PES 2011 Discussion thread

[Jimmy G-Force]

Not to worry Jim, I guess the downside of me having a balanced opinion is we will disagree 50% of the time

I don't think anyone's asking for players to sprint back or for Konami to overdo things. But at the moment, whether your player is rated 60, 70, 80, 90 for attack, if they're offside then they will edge back on over a long period of time. It can take them several seconds to make up 5 yards. Nobody is against the concept of a defence pushing up, nobody suggested otherwise, but a defence pushing up should not result in attackers being completely unable to react. A defence pushing up should force the attack back towards the halfway line - not leave them stranded and unable to move any faster than a crabwalk.

Touche.

 

[mfmaxpower]

Agreed James, TBF the keepers are the best as i can remember,although they are prone to some gaffs just like robert green lol. But for me it doesnt happen enough to be unrealistic.

Talking about keepers, i have just gone through a master league season, and during the business end of the season, Reina gets injured in training and out for 3 weeks. Itandje is on a purple condition arrow for all his stand in games and crash bang wallop! two errors and out of europe and the fa cup. But like McDonalds I'm lovin it.

Although player switching has improved, i still find when defending sometimes your team mates dont seem aware of anything,but once again not frequent enough to be annoying untill it costs you a goal that is.

Same for me with the keepers - I've had a couple gaffes but overall the keepers have been fine. I've read elsewhere complaints that the keepers are atrocious but I don't agree at all. More animations would be nice but I'd be fine if keepers remain largely untouched.

I only play on top player so maybe there's more keeper mistakes on the lower settings, sort of Konami's way of making it easier?

 

[UTD-PEARSON]

Been playing this game for the past few weeks with manual pass and manual cross only, truly mesmerising this game can't get off Master league(offline) the challenge is immense. Default pass feels like I am playing on auto pilot although its good for certain situations when manual pass only complicates matters.

 

[lancers]

I appreciate what your saying Gerd, but they are late getting back because the defensive line has pushed up. No matter which way you look at it, they are not offside until the point you pass forward. Which again, is down to awareness on the user's part. Nothing more, nothing less. It's black and white. Pass sideways or back. Usually the only time I get caught offside is when my players are pretty much level, and it's so tight it's almost impossible to judge that fine line.

I know what you are saying my problem is I am using Normal Long Camera while you are using the Wide shot. Yeah I know I need to switch that up but there isn't enough urgency on my player's parts to get back into an onside position. Konami did a great job just a few things left for the game to be nearly perfect in my mind.

 

[Andy]

Same for me with the keepers - I've had a couple gaffes but overall the keepers have been fine. I've read elsewhere complaints that the keepers are atrocious but I don't agree at all. More animations would be nice but I'd be fine if keepers remain largely untouched.

I only play on top player so maybe there's more keeper mistakes on the lower settings, sort of Konami's way of making it easier?

Yeah i would say thats a fair assumption, although when i mentioned my ML experience i was on top player, so i think the condition arrows obviously played a part.

Another thing i think konami maybe doing to make things harder is scripting the opponents to score more. There seemed to be a lot of headed goals scored from crosses against me in the last 5 mins of games. But now i have switched to pro level and it doesnt seem as bad.
I dont mind losing but when a team does nothing for 85 mins then magically gets the deciding goal it gets a bit much as on top player its all too regular for me, or am i just useless?.

 

[Jamezinho]

I agree that the keepers are decent and a big leap up from 2010, but they still parry the ball back out into the penalty are a little too often for my liking, resulting in easy tap-ins. Apart from that they're pretty solid bar the odd inexplicable error, but I'm fine with that.

Credit where credit's due though - the keepers in Fifa11 are quite impressive.

 

[UTD-PEARSON]

On legendary the keepers are pretty much all the same on fifa 11, this was the case with 09 and 10 as well so I find that far from impressive. With PES yes there's room for improvement but I feel the mistake ratio is realistic apart from the odd inexplicable error that in my time offline with the game has only happened a couple of times. The keepers on fifa do not feel realistic and even shit keepers make unrealistic saves, I really hope Konami don't copy fifa in this aspect of the game but I think they will unfortunately.

 

[Soulja]

Is it just me or did last night game of Barca vs Real really look like PES 2011? The assists Messi gave, the dribbling, the passing. I had this discussion today and we came to the conclusion that this years PES resembles real life if played correctly. Even during the game in certain situations we said: L2 + triangle, before the pass came and was finished. The flow of the game reminded me of some good games I had and have in PES 2011. But maybe it is just me being kind of happy with PES after all these years. I even looked for a radar during the game :p

 

[Jamezinho]

On legendary the keepers are pretty much all the same on fifa 11, this was the case with 09 and 10 as well so I find that far from impressive. With PES yes theirs room for improvement but I feel the mistake ratio is realistic apart from the odd inexplicable error that in my time offline with the game has only happened a couple of times. The keepers on fifa do not feel realistic and even shit keepers make unrealistic saves, I really hope Konami don't copy fifa in this aspect of the game but I think they will unfortunately.

True, and I suppose you could say the same about all the players in Fifa. It's hard to tell the good from the bad.

 

[YoungGun_UK]

In PES you can tell you have a great keeper, the amount of top saves Casillas makes compared to others is very noticeable.

The comment about the Real/Barca game is that PES is nowhere near as fluid, its a must along with animations and contact detection

 

[Lami]

I keep going back and forth between Fifa and PES and tbh every time I go from Fifa to PES everything feels much more organic again. Some things in Fifa might look better but imo PES looks and feels more like a real football match to me. Both are good games in their own right, but PES needs time to learn, not just pick up and play imo. PES makes me use my brain much more than Fifa does too. Prefer the atmosphere in Fifa though, PES is crap in that area.

 

[Rob92]

FIFA keepers are horrible in my opinion, so unrealistic, scripted and predictable.

They may look nice in terms of animation, but the way they play is just bollocks.
I know FIFA 10 is different to 11, but on 10 I created a joke keeper with the minimum height, maximum weight with all attributes to 1 and put him in a team to play against to get some Virtual Pro accomplishments (mainly long shots and headers)... He was making flying saves, catching crosses comfortably and generally playing almost on the level of a Casillas or Buffon. Imagine doing that on PES, that keeper would be completely useless (as he should be)...
Suppose it doesn't help that FIFA's shooting is shite.

Shooting and keepers, although have plenty of faults in PES and look ugly a lot of the time, are two of the main reasons I play PES over FIFA...

 

[CalcioCalabrese]

Not sure where I stand on the goalkeeper debate re: parrying the ball back into play. For me it looks a lot more realistic than FIFA where super human keepers are able to tip the ball away over the bar or past the post.

Regarding the offside debate and player awareness - I was at match on Friday night and definitely saw lots of occassions where players were in offside positions and walked back at a slow pace. They are huffing and puffing and for them to sprint back to be equal with the last defender, whilst the midfielder steps on the ball, then plays a pass back to that player is not going to happen. Not sure why anyone expects it to happen on PES.

Again, forwards or other players do not always get into good positions, due to various reasons - fatigue, coaches instructions, lack of awareness, laziness. if everyone did get into good positions, a lot more teams would have the movement of Barcelona. Instead there are many static teams in real life and at various points of playing a match on PES, players will also be static. Trigerring runs like FIFA would be good but might lead to the same problems....people playing 4-5 forward passes everytime. I really enjoy the gamestyle of PES now where you have to MOVE the ball around in different directions like a real game of football

 

[mfmaxpower]

I keep going back and forth between Fifa and PES and tbh every time I go from Fifa to PES everything feels much more organic again. Some things in Fifa might look better but imo PES looks and feels more like a real football match to me. Both are good games in their own right, but PES needs time to learn, not just pick up and play imo. PES makes me use my brain much more than Fifa does too. Prefer the atmosphere in Fifa though, PES is crap in that area.

Same for me. PES still has a lot that is just not satisfactory to me so I've been switching back and forth too. Today, however, I couldn't get through one match of FIFA - it was too fast, too physical... the usual. I hate to say it, because it's such a tired claim now, but in that one match of FIFA I was struck by how much the game feels more like hockey than football, what with how player movement is detached from the pitch, sliding around, bumping into each other, getting knocked down.

I'm not in love with this year's PES but it does feel more like football. Unless EA adds an extra slow speed in a patch, among other things, I can't see myself playing much more FIFA.

 

[Rooney10]

I keep going back and forth between Fifa and PES and tbh every time I go from Fifa to PES everything feels much more organic again. Some things in Fifa might look better but imo PES looks and feels more like a real football match to me. Both are good games in their own right, but PES needs time to learn, not just pick up and play imo. PES makes me use my brain much more than Fifa does too. Prefer the atmosphere in Fifa though, PES is crap in that area.

just get some decent chants for the top leagues or the leagues that you play in, and you've an atmosphere that's better than anything else.

try it, trust me, I did it, and I haven't looked back. imagine vuvuzelas for African teams. you need the link?

http://forums.pesfan.com/showthread.php?t=234101&page=1

 

[gerd]

About the off-side and the returning of the players.
I have the feeling that they are slow to return from an off-side position, but once they are not off-side anymore they go unrealistically fast back in a position that is far from off-side.
This is a clumsy explanation. I'll try it otherwise.

When you give a through ball to a certain player, at the moment that he receives that pass he is far from off-side. Then it turns out that he was off-side at the moment the pass was given. This is hardly believable if you see how much before the last defender was at the moment he received the ball.

 

[Steekbal]

Offside doesn't really work well for me. Sometimes it's just too painfully obvious and infuriating when one of your wingers remains in an offside position for more than three seconds despite the fact he can see the entire defensive line.

I think the speed at which players get back from an offside position should be dependant on response, stamina and mentality stats instead of one global setting for every player. At the moment everyone acts like Adebayor when it comes to offside, which is harsh on the Kuyt's and Chamakh's of this world.

 

[RAMAXWY]

Is it just me or did last night game of Barca vs Real really look like PES 2011? The assists Messi gave, the dribbling, the passing. I had this discussion today and we came to the conclusion that this years PES resembles real life if played correctly. Even during the game in certain situations we said: L2 + triangle, before the pass came and was finished. The flow of the game reminded me of some good games I had and have in PES 2011. But maybe it is just me being kind of happy with PES after all these years. I even looked for a radar during the game :p

its not just you cause i was thinking the same thing, the dribbling, those one touch passes from barca especially in midfield just about everything had me thinking damn this looks just like pes 2011.

 

[henrys hand]

its not just you cause i was thinking the same thing, the dribbling, those one touch passes from barca especially in midfield just about everything had me thinking damn this looks just like pes 2011.

Yes, a lot of the basic stuff is very similar, but there are also major differences:

1. Animation is way more varied and fluid in reallife-game!
2. Behaviour near the offside-defense-line is way more dynamic: Players make many more runs forward and when they come into offside they return quickly and try again to go forward... In the game.. it's no comparison actually.
3. Lightning is nice and clear, in game the lightning in such a night-game is very dull and dark.
4. Atmosphere is over the top in the real game espescially after Barca started trashing Real, in game it's not only way lower but also quite a bit static, even apathic to the goals made by the teams.

 

[Mityaj]

I'm also loving the diagonal long ball - played one with Montolivo about 70 yards over the full back perfectly into Vargas' stride who took one touch and belted it in under the keeper from just outside the box .

Video please!

 

[Mityaj]

That said, I've scored some great goals from dribbles on Regular level, but find dribbling next to impossible on Professional. I'm not sure where the difference lies in pulling off dribbles using R2, but I'm way off doing them at higher difficulties. Maybe, like you say, using the left stick to move the player and ball between players is a skill in itself. Just on the higher difficulties I'm finding that really tough to pull off, the AI just comes in and takes it off me.

Dribbles and shielding the ball aginst AI.
4 videos below all recorded from Top Player difficulty matches. Only Pandev goal was scored online.

Overall, the main thing and the key word is "inertia": unlike old-gen PES, 2011 players have much more of it and cant can no longer switch the way they face whilst running at speed like hovercraft. Aim to take the ball behind the back of the running defender- just like they advise in real life
YouTube - Pro Evo 2011 little gourmet moments

YouTube - Chut' obvodki

YouTube - PES moments

YouTube - PES2011 dribble TOP PLAYER.wmv


Last video was of the time when I was still getting uosed to the game- Professional difficulty here.
YouTube - PES2011 dribble through the middle.wmv

 

[hitmanuk]

Looking at the last video with the keeper this is the main reason I traded it in. Why doesnt the keeper stretch out more to save it? Is it just me or does it annoy anyone else?

 

[Suuuuupertalk]

Cheers for the tips

I've done some pretty amazing dribbles on Regular level with Messi just using the R2 button, literally taking on 3-4 players in the penalty area at once and getting in between them etc, but I guess that Regular level simply doesn't attempt to tackle you as much. So you're right on that.

On a different subject, people earlier were mentioning the camera. I've noticed something a bit odd. If you leave the game at the menu screen and watch the intro videos, it kicks into a demo match between Inter and Athletico Madrid. What's odd, is that the camera used in the gameplay demo isn't available in the game, or unless my eyes are tricking me. It's basically using the broadcast camera, but from a higher/slightly pulled back perspective. It looks great like broadcast camera does, but also looks much easier to see what's going on. The default broadcast camera is far more 'lower' to the ground and zoomed in.

Has anyone else noticed this, and if I'm right, why would Konami promote the game using a camera angle you can't actually select in the actual game?! It's an actual demo of a proper match, not a rendered video, so the camera is in there ready and working. You just can't select it, or so it seems.

Again, I only saw it once so my eyes may be tricking me

 

[Rob92]

Video please!

I'd love to upload it, but in the same match I conceded a very cheap equaliser in the last seconds so I just left the game at the end, forgetting to save the replay .

It looked beautiful though, scored a few others from keeper rebounds after great long balls (so didn't save them) but I'll be sure to upload in future if I score a similar goal!

 

[Mityaj]

Looking at the last video with the keeper this is the main reason I traded it in. Why doesnt the keeper stretch out more to save it? Is it just me or does it annoy anyone else?

It does annoy I have to say that the last video was made before the 1.02 patch, since then the keepers have been made A LOT better in terms of not spilling the ball from weak floaty shots all the time, holding on to it a lot more and generally do their job much better.
BUT, if keepers are an aspect of football you pay a lot of attention to, then 2011 is still poor. In EXACTLY the way you said- its like they WANT to let the ball in sometimes and refuse to stretch all the way or even criminally move their hands away from the path of the ball. It does happen.

 

[hitmanuk]

It does annoy I have to say that the last video was made before the 1.02 patch, since then the keepers have been made A LOT better in terms of not spilling the ball from weak floaty shots all the time, holding on to it a lot more and generally do their job much better.
BUT, if keepers are an aspect of football you pay a lot of attention to, then 2011 is still poor. In EXACTLY the way you said- its like they WANT to let the ball in sometimes and refuse to stretch all the way or even criminally move their hands away from the path of the ball. It does happen.

hmm not sure im willing to give it another go then..id rather be annoyed by sometimes amazingly good keepers than shit ones..it used to drive me insane on freekicks when the ball would float just past the keepers hands and id be screaming reach out FFS!! shame as used to love PES back in the day

 

[Pere Ubu]

The improvement in keepers post-patch is pretty unmissable. I thought I might be imagining it, but after a few days it was obvious that something had been tweaked. It's not just that they save more shots "properly" now, it's that they look better while doing it - a smart dive, two strong hands, WHUMP off the gloves and the ball rebounds at speed, usually round the post for a corner instead of trickling back into the area for an easy tap-in. I've had games finish 1-1 with two or three spectacular saves from each goalie. You can really get a sense now of your goalie keeping you in the game (or the other side's goalie keeping them in the game) which wasn't obvious before, when things were a bit more random and often silly. Their stupid mistakes are now rare enough that you can write them off as a freak, rather than just thinking "oh God not again". I'm fairly sure this isn't placebo, because I see good, realistic-looking saves in every match now, which I didn't before.

Speaking of the patch, I've started loving it. As I hoped, I got used to the increased pressure very quickly and learnt to live with it. The faster game speed isn't as bad as it seemed at first - once you get used to the pressure, you can still control the pace of the game if you play well, it just means that when you quicken the pace it actually looks quick. I still miss the stationary one-on-ones (like an isolation play in basketball, if anyone knows basketball), which have been swept away by the increased pressure on the wings, but apart from that it's a definite improvement even before you get to the obvious stuff like the removed green zone bug, improved (but still not perfect) cursor switching etc.

They've also toned down the rubberbanding when it comes to defenders catching up with forwards. It's still impossible to speedwhore all game, thank God, but a really quick winger can now get ahead of a full back and stay ahead of him for a lot longer. You still need to change direction or knock the ball ahead if you want to really use your pace over long distances, but little bursts of speed are far more effective. I think the balance is really good now - pure pace will get you so far, but you still need to use it intelligently (and realistically) to actually hurt the opponent.

The absurdly obvious scripting in certain matches is still there, sadly.

 

[sincover]

Goalkeepers would be perfect for some kind of adaptive animation. It'll probably never happen in PES though (it is developed by a Japanese studio after all).

 

[kgulls]

Could someone tell me if it is possible to have two different option files loaded if I make seperate user profiles on my PS3.Would one affect the other.
I noticed that if I loaded the game on a seperate user profile, all the teams were re-set to default.Has anyone tried this?

 

[Lami]

Could someone tell me if it is possible to have two different option files loaded if I make seperate user profiles on my PS3.Would one affect the other.
I noticed that if I loaded the game on a seperate user profile, all the teams were re-set to default.Has anyone tried this?

I did and it works.