PES 2011 Discussion thread

yes, im talkin about the close control aswell ..
so what "depth" ur talkin about and whats "basic" in ur opinion

wish u a lot of fun.. to explain me this :))

coz i cant see pes 6 close control is any better or more deep..

close control is by far more important in pes 2010 than pes6, thats the first thing, coz u cant run full speed and make feints all over the place to create some space
u need to get slower and then go to close control or make dribblings/feints whit R2+ LStick or this L2+Stick thing wich is not that great in my opinion, or just the simple tricks with just the LStick..
+
not every player is that responsive anymore as in pes6, so u have the special players for close control who do better, u cant do all the simple n effective stuff anymore with every player as in pes6

another thing is that the first touch systen now is a part of the close control aswell, if u hold r2 before u get the ball and holt it further u can do amazin stuff

so even .if. the close control wouldnt be that "deep" as in pes6, its by far more important
 
Aqua said:
yes, im talkin about the close control aswell ..
so what "depth" ur talkin about and whats "basic" in ur opinion

wish u a lot of fun.. to explain me this :))

coz i cant see pes 6 close control is any better or more deep..

close control is by far more important in pes 2010 than pes6, thats the first thing, coz u cant run full speed and make feints all over the place to create some space
u need to get slower and then go to close control or make dribblings/feints whit R2+ LStick or this L2+Stick thing wich is not that great in my opinion, or just the simple tricks with just the LStick..
+
not every player is that responsive anymore as in pes6, so u have the special players for close control who do better, u cant do all the simple n effective stuff anymore with every player as in pes6

another thing is that the first touch systen now is a part of the close control aswell, if u hold r2 before u get the ball and holt it further u can do amazin stuff

so even .if. the close control wouldnt be that "deep" as in pes6, its by far more important
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I think there is a big misunderstanding here. You seem to be implying that i can't use players in PES 2010 properly?

I not trying to say PES6 controls are better than PES 2010, i'm not saying i even have problems in controlling players on PES 2010 and i have mentioned 1000 of times i like how bad technique players turn like buses.

Like i said before i scored a goal with Dominguez of Valencia in which for the assist i beat 4 players (messi style lol with Pablo H.)

All i'm saying is on PES the close control meant you could jog very slowly with the ball pretty much at walking pace using L2 and R2. I would like to see this back given to all players but only the best can have all the functions like with PES6 (v-feint etc..) Whilst all other players should just have the abillity to jog very slowly/walk with the ball.

All i'm doing is giving an example of some elements of PES6 which should be brought back. Like this here, the overhead sombrero YouTube - Casano sombrero pes 5
 
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and u cant do that anymore in pes 2010?, to jog very slowly with the ball "pretty much walkin pace" ?
u can
or is the pace slower as in pes6?


then u wrote to all players, im sure u can do it with all players..

gallas goes to control mode,offensive players go...
same speed, tested it right now
off. players can do more tricks

so the only diffrence i can imagine are this tricks like in the video
 
Aqua said:
and u cant do that anymore in pes 2010?, to jog very slowly with the ball "pretty much walkin pace" ?
u can
or is the pace slower as in pes6?
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You can't jog as slowly as you could in PES6, thats the main point.

Also rememeber only players with good techinque can use pace control in PES 2010
 
slower ?
so whats the point to do it slower ?
its better on a higher speed...

and like i wrote, tested it whit arsenal, i can do it with every player on the pitch, sure it brings u not that much with a defender but its workin (good how it is)
 
He's right the ps2 versions are R2 gives u alot more control than pes 2010 ps3. This is partly due to the responsiveness and the lack of smoothness. On the pes 6 you feel properly in control. Messi feels more like Messi
 
Do people know that running with the "sprint"/R1 held down is the worst way to accelerate? Efficient movement in 2010 is completely dependent on timing the connection with foot and ball with R1/R2/a flick of the left stick. I find that even when I'm at the slowest pace, moving left to right, I'm still flicking the stick forward or at a maximum of 45 degrees so that I'm in complete control when I need to accelerate away or just make a quick change in direction to lay off the ball. With players like Lennon/Walcott/Agbonlahor, you need to keep tapping R1 to gain pace, but it's almost impossible to turn those players unless you use R2 or slow down completely. With Messi/Ronaldo/Ribery though, it's a completely different story because they can all turn on a dime and make all those impossible twists and turns that defenders can't perform because of a lack of agility/DA/technique. Just my experience with the dribbling system...

Can't you tap R2 to move very slowly, almost to walking pace? It seems to work for me. Players turn much more quickly that way too...
 
More AI
More slider and tactic options
New passing system allows you to pass to any player you want exactly
99 Pass Accuracy + 99 Team Work means perfect throw passes.
 
jameslv1986 said:
He's right the ps2 versions are R2 gives u alot more control than pes 2010 ps3. This is partly due to the responsiveness and the lack of smoothness. On the pes 6 you feel properly in control. Messi feels more like Messi
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just bullshit, period.
give specific statements and not "alot more" "responsiveness"
"lack of smoothness" <-- LOL

i gave examples, more tricks yes but not better and not more control or this shit...ridiculous
 
jameslv1986 said:
He's right the ps2 versions are R2 gives u alot more control than pes 2010 ps3. This is partly due to the responsiveness and the lack of smoothness. On the pes 6 you feel properly in control. Messi feels more like Messi
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Messi feels much more like Messi on PES 2010! in most aspects, PES 2010 just the abillity to slow the ball down to pretty much walking pace. I like the PES 2010 system but theres nothing wrong in showing that their room for improvment in terms of close control.

All i said was in PES6 you could make more very sutle movements at a almost walking pace. PES 2010 you can slow the pace down with the R2 but it seems with PES6 you had more control over how slow you wanted to go.

Why aqua geting so workied up i'm sure is down to a misunderstanding, i think he believes that we want all of PES6 controls back which is not the case.

Thing is PES6 gives you too much control in terms of average players compared to PES 2010.

@ tc811

I actually really like the sprinting method on this game, i love how you have to time your runs and learn about the players you are using and what they can do, haven't go any problems in normal dribbling/spring i been talking a lot moere about being able to literally walk witht he ball or jog at a VERY slow pace.
 
Konami should include a full on 360 degree dribbling system this year, they came close adding an extra 8 directions but its still rigded and incredbly fixed.

Im gettin tired of the CPU keeping the ball in play at impossible trajectorys and dribbling in a damn near straight line on the by line when i know full well gravity should have awarded me a corner
 
Aqua said:
just bullshit, period.
give specific statements and not "alot more" "responsiveness"
"lack of smoothness" <-- LOL

i gave examples, more tricks yes but not better and not more control or this shit...ridiculous
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Come on, go play PES 5 or 6 ps2, then PES 2010 back to back. R2 dribble gives alot more control on ps2. There is too much randomness on PES 2010 ps3. you can also see how much smoother the ps2 versions are in terms of flowing animations. What I am saying is it is no way near as responsive as PS2 versions.
 
jameslv1986 said:
Come on, go play PES 5 or 6 ps2, then PES 2010 back to back. R2 dribble gives alot more control on ps2. There is too much randomness on PES 2010 ps3. you can also see how much smoother the ps2 versions are in terms of flowing animations. What I am saying is it is no way near as responsive as PS2 versions.
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I wouldn't say there is too much randomness in PES 2010 in terms of dribbling, i've leanred to control and handle the dribbling and it's very rewarding but you don't have the same level of close control when dribbling slowly as in PES6. Dosne't bother me that much, just a clear point in which could be worked on.

The whole animatons and responsivness is down to because the PS2 sysem was optimized to it's full capacity back with PES5 etc.., PES 2010 is quite clearly work in progress and because PES 2008 and 2009 where a complete waste of time in terms of gameplay, starting a fresh with PEs 2010 they are still exploring the best method of implementing dribbling.
 
proJ3CHT said:
Konami should include a full on 360 degree dribbling system this year, they came close adding an extra 8 directions but its still rigded and incredbly fixed.

Im gettin tired of the CPU keeping the ball in play at impossible trajectorys and dribbling in a damn near straight line on the by line when i know full well gravity should have awarded me a corner
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Proper animations, collisions and a realistic feeling of inertia are more important to me than 360 degree movement. Fifa09 was 8-direction but because the animations were so smooth it gave a feeling of more freedom.

For me the jury is still out on 360 degree movement. I'm not sure it's as important as some make it out to be. It adds nothing to the experience in Fifa10 (imo) and certainly doesn't improve tight control. I think full 360 makes the game feel a bit slack and vague.
 
guys....
stop adoring the ps2 titles..it gets odd...

there is no randomness, there is no lack of smoothness, there is nothing u say...
a lot of people say that about the whole! controle of the game so i just assume that u guys dont have the best quality of responsivness on ur machine n thats why u say that about close control aswell, coz thats a problem with pes nextgen, its rly the same as the ps2 titles for me


its the same where it wants to be the same level, fast offensive players with high reaction value of agility or...
all the other players react like they shud in a football sim

so what i thought is that u guys kinda dont get this system and hav some responsive issues...
playin with walcott for me, to say a example, is as fluid n responsive exper. as any other pes titles, with or without close control doesnt matter
 
i managed to play with the xbox360 version of fifa10, the only thing that fifa is million years ahead of pes is the commentary...ofcourse its not the same quality as in real life, but compared to pes ...i was like WOA!!!
 
gabe.paul.logan said:
i managed to play with the xbox360 version of fifa10, the only thing that fifa is million years ahead of pes is the commentary...ofcourse its not the same quality as in real life, but compared to pes ...i was like WOA!!!
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I play pes 2010 much much more than FIFA 10 but whenever i do, the the commentary is the one of thew first things that impresses me every time i play Fifa, they capture Martins and Grays chemistry perfectly and it just sounds a lot more natural than Pes forced tone of thier commentary recordings
 


This is how must look PES 2011... How one guy from evo-web can make this.. but hole Konami's team can't do it ??
 
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Pretty nice, but thats all. By the way Rooney still wearing armor kit and i dont like his skin. But as i said pretty nice from a one man job.
 
PES2010 looks very good graphically, so I don't think Konami should make graphics their priority (I'm sure they're not). Sure, there is room for improvement, eg. the crowd, lighting and pitch textures....but I'll be happy if PES2011 looks the same. It's the animations I want.
 
Jamezinho said:
Proper animations, collisions and a realistic feeling of inertia are more important to me than 360 degree movement. Fifa09 was 8-direction but because the animations were so smooth it gave a feeling of more freedom.

For me the jury is still out on 360 degree movement. I'm not sure it's as important as some make it out to be. It adds nothing to the experience in Fifa10 (imo) and certainly doesn't improve tight control. I think full 360 makes the game feel a bit slack and vague.
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360 isn't something that can be perfected in one edition, tbh. It was always going to need to evolve over time, but it's a bloody good first stab.

360 movement and the list of things you prefer to it aren't mutually exclusive at all. I've tried to make it clear to Gary Paterson as many times as possible that the responsiveness at low speeds needs improving and that general movement needs to be more precise. He's said that they're working on these as well as on pingpong passing), though he's currently keeping his cards close to his chest as to how.

But for me, 360 movement is something that football games can't omit anymore. It's the present, let alone the future. It makes a world of difference. For FIFA, it's pretty much everything else that needs to be properly tuned - and the fans on the official site are being pretty vocal about simming up too.
 
Jamezinho said:
PES2010 looks very good graphically, so I don't think Konami should make graphics their priority (I'm sure they're not). Sure, there is room for improvement, eg. the crowd, lighting and pitch textures....but I'll be happy if PES2011 looks the same. It's the animations I want.
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yeah PES 2010 looks great and far better than Fifa, and yes i agree it just needs some little tweaks, i wouldn't be suprised if pes 2011 looks even better graphically, but its not the most important thing on the list atm.
 
romagnoli said:
But for me, 360 movement is something that football games can't omit anymore. It's the present, let alone the future. It makes a world of difference. For FIFA, it's pretty much everything else that needs to be properly tuned - and the fans on the official site are being pretty vocal about simming up too.
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I respect your opinion, but I still question if full 360 movement is a game-changing feature? I'm not advocating that football games should stick steadfastly to 8-direction control so that the d-pad dinosaurs can still play the game. I want more precise control, but not to the point where the game becomes cumbersome or awkward to play. I've always said that 32-directional control would be sufficient, and with good animations would feel very organic. This could be how it's implemented in Fifa10 anyway as I doubt that each of the 360 degrees is mapped to the analogue stick.

But after going back to Fifa09 and Euro 08 the thought never entered my head that these games need 360 control. It simply wasn't an issue for me.
 
Aqua said:
guys....
stop adoring the ps2 titles..it gets odd...

there is no randomness, there is no lack of smoothness, there is nothing u say...
a lot of people say that about the whole! controle of the game so i just assume that u guys dont have the best quality of responsivness on ur machine n thats why u say that about close control aswell, coz thats a problem with pes nextgen, its rly the same as the ps2 titles for me


its the same where it wants to be the same level, fast offensive players with high reaction value of agility or...
all the other players react like they shud in a football sim

so what i thought is that u guys kinda dont get this system and hav some responsive issues...
playin with walcott for me, to say a example, is as fluid n responsive exper. as any other pes titles, with or without close control doesnt matter
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Why stop liking them, pes 2010 came out on the ps2 as well. Its a very good game. And my opinion better than ps3 version, this is why I compare alot. Its just frustrating as Konami know how to make excellent football games. I reckon 2011 on Next-Gen will be their 1 st real quality game on ps3/xbox 360/pc. 2010 is good but not up to standard.
 
Jamezinho said:
I respect your opinion, but I still question if full 360 movement is a game-changing feature? I'm not advocating that football games should stick steadfastly to 8-direction control so that the d-pad dinosaurs can still play the game. I want more precise control, but not to the point where the game becomes cumbersome or awkward to play. I've always said that 32-directional control would be sufficient, and with good animations would feel very organic. This could be how it's implemented in Fifa10 anyway as I doubt that each of the 360 degrees is mapped to the analogue stick.

But after going back to Fifa09 and Euro 08 the thought never entered my head that these games need 360 control. It simply wasn't an issue for me.
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I was told the actual number of directions at one point. It was more than 128 in some situations, reducing for sprinting, that much I remember. It's certainly accurate enough for slight stick movements to be represented on-screen. I'd say 64 is the minimum required personally, though 32 might just about do it. Certainly 8 is just not enough for me now. As I said, I don't feel that you cannot have a tight or precise game with 360 controls either. It's just that a 360 degree game is a wildly different beast for devs to tame compared to an 8 directional one, so it will take time and experience to get this side of it back up to scratch, even if that time and experience is (hopefully) 1 edition's worth.

I genuinely do think being able to move wherever you'd like is of massive benefit. In Clubs, particularly, when I'm controlling one man, it comes into it's own. I've scored a couple of terrific team goals now where I've run deep from midfield at angles that you just wouldn't be able to get without 360 (or 128 or 64) controls. I've also blocked a fair few shots because I've been able to get in exactly the right position, rather than over-and-undercorrect because the control scheme is not fit for this scenario.

Being able to arc your run to stay offside (or indeed to get the opposition attacker offside), angling your run to stop a defender from intercepting you, subtly skimming along the challenge of a marker (when physicality doesn't completely overdo it and leave you a broken heap on the floor), it all makes a significant difference. It just needs tightening up in a number of respects, in the way that 8 directional dribbling, or abortive attempts at 360 like that in PES 2010, doesn't need because it's evolved over more than a decade.

Having said all this, the thing I miss from FIFA most when I play PES 2010 is variable speed. You can walk in FIFA, or jockey very slowly. In PES it's either stationary or full tilt. It feels remarkably inorganic by comparison and I hope it's one of the things they change for 2011.
 
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romagnoli said:
Having said all this, the thing I miss from FIFA most when I play PES 2010 is variable speed. You can walk in FIFA, or jockey very slowly. In PES it's either stationary or full tilt. It feels remarkably inorganic by comparison and I hope it's one of the things they change for 2011.
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Yes, this is something I miss also, and just adds to the clunky feeling when playing PES2010. It's stand still or run, with nothing in between.

Variable/full analogue player speed really has to be on the agenda for PES2011.
 
romagnoli said:
I'd say 64 is the minimum required personally, though 32 might just about do it. Certainly 8 is just not enough for me now. As I said, I don't feel that you cannot have a tight or precise game with 360 controls either.
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After having played PES2010 for some time, I must say that at least 64-direction movement is a key improvement.
I just struggle playing WE9LE/PES6 now without that kind of "almost-360-degree movement" I got used to..
But, as I said before at a certain point (maybe not in this thread though) way more important than 360 degree movement is 360 degree ball control: if I want to put the ball there, I should be able to put the ball THERE. I don't want the CPU to decide on my behalf where the ball is going to go!!
I think PES2010 made a big step forward also in this direction, but I still feel that ball control isn't "proper" yet.. Sometimes the passes are still misplaced and the shots go where the CPU wants them to go instead of where I tell them to go..
 
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