- Thread starter
- #1,231
jonneymendoza
Legend
- 1 January 2004
- Arsenal
Fifa 11 Xbox 360/PS3
- Thread starter jonneymendoza
- Start date
Trance_Allstar
I love lamp
- 18 March 2006
Re: Fifa 11
I've thought about it myself, but the control scheme would be hard to get right. If you make it too easy (one button for saving for example) it would get boring really quickly. But if you make it too controllable, doing reflex saves can be complicated if you have too many buttons to choose from.
Also the camera angle is important. Using the in-game camera (for example if you are playing 4 people on one console and one wants to be the goalie), would make it hard to position the goalkeeper and move him to save longshots. It is very easy to accidentally move the keeper a bit too much to the side, and once a longshot comes, your keeper can be hugging one of the posts rather than being positioned between them. You could use a button to autoposition the keeper, but that again takes away some control and perhaps makes it a bit boring.
Also online, if you play Virtual Pro, the latency alone in some of the matches would make goalkeeping a nightmare. You literally couldn't react quickly enough to any mildly surprising medium-range shot from a decent player.
Some games have tried the manual keeper approach before, and the ISS games worked well I suppose, but they used a one-button auto-save, so as long as you reacted quickly enough when pressing the key, you didn't need much else than decent positioning.
Though if I had to give my preference, I would use the right stick for diving or saving in various directions, and the triggers and bumpers for various modifiers (holding LT will give you a crouched alert-stance, hold LT+RT for sidestepping on the line, bumper buttons for additional behaviors, for example holding one bumper if you want the goalkeeper to parry or catch, etc). You could put even more specialized moves on the ABXY buttons aswell. The main thing for me is that if they go for manual goalkeepers, there should be alot of possibilities and little tricks to learn, but the basic saving could be done just with the right stick. Considering the downtime often associated with goalkeeping, I would like to be able to sit down in the goal and relax, lean against the post, hang from the bar, go to my water bottle and get a drink, you know, fun stuff like that to pass the time.
You could give the goalkeeper extended control of the defensive line so he shouts out commands, for example one press on any direction on the d-pad will have one intended function for the defensive line, push up, drop down, hold the line, or something like that (I'm not a goalkeeper so Dusse can most likely come up with alot more appropriate stuff
.
I've thought about it myself, but the control scheme would be hard to get right. If you make it too easy (one button for saving for example) it would get boring really quickly. But if you make it too controllable, doing reflex saves can be complicated if you have too many buttons to choose from.
Also the camera angle is important. Using the in-game camera (for example if you are playing 4 people on one console and one wants to be the goalie), would make it hard to position the goalkeeper and move him to save longshots. It is very easy to accidentally move the keeper a bit too much to the side, and once a longshot comes, your keeper can be hugging one of the posts rather than being positioned between them. You could use a button to autoposition the keeper, but that again takes away some control and perhaps makes it a bit boring.
Also online, if you play Virtual Pro, the latency alone in some of the matches would make goalkeeping a nightmare. You literally couldn't react quickly enough to any mildly surprising medium-range shot from a decent player.
Some games have tried the manual keeper approach before, and the ISS games worked well I suppose, but they used a one-button auto-save, so as long as you reacted quickly enough when pressing the key, you didn't need much else than decent positioning.
Though if I had to give my preference, I would use the right stick for diving or saving in various directions, and the triggers and bumpers for various modifiers (holding LT will give you a crouched alert-stance, hold LT+RT for sidestepping on the line, bumper buttons for additional behaviors, for example holding one bumper if you want the goalkeeper to parry or catch, etc). You could put even more specialized moves on the ABXY buttons aswell. The main thing for me is that if they go for manual goalkeepers, there should be alot of possibilities and little tricks to learn, but the basic saving could be done just with the right stick. Considering the downtime often associated with goalkeeping, I would like to be able to sit down in the goal and relax, lean against the post, hang from the bar, go to my water bottle and get a drink, you know, fun stuff like that to pass the time.
You could give the goalkeeper extended control of the defensive line so he shouts out commands, for example one press on any direction on the d-pad will have one intended function for the defensive line, push up, drop down, hold the line, or something like that (I'm not a goalkeeper so Dusse can most likely come up with alot more appropriate stuff
.
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Nick Cave
Wrexham fan for my sins...
Re: Fifa 11
Can't see the need to add goalkeepers and the variation of dives and saves including your hands and feet it to hard to create on a pad in the time you will have to react...
Can't see the need to add goalkeepers and the variation of dives and saves including your hands and feet it to hard to create on a pad in the time you will have to react...
Re: Fifa 11
One thing PES has got over FIFA is the clear distinction between right and left footed players.One example is when Ozil and Messi in the last PES video, are dribbling and you can see they do it exclusively on their left foot.
If you were to try the same on FIFA both of them would unrealistically use their right.I cannot wait when we'll have a proper distinction between left, right and 2 footed players.
One thing PES has got over FIFA is the clear distinction between right and left footed players.One example is when Ozil and Messi in the last PES video, are dribbling and you can see they do it exclusively on their left foot.
If you were to try the same on FIFA both of them would unrealistically use their right.I cannot wait when we'll have a proper distinction between left, right and 2 footed players.
Gab_
I agree
- 6 April 2009
Re: Fifa 11
What I hope they've added to FIFA 11 is more saves with the feet. Currently you often have the keeper going down in record time to save balls with his hands. In PES the keepers save a lot of shots with their feet when the shot is from close range, it looks much more realistic.
What I hope they've added to FIFA 11 is more saves with the feet. Currently you often have the keeper going down in record time to save balls with his hands. In PES the keepers save a lot of shots with their feet when the shot is from close range, it looks much more realistic.
Re: Fifa 11
Who would keep the ball moving then though
Anyway, you are off to PC world!
As I said, I wouldn't want keepers in the game. It's bad enough getting scored against by all the cheesers in clubs so it would be a nightmare if human controlled keepers were in!
you offering to be our goalkeeper for avf blu rays?
Who would keep the ball moving then though
Anyway, you are off to PC world!
As I said, I wouldn't want keepers in the game. It's bad enough getting scored against by all the cheesers in clubs so it would be a nightmare if human controlled keepers were in!
AlaaEG
Crunching
- 29 September 2007
Re: Fifa 11
I'd like to have control over keeper's position.
I'd like to have control over keeper's position.
cowden_harley
MOANING PRICK
Re: Fifa 11
me too as a keeper in real life i would like to be able to have a pop at it online.
me too as a keeper in real life i would like to be able to have a pop at it online.
Dusse
Banned
Re: Fifa 11
I'd prefer them keeping goalkeeper controls away from us players. I don't think there is a good solution. Even if it did, best case scenario is that we'd have goalkeepers just moving to the "wrong corner" when shooting as with PES manual goalkeepers which is horrible enough IMO.
(even though I too am a goalkeeper)
I'd prefer them keeping goalkeeper controls away from us players. I don't think there is a good solution. Even if it did, best case scenario is that we'd have goalkeepers just moving to the "wrong corner" when shooting as with PES manual goalkeepers which is horrible enough IMO.
(even though I too am a goalkeeper)
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- 7 August 2004
Re: Fifa 11
Being a keeper requires a hell of a lot of quick thinking and reflex reactions, as well as spatial awareness. I just don't see how controllable keepers could work, other than to be 90% AI and 10% human control - in which case what would be the point?
If there isn't a lot of news about what they've done with the keepers on July 22nd I may go into more detail about what they've done with them. Until then I'll have to stay fairly coy about things.
Being a keeper requires a hell of a lot of quick thinking and reflex reactions, as well as spatial awareness. I just don't see how controllable keepers could work, other than to be 90% AI and 10% human control - in which case what would be the point?
If there isn't a lot of news about what they've done with the keepers on July 22nd I may go into more detail about what they've done with them. Until then I'll have to stay fairly coy about things.
StuartCulli
College Dropout
- 25 July 2006
- Newcastle United
Re: Fifa 11
Would be great if keepers could get injuries from colliding with the post, getting a hard shot on the nose, landing badly after a save or colliding with other players.
I especially miss collisions with other players, as it happens all the time in real games. On corners and freekicks and crosses, there's almost never one where the goalie doesn't touch another player, when he goes for the ball.
Would be great if keepers could get injuries from colliding with the post, getting a hard shot on the nose, landing badly after a save or colliding with other players.
I especially miss collisions with other players, as it happens all the time in real games. On corners and freekicks and crosses, there's almost never one where the goalie doesn't touch another player, when he goes for the ball.
Nick Cave
Wrexham fan for my sins...
Re: Fifa 11
Yes being able to challenge the keeper at corners and crosses needs addressing, along with full range of injuries to the keeper as you say...
Yes being able to challenge the keeper at corners and crosses needs addressing, along with full range of injuries to the keeper as you say...
Dusse
Banned
Re: Fifa 11
There is so much they could do with goalkeepers and stuff around them to really increase the variety and chaos in the penalty area.
Some interaction with posts and bar (and net) would be nice.
Another thing I'm hoping they'll implement in the future is "goalkeeper styles", pretty much like the NHL series. Would make a huge difference IMO and helt with a lot of stuff, like chips etc. Attributes isn't enough for this. I guess you could also call it goalkeeper traits if you wish. This would be how agressive they are on crosses, how far out or their goal they are during play, for how long they'll stand up on 1-on-1s etc etc. Because one huge problem with them now is that they are way to predictable as they're all pretty much the same.
On top of that it's amazing how few attributes they have. What is it, like five specific goalkeeper attributes? Should be at least twice that, with attributes such as: tendency to punch, communication, throws, as well as attributes that decide how good the goalkeeper is at judging crosses etc. Really goalkeepers is one of the things that haven't changed much much since..well, a long time ago, that could have a major impact on the game.
There is so much they could do with goalkeepers and stuff around them to really increase the variety and chaos in the penalty area.
Some interaction with posts and bar (and net) would be nice.
Another thing I'm hoping they'll implement in the future is "goalkeeper styles", pretty much like the NHL series. Would make a huge difference IMO and helt with a lot of stuff, like chips etc. Attributes isn't enough for this. I guess you could also call it goalkeeper traits if you wish. This would be how agressive they are on crosses, how far out or their goal they are during play, for how long they'll stand up on 1-on-1s etc etc. Because one huge problem with them now is that they are way to predictable as they're all pretty much the same.
On top of that it's amazing how few attributes they have. What is it, like five specific goalkeeper attributes? Should be at least twice that, with attributes such as: tendency to punch, communication, throws, as well as attributes that decide how good the goalkeeper is at judging crosses etc. Really goalkeepers is one of the things that haven't changed much much since..well, a long time ago, that could have a major impact on the game.
klashman69
Fight the Power!
- 28 November 2007
Re: Fifa 11
Thats reminds me, imagine a football game with euphoria physics built in which real time injuries on point with collisions
Thats reminds me, imagine a football game with euphoria physics built in which real time injuries on point with collisions
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- 7 August 2004
Re: Fifa 11
There is a differentiation between normal keeper styles(VDS) and agile keepers (Lloris). They have quite different animation sets in a number of areas. Some of the save styles are jaw dropping, particularly the one where they specifically push a shot away with two hands.
They also said in the FSB podcast that they noticed a difference in frequency of comin out for crosses between Reina and Julio Cesar.
There is a differentiation between normal keeper styles(VDS) and agile keepers (Lloris). They have quite different animation sets in a number of areas. Some of the save styles are jaw dropping, particularly the one where they specifically push a shot away with two hands.
They also said in the FSB podcast that they noticed a difference in frequency of comin out for crosses between Reina and Julio Cesar.
klashman69
Fight the Power!
- 28 November 2007
Re: Fifa 11
Have you checked out the Argentina keeper Sergio Romero.
Rather unique keeper he is. HE's very mobile, aggresive and rushes off his line more than any other keeper that i have seen in a long time.
He's almost like a sweeper at times!
Have you checked out the Argentina keeper Sergio Romero.
Rather unique keeper he is. HE's very mobile, aggresive and rushes off his line more than any other keeper that i have seen in a long time.
He's almost like a sweeper at times!
gameklip
footy klip maestro
- 25 August 2006
- Tottenham Hotspur
Re: Fifa 11
I'll tell you what's wrong with Fifa's build-up play:
1) There's no punishment for pressing. You can move the ball around to your hearts content but nobody will be moved out of position as they can sprint back into shape at lightening speed. Sometimes even catching your player who is running at full pace with the ball ahead of him. It's total BS.
2) As part of the first point is FATIGUE. While moving the ball around in real life you are tiring the opposition. The opposition start to make more mistalkes positionally as they chase the ball down, and this leaves space for your intelligent runners. This doesn't happen in fifa because the the short term fatigue does not make a profound enough effect on short bursting runs.
3) Your players are brain dead. Seriously. You could put your foot on the ball and they barely move into space. And when they do they almost always run directly at the opponnet in straight-lines which is piss-easy to defend against. The movement during attacks needs to be way more pronounced in Fifa11/12. Build-up are as lackluster as the goal celebrations at the mo
BTW As an aside, i've always found it ironic that FIFAs have Rooney screaming in exhaltation on their covers but when you score with him in game he celebrates so meekly, as if embarrassed to score.
I'll tell you what's wrong with Fifa's build-up play:
1) There's no punishment for pressing. You can move the ball around to your hearts content but nobody will be moved out of position as they can sprint back into shape at lightening speed. Sometimes even catching your player who is running at full pace with the ball ahead of him. It's total BS.
2) As part of the first point is FATIGUE. While moving the ball around in real life you are tiring the opposition. The opposition start to make more mistalkes positionally as they chase the ball down, and this leaves space for your intelligent runners. This doesn't happen in fifa because the the short term fatigue does not make a profound enough effect on short bursting runs.
3) Your players are brain dead. Seriously. You could put your foot on the ball and they barely move into space. And when they do they almost always run directly at the opponnet in straight-lines which is piss-easy to defend against. The movement during attacks needs to be way more pronounced in Fifa11/12. Build-up are as lackluster as the goal celebrations at the mo
BTW As an aside, i've always found it ironic that FIFAs have Rooney screaming in exhaltation on their covers but when you score with him in game he celebrates so meekly, as if embarrassed to score.
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Dusse
Banned
Re: Fifa 11
Agile keepers I can understand, as there are stats for that. However, there are no stats or so for frequency on coming out for crosses so I don't know how they'd do that. It's also very important that how good they are at crosses and how often they'll come out for them (etc etc) is two separate things.
There also needs to be more situations where the goalkeeper will try to hold on to it but will let it go for a meter or so and have to throw himself on it. Right now it's really either he's holding on to it or he'll push it away - there is no in between.
Agile keepers I can understand, as there are stats for that. However, there are no stats or so for frequency on coming out for crosses so I don't know how they'd do that. It's also very important that how good they are at crosses and how often they'll come out for them (etc etc) is two separate things.
There also needs to be more situations where the goalkeeper will try to hold on to it but will let it go for a meter or so and have to throw himself on it. Right now it's really either he's holding on to it or he'll push it away - there is no in between.
StuartCulli
College Dropout
- 25 July 2006
- Newcastle United
Re: Fifa 11
Yeah, I'd love to see little 'knock-downs' that the keeper's just palm down and collect; if this makes sense.
Yeah, I'd love to see little 'knock-downs' that the keeper's just palm down and collect; if this makes sense.
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- 7 August 2004
Gab_
I agree
- 6 April 2009
Dusse
Banned
Re: Fifa 11
Well, I am a data reviewer...
You know that we're not really allowed to talk about this, but it's not enough.
You're talking about FIFA 10's attributes
Well, I am a data reviewer...
You know that we're not really allowed to talk about this, but it's not enough.
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Re: Fifa 11
You're kidding right?
If you're a data reviewer, like I am, you should know how they do this.
You're kidding right?
If you're a data reviewer, like I am, you should know how they do this.
Re: Fifa 11
@ Romagnoli - I posted the below in another forum where I'm a member of a Club team (same one as Scorpio who has just posted)
"Haven't really played that much BAP in a while but after last night I've had enough! It's not us but just the way a lot of opposition play. They just button mash like lunatics. It is total BS. I believe that most of the time we try to play the right way. I really hope pro passing in 11 completely gets rid of the pressing the button before it gets to the player as it's 100mph BS!!!!
I'm not saying I'm not going to play again but it just does my head in.
Sorry for the 1 giveaway for a goal last night but how I had a 0.00 rating is beyond me?! Passing stats were pretty good in the game. I didn't play well as my head had gone by then but 0! :rolleyes: EA got a good rating system going on there!! :god:"
Please tell me Pro Passing is going to be in Club mode too?! The mode is a joke atm. Great idea but needs serious work. I also hope this create a Club/Team mode doesn't have BS stat padded players which can be used in Clubs as some of the VP's are just so unrealistic it's laughable and wrecks the mode.
@ Romagnoli - I posted the below in another forum where I'm a member of a Club team (same one as Scorpio who has just posted)
"Haven't really played that much BAP in a while but after last night I've had enough! It's not us but just the way a lot of opposition play. They just button mash like lunatics. It is total BS. I believe that most of the time we try to play the right way. I really hope pro passing in 11 completely gets rid of the pressing the button before it gets to the player as it's 100mph BS!!!!
I'm not saying I'm not going to play again but it just does my head in.
Sorry for the 1 giveaway for a goal last night but how I had a 0.00 rating is beyond me?! Passing stats were pretty good in the game. I didn't play well as my head had gone by then but 0! :rolleyes: EA got a good rating system going on there!! :god:"
Please tell me Pro Passing is going to be in Club mode too?! The mode is a joke atm. Great idea but needs serious work. I also hope this create a Club/Team mode doesn't have BS stat padded players which can be used in Clubs as some of the VP's are just so unrealistic it's laughable and wrecks the mode.
- Thread starter
- #1,256
jonneymendoza
Legend
- 1 January 2004
- Arsenal
Re: Fifa 11
Well said especialy the stat pad shit. All we ask is for a realistic game of footy with realistic stats in club mode. Not this ping pong passing and god like players
SJP76 said:
Well said especialy the stat pad shit. All we ask is for a realistic game of footy with realistic stats in club mode. Not this ping pong passing and god like players
Dusse
Banned
Re: Fifa 11
Jeez, easy boy. No, I'm not kidding. I might have phrased it wrong..there is still way to few stats etc to accurately portray the difference on crosses between goalkeepers.
Jeez, easy boy. No, I'm not kidding. I might have phrased it wrong..there is still way to few stats etc to accurately portray the difference on crosses between goalkeepers.
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- 7 August 2004
Re: Fifa 11
Pro passing is across all of FIFA 11, for the CPU, BAP, Clubs, online, everything. The gameplay in Exhibition mode is the same for every other mode.
I don't know what is happening with VPs, only that the generic VPs that will play alongside you won't include 5'4" keepers etc.
Pro passing is across all of FIFA 11, for the CPU, BAP, Clubs, online, everything. The gameplay in Exhibition mode is the same for every other mode.
I don't know what is happening with VPs, only that the generic VPs that will play alongside you won't include 5'4" keepers etc.
Placebo
Ԁlɐɔǝqo
Re: Fifa 11
Is there really no "pro passing" on long/lobbed passes or did I read that wrong?
Is there really no "pro passing" on long/lobbed passes or did I read that wrong?
StuartCulli
College Dropout
- 25 July 2006
- Newcastle United
Re: Fifa 11
Seems the easiest one to put in; 'overhit', 'underhit' etc. Should be in.
Seems the easiest one to put in; 'overhit', 'underhit' etc. Should be in.