FIFA 12 Discussion Thread

It's strange, I agree with some of your points, yet massively disagree with others. The bottom-line is this, surely the better game is the one that represents football the best ?

Football is an incredibly simple game that is incredibly difficult to replicate. First and foremost, you need to get the basics right. And they are simple. You need a ball, two goals, a pitch and 22 individual players that collectively combine to make two unique teams. Thats it. EA Sports get the first 3 things right.

Only when you begin to the grasp the bare minimum basics, can you then move onto everything else.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
Only when you begin to the grasp the bare minimum basics, can you then move onto everything else.
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EA are trying to go at it the other way round though. Prioritise the animations and aesthetics first, and cram the game full of modes to pull in the crowds, then try and reverse-engineer in some actual football.
 
MadbaLL said:
more promising then pes 2012 trailer.

we'll see what's next.
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Well it's not really, is it?

Neither trailer really shows you true gameplay footage, both display new features in isolation and you can almost guarantee that both have been highly edited to make certain aspects look good.

One thing that is beginning to grate about FIFA is their stupid quirky titles for all the new features. Obviously it's a marketing ploy for kids to go 'Oooh look PRECISION dribbling or PRO PASSING' or whatever, but that just annoys me.

I bought, and play, both PES and FIFA this year, but I have a feeling that the demo will sway me either way come release in October.
 
Hi guys, I haven t introduced myself around here yet, I have been taking my time reading through threads and having a general look around the forums, and must I say its been very interesting to reed most of what you guys have to say.

I`m a big football fan - as most of you certainly are - and it so happens that I play FIFA albeit using full manual controls.

I also share most of your concerns regarding this game, some of them brought to light after reading "The Enemies of FIFA" thread - yup, I read it all - over at the EA forums.

Rodelero said:
http://bit.ly/iTzRL0

My impressions.
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Thought that your work towards analysing the game was very impressive, now I m just hoping that it can actually impact on the production of the game itself.I don t think EA Sports has anyone on their team that can - or intend to - understand your points to a full extent i m afraid, lets keep our fingers crossed.

Great read, cheers!
 
It didn't impressive at all to be honest.

That precision dribbling looks weird. Ribery moves at the beginning doesnt look natural. He makes like 10 little touchs in front of a defender that's just two stpes ahead, and he's almost floating.

I like the shooting at the final tho.
 
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Ronaldinho_23 said:
simulation is BIG
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Really you know, please just and move like Hummels did in the first part of the trailer. try and jockey while twisting your legs like he did there? Just try in your room or in a space to do that!

I think we need a video demonstrating just how ridiculous the foot planting is in FIFA, with people in real life showing it's impossible to move like they do.
 
Shearer_God said:
I bought, and play, both PES and FIFA this year, but I have a feeling that the demo will sway me either way come release in October.
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Hah, that may be tricky business, since both companies like to make post-demo gameplay changes, making full game experience somewhat different from the demo
 
I just tried to move like Hummels did when jockeying Ribery in the video. Whats stopping me from moving like him is that he, 'literally' slides along the grass when he crosses his legs to change he angle he jockeys Ribery at.

So would i be able to do that if i was wearing slippers on a shiny polished floor?

No, still no! There's no weight transfer in his movement either he he crosses his legs and twists direction. My upper body would need to make a swivel movement for me to change like Hummels did.

My conclusion is that maybe i could try and dance like that when i go out tonight as it does look slick but on a football field, it shouldn't be possible to move like that. What makes it worse is that FIFA 09 even didn't have thes foot planting issues so there's NO EXCUSE!

But maybe I'm wrong and how Hummels changed direction is a perfect example of a simulation for a human being moving!

I'm actually thinking of trying to slide and change direction like Ashley Cole did just after Terry's block.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
It's strange, I agree with some of your points, yet massively disagree with others. The bottom-line is this, surely the better game is the one that represents football the best ?

Football is an incredibly simple game that is incredibly difficult to replicate. First and foremost, you need to get the basics right. And they are simple. You need a ball, two goals, a pitch and 22 individual players that collectively combine to make two unique teams. Thats it. EA Sports get the first 3 things right.

Only when you begin to the grasp the bare minimum basics, can you then move onto everything else.
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Hit the nail on the head.
 
StuartCulli said:
Can someone please reiterate what role a GameChanger actually plays?
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They are just a selection of people that like the game, understand it and don't swear about the dev's mom's in every post.

Also GC's represent a wider base than just hardcore "sim" fans. There are lots of Clubs GC's, online ranked play GC's, CM GC's Like Nick and then you have more gameplay focused GC's like Rod and Rom.

We just pass our thoughts on and your thoughts on. That's basically it. It is then down to them to do something or not. It's why it's frustrating that people seem to think there is some sort of special powers as a GC.
 
Just read Rodelero's write-up & that is the exact sort of thing EA needs to be paying attention to. Fantastically thought out.

We just pass our thoughts on and your thoughts on. That's basically it. It is then down to them to do something or not. It's why it's frustrating that people seem to think there is some sort of special powers as a GC.
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Cool, cheers.
 
glen said:
They are just a selection of people that like the game, understand it and don't swear about the dev's mom's in every post.

Also GC's represent a wider base than just hardcore "sim" fans. There are lots of Clubs GC's, online ranked play GC's, CM GC's Like Nick and then you have more gameplay focused GC's like Rod and Rom.

We just pass our thoughts on and your thoughts on. That's basically it. It is then down to them to do something or not. It's why it's frustrating that people seem to think there is some sort of special powers as a GC.
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We do have the power to drain Alister's hospitality budget...:P
 
Something i forget about gamechangers is that to me it seems as if their requests, feedback and wishes are not treated as important compared to the skill monkeys like these.

YouTube - Lets Talk FIFA 12 | Be The Referee?

We always forget that unfortunate it may be, these guys come first for EA and the game will always be built to suit them. THIS is EA's target market! It's unlikely we going to see a game in which this guy isn't able to batter rubbish opponents online by string together 6-7 silly tricks and score from a rabona with wait for it....

Antonio Cassano!

Ten, eleven years ago i remember people use to criticize EA heavily for their unrealistic gameplay in which you could run round 6 players and score with almost anyone. People use to hate them with a passion, nowadays it's the exact same thing with flashy animations but instead they get awards and praise for the game being a simulation!
 
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With FIFA having such a massive fan base it's always going to be hard to get them away from the pick up and play masses and more towards the Sim based game we would prefer. It's the same push and pull every year...
 
Nick Cave said:
With FIFA having such a massive fan base it's always going to be hard to get them away from the pick up and play masses and more towards the Sim based game we would prefer. It's the same push and pull every year...
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Well a game in which you can do all these tricks etc.. and beat 6-7 people, could that still form into the philosophy of easy to learn hard to master? That's a million dollar question.

Could you add enough simulation without alienating EA's main market?
 
After reading some impressions and watching gameplay videos, my initial excitement is gone. Yet another year of pretending to be a footy sim. EA's technical guys are top notch, they just need better direction.
 
zlac said:
Hah, that may be tricky business, since both companies like to make post-demo gameplay changes, making full game experience somewhat different from the demo
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Well yeah obviously, but the demo will give some indication to the quality and improvements made in each game.
 
I do think there will be something in this year's edition for the hardcore. There will be reason to play with it and see what it offers you as an experience, and I do think a lot of us in this thread will still be here complaining rather than giving up and moving on to PES/something else. It's just a way off what we want and probably will be for a couple of years still.
 
At the end of the day i judge a game of football when playing it with a mate at home versus...Online will always be laggy and exploitable and playing VS the computer the Ai is always crap and boring all these years in both games.In Fifa when i play with my best friend almost full manual ( IMO manual needs a lot of work,some aspects are broken ) its completely different game from Fifa assisted...What i want 2 say generally is that two bad players can make a good game look ugly and bad...Sometimes the way we choose to play is responsible for the game we will see
 
kobayashi said:
Why? Did he beat you :LOL:?
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No, because he's preaching to the masses about superficial (and often insane) things & unfortunately the 'cunts' I speak of eat it all up. It's a shame that these are the people who get the 'final word in', let's say, when it comes to FIFA.

That's business though, isn't it?
 
o S i V a 2 1 o said:
In Fifa when i play with my best friend almost full manual ( IMO manual needs a lot of work,some aspects are broken ) its completely different game from Fifa assisted..
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No, not really. manual dosen't fix the defensive issues or gliding movement, or add anything tactics-wise or add any individuality and i can go on all day, really i can!

It's just harder, and for you more satisfying. But it's still the same game, just harder. I know from playing manual myself thats the case. There a different ways to play football games which game the experience but with FIFA the issues just destroy all these methods of playing.

I just take no please or fun whatsoever scoring on assisted manual or whatever controls when the defences are as broken and as flawed in their current state. The gliding movement and lack of any individuality also takes away too much need for skill, in your knowledge of getting the best out of that player. It kills all the respect you have for the game being for fun or simulation.
 
StuartCulli said:
Can someone please reiterate what role a GameChanger actually plays?
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Glen did a fairly good job of explaining what they are right now, so I won't add to that much. The question for me is what the GameChangers can be and whether the GameChanger's are using their influence as best they can.

Over the last two years, before I was a GC and while the programme was getting off the ground (if not in name), I often grew a bit frustrated when I compared the impressions that I heard from the GCs with the reality of what was released. I probably came off a bit rudely when challenging them on this at times, because in reality they certainly aren't trying to con anyone: but it's often quite difficult to know how a game will turn out when it's somewhat skeletal. There is no doubt that the game changed quite a bit from when they were playing it in April to what they then played in October. I think it's a combination of it being new territory for everyone, and a difficulty when trying to review something which is unfinished.

I think those mistakes can (and have in large part) been learnt from, but it doesn't remove the awkwardness of making comments on a game which isn't finished. I certainly don't want to screw EA by giving a really negative impression of a game which is in that state because it's got months 'til it releases; nor do I want to cover up the issues which are there, so it's not easy to strike the right balance.

There is a surprising level of consensus on most things within the GCs: it's about trying to make the GC's (which are little more than an extension of the various online FIFA communities) a force to behold against the likes of IGN who do little more than clap EA's every fart.

My mission is to make FIFA a better game. I feel that I'm in a better position to help do than than ever. Maybe I'm hopelessly naive, but I'm enjoying the challenge either way.
 
Judging from that trailer their is still absolutely no player inertia or footplanting at all.

The way they spin so quickly reminds me of a dog chasing his own tail.
 
StuartCulli said:
No, because he's preaching to the masses about superficial (and often insane) things & unfortunately the 'cunts' I speak of eat it all up. It's a shame that these are the people who get the 'final word in', let's say, when it comes to FIFA.

That's business though, isn't it?
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Well that's true he dosen't have an intellectual understanding of football at all. I mean look at the way he plays the game! Although not everybody who has in depth knowledge of football takes video games seriously and some play for fun regardless of how sim like the game is, i think in this case the skill monkey nature of his game and the topic he preaches do all add up to a lack of real football understanding, or even caring about simulation.

He's just a casual football fan at the end of the day. Thing is but if it carry on this way, FIFA might end up eating itself like PES did with PES on the PS2. PES on the PS2 was the best but the lack innovation really from PES 3onwards eventually morphed into a monster with PES 6-2009. By not addressing the big issues just relying on the recycling the old gameplay, making sprinting etc.. too important and flashy gimmicks.

EA to decide marketing wise where they stand on this arcade or simulation identity. Are they just focusing on the casuals an not try to trick people into believing this is simulation? Or do they genuinely want a simulation?
 
What have the GCs been asking for over the last nine months? Surely they will have pointed out that attributes, including Stamina, have little to no impact on the game, so surely that will be something EA will look at before 12 is released... right?

kobayashi said:
EA to decide marketing wise where they stand on this arcade or simulation identity. Are they just focusing on the casuals an not try to trick people into believing this is simulation? Or do they genuinely want a simulation?
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No, they don't need to decide anything. Like anyone else, they want to sell as many copies of their game as possible. That means appealing to all audiences.
 
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