PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

zeemeister said:
Erm no! I do not.

I just dont want this system to change sorry if ou felt I was labelling you.

I was exilarated byy a 1-0 win and a few others with Porto and Napoli just by getting the defending right.

I tried to record one tackle where Robinho wanted to take on my defence but I held back noticing a team mate also close an angle to Ibrahimovic then from his blindside slid in and kicked the ball away from him. Of course he fell and through his hands up as my DMF mopped up the loose ball. This is football damnit.
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No probs. I'm so desperate to play that second demo now its crazy.
 
I find the defending absolutely fantastic, and by far and away the best inclusion in this years game. It really isn't that difficult to get to grips with, and I cannot wait to see it's impact upon online. The type who were hardest to play against in PES 2011 will get ripped apart if they don't adapt their style, all out in your face pressuring will get clinically punished.

I'm still disappointed by the individuality (lack of) aspect though. Jimmy, I'm surprised you're fine with it as I remember you lauding Konami's choice of really emphasizing poor dribblers in PES 2010. So far everyone just seems to merge into one identical technically flawless player.

The responsive turning times and the extent of assisted passing means you no longer have to consider who you're controlling. Sure, Robinho and Ibrahimovic are a step above at skinning defenders, but when it comes to pulling off cross-field balls or taking it round someone it can just as easily be done with your avg. CB.

It's a really big issue for me and something that'll devalue the MLO experience. If you play it as a series of one off games it's majestic, and you get some really slick games of football. But in terms of depth and variability, at the moment PES 2011 is superior in that respect for me.
 
Right. Ordered a wired 360 controller from Play so that I can play the demo on the PC. Play aren't that quick usually, but I'm desperate for haste on this one. Bored of waiting.
 
dannyfc2 said:
I'm still disappointed by the individuality (lack of) aspect though. Jimmy, I'm surprised you're fine with it as I remember you lauding Konami's choice of really emphasizing poor dribblers in PES 2010. So far everyone just seems to merge into one identical technically flawless player.

The responsive turning times and the extent of assisted passing means you no longer have to consider who you're controlling. Sure, Robinho and Ibrahimovic are a step above at skinning defenders, but when it comes to pulling off cross-field balls or taking it round someone it can just as easily be done with your avg. CB.
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I do not find this at all when playing with penarol, the differences between players is very obvious. I did play with man u & napoli earlier and it did seem like all the players were perfect though. Giggs as a cmf was incredible, his taclking, passing, soohting, i scored from 30 yards withhim from a first time struck shot withhis right foot! I will only be using teams that have players rated around 70unless konami reallydial the stats down.
 
I dunno, I just played a game with Lucarelli upfront, your archetypal limited target man. In PES 2011 I'd have to make sure to take a touch then lay it off as quickly as possible. In this game I could use him as any other CF, blending seamlessly in with Cavani.
 
Just played one of the most amazing games except the AI ruined it again for me. I scored two long shots and controlled the whole game and possession but the AI decided to score two cheap pass-early cross-blind shot goals!:COAT:
 
dannyfc2 said:
I'm still disappointed by the individuality (lack of) aspect though. Jimmy, I'm surprised you're fine with it as I remember you lauding Konami's choice of really emphasizing poor dribblers in PES 2010. So far everyone just seems to merge into one identical technically flawless player.
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I've suprised myself Dan, and it took time get my head around it, but now I'm more than comfortable. And the reason, is I'm looking at the bigger picture and the philosophy of it. This new defending system, and the ability to beat a man with subtle movements requires that little more response for both the defence and attack. The subtle movements work both ways, and I'm still seeing poor touches and differences between players. The more skill-full players can dribble and are also given artistic licence with regards a high percentage of not being dispossessd. It just means that all players are realistically mobile as all Pro Players should be if we flip the coin over and study that take.

Digging deeper to the core gives me alot of confidence, and it's only recently clicked. For the good of the cause and this years vision I think it was paramount to achieve what Seabass is setting out to do. It's a big risk though, but the added agility will offer so many new avenues to explore. It truly is an evolution this one, and the more I play the more I feel the individuality, just not in the same blatantly raw manner we could in previous versions.


After it clicked for the second time last night, all the remainding games for me were met with constant 'Wow's". The refs are making this game what it is, without them we would be screwed. This is what Seabass wanted last year, but I'm sure he pulled the demo Ref's last year because he wasnt 100% satisfied that the defensive system was completely stable and in place.

I expect the full retail to have toned down the agility for all players, this demo was to turn the heads of the Fifa crowd, I'm certain of that.
 
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Jimmy G-Force said:
I've suprised myself Dan, and it took time get my head around it...
but now I'm more than comfortable. And the reason, is I'm looking at the bigger picture and the philosophy of it. This new defending system, and the ability to beat a man with subtle movements requires that little more response for both the defence and attack. The subtle movements work both ways, and I'm still seeing poor touches and differences between players. The more skill-full players can dribble and are also given artistic licence with regards a high percentage of not being dispossessd. It just means that all players are realistically mobile as all Pro Players should be if we flip the coin over and study that take.

Digging deeper to the core gives me alot of confidence, and it's only recently clicked. For the good of the cause and this years vision I think it was paramount to achieve what Seabass is setting out to do. It's a big risk though, but the added agility will offer so many new avenues to explore. It truly is an evolution this one, and the more I play the more I feel the individuality, just not in the same blatantly raw manner we could in previous versions.


After it clicked for the second time last night, all the remainding games for me were met with constant 'Wow's". The refs are making this game what it is, without them we would be screwed. This is what Seabass wanted last year, but I'm sure he pulled the demo Ref's last year because he wasnt 100% satisfied that the defensive system was completely stable and in place.

I expect the full retail to have toned down the agility for all players, this demo was to turn the heads of the Fifa crowd, I'm certain of that.
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Although you can't deny, the "individuality" is more akin to Fifa than not. Especially if Konami will decide to introduce manual passing in a more profound manner, this year or the next.

It's not quite as extreme as PES 11, whether that is a good thing remains to be seen...
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
I've suprised myself Dan, and it took time get my head around it, but now I'm more than comfortable. And the reason, is I'm looking at the bigger picture and the philosophy of it. This new defending system, and the ability to beat a man with subtle movements requires that little more response for both the defence and attack. The subtle movements work both ways, and I'm still seeing poor touches and differences between players. The more skill-full players can dribble and are also given artistic licence with regards a high percentage of not being dispossessd. It just means that all players are realistically mobile as all Pro Players should be if we flip the coin over and study that take.

Digging deeper to the core gives me alot of confidence, and it's only recently clicked. For the good of the cause and this years vision I think it was paramount to achieve what Seabass is setting out to do. It's a big risk though, but the added agility will offer so many new avenues to explore. It truly is an evolution this one, and the more I play the more I feel the individuality, just not in the same blatantly raw manner we could in previous versions.


After it clicked for the second time last night, all the remainding games for me were met with constant 'Wow's". The refs are making this game what it is, without them we would be screwed. This is what Seabass wanted last year, but I'm sure he pulled the demo Ref's last year because he wasnt 100% satisfied that the defensive system was completely stable and in place.

I expect the full retail to have toned down the agility for all players, this demo was to turn the heads of the Fifa crowd, I'm certain of that.
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After playing some games in the PES 2012 demo I have to say I agree with most opinions in here. There's something very special around this game, it's very challenging and it is impredictable. And both seem to be the spirit of a good and solid soccer simulation. On the other hand I have to agree I was quite stunned by the lack of individuality this release seems to have. It is very alike playing FIFA but with a PES engine and for me it is a quite strange feeling as of yet.
It is not even the fact that players seem to be very equal to each other, I think the bigger issue is that you don't feel the weight of any player, no matter who you are controlling and that is something that I hated in FIFA and loved about PES.
I could even agree with Jimmy about the bigger picture thing about this PES, because at the end of the day I really think this game is a hell more fun to play and it really has moments of pure football recreation due to his fluidity, but I can't stop myself from thinking while playing that something is missing. It could be a demo issue, it could be a lack of familiarity and a resiliance to change but definitely we all are aware of a new game in here.
 
I understand where you're coming from Jimmy, it definitely requires learning the games little nuances and feel before you truly appreciate the differences between players. But off the bat it just ain't working for me, although in time that may well change.

I can't agree with the point about all Pro footballers being that agile, definitely not below the top tier and many cases within it as well. With the exception of the few elite teams, most defenders are nowhere as near comfortable on the ball either. I like wildly having to hoof it away to someone more adept at retaining possession, but in this I never feel any particular weaknesses in players, just strengths accentuated in others.

It's not just movement either, I raised the worry of the absence of the Passers card a while ago and I'm struggling to find anyone on the demo that can play those passes others can't. This may just be an issue with the assistance settings which I hear have been tweaked, but lofted through balls especially seem universally accurate.

At the minute I'm content with the game, I can clearly see I'll enjoy it no end, but I reckon ultimately it'll lack that weird connection we develop with players we use a lot. :II
 
dannyfc2 said:
At the minute I'm content with the game, I can clearly see I'll enjoy it no end, but I reckon ultimately it'll lack that weird connection we develop with players we use a lot. :II
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I think I have developed that connection with Porto players. ;)
 
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Tempted to download the PC demo and try it on the lowest details/resolution, doubt even then it would run :LOL:.

And btw, Lami is banned? :CONFUSE:
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
I've suprised myself Dan, and it took time get my head around it, but now I'm more than comfortable. And the reason, is I'm looking at the bigger picture and the philosophy of it. This new defending system, and the ability to beat a man with subtle movements requires that little more response for both the defence and attack. The subtle movements work both ways, and I'm still seeing poor touches and differences between players. The more skill-full players can dribble and are also given artistic licence with regards a high percentage of not being dispossessd. It just means that all players are realistically mobile as all Pro Players should be if we flip the coin over and study that take.

Digging deeper to the core gives me alot of confidence, and it's only recently clicked. For the good of the cause and this years vision I think it was paramount to achieve what Seabass is setting out to do. It's a big risk though, but the added agility will offer so many new avenues to explore. It truly is an evolution this one, and the more I play the more I feel the individuality, just not in the same blatantly raw manner we could in previous versions.


After it clicked for the second time last night, all the remainding games for me were met with constant 'Wow's". The refs are making this game what it is, without them we would be screwed. This is what Seabass wanted last year, but I'm sure he pulled the demo Ref's last year because he wasnt 100% satisfied that the defensive system was completely stable and in place.

I expect the full retail to have toned down the agility for all players, this demo was to turn the heads of the Fifa crowd, I'm certain of that.
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For me it hasn't clicked at all (yet?). For me it's a fun game but neither realistic nor challenging, it has some nostalgic feeling to it, but it's way too easy. Individuality has become so subtle as to be nearly irrelevant and control is so precise and immediate for movement, balltrapment, passing... everything that it has a strong arcade feeling to it.

The only challenging thing is defense but that is only because of the exaggerated control of dribbling granted for everyone and once one gets that tackling is a near-no-go it's not a problem anymore.

I really expected something completely different coming from a PES 2011 I liked because of the simulation-route it took, although the game was hindered by numerous bugs to achieve its goal. I hoped that PES 2012 would be PES 2011 without the bugs and with excellent AI on top, but it seems like Konami chose to go more arcade again, because many criticized PES 2011's simulation route as being boring.

PES 2012 might be fun, maybe even challenging for some, but imho it has lost some considerable depth. I hope it's just being a raw unfinished demo-code, but the interview by some netherlandish magazine hints otherwise.
 
henrys hand said:
For me it hasn't clicked at all (yet?). For me it's a fun game but neither realistic nor challenging, it has some nostalgic feeling to it, but it's way too easy. Individuality has become so subtle as to be nearly irrelevant and control is so precise and immediate for movement, balltrapment, passing... everything that it has a strong arcade feeling to it.

The only challenging thing is defense but that is only because of the exaggerated control of dribbling granted for everyone and once one gets that tackling is a near-no-go it's not a problem anymore.

I really expected something completely different coming from a PES 2011 I liked because of the simulation-route it took, although the game was hindered by numerous bugs to achieve its goal. I hoped that PES 2012 would be PES 2011 without the bugs and with excellent AI on top, but it seems like Konami chose to go more arcade again, because many criticized PES 2011's simulation route as being boring.

PES 2012 might be fun, maybe even challenging for some, but imho it has lost some considerable depth. I hope it's just being a raw unfinished demo-code, but the interview by some netherlandish magazine hints otherwise.
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So sad to say this, but you are completely right. The game moved away from everything I liked about PES 2011.

I'm sad today, the game is really disappoiting. I'll be fine playing PES 2011 for one more year.
 
I think I've sorted my issue with the demo. I'd been typically playing against Napoli, figuring of the teams in the exhibition mode, they'd be the best to 'learn' against. Wrong.

Having now played against United and Porto, I can say that it's not the game that's broken, it's whatever the hell they've done to Napoli :) Lavezzi has scored 5/5 free kicks against me, and when they have the ball you cannot dispossess Hamsik and the mini-midfielder. Just ridiculous how overpowered they are.

Having now played against United and Porto, I can understand what people are so excited about. I can actually defend, though the trick is simply to not press anything but the left stick. I find if I use X or any L button I can't tackle very well, but if I just run near the player the ball pops out.

So my working theory is that this is another Seabass love of Serie A joke - make a great demo where no one can handle the utter power of Napoli
 
I think Konami need to listen a little less to the fans, even the "hardcore", as it messes up what their vision is. Everybody talks about having a game like PES 5 or 6, but those games aren't as good as people remember them. Although they were undoubtedly the best during that time and possibly for 1 or 2 years after, they aren't even close to the level of PES 2011. Still have my PS2 and decided to connect it to play PES 5 and it is miles behind PES 2011. Some aspects of it were good, but that is mostly little animations here and there and maybe some of the editing, but surely nothing gameplay wise.
 
It is time to move on from the old PS1/2 PES days.

And though many things have improved in video game technology and in PEs fundamentally the game has not been as enjoyable nor addictive as its predecessors for many and is not great game for its time.

Sure many things are better than old PES gams. But not simplistic fun which is what games are about. However its true the old games are very much obsolete in many ways now.
 
Guys, I have a question

Are there going to be available Special online tournaments?

I ask this because Sony Latin America has confirmed that a Latinoamerican Tournament will be held on October and the qualifier matches will be played Online, this Tournament is sponsored by Fox Sports Channel.

Are the Special Bundles that are coming to America will be available to the rest of the world, the bundles are, a blue PS3 console, an additional controller and the PES 2012 game, the other one is the PES 2012 game plus a controller.

http://translate.google.com.mx/tran...ystation-3-pro-evolution-soccer-2012/&act=url
 
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praying-mantis32 said:
I think Konami need to listen a little less to the fans, even the "hardcore", as it messes up what their vision is. Everybody talks about having a game like PES 5 or 6, but those games aren't as good as people remember them.
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No not true. I'd rather , and still do, play PES 5 and 6 over PES 11. In fact, they're just as good as people remember them because you can see how big the PES 6 fanbase is on evo-web.
 
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