FIFA 12 Discussion Thread

I am pretty shocked that EA got rid of the pressure systm. I honestly didnt think they would scrap this and would just claim to of made some tweaks. To rip it out and start again is a nice surprise!!
 
Bitter Rivals said:
Rob is as opitimistic as ever, it is refreshing too see
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The lesson of FIFA 10/11's disappointments has been learned.

I used to be hopeful in the build-up to the new FIFA, but last year was the final straw, there's no reason to expect any different this time around.
 
It's better to voice concerns now before everything is set in stone. Even if EA people don't read this board, we do have some people that do give direct feedback to them and could tell them our concerns if they agree with them. I really hope these people mention the inertia/momentum/weight things because they would make so much difference. That and the concern that everyone still have perfect touches all the time in the video. It is most obvious in the precision dribble where they make a lot of touches all over the place but never have a bad touch, it's not that easy to move around that quickly (especially not dribbling with both feet). Calculate some error in the touches depending on stats and situation and it would mirror real life really good.
 
GOL: First dispel all doubts. This year we are responsible not only for the console, but PCs FIF-E. Can we conclude that the "Dozen" will be identical on all platforms?

David Rutter: Yes, as a line producer I am finally able to supervise the work on all three versions of the FIF-y and I can assure you that we work hard and do what we can to this year edition of the PC was exactly the same as the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3


Finally PES has some real pressure....I wanna wait to see where the editing community will shift...
 
For me most of the things I've seen are positive.

I have 3 worries:

1. The "jogging in a circle" video (not the new slow dribble) still has the player doing instant 90+ degree turns without loosing any speed whatsoever. I hope this is improved to more mirror the way the player moves when using the technical dribble feature.

2. I agree that the "Contain" movement by the defender looks rubbish, exactly mirroring the attacker, even when the defender is sidestepping awkwardly. Needs alot of work.

3. Please please have an actual replay save feature this year, one that desn't render Flash files but saves the actual game data. I don't care if every replat takes up 10 MB, I just want the option.
 
The notes I took during the webcast:

Gameplay Only


* Close precision dribbling
* Improved jockeying
* Tactical defending
* No Auto Tackle
* Press is now contain

* More chances in area at top of box
* No more heat-seeking missiles (defenders)
* Better ability to buy time
* More tactical defending
* "Wow feel" rewarded for standing tackles
* 0-0 matches no longer boring stalemates; more exciting and engaging
* Secondary press still in but more "intelligent" coordination (whatever that means)
* All players can use "precision dribbling"; how well is attribute based


* New "Impact Engine"
*
* Biggest change in engine since next gens
* greater variety and realism in collisions
* variety almost "endless"
* real world physics
* More realistic interactions: no more clipping, bodies going through bodies
* Contextual Dribble Turns
* improved players avoiding defenders w/ left stick b/c players avoid tackles based on context

* better "resilience" of dribblers
*
* can now continue through stumbling animations to continue dribble




* "Foundations for the Future"
*
1. "True Injuries"
* Ex: bent knee animation = real knee injury

2. "Self injuries"
* Ex: a tired player stretches and pulls muscle

3. "Re-Injuries"
* risk of re-injuring same injury

4. "Push-pull"
* button press to harry dribbler from behind (I guess in replace of current crap jockeying interactions?)


* Fouls: game flows better b/c players better fight through smaller challenges; improved "resilience"
* AI: "Pro Player Intelligence"
* extra layer of awareness - players knowing what he is good at and teammates good at
* greater authenticity when playing against cpu
* Ex: Crouch as striker and strategy of crosses into box; AI teams would play different strategy with Crouch than with D. Villa




* "Vision Map"
*
* been in game before but not very good
* players see different things depending upon stats
* see more or less of the field
* see more or less and quicker/slower surrounding and development of play

* AI
* Can now more realistic and variable between opponents b/c team plays to strengths now
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Don't know that it adds anything but whatever...
 
I would rike more info on this "improved" jockeying, or I might not be able to sleep.
 
No I didn't. I guess I was just assuming that it would be the standing tackle button, and it would be contextual based, so that when you're not in a position to stick a boot in, your defender would cheat with his hands. But who knows?
 
Vieirinha said:
GOL: First dispel all doubts. This year we are responsible not only for the console, but PCs FIF-E. Can we conclude that the "Dozen" will be identical on all platforms?

David Rutter: Yes, as a line producer I am finally able to supervise the work on all three versions of the FIF-y and I can assure you that we work hard and do what we can to this year edition of the PC was exactly the same as the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3


Finally PES has some real pressure....I wanna wait to see where the editing community will shift...
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Most of them have shifted already to be fair. The majority of them are all into graphics, animations etc.. and aren't big with their knowledge of football.

Then again, there's always been a huge FIFA modding community at soccer gaming so it's not as if FIFA needs help in this regard.
 
kobayashi said:
Most of them have shifted already to be fair. The majority of them are all into graphics, animations etc.. and aren't big with their knowledge of football.

Then again, there's always been a huge FIFA modding community at soccer gaming so it's not as if FIFA needs help in this regard.
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But as far as evo-web is concered the PES editing community is still vibrant and thriving...
 
Gab_ said:
It's better to voice concerns now before everything is set in stone. Even if EA people don't read this board, we do have some people that do give direct feedback to them and could tell them our concerns if they agree with them. I really hope these people mention the inertia/momentum/weight things because they would make so much difference. That and the concern that everyone still have perfect touches all the time in the video. It is most obvious in the precision dribble where they make a lot of touches all over the place but never have a bad touch, it's not that easy to move around that quickly (especially not dribbling with both feet). Calculate some error in the touches depending on stats and situation and it would mirror real life really good.
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Yes, thing is atm no matter how nice and impressive this video and information has been it's not about they shizzle they release in may which sounds as if it's aimed at hardcore players. It's about the demo and about whether or not they dub down the game for casuals prior to to release (mainly in august)

Romi put a lot of effort in last year to advise EA on what do to make the simulation we want and he was screwed! It's seems in the development phase they release videos and early builds with the game being balanced at it's upper most to a simulation as they can offer, which will get those around to write positive things about e game, then at the last minute they hit the casual button and all that false hype about the game being a sim is, well, a fraud really!

So this is why atm I'm only impressed by the technology of the impact zone. Thats it, with EA's track record the dribbling looks like it'll be highly generic (they glide and skate, every player dribbles the same), and with EA taking out pressure buttons while it sounds good, i can just see it making tackling 'too hard' and you see scorelines of 6-6 etc.. and mroe abusive formations.

As for the AI :LOL: the demo will explain where it's really at!

I just advise people to be cautions and wait for the demo.
 
Vieirinha said:
But as far as evo-web is concered the PES editing community is still vibrant and thriving...
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Not as much as it was. The development of kitserver this year has been very slow compared to recent years because Juce dosen't like PES anymore.

Had a knock on effect i think, patches haven't been as expansive as compare to PES 5/6 etc.. No face server/stadium server or 3rd kits!

others have left with people following them.
 
kobayashi said:
Not as much as it was. The development of kitserver this year has been very slow compared to recent years because Juce dosen't like PES anymore.

Had a knock on effect i think, patches haven't been as expansive as compare to PES 5/6 etc.. No face server/stadium server or 3rd kits!

others have left with people following them.
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True.

But I really don't think PES modders would go modding Fifa. Maybe they would just leave PES and play Fifa, but with all their licences, there's almost anything left to edit in Fifa games.

The "problem" of PES is its dependency on kitserver. The community has its habits and when kitserver is late (or absent), almost everything else is delayed.
 
Ryuga-san said:
True.

But I really don't think PES modders would go modding Fifa. Maybe they would just leave PES and play Fifa, but with all their licences, there's almost anything left to edit in Fifa games.
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Yeah, actually i say that's closer to the truth. EVERYONE plays fifa, you just can't avoid it. You will have mates out they who have the and you play it. With the whole modding thing, well that's also true in that if you go to soccer gaming, they mod for the sake of it! there isn't much there that needs to be changed (apart from the gameplay)

Also they are still having a very hard time getting to grips with the new technology and things like faces, stadiums even kit's take longer to create than they did previously.

Ryuga-san said:
The "problem" of PES is its dependency on kitserver. The community has its habits and when kitserver is late (or absent), almost everything else is delayed.
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Absolutely! The guy dosen't like the game anyway so he's not going to be arsed to make tools for it. There needs to be alternatives put in place
 
DuduBR9 said:
field.jpg


This pic reminds me of pes 2011 graphics, wich is very good.
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One of the things that I like about PES' camera system is how it physically moves around to track the ball, instead of just panning and tilting, which FIFA does a lot. Here's hoping that's changed.
 
szejkk said:
some pics looks like fifa 11. Hummels face is good. Borussia have more faces?
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At least Götze, Schmelzer and Bender.

@Cesc_Fabregas : thanks for these HQ pictures ;)

@kobayashi : Yes, it would be better if many persons could make a kitserver, hopefully some genious may emerge in the future and help the community.
 
I made the same points about the movement of the 'contain' in the GC area and to Aaron and Santi via e-mail. I also added that bit about the jogging agility in a quick second mail. I will copy the e-mail here so people can see what I said - can't guarantee everyone will agree absolutely with what I said and the video examples I used were rushed but I did my best considering I only saw the video when it was privately rebroadcast on Monday and my feedback mail was that night!
 
The video clearly showed a couple of occasions where the opponent was tricked into making a rash tackle which moved him out of position and the ball carrier was free, not quite sure what all the drama is about.....
 
So until they actually come out of the contain and attempt a challenge they should be utterly invincible? You shouldn't be able to move the ball quickly to one side to create that narrow angle for a pass or a shot or a cross?
 
Here's a snippet from the mail I sent to explain what is lost. I've not tidied it up to be Evo-Web friendly...

Some examples of what I mean (though I am rushing to find clips, so some of them might be a bit indirect - hopefully the idea itself still carries across!)


http://www.footytube.com/video/Manchester-United-vs-Schalke-04-81077

At 13:30 you can see Berbatov come short to draw his defender in, before then bursting into space. At the same time, Nani cuts inside of his man, creating an angle for him to play the through ball. Notice how the angle between him and the man 'containing' him is subtly shifted by the fact that Nani can move the ball before the defender can move laterally with the ball.

Those are pretty rushed examples, and the Berba run itself is not so much an example of this contain system in action but more an example of why the concept of this time delay and momentum conservation is important, certainly for off the ball runs. But I'm sure you've all seen players do the same for your club several times a match. You see players like Rooney if he's on the left and trying to set up a far post curler, or any player who tends to have a defender trying to contain him as in these videos, knock the ball to one side to create a yard of space for him to either cross or shoot around the defender.



Some more examples:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPys2-djcDI

I've tried setting the times up for these but they don't seem to want to work. Open it up and skip to 2 mins 36 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pM8t8fP0QI

First highlight of this. Rooney ducks inside, creating space inside of the defender, and shoots immediately.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZRZKk6gSYM

2m 55s. I'm not sure Nani gets a big advantage touching the ball to his right as far as moving around the defender is concerned, since he's already taken a touch that way and the man covering him is sidestepping accordingly. But you could see how, if he hadn't taken that first touch and the defender was in the way of that pass, then that touch to Nani's right would open up that little angle for the pass into space. For me, this is EXACTLY the sort of thing I'd want to do in the game, in Clubs or in single player. Take a touch to the side onto your stronger foot (which I hope is a lot more important this year!), create a small gap and slot a pass into the path of a run.
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Shearer_God said:
:D I don't even post here much, but even I can sense the sarcasm. The guy just moans and moans.
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Being realistic about things does not equal moaning..

Please disprove my posts with valid explanations if you think I'm being unreasonably harsh... I don't think I am.

My theories and predictions are based upon video evidence and/or past experience of EA's utter bollocks, expecting a decent game in FIFA 12 is foolish to say the least.
 
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Rob92 said:
Being realistic about things does not equal moaning..

Please disprove my posts with valid explanations if you think I'm being unreasonably harsh... I don't think I am.

My theories and predictions are based upon video evidence and/or past experience of EA's utter bollocks, expecting a decent game in FIFA 12 is foolish to say the least.
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In any case you cannot deny the fact that technically FIFA is much more advanced that PES.
 
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