PES 2011 Discussion thread

Jimmy G-Force said:
There was a PEEL 2v2 Tourney last night Pere, I'm assuming you didnt get chance to play any LET games ?
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I did actually, played my last two. And then had a couple of games against another newcomer, the second of which was a torrid high-speed anal hammering, which I could try to excuse to myself by pointing out that two of his goals were scored from cutbacks, but hey, I was outclassed. Some tough competition you've got over there, especially for a slowcoach online-noob who needs to speed up his act a bit.
 
Pere Ubu said:
I did actually, played my last two. And then had a couple of games against another newcomer, the second of which was a torrid high-speed anal hammering, which I could try to excuse to myself by pointing out that two of his goals were scored from cutbacks, but hey, I was outclassed. Some tough competition you've got over there, especially for a slowcoach online-noob who needs to speed up his act a bit.
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He wasnt called Romagnoli was he ?? :CONFUSE:
 
I think the key to enjoying PES 2011 is not to overplay it - I have played about 200-250 MLO games, about 100 regular ranked matches and probably about 50 offline games in various modes and the game still feels fresh and realistic to me on the whole.
I don't know how some people in MLO have racked up about 5000+ games on their record in such a short space of time and still enjoy the game...

There's the odd frustrating nightmare games, but when these come along I try to ignore the result, do my best in the things I have control over (possession, defensive shape) and just take it as a moral victory if I play nice football and lose to a Ronaldo rocket, and play other games (recently been playing Assassin's Creed 2, awesome game) for a bit.

The worst thing you can do (in my experience/opinion) when the game is pissing you off, is to keep at it for hours despite the gradually increasing level of rage :P.

Jimmy G-Force said:
It's not like any professional player isnt capable of smashing a 30 yard shot straight in the top bag, but the likes of Gerrard et al, do it on a more regular basis.
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PES replicates this extremely well in my opinion.
Even with defensive midfielders or centre-backs not renowned for their goalscoring prowess, you can hit venomous drives from distance if all the variables are in their favour and they "catch" it right, just look at this with Vukojevic;
YouTube - PES 2011 MLO - Vukojevic screamer

On FIFA, playing as a Championship side (even bottom half Prem) is boring and repetitive as hell because the lesser players (i.e. these sides entire squads) are completely incapable of blasting a powerful effort at goal from distance.

As you said, all players should be capable of scoring screamers or playing pinpoint passes/crosses - even I, who by my own admission suck at football have (in real life) scored a fair few belters from distance, sweetly struck volleys and have played Beckham-esque crosses and long passes. It's the ability to be consistent that defines a player's skill.
 
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I like the dynamic form idea, or maybe a system that is even more based on performances without losing the home and away form system. Really don't care how it effects the online community far to much focus is put on online gaming at the moment, although I am more than happy to download patches and DLC. Even if dynamic form is subtle it could have a big effect on certain players and would go some way to replicating confidence within a game.
 
Ok so I have obviously been a prisoner of Master League for a good while now because I just noticed there is no Konami Cup! And maybe it wasn't in PES 2010 either? I wanted to play a quick random cup with Liverpool, guess I can't!
 
Isslander said:
Ok so I have obviously been a prisoner of Master League for a good while now because I just noticed there is no Konami Cup! And maybe it wasn't in PES 2010 either? I wanted to play a quick random cup with Liverpool, guess I can't!
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You can create one within community mode i think.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Rom/Dan,

I just think that during play, would people really try and concentrate on exploiting a Form Arrow raise ? I mean, how much concentration would that require on top of what is already needed to ensure your conforming to technique to get the best from your own play?
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Yep.

Jim, the thing to remember is that a lot of people online are mentally ill. People will try and get any possible sliver of an advantage they can to win. If it's possible to see the outcome of your actions, then people will exploit it. You'd be amazed at what people will do - FIFA is like a playpen for these sorts and the new and ingeniously twattish things they come up with would blow your mind.

Would you want to face 60-70 minutes of Ronaldo, Messi, Higuain, Arshavin etc all on a red?
 
romagnoli said:
Yep.

Jim, the thing to remember is that a lot of people online are mentally ill. People will try and get any possible sliver of an advantage they can to win. If it's possible to see the outcome of your actions, then people will exploit it. You'd be amazed at what people will do - FIFA is like a playpen for these sorts and the new and ingeniously twattish things they come up with would blow your mind.

Would you want to face 60-70 minutes of Ronaldo, Messi, Higuain, Arshavin etc all on a red?
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I'm obviously a bit naive to the extent these idiots will go. As for the God's all on a Red, not really, but I truly believe it would be harder to exploit than whats been made out. But I will concede, thats just my opinion, and I may well be very wrong. I guess it would be all down to how it's all implemented. I would imagine most of the players would be on Red's for the most part anyway, such is their high Form value.

Edit - That Vuko goal is a bit naughty Rob. :WOOT:
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
I played a good 4 hours last night on my MLO, and it was hands-down the worst PES play from me since I bought the game. I was terrible, PES-itus all over again. Every decision I made was the wrong one, I lacked composure, guile, I was just plain rubbish. My confidence in my own play dwindled with every poor performance.

Anyway, it got me thinking about Form. For the most part, alot of my best players were on Blues and Purples, which didnt help, but I refuse to use that as an easy out, I sucked worse than a two-bit dime store hooker. End of story.

I really like the way the Form works, as it really does represent a footballers mentality. Football is 90% mind and 10% physical. You can be the worlds best player, with technique to burn, but if your suffering from a lack of confidence, you can play like a schoolboy. Rooney in the World Cup is one of the best examples of this. On the flip-side of that coin, you can be an average player, but if your high on confidence, you can perform way above your natural consistent level. The worlds greatest players are defined by their consistency, that's what make them great. It's not like any professional player isnt capable of smashing a 30 yard shot straight in the top bag, but the likes of Gerrard et al, do it on a more regular basis.

I personally would love to see Konami take this Form one step further, and add 'Dynamic Form'. This would be a system that reflects what happens on pitch during the 90 minutes, and changes the confidence/Form levels accordingly. For example, a striker is in a good run of Form and comes into the game on a Red, but after 3 shots, none of which hit the target, and maybe a few misplaced passes, drops to an Orange. I would these type of calculations made for every player on the pitch, and updated under the hud, say every 15 minutes of match play. This system would be so much more realistic with regards how this works in real life. I've played games in real life where I havent stepped over the line full of confidence, but as the game as progressed, and after some nice touches, passes, strikes on goal etc, my confidence has grown, and I'm playing alot better with more conviction. It's called 'getting into the game'. I would like to see this reflected in PES.

It would work the other way to, a midfielder maybe starts on a blue, but after some nice completed passes, interceptions, and the odd chance crafted, his Blue then increases to a Green. The same would go for a keeper, he starts on a Green, pulls off some early great saves, and is upped to an Orange, or even a Red. This is how it should work. Players can drift in and out of games as the match plays, and I think this is a system that would add much more realism in every area. You could even have a player that may drop two arrows, from Red to Green in the first half, after some poor play. As a manager you notice this, and that player is replaced for the good of the team. Another example would be a striker starting on a Green, he then scores two goals and is upped to Red as he chases that Hat-Trick. Confidence breeds confidence, and a Red 7% stat boost would certainly ensure that Hat-Trick is a little more forthcoming, which is how it is in real-life. Anyone who has played, and scored two in a game, truly believes that the 3rd goal is a pretty much a formality. It's just the way you feel, those first two goals have massively upped your confidence to the point you believe that 3rd goal isnt far away, you have an adrenline spike, and you perform above your natural level.

PES is so stat related, and the way the Form Arrows work presently, means that a player on a Red gets a stat boost across the board of 7%, Orange 3% and Green is his natural stats. Blue drops his stats percentage by 3% and a Purple by 7%. Thats the way it works currently, so why not accentuate that over the 90 minutes. It would make perfect sense, and also increase the variables even more. Which is always a good thing when simulating football. It adds further to the randomness, which is essential when replicating the game.

The end arrows would then carry over to the next match and so on. How many times do we see players start off a game quiet, then seem to lift their game as the match progresses, it happens all the time in every game. And it works the other way to, a player can start on fire, then just seem to fizzle out till eventually they are dragged off and subbed as their condfidence is shot. Having the Form Arrows is great, but for a player to maintain his Red form throughout the whole 90 minutes isnt really totally accurate from a realism perspective. Sure it happens, but only when players are on fire, constantly contributing, and maintaining that high level of confidence.

Just a thought........
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Good post there Jim, the points about lack of confidence are so true. When i was younger i found, even though i say so myself i was pretty decent at training and in a kickabout,but in a match i was shite and it was all down to confidence. I was worrying about cocking things up. A bit like jimmy Grimble lol. The same also applied when i first played pes online untill my wisdom told me fuck it lets have em! lol

Great idea about the form during a match, but in reality you could imagine it...89mins you're relying on your centre back to clear a fairly easy ball but because his form as dropped during the match he becomes unresponsive and lets the striker in and bingo goes the back of the net and bingo goes your controller against the wall. :LOL: still a good idea though if the tech was there and implimented correctly.
 
Nope. Lagina is back in town. Just the same as yesterday, cannot play football with my team of footballers. Is it just me or do players seem to take much heavier touches when you're suffering lag? D'Agostino and Sessegnon have been despicable for it.
 
Isslander said:
Ok so I have obviously been a prisoner of Master League for a good while now because I just noticed there is no Konami Cup! And maybe it wasn't in PES 2010 either? I wanted to play a quick random cup with Liverpool, guess I can't!
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As Buzzy said it's in the community mode now, and you're right it wasn't in PES2010 either. Konami, for reasons best known to themselves took out the custom league/cup mode and buried it in the rather useless community mode. A strange decision that will hopefully be reversed this year.
 
Miki975 said:
Man, they mean to play 15 minutes the hole match, not a half like you think. Half time in that case is 7.5 minutes not 15.
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Oh dear I'm not sure what on earth I was thinking! That's what little sleep does to ya....have no idea why I assumed he meant 15 minute halves.....doh....

Just tried the game on 15 minute matches and changed my camera to Normal Long (was using Broadcast which I know is difficult but looks really cool) and I have to say I'm suddenly a lot better at the game, though results have still been up and down. I'm still, almost every game, being pegged back or having the lead taken against me via the CPU playing a couple of lightning quick passes up the field, covering a good 50 yards or so, and suddenly finding that I barely have anyone at the back. My full backs seem to wander all over the place, and just two passes from deep in the AI's half and they're through on goal. I've tried all the changes I can think of, from altering defensive line, compactness, player support, everything, and still I get caught out by the through pass and suddenly it's 2v2 at the back. Maybe using the second defender press is causing it, though I stopped using this completely and it still happened, but on a less frequent basis.

Nevertheless, I'm having more fun with the game, scored some great goals for a change. I've been playing around with the video on my new phone, gonna probably upload to Youtube and share on here if I get round to it. :))
 
What cam do people mostly use? I used Normal Long from PES 3 to 6, then started with and stuck with Wide for PES 2011. Got a feeling I'd be more immersed using Normal Long but my passing game would probably suffer as a result, might switch it up when boredom kicks in.
 
Broadcast cam. Graphics look great and it feels a bit easier to judge the drop of the ball and shooting etc as you can see the face of the goal nice and big. Other one I sometimes use is wide cam, which is good for seeing more of the pitch but it can sometimes force you into playing long balls or through balls more often than you really want to. I prefer to build up from the back with shorter passes so Broadcast is good for me :)

There's a couple of others that weren't too bad (Player cam? maybe) but I find these can strain your eyes after a while as you really get into the feel of being in the game lol
 
After the initial enthusiam i gave up and eventually decided tu put the game on ebay. A good package overall, nice license, nice menu', nice ML structure, good editing. But as far as gameplay goes, i just found it rather easy and dull on max dif., ball physics seems plainly wrong, visuals are still plastic like and no whatsoever atmosphere in game. Replays for every foul and bad ref don't help the flow of the game either. And i haven't watched one single highlights since the next gen because they are just too long (and on line is an agony to have players rewatch goals). no need to talk about the jerky animations.

I think the game needs a different pace and tempo like in the old pes3-5 where there wasn't any single dull moment in a game, where u feel that every second of it could be crucial. Also the game has some major flaws in the off the ball movements. Crossing is also really weird and the on line is spoiled by easy through ball which are too effective due to poor player switching. The PS3 version is also embarassing for the lack of AA, stadia look like crap and the crowd seems made of bowling balls with some annoying light effects. scripting is written all over it, i saw the same cristiano ronaldo deflected free kick go in in 4 out the last 10 on line games.

But i think 2012 or 2013 should give us a masterpiece, the foundations are there, they just need to make some proper adjustments.

for the time being, i guess i'll be playing ps2 pes and tons of NBA 2k11.

P.S.
Broadcast in pes 2010 was way better than 2011.
 
CalcioCalabrese said:
Broadcast cam. Graphics look great and it feels a bit easier to judge the drop of the ball and shooting etc as you can see the face of the goal nice and big. Other one I sometimes use is wide cam, which is good for seeing more of the pitch but it can sometimes force you into playing long balls or through balls more often than you really want to. I prefer to build up from the back with shorter passes so Broadcast is good for me :)

There's a couple of others that weren't too bad (Player cam? maybe) but I find these can strain your eyes after a while as you really get into the feel of being in the game lol
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I use wide cam, but I'd love to be able to play on Broadcast, yes it does look superb and realistic, but directional input kinda gets screwed up when playing on it and puts me off.

Speaking of cameras, i think that they are pretty bad this year, Wide cam doesn't truly feel "wide" enough and makes it pretty hard to counterattack with a long, 40 yard ground pass as you think you know where you're putting the ball but if the game can't "see" the player on the screen, it doesn't assist you with the necessary power and accuracy like it should and your pass ends up trickling into opposition possession.
 
Wendetta said:
After the initial enthusiam i gave up and eventually decided tu put the game on ebay. A good package overall, nice license, nice menu', nice ML structure, good editing. But as far as gameplay goes, i just found it rather easy and dull on max dif., ball physics seems plainly wrong, visuals are still plastic like and no whatsoever atmosphere in game. Replays for every foul and bad ref don't help the flow of the game either. And i haven't watched one single highlights since the next gen because they are just too long (and on line is an agony to have players rewatch goals). no need to talk about the jerky animations.

I think the game needs a different pace and tempo like in the old pes3-5 where there wasn't any single dull moment in a game, where u feel that every second of it could be crucial.
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+1, +2 ???? :CONFUSE:

Longer matches? 10 minutes isn't recommended! probably its easy for you. Look at LTFC and pjx. they changed from 10 to 15 minutes and now suddenly they like the game.
 
Konami nails a lot, but this has happened against me on three separate occasions in just a matter of a few weeks;

YouTube - PES2011 Free Kick Fail

It's kind of annoying and not very realistic. In fact, it's a massive bug. No attempt from my keeper to move for the ball whatsoever.

As for the camera issue, I can pick better passes and try more adventurous build up moves on Normal Long compared to Broadcast, which is a shame because it does look amazing. I think next year Konami really needs to take a leaf out of EA's book and offer camera customization. But so long as they actually keep the same kind of angle they have now, and let it be tweaked so it's not quite so 'top down' onto the pitch when the ball is up near the far side. When the ball is down by the near touchline, the camera's actually pretty perfect. Wish they'd keep it like that.

That said, I have no real complaints about the camera when you compare it to FIFA's. I'll never understand why the 'main' camera angle in that game is 'Tele', it's so side on that you can barely see any of the goal. You have to wait for a replay to actually see where exactly the ball went into the net......
 
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dannyfc2 said:
What cam do people mostly use? I used Normal Long from PES 3 to 6, then started with and stuck with Wide for PES 2011. Got a feeling I'd be more immersed using Normal Long but my passing game would probably suffer as a result, might switch it up when boredom kicks in.
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Normal long here. Always have used this camera as I find wide is too far away from the action. I like to be a little closer.

Although.......

Wendetta said:
P.S.
Broadcast in pes 2010 was way better than 2011.
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......I dabbled with Broadcast cam in PES2010 and I agree - it was way better than it is in PES2011.
 
klashman69 said:
I would have thought making the gameplay faster would help create that effect.
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Yeah you might be right. I just went on youtube and looked at some PES5 gameplay and the ball does not behave how I remembered. What I found interesting though is when comparing 5 and 2011 in the youtube vids PES2011 looks every bit as stiff and on rails as PES5 and graphics aside does not look like much of a leap forward.
 
I've seen some poor play by the goalies but I have never seen anything like that video. Thing about 2011 is sometimes the games are perfect and other times it is very frustrating.

A little more foot speed for the fastest players would help. Please bring back the advantage rule and try to fix the offsides somewhat. Other than that it is a great game.
 
It's bizarre, it had never happened until recently. That particular free kick I conceded in a friendly, but the other ones happened in a tournament on Professional level. David James did it on one occasion, the other in a ML game which really annoyed me!
 
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