PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......
- Thread starter Jimmy G-Force
- Start date
yes i do, but tbh i dont expect those things to be fixed...at least they werent fixed in the last pes games where those bugs also happened a couple of times...Pfff... Do you know what demo means?
but all in all i like pes2012 so far, guess im already used in having those bugs
_anderson
Retired Fanboy
Uh, what's wrong with saying "people"? Means some do it, others don't. Those who do it, seem to ignore that it happens in every other game, specially highly dynamic sports games.
NBA2K has crazy tech (benchmark title for sports games really, everyone should look up to it) but I bet there's still the odd clipping occurrences here in there.
mfmaxpower
International
- 29 July 2010
Hmm, I'm not entirely sure that's true. My impression has been that for a lot of people who switched, interest in PES has increased again as a result of frustration over FIFA 11, not so much necessarily because PES 2011 or the 2012 demo has impressed. If FIFA 12 is as good as what the advanced previews indicate, and unless the PES 2012 full release is a substantial improvement over the demo, I seriously doubt you'll be seeing the change in preference you seem to be anticipating.
Once upon a time, PES was the only football game for me. I would love nothing more than for PES to give EA a real run for their money, like NBA 2K has done in basketball, but I just don't think Konami has it in them this console generation. I'd love to be proved wrong.
zeemeister
foxy engine
LOL. Life according to bob.
Actually in south africa there is a lot of interest from regular diehard SA Fifa players in PES. I run a PES league on a SA Playstation forum and after the demo I am anticipating a large number of people signing up for it because that is the feedback that I am getting. I could be off the mark and these guys are just getting caught up in the hype but I have never seen so much positivity coming from a pro Fifa community.
This game needs new engine, which will come with next generation of consoles I hope.
They are trying very hard every year, but its quite funny how they are adding every year new things on PES 2008 to create great game and they still fail, thats fact.
It almost looks like someone who has bought 10 years old Toyota car and he is tunning his car with lots of things to make Ferrari out of it, it simply wont work, and it wont work with PES.
Still lots of people here are playing blind and talking about greatest PES experience every year new version comes out and they re still talking about good old PES days, however its gone forget it.
I hope they wont mess up new engine on new generations of consoles and PES will gain its glory untill then this games still survives thx to nostalgy of old PES players because it fails to deliver great football experience every year.
It is almost same story as with NHL 2k, they were delivering good hockey simulation and completly destroying EAs NHL in terms of gameplay, then new generation of consoles came and they failed to create good engine and good online experience, where are they now ?
I hope they are preparing for Playstation 4 and XBox 720 , thats what japanese should do too.
They are trying very hard every year, but its quite funny how they are adding every year new things on PES 2008 to create great game and they still fail, thats fact.
It almost looks like someone who has bought 10 years old Toyota car and he is tunning his car with lots of things to make Ferrari out of it, it simply wont work, and it wont work with PES.
Still lots of people here are playing blind and talking about greatest PES experience every year new version comes out and they re still talking about good old PES days, however its gone forget it.
I hope they wont mess up new engine on new generations of consoles and PES will gain its glory untill then this games still survives thx to nostalgy of old PES players because it fails to deliver great football experience every year.
It is almost same story as with NHL 2k, they were delivering good hockey simulation and completly destroying EAs NHL in terms of gameplay, then new generation of consoles came and they failed to create good engine and good online experience, where are they now ?
I hope they are preparing for Playstation 4 and XBox 720 , thats what japanese should do too.
mr_man
League 1
- 20 October 2008
I don't get the Xbox 720 thing. 720 --> 360 * 2, that's gonna be the third Xbox. Besides, 720 and 1080 don't make sense.
Enneway...
Enneway...
mfmaxpower
International
- 29 July 2010
Laugh all you want but your guess is no better than mine. Like I said, i'd love nothing more than to be proved wrong.
- Thread starter
- #7,000
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
This game is a Masterpiece, if the retail code is infact better than this then it will be incredible.
I just played 2 games as Penarol v Santos, lost both 0 - 1 but they could not of been any different and this variety is one of the things that makes the game special.
First game I had loads of the first 11 in poor form, usually I would just play them but I decided to use the squad players(they are terrible). The match was 90 mins of defending and it was absolutley thrilling. I could not pass out of my half, I would begin to build up and bring my players out and as soon as things got a bit tight and I had to try a pass that wasnt straight forward I would lose the ball. My only goto player, Estoyanoff a tricky winger on the right, was never in the game and the times I caught his runs in behind my long ball over the top was woefully inacurrate. As a result I faced attack after attack and really had to concentrate on my player positioning using secondary pressure and the new right stick switching. They got through plenty of times but my keeper and some luck kept it at 0 - 0. At one point they mananged to break through and hit a shot which my defender blocked, it fell to another attacker who hit a shot at the post, this rebounded to another santos player who struck it on goal only for my keeper to save, this fell for another shot hit into the post and then I managed to clear it. This was the most manic moment I can recall playing a football game, totally unscripted and it filled me with a sense of urgency, impending doom, amazement, joy and relief that I imagine would accompany a similar situation in real life. In the end they knicked a goal, I thought I was going to hold on but after creating 16 chances to my 0 they deserved it and I was happy to lose.
Second game I only had Aguilar in poor form so I swapped him for Domingo, switched Estoyanoff to the left wing, put the usual left winger back as a WB and put Pacheo as a SS instead of having 2 CFs like the previous game. The difference was immediate. I created a chance in the first few mins which required the keeper to make a great save. The movement was now brilliant, Esoyanoff on the left kept coming deep for the ball, the original LMF now at side back was bombing forward at every chance which was letting Estoyanoff come inside and many times I caught him making a diagonal run infield. Pacheo was dropping deep for the ball and filling the hole between the 2 DMFs and the CF. With this movement, the passing ability of my 2 DMFs and Pacheo and the dribbling of Estoyanoff who I was now able to constantly pick out, I was able to pull Santos all over the place. I battered them in the first half and it seemed like everytime I went forward it would result in a chance on goal, but it remained 0 - 0. Second half was a bit more even and both keepers were superb, especially mine who pulled off atleast 3 saves that I swore were in. If the keepers were in the usual form I think the score would of been around 3 or 4 all. Towards the end my boys started to tire, turns were a bit heavier, passes were wayward and the movement seemed to dry up and this is where Santos began to edge me out. They dominated the last 10 mins and got a goal but again they deserved it, I gave them my best in the first half and they held out.
I can never remember playing the AI in PES and being happy losing games, but not only being happy that I was beat fair and square but actually really enjoying the games despite losing.
I'm all over this and hear you loud and clear. Pacheco is a God, Esoyanoff is a superb outlet, but trying playing Aguilar in CM or even AMF for even better results.
Also, the default RMF is better played at RB.
zeemeister
foxy engine
Ding, ding, ding
It took 235 pages and our little engine has made its traditional appearance
Personally I expect the quality of ps2 PES not a clone in next gen.
- Thread starter
- #7,003
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
Ding, ding, ding
It took 235 pages and our little engine has made its traditional appearance
Ern Dog
Championship
- 23 October 2009
I'm all over this and hear you loud and clear. Pacheco is a God, Esoyanoff is a superb outlet, but trying playing Aguilar in CM or even AMF for even better results.
Also, the default RMF is better played at RB.
I know! I tried it last night when my RB had a blue arrow. In the first game I played him(Corujo) at RB with Utrea as a RMF, he spent most of his time marking Neymar and would only advance further than the half way line if I played a ball for him to get onto, or if I had an extended period of possession around their box.
Second time I tried it, I put Pacheo as a AMF in the RMF position and this turned Corujo into Dani Alves!
The way the AI's movement reacts to who they are played with is amazing. From the early videos I had no idea how clever it would be, I thought it would be 90 mins of mindless running forward. I am very impressed with what they have done and apparently its even better in the newer codes!
You really need to be patient and move the ball around to see it in all lits glory though, if you just want to get to the goal with as little passing as possible you will miss most of it. I would imagine that is the reason why we have seen a few on here saying they havnt seen any of the movement shown in the videos.
Another thing I like is how players like the Penarol CF, Olivera, who have high response are very receptive to balls played into space. If I am a bit lost for ideas around the box I always know if he is facing the right way and the space is there I can get him on the ball this way.
One criticism I have though is that the CPU does not pressure enough around its box, I could hold onto the ball all day in this position. Although maybe its because I am still playing on professional.
Couldn't agree more on every single word.
Blindness is an issue actually, due to the lack of alternatives and due to the fact we have been served with this semi-shit for the last 5 years.
- Thread starter
- #7,006
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
I mentioned in an earlier post how I felt the individuality this year is that of subtle genius. I firmly stand by that. My initial reaction was that individuality had been massively diluted, infact, it's exactly the opposite. It's not as blatant from the outside, but delve deeper and there is so much more to it than ever before. The general misconception derives from the added responsiveness, which is merely a head-fuck illusion that becomes apparent after grasping a greater understanding.
The argument that defenders now have the same dribbling capabilities as an established winger are incorrect. There is an artistic licence in place that allows these wingers to have far greater success rate. Infact, even though defenders now feel more agile, they struggle with dribbling, first-touch, postioning, and all the very same passing inaccuracies in both speed and placement that they always have.
The movement is also massively relevant this year, great players are not judged solely on what they do when they have the ball, but also, what they do without it. The more established players now read the game so much better, become better options, their intelligence and reading of the game is so much more relevant than before. This is the Active A.I. and it's individual relevance as opposed to just the collective.
Playing with Penarol pretty much exclusively, has deepened my understanding of literally everything. Much in the very same way it has for you Tom. There is a hidden depth to this game that isnt obvious until you begin to understand the philosophy and scratch deep below the surface. It's an incredible experience that continues to enhance as the understanding and appreciation gains momentum.
Also, I witnessed the CPU keeper come right out of his box last night to intercept a ball over the top. He came to near the corner flag in anticipation. Normally, he would have instantly pumped the ball up field as I closed him down with my attacker. Instead, he dropped a shoulder, came inside, and rolled a pass to his CB to retain possession and build-up from that. Absolutely class that, so, so, so realistic.
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Suuuuupertalk
International
- 17 August 2010
- Luton Town
I've not had a great deal of time with the demo but I'm still being impressed so so much with the AI, it just smashed me 3-0 on Professional, all three of the goals from well constructed, considered moves including neat one touch passing in triangles before releasing a long range shot. It's so good.
I think more game time will see me agree with you Jimmy, there are so many facets to this game that I've yet to discover. One such thing is that although early with my experience of this game, I'm already realising how much it rewards you for playing as slow as you can. The game allows you time to stop on the ball (love the shielding that goes on when that happens), and more passes become open. As for the responsiveness, I think it again encourages you to play in a deliberately more subtle way. The initial temptation is to bomb players in every direction, but the sense of inertia is there if you let it come through. By this I mean that by using R2 a lot, and moving the stick in one direction quickly before taking your thumb off the stick altogether allows some amazingly tricky little dribbles between players. Rather than controlling the player with the direction stick constantly, allowing his inertia to carry him forwards without moving him yourself, then making tiny little directional chances seems to allow the ball carrier the time, momentum and balance to take those little touches past players or away from trouble. Hope that makes any sense at all!
I agree Jimmy the game does have an increase in dribbling success depending on the player. I tried it as an experiment with Ferdinand. Okay, at first he 'feels' almost as responsive, and did succeed in beating one man, but then he can still do that in real life. The problem came when this happened and he then found himself in even less space. He then got tackeld. Nani on the other hand was able to fend players off, keep the ball for longer, and was noticeably able to keep his balance and stumble through tackles. Knowing this before you play the game encourages you to utilise the correct players for what they do best, and that's something we've all wanted for football game realism.
Oh and an unrelated point, one that was a massive audio problem for me in PES2011, was the horribly loud 'thump' of the ball when you kicked it. Well, I've only just noticed this seems to have all but gone, it's far more muted and realistic sounding. It probably wasn't an issue for most people, but really got on my nerves!
So, add that to the fixed offside problem, the fixed dodgy ref collision detection, fixed player switching (which I think is brilliant, especially the FIFA style manual selecting with the right stick), fixed input lag, and the fact that every goal I've conceded so far has been from a well constructed goal rather than PES2011 where you'd often concede from a bizarre AI gaffe, and it seems like it's gonna be brilliant, literally an improvement over every problem I picked out from PES2011. Which is great. Can't wait to play the next demo
I think more game time will see me agree with you Jimmy, there are so many facets to this game that I've yet to discover. One such thing is that although early with my experience of this game, I'm already realising how much it rewards you for playing as slow as you can. The game allows you time to stop on the ball (love the shielding that goes on when that happens), and more passes become open. As for the responsiveness, I think it again encourages you to play in a deliberately more subtle way. The initial temptation is to bomb players in every direction, but the sense of inertia is there if you let it come through. By this I mean that by using R2 a lot, and moving the stick in one direction quickly before taking your thumb off the stick altogether allows some amazingly tricky little dribbles between players. Rather than controlling the player with the direction stick constantly, allowing his inertia to carry him forwards without moving him yourself, then making tiny little directional chances seems to allow the ball carrier the time, momentum and balance to take those little touches past players or away from trouble. Hope that makes any sense at all!
I agree Jimmy the game does have an increase in dribbling success depending on the player. I tried it as an experiment with Ferdinand. Okay, at first he 'feels' almost as responsive, and did succeed in beating one man, but then he can still do that in real life. The problem came when this happened and he then found himself in even less space. He then got tackeld. Nani on the other hand was able to fend players off, keep the ball for longer, and was noticeably able to keep his balance and stumble through tackles. Knowing this before you play the game encourages you to utilise the correct players for what they do best, and that's something we've all wanted for football game realism.
Oh and an unrelated point, one that was a massive audio problem for me in PES2011, was the horribly loud 'thump' of the ball when you kicked it. Well, I've only just noticed this seems to have all but gone, it's far more muted and realistic sounding. It probably wasn't an issue for most people, but really got on my nerves!
So, add that to the fixed offside problem, the fixed dodgy ref collision detection, fixed player switching (which I think is brilliant, especially the FIFA style manual selecting with the right stick), fixed input lag, and the fact that every goal I've conceded so far has been from a well constructed goal rather than PES2011 where you'd often concede from a bizarre AI gaffe, and it seems like it's gonna be brilliant, literally an improvement over every problem I picked out from PES2011. Which is great. Can't wait to play the next demo
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I dont mind a few clippings but in the demo they are gameplay related
In that fifa video yes u see clipping but atleast the player reacts
In the pes demo most of the time they dont react and thats gameplay related
Players make such sharp turn their legs cross eachother and its even noticable in long cam
Those things are really a gamebreaker in the long run hope they fix that
In pes2011 this was far better
- Thread starter
- #7,009
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
I've not had a great deal of time with the demo but I'm still being impressed so so much with the AI, it just smashed me 3-0 on Professional, all three of the goals from well constructed, considered moves including neat one touch passing in triangles before releasing a long range shot. It's so good.
I think more game time will see me agree with you Jimmy, there are so many facets to this game that I've yet to discover. One such thing is that although early with my experience of this game, I'm already realising how much it rewards you for playing as slow as you can. The game allows you time to stop on the ball (love the shielding that goes on when that happens), and more passes become open. As for the responsiveness, I think it again encourages you to play in a deliberately more subtle way. The initial temptation is to bomb players in every direction, but the sense of inertia is there if you let it come through. By this I mean that by using R2 a lot, and moving the stick in one direction quickly before taking your thumb off the stick altogether allows some amazingly tricky little dribbles between players. Rather than controlling the player with the direction stick constantly, allowing his inertia to carry him forwards without moving him yourself, then making tiny little directional chances seems to allow the ball carrier the time, momentum and balance to take those little touches past players or away from trouble. Hope that makes any sense at all!
I agree Jimmy the game does have an increase in dribbling success depending on the player. I tried it as an experiment with Ferdinand. Okay, at first he 'feels' almost as responsive, and did succeed in beating one man, but then he can still do that in real life. The problem came when this happened and he then found himself in even less space. He then got tackeld. Nani on the other hand was able to fend players off, keep the ball for longer, and was noticeably able to keep his balance and stumble through tackles. Knowing this before you play the game encourages you to utilise the correct players for what they do best, and that's something we've all wanted for football game realism.
Oh and an unrelated point, one that was a massive audio problem for me in PES2011, was the horribly loud 'thump' of the ball when you kicked it. Well, I've only just noticed this seems to have all but gone, it's far more muted and realistic sounding. It probably wasn't an issue for most people, but really got on my nerves!
So, add that to the fixed offside problem, the fixed dodgy ref collision detection, fixed player switching (which I think is brilliant, especially the FIFA style manual selecting with the right stick), fixed input lag, and the fact that every goal I've conceded so far has been from a well constructed goal rather than PES2011 where you'd often concede from a bizarre AI gaffe, and it seems like it's gonna be brilliant, literally an improvement over every problem I picked out from PES2011. Which is great. Can't wait to play the next demo
Exactly, and that is this years philosophy of which everything is structured around. The theories truly promote a far deeper expression of football and it's mechanics. Without the responsiveness, the game would revert to a much quicker tempo, as you would feel the urge to keep the ball moving at a much quicker pace to combat both the pressure and reaction times. This in turn then changes the landscape on how the game would need to be played. A different philosophy if you will, more akin to PES 2011.
It really does amaze me year-on-year how the philosophies change, and how we are forced to learn and understand the vision. It rarely becomes immediate, infact the the deepest variations always take the longest to grasp. I would say that was most evident with PES 5, PES 10, and this years offering.
Jamezinho
Golden Boot Winner
Hmmm......you must be reading different forums to me. Many FIFA fans are genuinely impressed with PES this year on it's own merit. It's nothing to do with their frustrations at FIFA. The two games always have appealed to different crowds - PES has always put the emphasis on the football, individuality and tactics, FIFA concentrates on the televisual experience and neglects the depth. The two games have always been this way and nothing has changed.
PES is evolving what it does so well and that's what has captured people this year.
It's not about PES giving EA a run for it's money - PES will never push FIFA for sales - it's more about public and media perception and PES getting back the respect it once had as the purist's choice. From what I've seen of the demo Konami and the reaction around the internet, Konami will do just that.
makky
League 1
Ok. This early code completely outclasses pes 2011.
There are obviously issues that are being looked at as we speak, but we have a proper football game back at last.
If the guys from WENB are to be believed then it looks like the final release, in terms of gameplay is going to be stunning, which is what we all want yeah?.
I personally cannot wait for demo 2 and the game itself. Looking forward to a winter incorporating long nights of football heaven, stacking up on the supplies and generally getting wasted while playing my favourite game.
Btw why is Top Player easier than Professional?. The goalkeepers are better on this setting too, truly pulling off some superb saves.
Really excited about this one. Just have a go on pes 2011 online, I can tell you it's laughable. The game and ball physics are all over the place and............... I could go on and on.
To all those who love a football game, let's get this party started because it's back make no mistake.
There are obviously issues that are being looked at as we speak, but we have a proper football game back at last.
If the guys from WENB are to be believed then it looks like the final release, in terms of gameplay is going to be stunning, which is what we all want yeah?.
I personally cannot wait for demo 2 and the game itself. Looking forward to a winter incorporating long nights of football heaven, stacking up on the supplies and generally getting wasted while playing my favourite game.
Btw why is Top Player easier than Professional?. The goalkeepers are better on this setting too, truly pulling off some superb saves.
Really excited about this one. Just have a go on pes 2011 online, I can tell you it's laughable. The game and ball physics are all over the place and............... I could go on and on.
To all those who love a football game, let's get this party started because it's back make no mistake.
Andy
Evoweb Jester/Stadboardmaker.
I have to agree.
Although player individuality isnt as pronounced as previous years it is still there. As Seabby said in the very first video they are concentrating this year on Team individuality and according to reports Barca play like Barca & stoke play like stoke.
What really matters with a videogame of football is getting the balance right between sim/arcade otherwise it just doesnt work. Like if you over simulate it it would become too difficult and not much fun,likewise with too much arcade you get something resembling 2008 but you have to inject some arcadiness into it to keep it fun. Even from the first game with the demo i could see that this game has lots of potential. But make no mistake Konami have Not sold out in making a truely decent game.
Sorry if i have drifted off the path slightly there but just thought i would get my two penneth in.
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Simcut
BF3 Addict
What's with all these people registered in August, they've all appeared out of nowhere :o
Just destroyed AC Milan 5-1 with Napoli on professionel level.
I think I have just "clicked" and I am able to play some great defensive and offensive football.This game is so subtle and varied, it's amazing.
Even despite the weak shooting, you still have pretty realistic trajectories.
The more I play it, the more I enjoy it
I think I have just "clicked" and I am able to play some great defensive and offensive football.This game is so subtle and varied, it's amazing.
Even despite the weak shooting, you still have pretty realistic trajectories.
The more I play it, the more I enjoy it
- Thread starter
- #7,016
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
There isnt any weak shooting, it's a myth, just hold down the power-bar alot more than PES 2011. I have hit shots with more venom than I could in PES 2011.
Great result by the way, now, the tough part will be to replicate it.
Great result by the way, now, the tough part will be to replicate it.
You're right Jimmy.Actually it is actually what I thought of without writing in my post.Powerful and aerial shots can be made thanks to holding the button longer.
This game is so realistic, the ball physics during shooting behaves 90% of the time like I'd expect it in real football.I can hardly beat Milan with all the other teams, Napoli plays in a way that renders Robinho and Ibrahimovic to nothing.Gargano is a monster in midfield, he recovers the ball so consistently
This game is so realistic, the ball physics during shooting behaves 90% of the time like I'd expect it in real football.I can hardly beat Milan with all the other teams, Napoli plays in a way that renders Robinho and Ibrahimovic to nothing.Gargano is a monster in midfield, he recovers the ball so consistently
makky
League 1
I won't be gone mate, been there from the beginning. J league, ISS, WE and PES all the way through. I'll admit i bought Fifa 11 took it back the next day and told them exactly why at the shop and they agreed with me. I'm just new to the forum that's all.
- Thread starter
- #7,019
Jimmy G-Force
Resident PES Fanman
Good.
Lavezzi is phenomenal as well Kouroux, I've scored some ridiculous goals with him, one from all of 35 yards into the far top corner. That was against Milan as well. I also scored a back-heel flick with Ibra. That looked sublime. Infact, I'll make a little Highlight video of what I have so far.
bluchampblogger
League 2
- 6 June 2009
Very impressed with the demo. Definitely brings back the vintage PES/WE memories. I have a feeling that the HDTVs have kinda ruined the gameplay experience in PES. Yes, the game looks gorgeous now but something from the old days is missing and I think that's due to the HD.
I found the solution and hence I have a good tip for you:
If you have an HDTV, turn the resolution down to 480p at a ratio of 4:3. Now run the demo and play it. It absolutely looks, feels and PLAYS like PES 3-5. The players don't look stupidly tall, they feel heavy and the game runs much more fluidly. Yeah, it will be in standard definition but you can reclaim the classic PES on PS3! Try it out and post your views.
I found the solution and hence I have a good tip for you:
If you have an HDTV, turn the resolution down to 480p at a ratio of 4:3. Now run the demo and play it. It absolutely looks, feels and PLAYS like PES 3-5. The players don't look stupidly tall, they feel heavy and the game runs much more fluidly. Yeah, it will be in standard definition but you can reclaim the classic PES on PS3! Try it out and post your views.
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