FIFA 23 Discussion Thread (Console Versions)

[el niche]

Disappointed but that's where the game is headed. I leave it up to you guys to write in twitter and start change.org petitions (I'm sure EA will probably snap their fingers and say "gosh we forgot to code in defense" while they sleep in a truckload of $).

I really think they had something good with '22 if they could just activate some sort of brain with defense and positioning. But that's the way the game is now. It will be the same for '24 undoubtedly.
It's an NFL Blitz now, take it as what it is.

Edit: I've actually been playing FUT so you can call me a FUT player, but that doesn't mean I want the game in the direction its heading. I like to point out that I am a FUT player because this forum uses its players as a scapegoat for their frustrations. Yes I play it, no I am not stealing money from my parents to fund my squad (actually haven't spent a dime) and yes I would like to have defense in my FUT games.

 

[rojofa]

I honestly don't even have anything to say about new football games this year, nothing even worth discussion. It's going to be more of the same shit.

Absolute garbage, I've lost all hope and the eFootball shitshow last year was the final nail in the coffin.

The only thing which could possibly change their direction is heavy regulation on lootboxes/gambling/P2W. Doesn't look like that's forthcoming but would be delighted to be proven wrong.

 

[Emroth]

I used to get really annoyed when someone was coming here, calling us toxic, after sprouting an utter pile of shite as arguments and then playing a victim of toxicity when people pulled him over it.

Now it doesnt really bother me anymore, I just laugh.

Coz apparently we are ELITISTS for wanting to see fouls in football games and decent AI and have a challenge to score a goal.
Coz these are not basics of football, these are, apparently, some next fucking level features!
And how dare we pulling EA on ignoring the basics of sport?!
And how dare we not be grateful for being able to read a book and visit a mate in a hospital?
EA is doing so fucking much to please us and we are just a bunch of ungrateful toxic bastards.

 

[Placebo]

I don't know how much of the core gameplay has changed to be honest as the last Operation Sports sliders for FIFA 22 seem to correct most of the technical problems but as we all know, there's not much (without editing each individual team's tactics) that we can do to stop the tactical mess but these sliders seem to counter most of the technical things.

Big problem with sliders is that for some reason their impact was massively reduced in 22 compared to previous Fifas.

 

[pacpes]

#FIFA23 hasn't trended on Twitter, besides when they launched the first trailer, until they talked about FUT. 'nuff said.

 

[Jay-Jay 10]

Coz apparently we are ELITISTS for wanting to see fouls in football games and decent AI and have a challenge to score a goal.

Which I never said. But apparently you feel the need to twist my words to somehow excuse your behaviour. Which is fine.

Again funnily enough I also want gameplay improvements and so on. Which you ignore when I state it since it doesn't help your story. I just say the aggressiveness and toxic behaviour to players who also like features is unnecessary. But if you think spouting your frustration in that behaviour helps you, more power to you the laughing part is equal by the way.

 

[TheWolf]

I used to get really annoyed when someone was coming here, calling us toxic, after sprouting an utter pile of shite as arguments and then playing a victim of toxicity when people pulled him over it.

Now it doesnt really bother me anymore, I just laugh.

Coz apparently we are ELITISTS for wanting to see fouls in football games and decent AI and have a challenge to score a goal.
Coz these are not basics of football, these are, apparently, some next fucking level features!
And how dare we pulling EA on ignoring the basics of sport?!
And how dare we not be grateful for being able to read a book and visit a mate in a hospital?
EA is doing so fucking much to please us and we are just a bunch of ungrateful toxic bastards.

End of the day mate, we're in 2022. FIFA 16 was 6 years ago and how much progress have we made in gameplay? PES 6/2007 was 15 years ago and how much progress do we have on that side? With the power of modern day consoles, there is zero excuse to say there's not enough resources to properly simulate accurately a football game. I know we all get romantic about FIFA 16/PES 6 but the truth is, most of us would take those games with updated graphics and rosters and be happier than a pig in shit (sorry Peppa!)

If this community is toxic then it's only representative of the fact THERE IS NO EXCUSE to not have games better than those two titles. They should be confined to the rubbish bin of history but instead here we are having to look into the past to try and shape the future of the games. We do need to be a little more balanced and point out the good things when we see them too though but game-breaking features shouldn't be a thing anymore. It's not like the real sport has changed so much that they can't analyse what a proper game should look like.

So what that they have a FUT base they aim their marketing at! There's enough players aged 16+ (and even younger) who want an accurate simulation and the fact Konami has lasted as long as it as with it's PES titles with poor licenses, etc. is proof people will forego a lot to get a more realistic experience and put their money where their mouth is. Crap, I spent about 10-15 hours a week making patches as 'The Wolf' for the PES/WE titles because I believed in the gameplay so much in the PES 5-9 era and it was so much more enjoyable/realistic than FIFA at the time. Then the PES series went tits-up for 7-8 years allowing FIFA to out-PES the actual PES titles. Only Konami's hardcore fanbase kept the series alive because with a couple of exceptions (e.g. PES 2013 and 2016 to a lesser extent), we saw nothing promising again until PES 2017. The same year EA/FIFA decided to go backwards.

I'm glad we have so long to provide feedback on this beta because if they ignore the simulation crowd this time around, we know it's over for good. There's a place in the game to support FUT superhero mode and a realistic simulation offline for the leagues and career mode. Even the online modes should have a choice between arcade and simulation leagues. NO EXCUSE WHATSOEVER! It doesn't matter if FUT is 80% of their base, that still leaves a lot of people when we're talking how many millions of copies sold each year (FIFA 22 had sold 9 million by January) in revenue to miss out on if Konami beat EA to a good sim or vice versa. Actually, if EA ever make a great footy sim, eFootball will die in it's sleep overnight.

 

[rockstrongo]

If we're a miniscule part of their income (offline players) which I can't believe we are since they try to promote the game as a football game first, and having all the right things done outside gameplay (atmosphere/looks/stadiums) it's so weird that they can't separate gameplay for the two?
Are they afraid it will take away from the online income?

Having a separate gameplay that is more realism based and a more arcade one for online how hard can it be?
They would only have to revert back to a FIFA 14/15/16 code and tweak it ,and having the latest gameplay patch for FUT/pro clubs.

The reason it's not done that way is obviously bad for business and shareholders ,nothing else!
Just imagine how it's going to be when EA FC is released...

 

[Sami 1999]

End of the day mate, we're in 2022. FIFA 16 was 6 years ago and how much progress have we made in gameplay? PES 6/2007 was 15 years ago and how much progress do we have on that side? With the power of modern day consoles, there is zero excuse to say there's not enough resources to properly simulate accurately a football game. I know we all get romantic about FIFA 16/PES 6 but the truth is, most of us would take those games with updated graphics and rosters and be happier than a pig in shit (sorry Peppa!)

This! At this point I'd take fifa 16 gameplay with improved graphics and rosters.

 

[saturator]

They can add as much of that stuff as they like and I wouldn't ever moan about it again (I promise, EA, if you're out there ) if I could just play offline games where your AI and the opponent AI worked as a team - NOT 1v1 only, which simply doesn't represent the sport (I get it for online, but not for offline when it breaks the game like it does in my opinion) - to stop you getting through on goal so easily.

It's so obvious when the AI just jogs on the spot next to you that they're not the designated 1v1 player, so you're "free to go". Which isn't realistic, or fun, it's just frustrating that the game "isn't trying". It's very genuinely a broken game as far as I can see (for offline purposes), and the guys I know with the 23 beta have come back to me to say "I can't stop running from box to box now like you pointed out".

They fix that (not a "quick fix" like making the AI try to break your legs with every tackle to reintroduce fouls, as happened a few FIFA 22 patches ago, but actually giving all players their AI back), and I can love the game. It's really just that. I could moan about the skating (which is very much still there) and limbs ghosting through solid objects (same), but it doesn't compare to the 1v1 issue. That simply destroys offline play irrevocably, not just in my opinion but also the likes of Matt10 of Operation Sports, and everyone I've spoken to personally who is playing the 23 beta.

Hi Chris.
This beta looks very very bad. I can't play before saturday afternoon, and more I read you more the fear is growing.
How many matches did you play? WC or Legendary? FUTO/Semi/Fuma?

What's good, what's wrong? Did you have started a career ?

 

[rockstrongo]

A mix of two things
1) Yeah of course they'd like everyone to play the casino mode.
2) Everything else is extremely low priority. If there are no people rioting with a trending hashtag, they've done enough.

As a testament of number 2:
In 19 they changed the tactical system and didn't bother changing the AI to use it. So for the first time since the stone age of football games the cpu didn't change anything during a game. Now, FOUR (4) years later they brought it back as a new feature. That's 4 years to make the cpu double tap right on the d-pad and switch to "attacking" if they're losing.

But it was also amazing to see how many people wouldn't even notice or care about how brain dead the cpu was in this regard all these years. So, I can't blame them too much for taking their sweet time.

Good analysis buddy, I agree.
If I'm not wrong ,FIFA 20 was the first game where promoted/relegated teams had the right league badge on the jersey if promoted/relegated.
Which is extremely sloppy and lazy.
And yet to this day ,there's no managerial sackings, except your own.
Outside the presentation/atmosphere etc Fifa is a very half assed game imo.

Back when Pes was relevant and a competitor we always compared the two, imo I've always compared FIFA with its big budget, to the two other sport giants MLB The Show and NBA 2k.
Budget wise that's where the comparison should be ,and Fifa has always been so far behind it's almost laughable.

I wrote RIP Pes when efootball came out ,and I'm pretty sure I'll write RIP FIFA next year, and not only because of the name change

 

[Nicholas]

Ball still clips... and that rotation on the spot...

 

[rockstrongo]

Ball still clips... and that rotation on the spot...
View attachment 172931

And that skating when handling the ball.
Jesus!

 

[Emroth]

Which I never said

You literally did.

Im coming here, pointing out the stupid way that EA development is heading towards, stating fundamental gameplay issues, that are bugging this game for the last 6 years at least, since Frostbite was implemented. I also give examples of idiotic things that EA is focusing on, instead of tackling the real game issues.
Asking who is this game developed for, coz judging by diabolical state of its On-The-Pitch gameplay - it cant be for football fans.

Then you come in, ignore EVERY SINGLE one of the issues I stated, and come out with "tHaNks FOr dECiDInG fOR mE tHAt Im nOT a FOotbaLL fAN"...

..and when I respons with sarcasm to that ridiculous statement - you go (drums please):

Like I said: to get changes you will need the casual players on board. You won't achieve that by being elitists.

And who do you think we are if not casual gamers?? Average age of Evo member is probly around 35-40.
Most of us have families and not much time to play. We are not e-sport Pros, or streamers, or Fifa champions.
We just want a good football game that has all the basics of football.
If EA is prioritising rpg elements instead of actual gameplay - why would we play it? If a football game has shite football, we might as well play some rpg, that will have better rpg elements.

 

[Jay-Jay 10]

You literally did.

Im coming here, pointing out the stupid way that EA development is heading towards, stating fundamental gameplay issues, that are bugging this game for the last 6 years at least, since Frostbite was implemented. I also give examples of idiotic things that EA is focusing on, instead of tackling the real game issues.
Asking who is this game developed for, coz judging by diabolical state of its On-The-Pitch gameplay - it cant be for football fans.

Then you come in, ignore EVERY SINGLE one of the issues I stated, and come out with "tHaNks FOr dECiDInG fOR mE tHAt Im nOT a FOotbaLL fAN"...

..and when I respons with sarcasm to that ridiculous statement - you go (drums please):




And who do you think we are if not casual gamers?? Average age of Evo member is probly around 35-40.
Most of us have families and not much time to play. We are not e-sport Pros, or streamers, or Fifa champions.
We just want a good football game that has all the basics of football.
If EA is prioritising rpg elements instead of actual gameplay - why would we play it? If a football game has shite football, we might as well play some rpg, that will have better rpg elements.

Wont argue with you anymore it's not worth it. I never said someone wanting gameplay is elitist and I also didn't ignore your points, all I did was saying that I am a footballf an and like these features, while you are ignoring that I am also pro gameplay.But it is also not worth engaging with you when you do stuff like: tHaNks FOr dECiDInG fOR mE tHAt Im nOT a FOotbaLL fAN"... Funny thing is you couldn't find a quote of me saying who wants gameplay is an elitist because I never said that.

If you want to have a real discussion let me know otherwise I will spend my time in better ways.

I like some of the ideas and you don't and that's that. We don't need to agree and we won't and if you don't enjoy the game it is fine by me.

 

[Chris Davies]

Okay guys, let's try and get back to some kind of normality... Let's not give anyone a reason to believe the critique in here isn't heartfelt and valid rather than purely toxic.

I'll be deleting anything that's just an insult from now on. Debate is fine but please keep on topic and discuss rather than bait each other.

 

[zyrien]

do we have any beta opinions?

 

[fallensoldier]

Wont argue with you anymore it's not worth it. I never said someone wanting gameplay is elitist and I also didn't ignore your points, all I did was saying that I am a footballf an and like these features, while you are ignoring that I am also pro gameplay.But it is also not worth engaging with you when you do stuff like: tHaNks FOr dECiDInG fOR mE tHAt Im nOT a FOotbaLL fAN"... Funny thing is you couldn't find a quote of me saying who wants gameplay is an elitist because I never said that.

If you want to have a real discussion let me know otherwise I will spend my time in better ways.

I like some of the ideas and you don't and that's that. We don't need to agree and we won't and if you don't enjoy the game it is fine by me.

I don't think you get the MAIN point. There's nothing wrong with liking the RPG elements. The problem is that EA are prioritizing introducing RPG elements instead of BASIC football elements. Most of the flaws highlighted have been in the game for years and they CHOOSE to ignore it because of FUT money. At the end of the day, they can pump all the RPG elements into the game they want, hell make it CyperFifa 2023. It if looks and plays nothing like a realistic game of football, you'll find most people in the forum you choosen to be a part of won't play it. So to recap, there's nothing wrong with wanted or liking RPG elements but all of that is and will always be second nature to having a realistic football game. I welcome all the bells and whistles. From a core PES fan, i'm happy for it but if the core gameplay is as broken and unrealistic as it is then guess what, I won't be playing it nor will I care for it. And they should be called out for it btw and I don't support this crap that we should bend to FUT players to get them to support the cause. Like what. We should all want at the very least a game that as close as possible replicates a real game of football. That doesn't mean that everyone has to play a certain way but CORE fundamentals should be there BEFORE focusing on RPG elements.

 

[Peter Withe]

@Emroth speaks the truth. That is all.

 

[saturator]

I have found this vidéo : United vs City
It looks decent. Not marvellous but playable




What do you think?

 

[ezosk]

I have found this vidéo : United vs City
It looks decent. Not marvellous but playable




What do you think?

I think it's last gen, it says so in the comments and the nets movement also looks like last gen. Nevertheles, besides the cpu doing tricks, which is solvable, it doesn't look too bad.

 

[PRO_TOO]

I think it's last gen, it says so in the comments and the nets movement also looks like last gen. Nevertheles, besides the cpu doing tricks, which is solvable, it doesn't look too bad.

I really like how the camera zooms in for those massive shots. Not saying I like the feature of those shots.

 

[saturator]

I think it's last gen, it says so in the comments and the nets movement also looks like last gen. Nevertheles, besides the cpu doing tricks, which is solvable, it doesn't look too bad.

Yes. I haven't read the comments but yes it's PS4 on Ultimate. The strikes it's because of a shity option on by default

 

[Fukaru]

Maybe I'm simply unlucky, but I swear that every, single interaction I saw or had on Twitter or any other form of social media/comment section with a FUT player was like.. talking with a wall of bricks. Like they just won't listen, game must be fast, game must be filled wih goals, CPU must be stupid and so on and so forth. You'll be laughed at or even just dismissed as nonsensical if you try to explain there is people wanting a football game that represents the sport. I think it was @Chris Davies ?, who once a guy on twitter said to, "Ooh it's you guys, it's you people's fault the game is slow".. something along those lines.

Yeah I don't think there is any dialogue or support or compromise of any sort to have with them.

The exact same thing also applies to your side. It's amusing that you don't seem to realize that.

 

[FShas]

I doubt they would even be offended by that as I could quote them (I won't waste time searching though) saying they don't want a real football game or some variation of that statement.

Personally I think this is now a game for people who hate football.

And no, me saying that won't change the game. But it also won't change if I don't say it or if I just continue buying and playing this garbage. And we don't even want to change or ruin the game for them and I sure don't want to convince them about anything. I want an option that can turn it into a football game for people who want one. This option does not exist.

You've mentioned a game that can be enjoyed by many different people before. That's impossible without the right options. It's never going to be "let's try to convince this many millions that the game should be done our way".

That is the real madness, a perfect recipe for toxicity and why we're here.

This is precisely the point. It's not really a football game anymore is it?

It's a FPS/button basher/player-switching simulator with elements of a football game appended to it.

I do not know a single person who actually cares about the game of football, who understands the game in depth, or at least respects it, who thinks FIFA is great simulation of football. They play it out of habit. Muscle memory.

Conversely, the people who I know who play lots of fifa...dont play football, dont know how to play football, nor do they know anything about the detail or intricacies about football. And that's fine. Why the hell should they? It's like asking a COD player to know about military tactics. Why should they?

Go play the original operation flashpoint on pc.

Oh. I see what's happened here...

 

[Madmac79]

The exact same thing also applies to your side. It's amusing that you don't seem to realize that.

How so? "We" (that are so few and unimportant it's a bit hilarious even calling us a "side", but whatever) advocated for separate gameplays multiple times. I personally don't care to make everyone play "my" game where all of us could be happy in different ways. Tell me how it isn't reasonable? There are example of people like, again, Chris (or even Matt as far as I can remember) engaging positively only to be answered with toxicity.

If you are pissed off at the last pages, I assure you putting on the same plan a bunch of posts on a forum with the swarm of rabid FUT ants on social media is also quite amusing

 

[Jay-Jay 10]

The exact same thing also applies to your side. It's amusing that you don't seem to realize that.

Which is exactly what I meant. You have two sides shouting at each other. One extreme side shouting "you guys ruined everything and are not football fans" and the other shouting "you and your realism, this is not fun". While in the middle and probably the majority you have people who just play the game and enjoy one of the modes, have some things they would like to see improved etc.

And this is where it gets tricky: no matter if you want better gameplay or a new youth academy or new features for FUT, if you will look for your cause you will find a lot of antagonising, name calling, blaming etc if you go online

Which to me is just wrong. Football games should just be fun for everyone and in my opinion the footballgaming community should represent that. I remember the time when I just played football games with friends, some we liked more, some less, some more sim, some more arcade.

But somehow this feeling gets more and more lost online and instead you have two extremes attacking each other.

I still believe if the football gaming community would be exactly that, a community, you would have a much better voice for changes in the football games.

 

[FShas]

Which is exactly what I meant. You have two sides shouting at each other. One extreme side shouting "you guys ruined everything and are not football fans" and the other shouting "you and your realism, this is not fun". While in the middle and probably the majority you have people who just play the game and enjoy one of the modes, have some things they would like to see improved etc.

And this is where it gets tricky: no matter if you want better gameplay or a new youth academy or new features for FUT, if you will look for your cause you will find a lot of antagonising, name calling, blaming etc if you go online

Which to me is just wrong. Football games should just be fun for everyone and in my opinion the footballgaming community should represent that. I remember the time when I just played football games with friends, some we liked more, some less, some more sim, some more arcade.

But somehow this feeling gets more and more lost online and instead you have two extremes attacking each other.

I still believe if the football gaming community would be exactly that, a community, you would have a much better voice for changes in the football games.

I think the issue is that people here feel that the game of football has been actively vandalised to create a bastardised version of the sport. For the sake of making obscene amounts of money. Nothing else. No other higher goal. Nothing. Just make money.

That never happened before. Never. If pes went too arcade one year, they would attempt to balance it the following year. Even fifa yo-yo'd from arcade and simulation through fifa 09, 10, 12, 15, 16 etc. But the intention was always clear. Emulate the sport in a way that represents the essence of the sport. This is probably why you and your friends managed to rub along with various versions. There was a meaningful, common cause between player and developer.

That is no longer happening. And I barely play anything nowadays. Has been 5 years since I've played any football game properly, or even really cared that much. But it's still quite clear to me what's happened in the last 4 years.

It feels at times as if EA have exploited the sport of football to make billions by completely misrepresenting it, under the banner of authenticity.

The game lacks integrity. And this will be its ultimate demise, I expect. 10-15 years from now, people will probably abandon the game in its droves because it will have no intrinsic worth or value.

And then a developer, EA or some other, will talk about recreating the sport in its truest form.

It's happened with other sports and will happen here too eventually.

 

[manmachine]

Which to me is just wrong. Football games should just be fun for everyone and in my opinion the footbal lgaming community should represent that.

I suppose I'll repeat myself. A game can not be fun for everyone without the right options which is 100% EA's fault but you'd rather blame the users.

You just can't get away with a sports game with no fucking AI because that's what the "pros" want for their e-sport and then serve that to everyone else on all your offline modes. It's madness. But apparently the users are to blame.

So yeah, the stupid competitive scene has ruined football games.

 

[rockstrongo]

I think the issue is that people here feel that the game of football has been actively vandalised to create a bastardised version of the sport. For the sake of making obscene amounts of money. Nothing else. No other higher goal. Nothing. Just make money.

That never happened before. Never. If pes went too arcade one year, they would attempt to balance it the following year. Even fifa yo-yo'd from arcade and simulation through fifa 09, 10, 12, 15, 16 etc. But the intention was always clear. Emulate the sport in a way that represents the essence of the sport. This is probably why you and your friends managed to rub along with various versions. There was a meaningful, common cause between player and developer.

That is no longer happening. And I barely play anything nowadays. Has been 5 years since I've played any football game properly, or even really cared that much. But it's still quite clear to me what's happened in the last 4 years.

It feels at times as if EA have exploited the sport of football to make billions by completely misrepresenting it, under the banner of authenticity.

The game lacks integrity. And this will be its ultimate demise, I expect. 10-15 years from now, people will probably abandon the game in its droves because it will have no intrinsic worth or value.

And then a developer, EA or some other, will talk about recreating the sport in its truest form.

It's happened with other sports and will happen here too eventually.

That's a very balanced and sober analysis of this series (and others).
Well written.