PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Very true Buzzy, I would love the odd wrongly called off-side, at the moment, even when your barely off it's flagged. This isnt right. We are not using laser-technology here.

And Rom, yeah, it is pure coincidence, but it works. I like it anyway. I'm one of these players that constantly debates ref's decisions in real-life, so these poor calls at present feel very realistic to me. I would like it programmed this way though, with relevant commentary.
 
Anything that causes talking points and controversy in football games is part of the fun so I'd love to see offside calls not given, blatant fouls not given and nothing challenges given - all in moderation of course.

As proJ3CHT said earlier, they should make diving more effective (just making it abundantly clear: I hate diving in real life but it's a part of modern football). At present it seems like a tacked-on feature with no real useful purpose. I'd like to see shirt pulling back - this would be a good time to dive and make it look convincing. I'd also like to be able to back into a defender and win a free kick, or as a defender climb all over an attacker.

As I said, these are all things that happen every match in real-life, like it or not.
 
I do miss the shirt pulling. Konami really do make some odd decisions over time.
 
Id prefer if diving was more a player card than you having the option to dive, for example tackling diver would more likely result in them making the most of it or even if the tackle missed the player then intentionally going over the leg.
 
YoungGun_UK said:
Id prefer if diving was more a player card than you having the option to dive, for example tackling diver would more likely result in them making the most of it or even if the tackle missed the player then intentionally going over the leg.
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I'd be happy with that myself but I'm sure the anti-scripting brigade would be opposed to it.

Player temperament is something that should be expanded on. For example a player with a 'hot' temperament could react badly to fouls, or go in too hard on other players.
 
Regarding having a "margin of error" for the officials then I am all for it but the absolute clear-cut decisions do need to be correct. Also giving people excuses is going to lead to some teen soap drama, guaranteed. I don't accept that sliding tackled are over used simply because you have to be clean for it to work as a tactic (even then you get called up on it). Sliding tackles are a part of football and they were a fantastic asset for me when I was starting MLO against the big teams, it allows you to break up play and buy you some time.

About the people moaning about PES 2011, all I can say is that I've stayed away from football games through this generation because none of them have been able to match what we had on the PS2. Fair enough the games today are more glossier but they lacked that bit of something special. PES 2011 is the first game that has shown a positive sign of things to come. Games are fun, usually close affairs that can be separated by a bit of magic - this is what they need to preserve for future games - forget the licenses or whatever, the game needs to grab you by the balls.
 
Controversial subjects things such as diving or the referee making the wrong decision is often spoken about. Alot of people would like see these things improved so they dont happen as frequenlty as they do now. England against Germany in the world cup obviously scored a goal but didn't receive it people afterwards felt like they've been robbed. Honestly how would anyone feel if something like this happened in the game?

Also making diving more effective would only lead to people trying to use it to much to score a cheap penalty. Losing because someone got away with offside or because someone got a penalty for diving isnt fun. Not everything has to be as realistic as real life. It would simply ruin the game.
 
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Depends if you play purely to win or not. Personally I don't really care if I get robbed by a dive or offside goal. That's football. That's why we talk about it.
 
Improved technology on the field, camera's on the goal line or more officials alot dont like this part of football and would like to see different measures being takes to remove these things from the game. I dont necessary play to win I dont mind losing, But losing because someone scored a penalty kick by diving? The same would apply If I were to win, winning because I got lucky with a offside call Would feel like a cheap way to win a match. There's already heavy scripting when you play against the CPU adding random factors such as these would cause mass hysteria.
 
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I must confess that whenever i played against some people they felt aggrieved that they were awarded a foul for sliding directly into a player (as in if they were face to face). It's weird that in PES you will win the ball sliding in this way rather than take out the player but it does usually results in a foul being given which is the right decision IMO as it's a reckless way of slide tackling. It looks a bit strange because it does appear like you win the ball i'm sure if a player wouldn't attempt this in real life because you would never win the ball, the more likely scenario is that you'd just go flying into the other player maybe having touched the ball a bit.

Winning the ball through slide tackling is too easy as somebody mentioned, the stumble animation adds greatly to this because the opponent can no longer contest for the ball, but i kind of like the way that you get fouls awarded against you easily for . It's not fair a lot of the time either when you go in for a normal slide tackle and win the ball but in truth there's no need for the game to be a sliding fest (it kind of is) but the bad refs act as a natural deterrent to it as it is at the moment. If they alter the refs then they better alter the way that players slide in and the resulting action of the tackled player (i.e cut down drastically on stumbling when slightly touched).
 
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Jamezinho said:
Depends if you play purely to win or not. Personally I don't really care if I get robbed by a dive or offside goal. That's football. That's why we talk about it.
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Amen.

And Northzz, seriously, if you cant find football in PES 2011 there is something seriously, seriously wrong.
 
I'm for the offside thing if it's marginal but unless they bring back shirt pulling then i don't think diving should really work. If i had my way I wouldn't even call it diving, i'd call it having the ability to go down if a player is tugging at your shirt and therefore hindering your ability to move.

If they don't change the system then they need to stop definite yellows for dives anywhere on the pitch, just let play continue with the player on the floor FFS. It'd be much more seamless, unless say a player tried to dive in the penalty area or about 30 yards within goal where a freekick might lead to a goalscoring opportunity.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Amen.

And Northzz, seriously, if you cant find football in PES 2011 there is something seriously, seriously wrong.
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It wasn't a negative criticism of the game. I meant that i miss having a football game because i don't own PES anymore. I sold it because i live in a shared house and the internet is not good enough to play online and my house-mates wouldn't play because they just didn't really know how to play PES. Playing against the AI is alright but it is a less fulfilling experience in comparison to real people so i kind of got a bit bored.

If you saw my post a couple of days back about the game needing a training mode, then it was directly because of my situation. Unfortunately the aforementioned people struggled with PES because they aren't used to it so they just gave up (call it the FIFA effect if you will).
 
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Thought i would post this goal that the AI scored against me. It shows what the current AI is capable of when tweaked. the computer could score goals like this all day for me. really intellegent IMO, so come on konami give us this standard for 2012.BTW this was on pro level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjRDXfdWvLQ
 
buzzyhead said:
Thought i would post this goal that the AI scored against me. It shows what the current AI is capable of when tweaked. the computer could score goals like this all day for me. really intellegent IMO, so come on konami give us this standard for 2012.BTW this was on pro level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjRDXfdWvLQ
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the game needs to be that way without user - tweaked AI.
 
Northzzz said:
It wasn't a negative criticism of the game. I meant that i miss having a football game because i don't own PES anymore. I sold it because i live in a shared house and the internet is not good enough to play online and my house-mates wouldn't play because they just didn't really know how to play PES. Playing against the AI is alright but it is a less fulfilling experience in comparison to real people so i kind of got a bit bored.

If you saw my post a couple of days back about the game needing a training mode, then it was directly because of my situation. Unfortunately the aforementioned people struggled with PES because they aren't used to it so they just gave up (call it the FIFA effect if you will).
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Ah got you, fair enough. Apologies, I jumped to that conclusion based on a previous post of yours.

You can probably pick it up for £15 though, less than the price of a decent take-away, yet you can feast on the football for two lifetimes, arguably three. :)
 
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_anderson said:
Not really a discussion. It's just the way it is, he keeps the hype machine running! And tbh, since last year at least, he hasn't promised anything we didn't get afterwards in some way or another. But I shouldn't be talking, lol.
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Not disagreeing. I am very impressed with what he has achieved. His name is synonomous with PES, well at least on Evo-web.
 
buzzyhead said:
Thought i would post this goal that the AI scored against me. It shows what the current AI is capable of when tweaked. the computer could score goals like this all day for me. really intellegent IMO, so come on konami give us this standard for 2012.BTW this was on pro level.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjRDXfdWvLQ
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That's Newcastle though; hardly surprising when we have such class players. :SMUG:
 
zeemeister said:
wow buzz nice goal by the AI there. Is that a patched PC version?
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Yes Zee it is :))

MadbaLL said:
the game needs to be that way without user - tweaked AI.
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Yes, that was my point. Showing that it can already be achieved with tweaking the gameplay code, so konami need to sort it out for 2012,no more excuses now.

StuartCulli said:
That's Newcastle though; hardly surprising when we have such class players. :SMUG:
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Yes M8 very good game that was, finished 2-2 in the end :COOL:
 
Cant get the thought out of my head that the souped up tweaked game as it is
now will actually be better than PES2012.
Absolutely loving some of the goals that A1 now scores against me,it makes the game a real focused challenge.
Lets face it, they will have to dramatically improve things just to match
the improvements made by Yair & Jenkey this year.
It matters not though,if current game proves to be best than I will stick with it for another year.
 
If the improvements on PC are that good in relation to AI and physics, I hope that Yair and Jenkey are putting their suggestions forward to Konami along with video evidence of how the game has improved as a direct result.
 
This yair patch do you have to put it on Professional to work or something, because i've been testing it on World Class and it's just easy?
 
Are the ball physics improved for shooting? I mean, is there some curve to the placed shots and some dip to the trajectory? Or is just looks a bit nicer when you pass?

Also, how is the responsiveness of the power bar?
 
CalcioCalabrese said:
Are the ball physics improved for shooting? I mean, is there some curve to the placed shots and some dip to the trajectory? Or is just looks a bit nicer when you pass?

Also, how is the responsiveness of the power bar?
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Mad about curves, aint'cha ;)
 
LOL I am indeed. I'm sure i hit a shot with David Villa in the demo that swerved a fair bit just as it was reaching the post and it snuck inside about a metre off the ground.

Curves are good - Monica Belluci anyone ;)
 
CalcioCalabrese said:
LOL I am indeed. I'm sure i hit a shot with David Villa in the demo that swerved a fair bit just as it was reaching the post and it snuck inside about a metre off the ground.

Curves are good - Monica Belluci anyone ;)
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If you want curve in a Football game, boot up ISS2000 on PS2, or ISS 98 on N64. There was a dedicated curve button.

It had some advantages in that it gave more control to the player, but...

It allowed for some exploits though - "S" curves (one way, then back the other) and in some cases (from memory) you could add curve to passes to squeeze a bit more (or less) strength out of the pass. Also, with free kicks you can effect the ball movement after it has left the foot of the kicker - this could be a good (or bad) thing...
 
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