FIFA 10

He's right...its been a separate entity since 07 now, inverse kinematics made that possible, with the only reasons for erratic behaviour being shoddy physics and collision detection.
 
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So then when playing online team play or even 1v1, what's the reason for a player sprinting towards the ball without me actually trying to make him run to it myself? Why does an assisted through pass actually lock your player into a run that he can't break out of and be allowed to run freely (as freely as one can hope to run in the game with the ball at your feet) until he receives the pass in this game? Even when switching fields that player that you've lobbed the ball to will stand there completely still as if locked in place until he receives the ball unless you hold the triggers to cancel it and then move out of the way.

Really if the ball were a separate entity you could conceivably run away from it completely mid dribble. Say I hit the right analog stick up and to the left and then run in the opposite direction. The ball doesn't stay on that path, it goes wherever I go which is precisely why (although tons of people were speculating this early on in FIFA 09's development cycle due to the news of increased responsiveness and better dribbling) I can't tap the ball around a player on the left and then run around him and collect it.

The game is definitely still on rails to an extent.
 
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Murkurial said:
Really if the ball were a separate entity you could conceivably run away from it completely mid dribble. Say I hit the right analog stick up and to the left and then run in the opposite direction. The ball doesn't stay on that path, it goes wherever I go which is precisely why (although tons of people were speculating this early on in FIFA 09's development cycle due to the news of increased responsiveness and better dribbling) I can't tap the ball around a player on the left and then run around him and collect it.

The game is definitely still on rails to an extent.
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Oh there's no doubt that the game's scripted albeit to a point (see trick moves like the rainbow where the ball would actually slide ever so slightly into position as the move is performed) but for that particular action you described (and pretty much everything else really), the ball itself is untethered to the player ie: the movement of the ball is always dictated by a collision detection and the latter is always determined by an animation, which in turn is performed by you. The in-game player would always adapt himself to the ball with an appropriate animation (inverse kinematic calculations ensures that the foot is always touching the ball to make it move whilst maintaining a realistic posture for the rest of the body). So say you were pushing the ball forward, then an opposing player comes running towards you and perform a typical standing tackle, you can clearly see the ball's path being altered by that player's feet.

Or try this: go to the arena and perform a "Cancel" so your player is not drawn towards/tied to the ball (I can't remember if you can do this when you're already in posession of the ball but it works if you press both triggers as the goalie is tossing the ball back at you). With the ball "unattached" and in front of you, run towards it and notice how his feet traps the ball with ease and how the ball moves according to way it collides with the feet (might wanna score a goal immediately after so you can view a replay of that animation heh).

As far as scripting goes, its a necessity to keep it "on rails" as you're dribbling but like I said, even then the ball is still free to be altered from its path if its knocked away with even the slightest touch by another player.
 
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Chris Davies said:
To try and squeeze some extra life out of FIFA 09 I'm going to play all-manual against friends and the CPU for a few days, see if that makes it feel any different. I'd like to score some different goals. I just don't think I can master it, especially not the shooting. It's corner flag every time...
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Ah you see I think 2010 might fix that without us realising. At the moment we run on a sort of 8 way track and then shoot. So basically when you aim on semi and shoot your left stick will either be pointing vertically up/down, horizontally left/right or at one of the 4 45 degree angles. The game takes over and the shot still ends up on target. On manual I'm guessing everyone's problem is the same as me and you forget you're holding top right to run at an angle as you shoot so the shot zooms to the corner. Then you're left thinking 'ah shit I should have moved the stick down slightly towards the goals'.

Now we have this 180 dribbling we will all be using the sticks at different angles to move around the pitch and it will feel much more natural to hold it at 25 degrees (if shooting to the right of the screen) and shoot at the goal rather than the fixed 45 running towards the corner flag.

This image might help with the numbers/angles I'm talking about.

degrees-360.gif
 
Chris Davies said:
To try and squeeze some extra life out of FIFA 09 I'm going to play all-manual against friends and the CPU for a few days, see if that makes it feel any different. I'd like to score some different goals. I just don't think I can master it, especially not the shooting. It's corner flag every time...
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I have done the exact same thing a couple of weeks ago and if you stick with the all manual for some games and get used to it, it's like discovering another game.
My shots went into row Z the first few games but after settling in I scored some unpredictable crackers! Great stuff!
Couldn't get the crosses right though so I put them on Semi...
 
To get good crosses, you can either cross by double tapping or by holding the right trigger. That would make lower crosses that are great if you have a tall and strong striker, as Ibrahimovic in my Barcelona ;)

About shooting, the most important thing at the begining is to be SUBTLE. You don't need to squash the ball into the net. Simply tapping the shoot button on 1 vs 1s should make it, as goalkeepers are way more realistic and will make mistakes now and then.

And yeah, I keep wasting some chances now and then but if you are really careful with your shots, and start to gain confidence with the stick, at the end you end up scoring great shots. One thing tat could help is playing SEMI passing in Professional difficulty with a big team. Then the game should be easy enough to create between 10 or 15 good chances every game (I play 10 minutes every half). It is VERY important how stats would impacrt on your shoots. For example, I tweaked my Yaya Touré to be a beast when shooting (just like in real life) and Ibra is a beast as well from long range, so I use that to my advantage. There's a huge difference between them and Iniesta, to say something. So, KNOW your players before shooting.

Don't rush the shot, be sure your player has balance and is more or less facing the goal. And remember at first not to blast it if you're inside the area.

The most curious thing is that at the end you can score great goals from any position... except when you're VERY near the goal. Then it's possible to have a shot to the corner flag, I admit it, but if I concentrate enough, I even score some of those low-angled shots!

Once you are confident enough with manual shooting and manual crossing, you can start playing manual passing, though for entertainment I recommend letting passing on semi if you're against the CPU and go full manual only with off-line multiplayer.
 
Chris Davies said:
To try and squeeze some extra life out of FIFA 09 I'm going to play all-manual against friends and the CPU for a few days, see if that makes it feel any different. I'd like to score some different goals. I just don't think I can master it, especially not the shooting. It's corner flag every time...
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been playing full on manual for a week now and its great. shooting is easy for me. passing is difficult for me though
 
Chris Davies said:
To try and squeeze some extra life out of FIFA 09 I'm going to play all-manual against friends and the CPU for a few days, see if that makes it feel any different. I'd like to score some different goals. I just don't think I can master it, especially not the shooting. It's corner flag every time...
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I'm up for some fully manual games too :)).
 
I know this is ever so slightly off-topic, but try to forgive me this once! ;)

FSB are going to be involved in the next EA FIFA podcast and one of the topics is going to be about the money involved in football now. We really need people's opinions and if you're lucky you might get a shout-out on the podcast (you can listen to it in FIFA 09 remember, and you can turn it off again once you've found out if you get a mention or not ;))).

If you want to get involved please POST HERE. :)
 
Yet more Fifa10 MM bad news:
EA_MarcelKuhn; said:
Marcel didn´t say a word about the failure that irish, swedish and norwegian teams couldn´t qualify for the european cups

[MK] Due to the offset league schedules these leagues have, they can't qualify for the ECC / EFA - we couldn't fix this issue this year. It's related to our scheduling engine that will hopefull be replaced very soon. These type of authenticity issues bug me a lot as well :-(.
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...sorry for not answering the Norway / Sweden question earlier, but we were trying to find a way to address this, in the end our solution had too many knock-on issues, we ran out of time on this and could not include this for FIFA 10. :-(
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Seems there are a lot of seemingly minor but important issues we are not going to see sorted for 10, I wonder if they are going to stick with the same engine for 11, because if they go for major changes, with the work that involves the MM is going to get short shrift again...
 
Well I think it would pretty ridiculous to build a new engine just as they are getting the current one at the right level. Im pretty sure Ive heard Rutter anwser a question saying that the current engine will be tweaked and improved for this generation of consoles.
 
EA can't possibly have been so stupid that they built an engine that needs to be replaced, I belive that they rather have built is to that they can change certain things, ie the physics engine, the graphics etc is easy to just lift out and replace without having to code a whole new game (which probably is Konamis greatest problem).

The news about not being able to play CL with my Hammarby yet again is ridicoulus..and you complain about playing finals on the wrong stadium..
 
TikTikTikTikTik said:
And mm is a 3year project so they will continue to improve it.
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Unless they're forced by customer pressure to focus elsewhere, if thousands upon thousands of whiny 12 year olds spam all the various forums to demand "women's indoor beach 5v5 Be a Goalkeeper mode" else they won't buy the game, for example, they'll give in and create it, at the loss of whichever game mode's supporters are too quiet. That's exactly what happened with buttons in FNR4.
 
Placebo said:
Unless they're forced by customer pressure to focus elsewhere, if thousands upon thousands of whiny 12 year olds spam all the various forums to demand "women's indoor beach 5v5 Be a Goalkeeper mode" else they won't buy the game, for example, they'll give in and create it, at the loss of whichever game mode's supporters are too quiet. That's exactly what happened with buttons in FNR4.
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They have to listen to their audience if they expect to sell the game - it isn't a work of art that they're working on, it's a product. And if their largest audience happens to be whiny little 12-year-olds, which it is (try playing online for confirmation of that), then... God help us.

That said, I have confidence in them drowning out the calls for Ronaldo's mascara to be applied more liberally and focussing on the more important "demands", based on FIFA being the best and most realistic football game available. Although if I was a fan of an Irish / Norwegian / Swedish team right now, I would be pretty pissed.
 
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Chris Davies said:
They have to listen to their audience if they expect to sell the game - it isn't a work of art that they're working on, it's a product. And if their largest audience happens to be whiny little 12-year-olds, which it is (try playing online for confirmation of that), then... God help us.

That said, I have confidence in them drowning out the calls for Ronaldo's mascara to be applied more liberally and focussing on the more important "demands", based on FIFA being the best and most realistic football game available. Although if I was a fan of an Irish / Norwegian / Swedish team right now, I would be pretty pissed.
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exactly....it's a football game for the masses..........unfortunetly the masses don't care about a simulation footie game. it's a balancing act, keep the whining kids happy, but also cater for the sim gamer like most of us are.
 
so give peope option to play on simulator mode just like forza 3. turn off all aids and you got yourself a real simulator racing game in your hands. turn all aids on and you practicly only need to press one button to race and thats the acceleration. there is a aid to break for you LOL
 
Radiation said:
Ah you see I think 2010 might fix that without us realising. At the moment we run on a sort of 8 way track and then shoot. So basically when you aim on semi and shoot your left stick will either be pointing vertically up/down, horizontally left/right or at one of the 4 45 degree angles. The game takes over and the shot still ends up on target. On manual I'm guessing everyone's problem is the same as me and you forget you're holding top right to run at an angle as you shoot so the shot zooms to the corner. Then you're left thinking 'ah shit I should have moved the stick down slightly towards the goals'.

Now we have this 180 dribbling we will all be using the sticks at different angles to move around the pitch and it will feel much more natural to hold it at 25 degrees (if shooting to the right of the screen) and shoot at the goal rather than the fixed 45 running towards the corner flag.
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You're probably right there. Although it was my understanding that 360 degree dribbling only takes effect when in close control mode, or am I wrong?
 
^ Good point.It'll be interesting how the 360° dribbling will be implemented with the tricks.Will be able for instance to make step overs in every possible angle ?
 
I just want to see weight and pace to the ball.

I hate the way footy games take control for you at times, i want my actions to have a real time direct result on the outcome.
 
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