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PES 2011 Discussion thread

It leaves massive gaps as well though for the counter. Set your tactics if for the counter if you find a team playing this way. It will help massively. Also place a winger wide for an easy option to build the counter.
 
Rob92 said:
How the fuck is this not offside?;

YouTube - PES 2011 - Offside not given

And no, nobody was playing him on off-screen... The goal stood!
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I'd say it's a cool realistic mistake were it not for the fact that it only ever seems to happen while resulting in a goal conceded. The game freaks out repeatedly and it ALWAYS benefits the AI in some way.

The game will run absolutely fine all match, then player cursor selection freaks out just as I'm running in on goal in the last minute, or it will freak out and let someone walk between a bunch of players I'm desperately trying to gain control of, always in front of goal, rarely in unimportant areas of the pitch.

As for the video, I've had this happen before, only ever AGAINST me though. On the flip side, I've take a long goal kick before and the whistle has instantly blown on the halfway line for offside against me.....

Oh, and the refs. Boy did Konami f*** this up big time, again. Last year the refs were incapable of awarding a penalty, this year they're seemingly programmed to call you up for lightly brushing an opponent, or making a perfect tackle, then the AI cynically scythes through the back of you from behind and the ref calls no foul.

Best one of all was when I scored a screamer from the outside of the box, and it was disallowed for a foul. Close inspection of the replay showed my player striking through the ball with the shot, then miles after the ball had already left the player's foot, an AI defender simply ran into my attacker's now outstretched foot.....it's a complete joke.
 
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LTFC said:
Oh, and the refs. Boy did Konami f*** this up big time, again. Last year the refs were incapable of awarding a penalty, this year they're seemingly programmed to call you up for lightly brushing an opponent, or making a perfect tackle, then the AI cynically scythes through the back of you from behind and the ref calls no foul.

Best one of all was when I scored a screamer from the outside of the box, and it was disallowed for a foul. Close inspection of the replay showed my player striking through the ball with the shot, then miles after the ball had already left the player's foot, an AI defender simply ran into my attacker's now outstretched foot.....it's a complete joke.
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Apart from Player switching, this is the single biggest f*** up and essential fix that needs to happen for PES12.
Ive had all the same things happen LTFC, the collision detection system in PES is totally flawed.
 
Gab_ said:
I realised I probably haven't used high through balls once. I only use manual lob passes instead, anyone else do this? Maybe it's because I come back from playing manual FIFA, because I used to use high through balls a lot before in PES. It's funny in a way since they forgot to program the AI to make high through balls too, they also only use lob passes, but not long for the player to run on, only directly to the player.
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I tend to use the manual lobbed pass more often than the chipped through ball. Holding R2 as well as L2 adds more elevation to the ball, making it suitable to use this way.

CalcioCalabrese said:
If you overhit the lobbed through ball your player will be running...and the ball win run...
straight to the keeper lol
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He means that when you play against the CPU, they NEVER use the chipped through ball, the only passes in the air they play are long balls directly to players or crosses...
 
**** me, I played a friendly tonight, don't know why considering I seem to rage at the game every time (lack of a decent football game I think!) and within 4 minutes the ref called me up for this 'foul' when I'm really close to the AI goal. Feel free to try and spot the foul. Ruined a genuine goalscoring chance.

YouTube - 080411 0460

The game then played a through ball beyond my defence. The replay showed the AI controlling my defender and just letting the AI striker wander through. I didn't gain control of the defender until after the guy has gone through with the ball, but check out how the game just lets him through. Crazy stuff.

YouTube - 080411 0461

Seriously, what is wrong with my copy of the game?!
 
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LTFC said:
Seriously, what is wrong with my copy of the game?!
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The last one is what I wrote about earlier. It doesn't update the AI's knowledge about who has the ball often enough. Or it is just some old cheating stuff... like the very mysterious CATCH_UP references in the exe file...hmmm...
 
Nothing is wrong with it LTFC, you just seem to focus soley on the odd niggles without appreciating everything the game does so very well. It's not an easy game to pick up and play either. You also need to play your percentages and you'll have alot more success. I'm bemused by your issues, I put it down to your constant switching between the two games. your never truly appreciating either. Which is a crying shame. One thing is for sure, if you want to get the best out of this PES, you need to put a hell of alot more hours in bud. Hopefully it will then click once and for all. :)

Maybe we can hook up for a few games online and see if that helps. I dont have the issues your having. Of course player switching isnt perfect, but you'll see it doesnt effect my game. Collision detection is very sloppy as well at times, but it certainly doesnt ruin my experience. I have far more to be elated about for that to even begin to be an issue.
 
It's sometimes pretty much unavoidable that the player switching will utterly ruin you. At least once a game I will have a glitch where all of my players will suddenly get ball-fear and will not move towards the ball for all the tea in china.

For all of PES 11's good, there is some stuff which just isn't right. Unless I'm missing something massive, the speed penalty is an absolute joke. I cannot actually get away from players for all the tea in china. Walcott is pretty fast off the ball but once he gets on it he's no different from Vidic whether I use the knock on or not.

I can quite easily pass players with some nice footwork, but if anything it's even worse than FIFA when it comes to artificially allowing them to catch up.
 
Semi-assisted switching and extensive use of super cancel (R1+R2+direction) significantly reduces the amount of defensive player switching issues.

It's not ideal, but it helps a lot! :)
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Nothing is wrong with it LTFC, you just seem to focus soley on the odd niggles without appreciating everything the game does so very well. It's not an easy game to pick up and play either. You also need to play your percentages and you'll have alot more success. I'm bemused by your issues, I put it down to your constant switching between the two games. your never truly appreciating either. Which is a crying shame. One thing is for sure, if you want to get the best out of this PES, you need to put a hell of alot more hours in bud. Hopefully it will then click once and for all. :)

Maybe we can hook up for a few games online and see if that helps. I dont have the issues your having. Of course player switching isnt perfect, but you'll see it doesnt effect my game. Collision detection is very sloppy as well at times, but it certainly doesnt ruin my experience. I have far more to be elated about for that to even begin to be an issue.
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True, I have focused on the niggles, screw it I may as well just focus on the positive aspects of the game :))
 
There are things we simply can't change bud, it's just a case of working around them as much as possible. As Rob quite rightly states. PES has always been like like this. It's just some versions have niggles that are far more damning than others. The day PES is niggle free will be the day I eat my Sombrero.....
 
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Fair point Jimmy :)

For a laugh though, I just had to upload this video. This is me committing the most cynical professional foul you'll ever see. Terry gets up, the ref only gives him a yellow card, then the AI blasts the penalty over the bar. LOOOOL. I was only playing the computer, and it still made me feel bad for a few seconds. The most blatant professional foul you'll ever see.

The lesson is, where the AI is concerned, cheating works ;)

YouTube - 100411 0464
 
The AI in this game is too stupid to notice the significance of a foul like that.

Just picked up the game again after about a month and put it right back down. Some may call it 'niggles', but to me they aren't at all. They are huge flaws that need to be addressed because they have severely crippled my enjoyment of the game.

It's like sitting down to eat the most delicious meal ever cooked but you keep finding flies or dead roaches in it every so often. I don't care about the overall quality of the dish, I'm not the type of person who finds dead insects in his food and quietly eats it anyway.
 
Haha that vid was funny as hell, however, if that was me through on goal and the a.i chopped me down like that and got a yellow or worse yet, a goal kick..

I'm pretty sure my pad would be driven through the wall, especially if i was losing!
 
I could spend hours writing about the niggles in PES. But this is nothing new, I have played the games since its PSone days as ISS Pro and you expect this from the game engine. Especially when playing Master League you have to endure periods where the game lets you do nothing.

The beauty of PES are the moments when you can play some fantastic football. Just like in the real game it is impossible to play like this all the time. The niggles on PES are an issue but equally they make the game, if you could play fantastic all the time it'd soon lose its appeal.
 
Rant about online

So is there some kind of trick to finding a game online without waiting forever for the other to accept (which he never does) or not being kicked from the match room?

I don't even really care about playing online, i just want to see how my new Internet connection reacts to a dastardly game such as PES. Chance seems to be a fine thing as i've been relentlessly trying for about 30 minutes now to get into a game. I got into one game, it lagged a bit, i won a freekick in the 5th minute and then it decimated the game tearing both me and my opponent away from it.

That said, that only really affects the technical side of actually finding a game. It hardly reaches as far to question why when you finally do find a match everybody plays on the terrible regular AI settings, with 4 open slots rather than 2 (i don't want to play with strangers on my team, especially with PES' switching problems) and with about the same 3/4 different teams if it isn't their created ML team with Messi, Cruyff, Ronaldo etc.

It's crazy to think that Konami have actually made a game that did work well online on the this generation of consoles (PES 6). Why the hell did they ever take out the ability to see the last 5 teams picked? Are Konami really going for the award of worst programming and functionality in an online game?

TLDR - Online sucks
 
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Just play quick matches or MLO, the match lobbies are only any good for friendlies or 2v2 :TU:.
 
I'm more frustrated I think because I'm crap at it, quite frankly. I've not put in the time really to explore it fully, the total lack of a tutorial from Konami has been a major factor. I've only just noticed that the dribble stick is really pressure sensitive, you can keep much tighter control of the ball barely tipping the stick, much like FIFA in fact.

I know a lot of people don't like them, but I'm really enjoying using some skills assigned to the right stick. I've gone for less 'flashy' skills and more functional ones that might be used by a wider range of players. It's working really well, seems to sometimes open up a bit more space by tricking not only the defender challenging, but those behind him too, which is cool.

I was wondering if anyone knows the answers, but I've read about the knuckleball shot, is this a load of rubbish or a legitimate skill you can learn? I've checked tutorials on youtube, but to be fair I've not been able to do it.
 
I assumed match lobbies would allow me to specify the kind of game i wanted (i.e 15 minute match with Top Player AI and no ML teams) but it really doesn't. I'll try quick match. Anyway it worked. Aston Villa (me after picking first) v Real Madrid. The regular AI makes the game unplayable, it really does. I mean the lag didn't help either but i feel like a big 'sort your game out FFS' being directed at Konami from my end is in order.

I was one of the more patient followers of this game but 7 months after the release i have absolutely no idea what first appealed to me upon release. It feels more and more like a lot of people are at the end of their tethers with this game, judging by comments over the past couple of weeks, and i feel as if i definitely fit into that category now.
 
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LTFC said:
I'm more frustrated I think because I'm crap at it, quite frankly. I've not put in the time really to explore it fully, the total lack of a tutorial from Konami has been a major factor. I've only just noticed that the dribble stick is really pressure sensitive, you can keep much tighter control of the ball barely tipping the stick, much like FIFA in fact.

I know a lot of people don't like them, but I'm really enjoying using some skills assigned to the right stick. I've gone for less 'flashy' skills and more functional ones that might be used by a wider range of players. It's working really well, seems to sometimes open up a bit more space by tricking not only the defender challenging, but those behind him too, which is cool.

I was wondering if anyone knows the answers, but I've read about the knuckleball shot, is this a load of rubbish or a legitimate skill you can learn? I've checked tutorials on youtube, but to be fair I've not been able to do it.
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You hit the nail in the head there for me LT, most of the frustrations I have are always down to me if I'm honest with myself. When I rush things, make wrong decisions, dont play my percentages ( By this I mean not ensuring all the technical variables are in place. Such as not being completely aware of which foot I'm passing with, or trying to make 'Premiership Passes' when I would be better off laying off a short simple ball and building up play. Also, lacking composure, trying to complete passes when my angles are wrong, or body posture isnt correct. The biggest is using through-ball when a simple press of X is the better option. So many factors that dictate how well my play is, or isnt.

This is what Konami do so very, very well in mimicing the real game. In real-life on the pitch, a footballers best performaces always require everything I have just mentioned in order produce a great consistent display on the park. Then add confidence to that list, and again, when your playing well in PES, your confidence is high, and if your good enough, and it all clicks, you can become almost unplayable.

The dribbling system in PES is so ridiculously complex that it requires a level of skill that very few if any can reach. It's almost impossible to master. But, if you get all those subtle touches right, what you can achieve is beyond stunning. Very slight movements of the pad/stick with relevance to direction and R2 can produce magical results with the right players. I've only pulled this off a couple of times, and one occasion the other night I got everything perfect and ending up scoring from the dribble with Nene. I saved that goal, and although it didnt look blatantly obvious, the quick movements of the stick that produced two seperate body-swerves, a drop of the shoulder with a change of direction were phenonmenal. It took out 3-4 defenders within a 10 yard radius. I meant every movement and got every touch spot-on. These instances are so very few and far between due to the highly complex nature of the system. Which for me, truly captures the technical skill required in real-life. Body balance, the shifting of weight, and two great feet being essential.

I use the Right Stick and L1 for preset feints, but only the subtle ones that give me the change of direction I need in small space. They work very well and buy you that second. They need to be peformed at the right time though, and when the situation is relevant.

As for the Knuckleball, I've never even attempted one to be honest. I have never played with a team that has a player that can pull it off. Im sure it's only possible with a certain Freekick stance, and I know Drogba and Ronaldo have that stance, but I'm not sure which other players possess it.
 
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I agree.

With PES 2011, you really do have "those days" at either end of the spectrum.

Yesterday, I couldn't hit a barn door, couldn't beat a man, couldn't build up play properly as well as scoring shitloads of own goals and conceding very cheaply (plus the things Jimmy mentions)... Basically everything that could go wrong, did go wrong, I played crap.

One session last week though, everything I touched turned to gold - I was constantly turning defenders inside-out with Nene + R2, playing magical manual passes with Pires, banging in the goals with Keane, whipping in deadly crosses with Kranjcar... Also shutting out everyone, hardly putting a foot wrong in defence.
I even got a win streak of 10, which is my best in MLO so far, and as Jimmy says, I was pretty much "unplayable" - even D1 teams with the likes of Chiellini, Maicon, Ronaldo, Arshavin etc with win percentages well over 60% didn't stand a chance.

It's too easy to blame this on scripting, but as in real football, there are just those games where you're not "in the zone" and nothing comes naturally.
At my best, I don't even need to think about most of the aspects of my play, I just picture something in my mind, and it ends up playing itself out as intended.
On the other hand, when not playing well, every little thing needs a lot of effort and always seems "forced", at these times it's probably best to hang up your boots (or controller :P) for the night, it's not often you play yourself out of this rut (however, my spectacular Nene free kick posted in the MLO thread turned a game on it's head and triggered a 3-2 win from 2-0 down :)))).
 
Could you guys give me a tip ?

I like passing around my defence and build up my attack slowly. I don't pass like many people who hold down x button to make strong pass to attack or through ball to cristiano ronaldo to counter attack so easily, I like playing slowly.

But the thing is that even in my own defence i find myself very over pressured on unrealistic manner, the rb and lb are not very wide opened in both sides to get rid of this. I need to know how to play on my defence without loosing the ball by this stupid pressure.

WHy the hell my defeders make those stupid slow animations as soon as an attacker pressures them ? It's already too easy to pressure and get the ball back (mainly if you play with madrid), and it becomes a lot easier to steal the ball when defenders make those stupid slow animations.

Konami need to cut out those stupid slow animations and add auto shielding animations back (players need to use their armas a lot more) and balance stats. It would be nice to see some faults commited by pushing player. We need more faults and fair referees.

From Brazil.
Thanks.
 
Rob92 said:
I agree.

With PES 2011, you really do have "those days" at either end of the spectrum.

Yesterday, I couldn't hit a barn door, couldn't beat a man, couldn't build up play properly as well as scoring shitloads of own goals and conceding very cheaply (plus the things Jimmy mentions)... Basically everything that could go wrong, did go wrong, I played crap.

One session last week though, everything I touched turned to gold - I was constantly turning defenders inside-out with Nene + R2, playing magical manual passes with Pires, banging in the goals with Keane, whipping in deadly crosses with Kranjcar... Also shutting out everyone, hardly putting a foot wrong in defence.
I even got a win streak of 10, which is my best in MLO so far, and as Jimmy says, I was pretty much "unplayable" - even D1 teams with the likes of Chiellini, Maicon, Ronaldo, Arshavin etc with win percentages well over 60% didn't stand a chance.

It's too easy to blame this on scripting, but as in real football, there are just those games where you're not "in the zone" and nothing comes naturally.
At my best, I don't even need to think about most of the aspects of my play, I just picture something in my mind, and it ends up playing itself out as intended.
On the other hand, when not playing well, every little thing needs a lot of effort and always seems "forced", at these times it's probably best to hang up your boots (or controller :P) for the night, it's not often you play yourself out of this rut (however, my spectacular Nene free kick posted in the MLO thread turned a game on it's head and triggered a 3-2 win from 2-0 down :)))).
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Worth its weight in gold that Rob. 100% bang on the money.
 
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