PES 2011 Discussion thread

[TanMak]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

There was an article in OPM last year about Pro Baseball Spirits:

http://winningelevenblog.com/blog/opm-pes-saved-by-pbs/

The game was well received in Japan. The point of the article was to highlight the tech-sharing potential (or lack of) at Konami.

Well I was pointing out exactly how one studio under konami doing well doesn't mean much for another. But I would have known more with that source you posted, which I was requesting.

Also, Japanese market tastes don't necessarily translate well to other territories. Infact as someone stated earlier, a lot of their games are bereft of technological innovation.

Does it? Konami's promo material for PES2010 was fucking awful in my opinion.

I was discussing the actual graphical fidelity, the rest of the awful promo material was more akin to how it actually plays.

 

[Leo]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

There was an article in OPM last year about Pro Baseball Spirits:

http://winningelevenblog.com/blog/opm-pes-saved-by-pbs/

The game was well received in Japan. The point of the article was to highlight the tech-sharing potential (or lack of) at Konami

Hasn't that been one of PES problems though? That KONAMI, situated in Japan, has made a game that they feel is right and is well recieved by the Japanese (now I'm not sure, but PES is probably bigger than FIFA there still?) but not in the taste of us in the west? I'm sure Seabass has been talking about how the Europeans wants a slower game with more sim feeling to it and so on, whilst the Japanese might find that's how the game should be.

 

[Lons]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

KONAMI's love for Sony was their downfall:
In November 2005 EA made FIFA06 RTWC the first NG FIFA which was beyond crap. In comparison FIFA 10 is like EA made another engine BUT THEY DIDNT.
KONAMI made PES5 PS2

October 06 EA made FIFA 07 NG
KONAMI stuck in PES6 LG

October 07 EA made FIFA 08 NG THE THIRD NG FIFA
KONAMI made PES2008 the FIRST NG PES....a joke

October 08 EA made FIFA 09 NG FOURTH FIFA on NG consoles
KONAMI is on second PES 2009

EA had 2 years headstart because it didnt care about Sony....It made TWO failiures FIFA 06 RTWC and FIFA 07....And learned. KONAMI stubbornly waited for PS3 to be released....IF KONAMI was in synch with EA PES2008 would have been PES 2006 Xbox360....PES2009 would have been PES2007 and PES 2010 would have been PES2008...By now we would be on 5th PES NG its like we would be playing PES2012....in 2009...

The same what i said. KONAMI have problem with programming becasue for years they didn't inwest in next-gen era. Today they have BIG problem.......

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Hasn't that been one of PES problems though? That KONAMI, situated in Japan, has made a game that they feel is right and is well recieved by the Japanese (now I'm not sure, but PES is probably bigger than FIFA there still?) but not in the taste of us in the west? I'm sure Seabass has been talking about how the Europeans wants a slower game with more sim feeling to it and so on, whilst the Japanese might find that's how the game should be.

I agree it's a problem. Whether they like it or not, Konami's key market for PES is Europe. That's where the biggest and most passionate football market is and if they want to keep up with Fifa in sales then they have to focus on what the European gamers want. At the moment, bar a few PR offices, they are almost completely detached from Europe as their studios are based in Japan and staffed (as far as I'm aware) exclusively by people from Japan. Konami need a European studio, or at least some Europeans working with them in Japan for some fresh ideas. They need to focus their efforts on one global release of PES/WE (no seperate WE games and the subsequent mid-season editions), and try to recreate football the best they can.

I don't think Konami purposely try to create a game to appeal to the Japanese. It's not as if the game is quirky or off-the-wall like many Japanese games. It's more likely that Konami are just part of the wider problem affecting Japanese developers i.e. not keeping up with the latest tech and methods used by western developers. Japanese developers as a whole have been guilty of being insular on this generation of consoles.

 

[iluvnineties]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

I would be very happy if they have 360 deg. movement like FIFA 10 has and the freedom that FIFA 10 gives you along with FIFA 10 animations. The gameplay should be what PES/WE was always known for: realism and life-like.

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

There was an article in OPM last year about Pro Baseball Spirits:

http://winningelevenblog.com/blog/opm-pes-saved-by-pbs/

The game was well received in Japan. The point of the article was to highlight the tech-sharing potential (or lack of) at Konami.



Does it? Konami's promo material for PES2010 was fucking awful in my opinion.

PES/WE dominate Japan....Fifa doesnt appear even in top 40 sales charts....very sad because if KONAMI felt EAs boot in Japan it would take much more extreme measures....

 

[Lami]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

I agree it's a problem. Whether they like it or not, Konami's key market for PES is Europe. That's where the biggest and most passionate football market is and if they want to keep up with Fifa in sales then they have to focus on what the European gamers want. At the moment, bar a few PR offices, they are almost completely detached from Europe as their studios are based in Japan and staffed (as far as I'm aware) exclusively by people from Japan. Konami need a European studio, or at least some Europeans working with them in Japan for some fresh ideas. They need to focus their efforts on one global release of PES/WE (no seperate WE games and the subsequent mid-season editions), and try to recreate football the best they can.

I don't think Konami purposely try to create a game to appeal to the Japanese. It's not as if the game is quirky or off-the-wall like many Japanese games. It's more likely that Konami are just part of the wider problem affecting Japanese developers i.e. not keeping up with the latest tech and methods used by western developers. Japanese developers as a whole have been guilty of being insular on this generation of consoles.

But, the same PES/WE that were on the PS2 were made in Japan as well, without Western influence and they were great. I don't think its got anything to do with that really. I think its more of a case of moving onto current-gen for them. Its taking them quite a while. I'm still enjoying the polished PS2 version, but I'm yet to see how a fully current-gen PES/WE would be like.

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

But, the same PES/WE that were on the PS2 were made in Japan as well, without Western influence and they were great. I don't think its got anything to do with that really. I think its more of a case of moving onto current-gen for them. Its taking them quite a while. I'm still enjoying the polished PS2 version, but I'm yet to see how a fully current-gen PES/WE would be like.

It took EA 3 years to reach FIFA08 levels....KONAMI got late by loving SONY too much...Had they made PES2006 in NOv 05 for the Xbox launch like EA did they would have been in a much better position....
Sony took KONAMI with it in the grave...

 

[diogo27]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Konami began to see now that fans are no longer enjoying the PES, are still not willing to spend to make a decent patch, I hope that PES2011 is a mark of improvement, if not, it need not wait a year to solve problems , Make a decent patch, not that crap they are doing this year so far have not improved anything in the game, she should worry about those that generate profits and not just the $$$$$ itself ....

 

[Lami]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

It took EA 3 years to reach FIFA08 levels....KONAMI got late by loving SONY too much...Had they made PES2006 in NOv 05 for the Xbox launch like EA did they would have been in a much better position....
Sony took KONAMI with it in the grave...

What I think is, if PES was exclusive to Sony, they would have certainly been improved much better than what we have now. Sony would have given them a hand surely. I'm not against multiplatforming, but tbh I think it takes some of the concentration off developers when its better for them taking full advantage of the one console.

I'm not saying this is the definite issue, but I think it partly is. Imagine having all these developers in Konami WE/PES HQ being divided into different sections for the PS3, 360, PS2, Wii, etc. Instead, try having them all working for just one platform.

 

[Dusse]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

KONAMI's love for Sony was their downfall:
In November 2005 EA made FIFA06 RTWC the first NG FIFA which was beyond crap. In comparison FIFA 10 is like EA made another engine BUT THEY DIDNT.

YES; THEY DID!
"XCN : In what way did you use the extra capacity of next gen (360) other than just better graphics? and what is the single biggest enhancement over Fifa 06 you think?

Jamie Toghill : The main point of focus this year was to build a new gameplay engine from scratch. The things our new system does, you just couldn't do on the current generation of consoles. We've really taken full advantage of the Xbox360 technology and our game is truly next generation. We have no legacy code from our older games. So when you ask the question, what is the single biggest enhancement over FIFA06, it has to be gameplay, gameplay, gameplay!"

http://www.xboxgazette.com/interview_fifa07_en.php
http://www.planetxbox360.com/article_287/EA_Unveil_Next_Generation_FIFA
http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/11842/New-Features-for-FIFA-07/
http://news.ea.com/portal/site/ea/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&ndmConfigId=1013896&newsId=20060927005332&newsLang=en
http://www.xboxworld.com.au/news/ea-releases-brand-new-fifa-08-info.htm
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161468
http://www.xbox.com/en-GB/community/news/x06/fifa07.htm

Soo tired of that argument. Yes they did develop a new engine with no old code for the next generation. First used in FIFA07, and developed by another team while the old guys made FIFA06, so it was under development for at least two years before the first game.

 

[Chimps-with-quiffs]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

I really do think it is just a tweaked PES 08 which was an insult & if it just keeps getting tweaked instead of being reworked then it'll be dead in the water. It is not so much the evolution that is the problem but that it is evolving from a lemon.

We need a new start to build on marrying the series' past glory and modern technology.

That's really just my vien bursting gripe

cheers

This is all that it seems they have been doing for a few years. They tweak the game play each year and add a few new animations and some better graphics.

If you know what your doing, you can recreate each of the last years games by editing player stats.

Want more arcade like faster game play, easy - increase response, agility, dribble speed. Want slower game play, reduce these and short pass speed.

What they don't seem to realise, is even with the current engine, you can create a smooth fluid game where player ability is not defined by how much control you have over the player, but how much football ability they have if you increase the AI of the opposition and reduce the stats of any player who's ability makes the game unrealistic and unbalanced.

Most of the really fast players should have their speed slightly reduced. Players with speeds of above 92, when combined with high response will unbalance the game play as they will be able to turn and run into space every time they get the ball.

Same with short passing speed, this should be limited to a maximum of 85 and that should only be for the very best midfielders.

 

[diogo27]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

This is all that it seems they have been doing for a few years. They tweak the game play each year and add a few new animations and some better graphics.

If you know what your doing, you can recreate each of the last years games by editing player stats.

Want more arcade like faster game play, easy - increase response, agility, dribble speed. Want slower game play, reduce these and short pass speed.

What they don't seem to realise, is even with the current engine, you can create a smooth fluid game where player ability is not defined by how much control you have over the player, but how much football ability they have if you increase the AI of the opposition and reduce the stats of any player who's ability makes the game unrealistic and unbalanced.

Most of the really fast players should have their speed slightly reduced. Players with speeds of above 92, when combined with high response will unbalance the game play as they will be able to turn and run into space every time they get the ball.

Same with short passing speed, this should be limited to a maximum of 85 and that should only be for the very best midfielders.

Improving the AI defenders need not take the skill and speed of good players like messi cristiano ronaldo, they have skill, speed, just not any defender or midfielder who is silly to take their dribbling, still use other means to pull his shirt, played more harsh, the thing that konami does not exploit the game, have absences to yellow and red, could have more choices of combinations of buttons to the mark and not just x and [] could be x + [] To pull the shirt, x + l1 to make a mark with more aggression, tackle by the side of the body did not exist in the game ... sorry my english

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

YES; THEY DID!
"XCN : In what way did you use the extra capacity of next gen (360) other than just better graphics? and what is the single biggest enhancement over Fifa 06 you think?

Jamie Toghill : The main point of focus this year was to build a new gameplay engine from scratch. The things our new system does, you just couldn't do on the current generation of consoles. We've really taken full advantage of the Xbox360 technology and our game is truly next generation. We have no legacy code from our older games. So when you ask the question, what is the single biggest enhancement over FIFA06, it has to be gameplay, gameplay, gameplay!"

http://www.xboxgazette.com/interview_fifa07_en.php
http://www.planetxbox360.com/article_287/EA_Unveil_Next_Generation_FIFA
http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/11842/New-Features-for-FIFA-07/
http://news.ea.com/portal/site/ea/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&ndmConfigId=1013896&newsId=20060927005332&newsLang=en
http://www.xboxworld.com.au/news/ea-releases-brand-new-fifa-08-info.htm
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161468
http://www.xbox.com/en-GB/community/news/x06/fifa07.htm

Soo tired of that argument. Yes they did develop a new engine with no old code for the next generation. First used in FIFA07, and developed by another team while the old guys made FIFA06, so it was under development for at least two years before the first game.

Thats the engine's DEBUTE on NG consoles....Sorry to prove you wrong

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

What I think is, if PES was exclusive to Sony, they would have certainly been improved much better than what we have now. Sony would have given them a hand surely. I'm not against multiplatforming, but tbh I think it takes some of the concentration off developers when its better for them taking full advantage of the one console.

I'm not saying this is the definite issue, but I think it partly is. Imagine having all these developers in Konami WE/PES HQ being divided into different sections for the PS3, 360, PS2, Wii, etc. Instead, try having them all working for just one platform.

EA managed multiplatform...As do loads of companies best example:
2kSports NBA2k9/10 is a cross 3 platforms game....
KONAMI is simply too late to the party...

 

[Dusse]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Thats the engine's DEBUTE on NG consoles....Sorry to prove you wrong

No, it is not for gods sake. That was just a port of the old engine with new graphics.

"The future of football was unveiled today at the Leipzig Games Convention in Germany when Electronic Arts revealed the dynamic new engine that will debut in FIFA 07 on the Xbox 360 system and lead the franchise into the future."

"Wilson: We launched our new engine for FIFA 07 and that was the first year of a new engine. We saw a few things with the new engine that became the foundation for these new ideas.

We saw a different level of athletic ability in the player, so how the player moved and how they interacted with the ball. We also gave the ball its own level of physics. But we started to see the different levels of decision-making on the pitch with depth and context to what's happening.

The thing with writing artificial intelligence is that once you build the infrastructure you can start building on top of it. And year on year we can build more attributes on top of this.

The World Cup game didn't use that engine, it used an old engine. FIFA 07 was the first and 08 will be the second run of that engine. "

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161468

Happy to prove you wrong.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

What I think is, if PES was exclusive to Sony, they would have certainly been improved much better than what we have now. Sony would have given them a hand surely. I'm not against multiplatforming, but tbh I think it takes some of the concentration off developers when its better for them taking full advantage of the one console.

I'm not saying this is the definite issue, but I think it partly is. Imagine having all these developers in Konami WE/PES HQ being divided into different sections for the PS3, 360, PS2, Wii, etc. Instead, try having them all working for just one platform.

I totally agree, Lami. I would prefer PES to become a PS3 exclusive, which may seem an odd thing to say as I have a 360 and no PS3. PES is the one series that would make me buy a PS3. It would be in Sony's interest to sign-up PES as an exclusive, because even in it's current state the game is a big seller and still has a massive fanbase around the world.

I remember reading on wenb that the PS3 version of PES2010 has outsold the 360 version by something like 4-to-1. When it comes to PES the community is still deeply rooted on the Playstation. The amount of PS3 option files available compared to the handful available on the 360 is proof of this fact, as I see it. I'm not sure if it's worth Konami spending their precious time and resources on a series that is unloved on the 360.

Other factors:
- Option files are easier to apply which is essential for the editing community
- PS3 pad is better for sports games (imo)
- Xbox 360 has hit the wall technically. The PS3 is only now starting to show what it can do and is a more powerful platform.
- The future of PES should be on Blu-ray discs. DVDs are becoming stretched.

Konami should write-off the 360 and concentrate on the PS3. I think multi-format games will start to become restricted by the limitations of the 360, which will become increasingly apparent in the next year or two.

Not wishing to start a format war. Just my opinion, of course.

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

No, it is not for gods sake. That was just a port of the old engine with new graphics.

"The future of football was unveiled today at the Leipzig Games Convention in Germany when Electronic Arts revealed the dynamic new engine that will debut in FIFA 07 on the Xbox 360 system and lead the franchise into the future."

"Wilson: We launched our new engine for FIFA 07 and that was the first year of a new engine. We saw a few things with the new engine that became the foundation for these new ideas.

We saw a different level of athletic ability in the player, so how the player moved and how they interacted with the ball. We also gave the ball its own level of physics. But we started to see the different levels of decision-making on the pitch with depth and context to what's happening.

The thing with writing artificial intelligence is that once you build the infrastructure you can start building on top of it. And year on year we can build more attributes on top of this.

The World Cup game didn't use that engine, it used an old engine. FIFA 07 was the first and 08 will be the second run of that engine. "

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161468

Happy to prove you wrong.

I believe more to my eyes and the platform development than to PR bull....No matter how many fail smileys you put in your post....
Happy to prove you flashed by PR BS

 

[Niero]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

I totally agree, Lami. I would prefer PES to become a PS3 exclusive, which may seem an odd thing to say as I have a 360 and no PS3. PES is the one series that would make me buy a PS3. It would be in Sony's interest to sign-up PES as an exclusive, because even in it's current state the game is a big seller and still has a massive fanbase around the world.

I remember reading on wenb that the PS3 version of PES2010 has outsold the 360 version by something like 4-to-1. When it comes to PES the community is still deeply rooted on the Playstation. The amount of PS3 option files available compared to the handful available on the 360 is proof of this fact, as I see it. I'm not sure if it's worth Konami spending their precious time and resources on a series that is unloved on the 360.

Other factors:
- Option files are easier to apply which is essential for the editing community
- PS3 pad is better for sports games (imo)
- Xbox 360 has hit the wall technically. The PS3 is only now starting to show what it can do and is a more powerful platform.
- The future of PES should be on Blu-ray discs. DVDs are becoming stretched.

Konami should write-off the 360 and concentrate on the PS3. I think multi-format games will start to become restricted by the limitations of the 360, which will become increasingly apparent in the next year or two.

Not wishing to start a format war. Just my opinion, of course.

KONAMI made a huge mistake by putting loads of cash into MGS....If even half of that went to PES it would made 10 times the money...
FIFA has proved that Xbox360 can produce games that are technically impressive....GTA 4 and NBA 2k proved that as well...
Next Gen I hope KONAMI puts its money where the milked cow is aka PES.

 

[Lons]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

FIFA 06 next-gen = old engine but better graphics

PES 6 next-gen = old engine but better graphics

FIFA 07 next gen = new engine and better graphics

PES 2008 next gen = something between new and old engine and better graphics.

 

[DerleiPT]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Analog in xbox pad is much better and i dont think ps3 is more powerful platform than 360. wait for Alan Wake and Metro and we will see.Anyway ps3 exclusive games graphics is far behind Crisis PC and i am sure ps3 and 360 would be twice burned with Crisis on V.High details to be honest ,ps3/360 has hit the wall technically .Both consoles are technically similar.

 

[Lons]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Analog in xbox pad is much better and i dont think ps3 is more powerful platform than 360. wait for Alan Wake and Metro and we will see.Anyway ps3 exclusive games graphics is far behind Crisis PC and i am sure ps3 and 360 would be twice burned with Crisis on V.High details to be honest ,ps3/360 has hit the wall technically .Both consoles are technically similar.

I don't agree with you. Look for Uncharted 2, God of War III, Heavy Rain and Final Fantasy.

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Analog in xbox pad is much better and i dont think ps3 is more powerful platform than 360. wait for Alan Wake and Metro and we will see.Anyway ps3 exclusive games graphics is far behind Crisis PC and i am sure ps3 and 360 would be twice burned with Crisis on V.High details to be honest ,ps3/360 has hit the wall technically .Both consoles are technically similar.

The PS3 has far from hit the wall!

Developers are only just getting to grips with the machine after initial programming troubles, hence why many PS3 games have not been as good as their 360 counterparts. Once they learn how to maximise the potential of the PS3 it should really come into it's own, which is what we are beginning to see now with games like Uncharted 2. Remember, the 360 had a head start on the PS3, and is less powerful (not massively so, but it's a fact), so it will hit the wall first. Also, HD gaming really needs blu-ray if games are to become bigger and more deatiled, another problem for the 360.

Please, let's leave the PC aside. We all know a console is no comparison for a high end PC.

 

[Lami]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

So we went from PES v Fifa debate to Fifa old-gen v Fifa next-gen debtate in a PES thread? That's a first.



Anyway, the debates in here are all fine until now but lets keep it PES related, somehow

And no flaming whatever please.

EA managed multiplatform...As do loads of companies best example:
2kSports NBA2k9/10 is a cross 3 platforms game....
KONAMI is simply too late to the party...

I don't want them to only "manage". I want them to perfect it.

 

[bobfifalas]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Great discussion here guys, thanks. I wonder what japanese PES/WE community thinks, dicuss and what kind of influence they have on Konami, good or bad way. Any idea, ay japanese friends here?

 

[Lons]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Do you think guys that PES 2010 is on the same technical level as FIFA 08?

 

[klashman69]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

This is all that it seems they have been doing for a few years. They tweak the game play each year and add a few new animations and some better graphics.

If you know what your doing, you can recreate each of the last years games by editing player stats.

Want more arcade like faster game play, easy - increase response, agility, dribble speed. Want slower game play, reduce these and short pass speed.

What they don't seem to realise, is even with the current engine, you can create a smooth fluid game where player ability is not defined by how much control you have over the player, but how much football ability they have if you increase the AI of the opposition and reduce the stats of any player who's ability makes the game unrealistic and unbalanced.

Most of the really fast players should have their speed slightly reduced. Players with speeds of above 92, when combined with high response will unbalance the game play as they will be able to turn and run into space every time they get the ball.

Same with short passing speed, this should be limited to a maximum of 85 and that should only be for the very best midfielders.

Hmm you opened a interesting debate here , i've noticed heavily after playing with ono's gameplay global edits the game plays pretty much exactly like PES6, this in a way is bad for Konami in the sense that there a so many people out there who love PEs6 but hate pes2010

In a marketing sense. If they give us a choice even in settings to modify our own style of gameplay to suit our needs those people who love PES5 PES6 etc if that was available to people the series would be in better shape that it is now, woldn't recieve as much critisisum and would have a lot more people playing it.

I mean this could be done very, very easily, it's almost like Konami have these hidden sliders which tweak the power of attribues.

I rememebr when patching fifa on the pc you could actually edit the gameplay code without having to use global editing to make the game more realisitc, there must be a way to do this in PES?

Do you think guys that PES 2010 is on the same technical level as FIFA 08?

In terms of animations, player physics, natural human behaviour, no Easily no but still somehow holds its own since although FIFA 08 was better in these aspects it was rather basic, FIFA 10's has technically the best animations but it's put together horribly

In terms of tactics, gameplay balance, AI intelligence, player attributes PES is MILES ahead! And i really mean many, many MILES!

Thing is 75% of people really just care about animations and fluidity and couldn't care much about tactics and individuallity. With the casual players thats fine, i totally agree but it's those crazy people who believe FIFA 10 is realisitc is what baffs me.

 

[TanMak]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Thing is 75% of people really just care about animations and fluidity and couldn't care much about tactics and individuallity. With the casual players thats fine, i totally agree but it's those crazy people who believe FIFA 10 is realisitc is what baffs me.

lol, nothing like a made up statistic to suit your beliefs then

anyway, klashman ... why do think more & more people are leaving PES and are becoming more & more disillusioned with the franchise? I just want to hear your take mate. Bare in mind most PS2 era PES players loathed FIFA and believed PES was THE out and out football game to get, are they just crazy?

 

[Jamezinho]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

So we went from PES v Fifa debate to Fifa old-gen v Fifa next-gen debtate in a PES thread? That's a first.



Anyway, the debates in here are all fine until now but lets keep it PES related, somehow

And no flaming whatever please.

You started the PS3 exclusivity subject!

Perhaps we need a separate thread on the subject? Anyway, there's a lot of good discussion here for a change.

 

[DerleiPT]

Re: PES 2011 News & Rumours Discussion thread

Thing is 75% of people really just care about animations and fluidity and couldn't care much about tactics and individuallity. With the casual players thats fine, i totally agree but it's those crazy people who believe FIFA 10 is realisitc is what baffs me.

Can you stop this childish provocation ?

You trying to believe yourself that Fifa is bla bla bla ? its boring mate , its boring