a Nissan Micra to go 150 mph (it can't and shouldn't), but because it can't beat a Ferrari it is fine. No it's not.[/QUOTE]
You see I just dont understand why you would want to start dribbling and beating players with the likes of Ferdinand,Vidic or whichever defender you care to name.
Yes,they may have too high a skill level in game,but I can't imagine a scenario where I would want to use such dribbling skill.
I can see a situation where it helps in getting out of trouble when under pressure but that applies in the real game where decent defenders can and do beat skilful attackers by dribbling.
Thats known as composure or even arrogance.
Surely as a defender you've done it yourself!
You see I just dont understand why you would want to start dribbling and beating players with the likes of Ferdinand,Vidic or whichever defender you care to name.
Yes,they may have too high a skill level in game,but I can't imagine a scenario where I would want to use such dribbling skill.
I can see a situation where it helps in getting out of trouble when under pressure but that applies in the real game where decent defenders can and do beat skilful attackers by dribbling.
Thats known as composure or even arrogance.
Surely as a defender you've done it yourself!
Try manual Offside trap via settings works pretty good
You see I just dont understand why you would want to start dribbling and beating players with the likes of Ferdinand,Vidic or whichever defender you care to name.
Yes,they may have too high a skill level in game,but I can't imagine a scenario where I would want to use such dribbling skill.
I can see a situation where it helps in getting out of trouble when under pressure but that applies in the real game where decent defenders can and do beat skilful attackers by dribbling.
Thats known as composure or even arrogance.
Surely as a defender you've done it yourself![/QUOTE]
zeemeister
foxy engine
That is a bad solution, just because a team isn't actively trying to play an offside trap as 'team strategy' it doesn't mean they'll keep on trying to chase defenders pass their defensive line.
It's not a big deal, but the defensive lines were better in PES 2011 in the organizational team aspect of it.
gerd
Retired Footballer
Jimmy, the last Brazilian national that really entertained me was the 1982 NT with Zico, Socrates, Toninho Cerezo, Falcao and Eder. All what followed bored me to death (but i'm prejudiced because i lover Argentinian football).
About cheating ai: it took me long to notice it, but the AI sometimes effectively cheats. I remember doing the Rhoda JC test a couple of years ago. i was playing a league with AZ67 and i had to play Rhoda. I had one of those days, dominating the game but never seeming able to score. And then Rhoda scored an absolute lucky goal...i kept on dominating, but to no avail. Rhoda had one more defelcted shot on goal...2-0. I decided to cheat and replayed the match: same result (of course the match was not identical). I can be very stubborn and swore to win the match. I gave up after 24 attempts, realising how ridiculous my "test" was...
I'm far from a world beater, i have played one online match were i got slaughtered (but IMO this was due to the lag that made the game unplayable). When i play ML i always play the highest difficulty and i regularly (but not always) win the CL with minnows clubs like Auxerre, Parma, Sochaux... I might not be a PES-god, but loosing 24 matches when absolutely dominating the opponents is not normal...i call that cheating. It does not disturbs me because this happens in real football and one is not supposed to replay matches...conclusion: i cheated, but so did the AI (that was PES2009 on PSP).
About cheating ai: it took me long to notice it, but the AI sometimes effectively cheats. I remember doing the Rhoda JC test a couple of years ago. i was playing a league with AZ67 and i had to play Rhoda. I had one of those days, dominating the game but never seeming able to score. And then Rhoda scored an absolute lucky goal...i kept on dominating, but to no avail. Rhoda had one more defelcted shot on goal...2-0. I decided to cheat and replayed the match: same result (of course the match was not identical). I can be very stubborn and swore to win the match. I gave up after 24 attempts, realising how ridiculous my "test" was...
I'm far from a world beater, i have played one online match were i got slaughtered (but IMO this was due to the lag that made the game unplayable). When i play ML i always play the highest difficulty and i regularly (but not always) win the CL with minnows clubs like Auxerre, Parma, Sochaux... I might not be a PES-god, but loosing 24 matches when absolutely dominating the opponents is not normal...i call that cheating. It does not disturbs me because this happens in real football and one is not supposed to replay matches...conclusion: i cheated, but so did the AI (that was PES2009 on PSP).
dannyfc2
Premiership
- 9 June 2009
It's really obnoxious how some of you will take any slight at the game as if it was an attack on your own family.
Replies such as 'OMG LEARN TO PLAY PROPERLY!!' or 'you're not doing it right!!!' are just childish and counter productive. No-one is saying PES 2012 is a poor game, or even worse than PES 2011, or that it's too hard or difficult to play....but that doesn't mean there aren't glaring issues for some of us and biting the head off anyone to bring them up is ridiculous....
'Well you shouldn't be dribbling with a CB' ISN'T a solution, trying to rectify lack of individuality by forcing your playing style depending on who youre controlling is senseless.
This, this, exactly this.
Replies such as 'OMG LEARN TO PLAY PROPERLY!!' or 'you're not doing it right!!!' are just childish and counter productive. No-one is saying PES 2012 is a poor game, or even worse than PES 2011, or that it's too hard or difficult to play....but that doesn't mean there aren't glaring issues for some of us and biting the head off anyone to bring them up is ridiculous....
'Well you shouldn't be dribbling with a CB' ISN'T a solution, trying to rectify lack of individuality by forcing your playing style depending on who youre controlling is senseless.
This, this, exactly this.
jflores
Diegoooooooool!
-I for one found PES11's collision better than the current demo. In fact, I hardly see any duels.
-Also, can someone point me to a vid that shows you how to sprint at full pelt while knocking the ball ahead a few yards. In the last PES, I would tap x 3 and the player would noticeably speed up. Is this still possible in the demo? I've tried it but the player seems to slow down and not continue on his sprint in open space towards goal.
-Also, can someone point me to a vid that shows you how to sprint at full pelt while knocking the ball ahead a few yards. In the last PES, I would tap x 3 and the player would noticeably speed up. Is this still possible in the demo? I've tried it but the player seems to slow down and not continue on his sprint in open space towards goal.