Fifa 11 Xbox 360/PS3

it has to be, none of the players seem to be rushing him and i'm sure same thing happens on 10 when u put difficulty low
 
SJP76 said:
People are crying about certain things when they haven't even played the game though!!! Complain when it's in your hands. It's like saying a woman is shit in bed when how would you know? Cos yr mate says she was?! I'd still like to find out for myself though!!!

You get me?

Not going to complain about watching some mugs play the game when it's offline and pro passing looks turned off to me. Somebody said you can't turn it off but you can offline. At least that's what I read.
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:LMAO:
 
SJP76 said:
People are crying about certain things when they haven't even played the game though!!! Complain when it's in your hands. It's like saying a woman is shit in bed when how would you know? Cos yr mate says she was?! I'd still like to find out for myself though!!!
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Show us a video and we will decide for ourselves! ;)

Regarding defensive AI, would it really be down to the difficulty level? I always find it odd that when playing 1v1 or clubs that they would make your own players AI easy. The balance should be the otherway around as going for easy means you would need better defensive AI to help you out.

But I guess that logic is to complicated.......:/
 
TikTikTikTikTik said:
Show us a video and we will decide for ourselves! ;)

Regarding defensive AI, would it really be down to the difficulty level? I always find it odd that when playing 1v1 or clubs that they would make your own players AI easy. The balance should be the otherway around as going for easy means you would need better defensive AI to help you out.

But I guess that logic is to complicated.......:/
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Clubs have AI that is World Class difficulty, they upped it from Semi-Pro with a patch. I would guess they'll keep it at WC for FIFA 11. All other modes they seem to be on Semi-Pro though, not sure why they do it, it would only make the game more realistic if it was WC on all modes (because of better positioning mainly).

Edit: Maybe this is something people that will play it can ask about? Or maybe Romagnoli could ask Gary why this is the case and if it wouldn't actually be better to default it to WC difficulty in all modes. At least ask Gary if positional play is different on Semi-Pro AI and WC AI, because if it is they should absolutely change it. It's not like the CPU players that you don't control will play the game for you anyway, it's only more realistic off the ball behaviour.
 
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Fifa 11 looks like the bomb.

I like the way that the players instantly control the ball if it's next to their feet kind of as if the ball and the player's feet are magnetically attracted together. It shouldn't matter what angle they happen to be facing, the speed of the ball or what angle it is travelling at. A little bit like in Fifa 10 when you took a long shot and if it hit a player's leg then they would instantly bring it down and control it. I like that. Why waste time by having the ball spin off into several directions, this way i can easily get the ball to Ronaldo by playing a couple of 180 degree first time passes from my defence straight to the half way line and let CR9 run galliently past a couple of hopeless defenders and slot the ball home with Ozil. Then i'll shush my opponent and i'll feel great because that means i have become a Fifa God.
 
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I guess some of the defensive holes open because of tired players who keep running all the game? I haven't seen one video of human players who care for stamina. However, the bigger problem I see with this game is its disregard for players bodies. Everyone goes for the ball even if it looks impossible for them to get past the body of the opponent.
 
MindlessDrugHoover said:
This i agree with. The part about the defensive AI. I do believe that needs to be stepped up. You say if there was a high likelihood of giving the ball away it would stop ping pong passing. Wouldn't you then get pissed off that your players can't pass properly?
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The thing about ping pong passing is that it goes way beyond just accuracy error.

Yes, first-time passes and passes at difficult angles (180 degrees, etc) should be less consistently accurate, this is true. But most of the problem comes from the facility of the mindset that each next pass can go forwards, quickly.

Watch any video of FIFA and notice how almost every pass goes diagonally forwards. Diagonal forward pass, touch, diagonal forward pass, turn, diagonal forward pass, first-time diagonal forward pass, shoot.

This is not how real football is played, 90% of the time.

In FIFA there's almost never a need to pass backwards, or even sideways half the time. There's never the feeling of being forced to turn and play the safe ball back to your centre-back, to start again. The 'protect the ball and hold possession' pass. In FIFA, the 'hold possession' pass is an easy diagonal fowards pass to the next teammate up the pitch, standing happily unmarked.

There's no risk in the forward pass, so why not play it?

Firstly, as we know, there's no risk because contextual/attribute error in past FIFA games is non-existent, so you know the forward pass will unerringly reach its target and be controlled perfectly. This is supposed to change in FIFA 11, we'll see. My presumptive feeling is that it will have nowhere near the necessary impact on high-attributed 5-star teams, which is all anyone uses.

One of the great joys of Manual controls is that it introduces an amount of uncertainty, because the factor of human error compromises your confidence that the forward pass will be an accurate one. So sometimes you elect to play safe and play backwards, knowing that a pass to a wide open & stationary teammate behind you requires less precision than a pass to a teammate with opponents in close vicinity, or weighting it into the path a moving target. This uncertainty is absent with Assisted controls, so your pass selection is not compromised.

Secondly, and perhaps even more importantly, there's no risk because the next teammate up the pitch is so often unmarked, so you know he will have time and space to receive it safely. The AI is clearly not very smart when it comes to marking. In real professional football, a player has to use intelligent movement to shake his marker and/or to locate a few yards of space to offer for a pass. Simultaneously, his teammate with the ball often has to delay and wait for said movement to develop, rather than always having an instant un-marked option like you get in FIFA.

Thirdly, this inability to mark players tightly (and we rely on the AI for this, because we only control one guy at a time) is exacerbated by the complete lack of team shape, of team-wide organisation. Look at any video of FIFA gameplay and it is a challenge to figure out what formation either midfield is supposed to be in. They're just a cluster of individuals chasing their tails. Where's the risk in passing through or around a random jumble of individuals? It makes that forward pass easy because of the wide open passing lanes, and makes finding forward space easy because there's no shape covering those zones.

Diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass...

The very idea of equating FIFA's flowing ping pong with so-called 'playing like Barcelona' couldn't possibly be more erroneous. Spain & Barca play more backwards and sideways passes than anyone. The fact that they are better technically-equipped than anyone else to manipulate the ball in tight areas still does not result in forward pass after forward pass.

In real life, that pass back to your centre-half is usually the option with a higher chance of success than a forward pass to your striker. That's not about technique or passing accuracy, you can't mystically pass towards your own goal more accurately than you can pass towards the opposition goal. It's because you're not trying to force the ball past/between opponents, to a teammate who is marked and likely to be under pressure when he receives it, in a situation where any inaccuracy results in a loss of possession. Your centre-back, in contrast, has the time and space to gather almost any quality of pass safely, because he is un-marked and not under pressure. Passing should be about the availability of teammates in context of the shape and organisation of the opposing team.

All of this is what FIFA fails to emulate and the same is true for PES, or any other football video game I've ever known. When one dev team recognises this, when they realise that it goes beyond just making four defenders stand in a line, I'm convinced their game will take a leap ahead of their direct competition and anything we've played before.
 
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nerf said:
The thing about ping pong passing is that it goes way beyond just accuracy error.

Yes, first-time passes and passes at difficult angles (180 degrees, etc) should be less consistently accurate, this is true. But most of the problem comes from the facility of the mindset that each next pass can go forwards, quickly.

Watch any video of FIFA and notice how almost every pass goes diagonally forwards. Diagonal forward pass, touch, diagonal forward pass, turn, diagonal forward pass, first-time diagonal forward pass, shoot.

This is not how real football is played, 90% of the time.

There's almost never a need to pass backwards, or even sideways half the time. There's never the feeling of being forced to turn and play the safe ball back to your centre-back, to start again. The 'protect the ball and hold possession' pass. In FIFA, the 'hold possession' pass is an easy diagonal fowards pass to the next teammate up the pitch, standing happily unmarked.

There's no risk in the forward pass, so why not play it?

There's no risk because contextual/attribute error in past FIFA games is non-existent, so you know the pass will unerringly reach its target and be controlled perfectly. This is supposed to change in FIFA 11, we'll see. My presumptive feeling is that it will have nowhere near the necessary impact on high-attributed 5-star teams, which is all anyone uses.

One of the great joys of Manual controls is that it introduces an amount of uncertainty, because the factor of human error compromises your confidence that the forward pass will be accurate one. So sometimes you elect to play safe and play backwards, knowing that a pass to a wide open teammate behind you requires less precision than a pass to a teammate with opponents in close vicinity. This is absent with Assisted controls.

Another reason why there's no risk is because the next teammate up the pitch is so often unmarked, so you know he will have time and space to receive it safely. This is because defensively the AI has little concept of shape, of organisation, and is not very smart at marking.

In real professional football, a player has to use intelligent movement to shake his marker and/or to locate a few yards of space to offer for a pass. Simultaneously, his teammate with the ball often has to delay and wait for said movement to develop, rather than always having an instant un-marked option like you get in FIFA.

This inability to mark players tightly (and we rely on the AI for this, because we only control one guy at a time) is exacerbated by the complete lack of team shape. Look at any video of FIFA gameplay and it is a challenge to figure out what formation either midfield is supposed to be in. They're just a cluster of individuals chasing their tails. Where's the risk in passing through or around a random jumble of individuals? It makes that forward pass easy because of the wide open passing lanes, and makes finding forward space easy because there's no shape covering those zones.

Diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass...

The very idea of equating FIFA's flowing ping pong with so-called 'playing like Barcelona' couldn't possibly be more erroneous. Spain & Barca play more backwards and sideways passes than anyone. The fact that they are better technically-equipped than anyone else to manipulate the ball in tight areas still does not result in forward pass after forward pass.

In real life, that pass back to your centre-half is usually the option with a higher chance of success than a forward pass to your striker. That's not about technique or passing accuracy, you can't mystically pass towards your own goal more accurately than you can pass towards the opposition goal. It's because you're not trying to force the ball past/between opponents, to a teammate who is marked and likely to be under pressure when he receives it. Your centre-back, in contrast, has the time and space to gather almost any quality of pass, because he is un-marked and not under pressure. Passing should be about the availability of teammates in context of the shape and organisation of the opposing team.

All of this is what FIFA fails to emulate and the same is true for PES, or any other football video game I've ever known. When one dev team recognises this, when they realise that it goes beyond just making four defenders stand in a line, I'm convinced their game will take a leap ahead of their direct competition and anything we've played before.
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That's a dope post
 
See this is what I dont understand. The guy is saying in Guildford when they tried ping ponging it about after 4 passes it didnt work no more due to accuracy needed with the power bar.

Is the concern now that this powerbar doesnt need to be used so it means the chance of error is a lot slimmer without it?
 
liger05 said:
See this is what I dont understand. The guy is saying in Guildford when they tried ping ponging it about after 4 passes it didnt work no more due to accuracy needed with the power bar.

Is the concern now that this powerbar doesnt need to be used so it means the chance of error is a lot slimmer without it?
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I don't think that's what people are worried about, because you can only turn off the power bar in offline modes (and it doesn't matter what people do offline). I think people just don't see enough error in the passes.
 
nerf said:
The thing about ping pong passing is that it goes way beyond just accuracy error.

Yes, first-time passes and passes at difficult angles (180 degrees, etc) should be less consistently accurate, this is true. But most of the problem comes from the facility of the mindset that each next pass can go forwards, quickly.

Watch any video of FIFA and notice how almost every pass goes diagonally forwards. Diagonal forward pass, touch, diagonal forward pass, turn, diagonal forward pass, first-time diagonal forward pass, shoot.

This is not how real football is played, 90% of the time.

In FIFA there's almost never a need to pass backwards, or even sideways half the time. There's never the feeling of being forced to turn and play the safe ball back to your centre-back, to start again. The 'protect the ball and hold possession' pass. In FIFA, the 'hold possession' pass is an easy diagonal fowards pass to the next teammate up the pitch, standing happily unmarked.

There's no risk in the forward pass, so why not play it?

Firstly, as we know, there's no risk because contextual/attribute error in past FIFA games is non-existent, so you know the pass will unerringly reach its target and be controlled perfectly. This is supposed to change in FIFA 11, we'll see. My presumptive feeling is that it will have nowhere near the necessary impact on high-attributed 5-star teams, which is all anyone uses.

One of the great joys of Manual controls is that it introduces an amount of uncertainty, because the factor of human error compromises your confidence that the forward pass will be an accurate one. So sometimes you elect to play safe and play backwards, knowing that a pass to a wide open & stationary teammate behind you requires less precision than a pass to a teammate with opponents in close vicinity, or weighting it into the path a moving target. This uncertainty is absent with Assisted controls.

Secondly, and perhaps even more importantly, there's no risk because the next teammate up the pitch is so often unmarked, so you know he will have time and space to receive it safely. This is because defensively the AI has little concept of shape, of organisation, and is not very smart at marking.

In real professional football, a player has to use intelligent movement to shake his marker and/or to locate a few yards of space to offer for a pass. Simultaneously, his teammate with the ball often has to delay and wait for said movement to develop, rather than always having an instant un-marked option like you get in FIFA.

This inability to mark players tightly (and we rely on the AI for this, because we only control one guy at a time) is exacerbated by the complete lack of team shape. Look at any video of FIFA gameplay and it is a challenge to figure out what formation either midfield is supposed to be in. They're just a cluster of individuals chasing their tails. Where's the risk in passing through or around a random jumble of individuals? It makes that forward pass easy because of the wide open passing lanes, and makes finding forward space easy because there's no shape covering those zones.

Diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass, diagonal forwards pass...

The very idea of equating FIFA's flowing ping pong with so-called 'playing like Barcelona' couldn't possibly be more erroneous. Spain & Barca play more backwards and sideways passes than anyone. The fact that they are better technically-equipped than anyone else to manipulate the ball in tight areas still does not result in forward pass after forward pass.

In real life, that pass back to your centre-half is usually the option with a higher chance of success than a forward pass to your striker. That's not about technique or passing accuracy, you can't mystically pass towards your own goal more accurately than you can pass towards the opposition goal. It's because you're not trying to force the ball past/between opponents, to a teammate who is marked and likely to be under pressure when he receives it, in a situation where any inaccuracy results in a loss of possession. Your centre-back, in contrast, has the time and space to gather almost any quality of pass safely, because he is un-marked and not under pressure. Passing should be about the availability of teammates in context of the shape and organisation of the opposing team.

All of this is what FIFA fails to emulate and the same is true for PES, or any other football video game I've ever known. When one dev team recognises this, when they realise that it goes beyond just making four defenders stand in a line, I'm convinced their game will take a leap ahead of their direct competition and anything we've played before.
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I Love you



Rom could you please get this to eyes that matter.....
 
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Nick Cave said:
I had to turn them off "people should not make their mind up from what they see they should ask us, we know and they don't"

Then the I have a text from Rutter whooo... Idiots...

People listen to this?...
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At the end of the day what will ruin these podcasts (and for me has ruined the WENB ones for years) is if they are incapable of sticking it to EA when it's necessary. That's what it always comes down to.

I can understand, given that they are going to play on Monday, that they don't want to be too presumptuous, but my concern is that long term they'll be weak in terms of being honest. We've fallen into this trap with both games for so long - what we need sometimes is respectable people who people follow to actually take EA on. Now, we'll see what happens on Monday and after their next podcast (and obviously maybe the game really is OK).. but if it isn't, I hope to hear them be less protective.

What the people at FSB have, and some members on the forum have (the people who go to these events) is power. The question is whether they have strength. For me, they are less worried than I'd like, but, then maybe they are just less of a pessimist than me.
 
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ajaxforever said:
Celebrations/cut-scenes look really poor again this year.
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Apparently EAs' response, "they are expensive and everyone just skips them anyway", yet they make celebrations a big PR point and almost a mode in itself and the reason people skip the cut scenes is they're the same four we had in the previous incarnation...

This reminds me of PES standing still and taking things out to add atweak here and there...

Rodelero said:
At the end of the day what will ruin these podcasts (and for me has ruined the WENB ones for years) is if they are incapable of sticking it to EA when it's necessary. That's what it always comes down to.

I can understand, given that they are going to play on Monday, that they don't want to be too presumptuous, but my concern is that long term they'll be weak in terms of being honest. We've fallen into this trap with both games for so long - what we need sometimes is respectable people who people follow to actually take EA on. Now, we'll see what happens on Monday and after their next podcast (and obviously maybe the game really is OK).. but if it isn't, I hope to hear them be less protective.

What the people at FSB have, and some members on the forum have (the people who go to these events) is power. The question is whether they have strength.

For me, they are less worried than I'd like, but, then maybe they are just less of a pessimist than me. Only a few days to go.
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I'll be there on Monday too so I'll get to see just how it looks and feels, and as I have no site to promote I will ask the awkward questions, as for the Podcast if you only have 10 Min's of info and the personality of a slug, make the podcast 10 Min's... :ZZZ: ;)
 
Nick Cave said:
I'll be there on Monday too so I'll get to see just how it looks and feels, and as I have no site to promote I will ask the awkward questions, as for the Podcast if you only have 10 Min's of info and the personality of a slug, make the podcast 10 Min's... :ZZZ: ;)
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Lots of us going then, which is good - I don't see you pulling punches ;)
 
I like the new in game celebrations and that people grab on to other players in game, looks great. Like when Kaka scored and he didn't even have time to start celebrating because a team mate grabbed him. Or when he slides on his knees and another player pull him down, all in game, that's impressive stuff to me, but I'm an IK whore so that might just be me.

One thing I realised is that goalkeepers are supposed to have been improved a lot and I haven't even thought about it. I think Adam crapped his pants saying they behaved so amazingly realistic. Maybe the fact that I haven't noticed them is a good sign though.
 
I can't believe there is still using the same retarded angles for replays and highlights.Yes we can finally save those but why not give proper realistic angles like PES does so well ?
 
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