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PES 2011 Discussion thread

Lami said:
Classic games = PS2. Not one Fifa game is worth mentioning during that era. And we all know that. So he's right.
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Ducks can't whistle. I'm right too. Nobody can disagree. But, like joeryan's post, it isn't remotely relevant to the point being made - that the competition for the title of 'best football game' that we see now (now) is what drives both sides on. Without FIFA, PES 2011 would be another shower of shite. Without PES, FIFA wouldn't have turned itself around as it has done this gen and wouldn't have made a number of the changes they're making this year.
 
Fifa has always outsold PES regardless of the quality of either title.

Fifa needs to outsell PES to pay for the higher production costs and licences.

So Fifa's higher sales has never really been a factor in the development of PES. Seabass just got on with making the better football game for many, many years.
 
I think thats the point everyone here is trying to make. Without PES, FIFA wouldn't be where its at now and without FIFA in its current state this generation PES wouldn't be advancing but rather stagnating and getting more worse with each iteration. The competition is a great thing as it brings about advancements in both football games and the sports genre as a whole. However even when PES has been bad, for example PES 2008, its still far, far better than some of the worst FIFA games such as the ones in the PS2 era. The biggest gulf in terms of yearly versions was between PES 2009 and FIFA 09. FIFA 09 was great while PES 2009 done pretty much nothing to alleviate the previous games problems. But with PES 2010 Konami are heading in a positive direction and look set to accelerate with PES 2011. The biggest difference in quality between the two games was during the PS2 era with those versions of PES arguably being some of the best football games ever made right up there with SWOS. This gen there is a clear difference but its not as big as the previous one.
 
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Leo said:
I thought the point was that Seabass produced great games while EA's was shit, and my point was that competition doesn't necessarily mean only gameplay. And since FIFA sold well it was indeed a very good reason for PES to continue to improve, which is why even back then EA was a very true competitor to PES and helped to develop the series forward. End of story.
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Jamezinho said:
Fifa has always outsold PES regardless of the quality of either title.

Fifa needs to outsell PES to pay for the higher production costs and licences.

So Fifa's higher sales has never really been a factor in the development of PES. Seabass just got on with making the better football game for many, many years.
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Thank you very much.
 
It wasn't the point at all. You simply can't get from gameklip's post to joeryan's and see a consistent point being made. Hence my facepalm and Nick's eyeroll.

Billy - The thing is that the past FIFA's, the PS2 ones of 2005 or earlier in particular, bear almost no relation to the current titles. The top members of the development team are almost completely different for a start. Any tarring of the current FIFA team, headed up by former PES fanboys no less, with the same brush as the darker (read shit) PS2 days or indeed the PS1 days, is absurd when you look at it beyond the name on the box. It's as if people look at Seabass's extremely long tenure at the top for Konami and expect this to be the same for FIFA.
 
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A friend of mine tried to swear down that Pes 2010 has the same graphics as Pes 2008 the other day.

Sometimes i can't tell if people are just trying to irrationally convince themselves they made the right decision concerning the football title they bought by coming up with odd opinions.
 
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Northzzz said:
A friend of mine tried to swear down that Pes 2010 has the same graphics as Pes 2008 the other day.

Sometimes i can't tell if people are just trying to irrationally convince themselves they made the right decision concerning the football title they bought by coming up with odd opinions.
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You can read that type of stuff every day in some forums. I guess some people just like to be "irrational" and are happy that way. Scientists should study those people, firstly to see if they really believe in what they are saying, and then figuring out what makes people draw this kind of conclusions.
 
hi i want to know if it is confirmed that there will be no "video, the video came out last week in game, do you think there will be photos of the Copa Libertadores?
 
romagnoli said:
It wasn't the point at all. You simply can't get from gameklip's post to joeryan's and see a consistent point being made. Hence my facepalm and Nick's eyeroll.

Billy - The thing is that the past FIFA's, the PS2 ones of 2005 or earlier in particular, bear almost no relation to the current titles. The top members of the development team are almost completely different for a start. Any tarring of the current FIFA team, headed up by former PES fanboys no less, with the same brush as the darker (read shit) PS2 days or indeed the PS1 days, is absurd when you look at it beyond the name on the box. It's as if people look at Seabass's extremely long tenure at the top for Konami and expect this to be the same for FIFA.
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Hey look all I want to do is enjoy both football games and hope that this year we get quality ones. Obviously I have a preference for PES over FIFA because it has given me some superb games in the past decade. That's the reason why you and me are on here. This is afterall a PES fansite. But that's not to say I don't like FIFA. I love FIFA too. 08 was great, 09 was my favourite and I'm really enjoying the World Cup game. I'm looking forward to FIFA 11 and can't wait to play the demo. Can't we all get along? :)
 
gameklip said:
Without Konami, Fifa (...),09 & 10 (and likely 11) wouldn't be what they are.
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The new FIFA's bear more resemblances to Football Kingdom and Perfect Striker than to the oldschool Winning Eleven/PES, actually.

To draw a parallel it's like compating SWOS to Kick Off 2/Goal: similar approach but diametrically different gameplay.

...unless you were referring to commercial competition alone, that's it.
 
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i wish they would bring back the old ps2 highlight/replay system. the new one is long and boring. I never watch anything these days.
 
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I am not at Twitter.
Can somebody tell me what the questions were that Jon Murphy answered here?
# @thomasdw1980 Not yet. Need to get regular online play perfect first
10 minutes ago via TweetDeck in reply to thomasdw1980

# @QuackserFortune Darn. And this is the best PES ever! Will sort it for you next year.
11 minutes ago via TweetDeck in reply to QuackserFortune

# @macca2278 been pushing team really hard on this but they haven't had time to fix it. Really sorry. Top of the list next year. All I can do
about 17 hours ago via TweetDeck in reply to macca2278
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Searain said:
The new FIFA's bear more resemblances to Football Kingdom and Perfect Striker than to the oldschool Winning Eleven/PES, actually.

To draw a parallel it's like compating SWOS to Kick Off 2/Goal: similar approach but diametrically different gameplay.

...unless you were referring to commercial competition alone, that's it.
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I agree,especially in relation to fifa10 and FWC being of a very similiar mold and ilk to konamis very own iss/perfect striker series on the n64 and perfect striker3 on the ps2.

Ea have taken the solid formula of these old konami games and re-invented it for a new generation,which in my mind isnt such a bad thing because even to this day i still believe in many ways the iss/perfect series had a far superior nucleaus then pes,adhering to the principles of real football better without sacrificing what the end user could do with the players and ball or individuality.

Pes has always been a far cry from the freedom of control and movement you had in iss/perfect striker,with fifa over the course of the last three years just re-engineering what we had 14years ago on the n64 in iss albeit with better graphics,animation and presentation,being-360 movement,a user defined passing and shooting system,realistic animation,organic gameplay,analog control,before the football genre regressed pre ps2,opting for the limitations of the d-pad,8-axis movement and the automation of passing and shooting all those years ago.

Its no coincidence,history doesnt lie nor does the reality that ea have taken something konami created moulded it into something superior and are now reaping the rewards with there game only really needing improvements to replays,heading,a better player attribute system,additional balancing of the ai and the physicality system,more weight in the ball physics and feel in shooting.

Thats not to say konami are finished they have just got to up the anti and start competing with ea on both a technical and gameplay front again,the evidence is there in pes2011,they just have to make sure the AIs tuned right and all 22 players react naturally to the ball,theyve nailed free passing,animation,graphics and tactics from what i experienced at e3.

Pes2011 resembles ISS on the n64 more then it does pes on the ps2 now,and that in my book is a good thing for all of us.
 
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Classic Brazil and Classic Holland were amazing. Classic France weren't too bad either. Pele, Jairzinho, Van Basten, Papin. All great.
 
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