Arsenal Thread

What a load of shite!

What has the English culture got to do with anything? You have accepted that foreign imports have improved the game but then say they have difficulty with our culture.

We have had players like Bergkamp and Henry who have come to England and stayed for a long time. Bergkamp has had 3 kids here and now lives here 24\7 and Henry has married an English woman. These guys look after their bodies and have been model professionals. They both state they love England and will continue to live here, do these guys not understand the English way?

On the flip side we have had guys like Pennant and Jeffers who were more interested in living the high life in London, out partying etc and generally not giving 100%.

Generally young foriegn players seem to have a better attitude towards their career and are not interested in appearing in the tabloids every day coming out of night club. Plus they are way cheaper too.

Your missing the point., I said its easier for a english player to understand the culture, never did I say it was impossible for foriegners to understand the culture but some do struggle and find it difficult to adapt. My point is that tthere is more of a connection if the player is a local lad. if you look at what an effect Theo has on the crowd when he comes on,, or even is warming up it gets the fans going. ..It maintains the local connection, and the local rivalry. I am not saying that English players should be in the team in front of better foreigners, but it is natural for supporters that live in England to want to have a bit of local pride and see english players in a english football club. It may be the reason why you have such a poor atmosphere at your ground. As a British club with British owners I think that is important to have some local representation in the playing staff don't you think?

Having more English/ local players is better as that what football is about, local players/local fans being represented in a team. Arsenal are meant to represent their local community, or can't you understand that? Even Jose Morinho said u must have an English base becasue young fans must look on and think 'I could make it some day' when watching their team, they need role models from the area. Look how much Gerrard means to Liverpool or John Terry to Chelsea - why because they are very good but also becasue they are local lads.
 
That post is SPOT-ON Alucard. The atmosphere at the Emirates Stadium is piss-poor as it was at Highbury the library. They need some English lads in the starting eleven; even if it's three or four local heroes.
 
We have hardley any British Talent because they are on the whole way more expensive and they are money grabbing wee shites!

Or they are wayward or in some cases not good enough.

Well if English players are so bad then why are Tottenham, West Ham ,Liverpool, Man U, Chelsea, all above Arsenal with much more English players?

The basis of our team has been built from cheap foreign buys. If we would have bought the same quality of player here it would have cost twice as much!
The basis of why we are one of the top teams in the premiership at the moment is because we have invested our money (on the Whole) Wisely - (Don't start listing Flops - like Jeffers etc).
We have never been able to compete financialy with Man U and now definatley not Chelsea. Chelsea can afford to have the policy to buy the great English players because they can out bid us anytime.
Until English players reduce in price and there attitude improves. Why should we spend money on them?!

Hmm this argument is very popular amongst the arsenal faithful and is always in response to when someone asks why arsenal have no english players. The only reason people claim (If their supposed to be representimng arsenal then they should have players from London as well that have come throughh their ranks
falsly) that English players are overpriced is because of the occassional "prospect" that gets a bidding war over them.

Foriegn prospects easily cost just as much as top English prospects. Parker for £6.5m!!!!!! thats hardly a rip off when he's a quality player and someone like Reyes who could make the grade at £15m

The managers and those who take the mangers excuses as gospel need to come up with a better line than English players cost too much, cause lets be honest its only chelsea and Man Utd targets who's prices get inflated.

Look around for English transfers and you'll see that the cost of alot of players is relative to forign players.
Westham for example bought Dean Ashton £7m whilst you look for a spanish centerforward who's name spells out Ricardinho is likely to score as many as ashton could you'd be looking at £5-10m its pretty even. Just look at Martins for Necastle and Berbetov for tottenham both costing around 10million. Charlton got Bent for 2mil from ipswitch, so don't give me anymore pathetic excuses of 'oh look at jeffers and pennant, all english players are not good enough' English players are more expensive than foriegn players. Because you can look at it this way, Drogba cost chelsea 24million Shevchenko 30millioin, Obi Mikel 16million.. Reyes 17million. Rosicky cost the same amount as Pennant did for liverpool.

If Wenger had as good an eye for talent and judge of character as people make him out to be, then he would have found some good young english model professionals who are just as talented as your average flamini's or diaby

Also The way in which you try to pass your comments off as constructive criticism is funny. When You keep putting in put downs to our Players and staff then your 'constructive Criticism' is not that at all. Just admit you are trying to wind us up and accept the way we react to your posting.

Whenever I criticise Wenger or your precious team who can do no wrong-its always a wind up or an insult to you goons. If you didnt hold on to Wengers words as gospel and treat him like the second coming of Jesus Christ where he cannot be scruntinised or questioned, then you would see my responses as reasonable and fair. Anyone can see he is constantly complaing and now this flag ban thing is utterly ridiculous. I simply point this out and I'm a wind up merchant all of a sudden

You try to make it like your some fair, unbiased commentater on Arsenal. We know your not, so stop explaining yourself and trying to take the Moral high Ground.

Well if someone is suggesting I'm racist, I am not going to stay silent about it and shy away from defending myself against someone cretinous mong trying question my integrity

You are Man U and we are Arsenal - We will never agree

Well you wont agree unless your winning and people start masturbating over your team and their performances and sprouting such things of how much of a genuis your manager is.
 
Your missing the point., I said its easier for a english player to understand the culture, never did I say it was impossible for foriegners to understand the culture but some do struggle and find it difficult to adapt. My point is that tthere is more of a connection if the player is a local lad. if you look at what an effect Theo has on the crowd when he comes on,, or even is warming up it gets the fans going. ..It maintains the local connection, and the local rivalry. I am not saying that English players should be in the team in front of better foreigners, but it is natural for supporters that live in England to want to have a bit of local pride and see english players in a english football club. It may be the reason why you have such a poor atmosphere at your ground. As a British club with British owners I think that is important to have some local representation in the playing staff don't you think?

Having more English/ local players is better as that what football is about, local players/local fans being represented in a team. Arsenal are meant to represent their local community, or can't you understand that? Even Jose Morinho said u must have an English base becasue young fans must look on and think 'I could make it some day' when watching their team, they need role models from the area. Look how much Gerrard means to Liverpool or John Terry to Chelsea - why because they are very good but also becasue they are local lads.

You know very little about our club and yet you think you know it all.

The local community to Arsenal is very cosmopolitan, there are many nationalities\ethic races that live in the catchment area of Arsenal. So in effect our multi-national team does represent our community.

Theo Walcott is from Newbury, he is not from London. The buzz that occurs when he comes on is because he is young and talented and he want him to suceed. Jose Reyes got the same reaction when he joined and he ain't English.

You are missing the point in all this. We are an English club, with a rich and successful history and just because we have 11 non-english players on the pitch doesn't dilute that one bit. What we want is 11 players on the pitch in red and white who will to give their all for the club. Where they are from don't matter one bit. I would like more English players in the side but I don't think its that important. A successful team is important.

One point on the atmoshere at the Emirates. You take the piss but you have never been so how would you know? Its been getting better and better since the start of the season and I am happy with it now. We were really noisy on Saturday now we have settled in and its a myth to say that our atmosphere is bad. What would you know about atmosphere at football anyway? The closest you get is a Utd sing-song in a pub whilst watching the game on TV.
 
You know very little about our club and yet you think you know it all.

I don't think I know it all. I know a fair bit about many clubs besides the one I support, but I don't go about on the pretense that I know everything.

The local community to Arsenal is very cosmopolitan, there are many nationalities\ethic races that live in the catchment area of Arsenal. So in effect our multi-national team does represent our community..

So what your saying is just because there are some many different nationalities coming through immigration into London, then it means its ok not to field a single homegrown british player and arsenal should cater to include multi -nationalities in the squad and neglect players who were actualy born in the country?

Theo Walcott is from Newbury, he is not from London. The buzz that occurs when he comes on is because he is young and talented and he want him to suceed. Jose Reyes got the same reaction when he joined and he ain't English.

I know wilcott is not from London, I was merely using him as an example to illustrate the effect an english player can bring to the team and supporters.

You are missing the point in all this. We are an English club, with a rich and successful history and just because we have 11 non-english players on the pitch doesn't dilute that one bit. What we want is 11 players on the pitch in red and white who will to give their all for the club. Where they are from don't matter one bit. I would like more English players in the side but I don't think its that important. A successful team is important.

No your mistaken sunshine, it does matter as fifa obviously see a problem in it as I do in fielding a team without any home grown players. Fifa boss Sepp Blatter has proposed that European clubs must field a minimum of six home players or face legal action.
Of course your chairman David Dein is shitting his pants about this proposal and is using his position in the G14 group to appeal against it. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/6219798.stm

One point on the atmoshere at the Emirates. You take the piss but you have never been so how would you know? Its been getting better and better since the start of the season and I am happy with it now. We were really noisy on Saturday now we have settled in and its a myth to say that our atmosphere is bad. What would you know about atmosphere at football anyway? The closest you get is a Utd sing-song in a pub whilst watching the game on TV.

I'm not a pub person myself, and I don't watch games off the TV.
So I don't know where you got the idea that I done any of those things.
 
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I don't think I know it all. I know a fair bit about many clubs besides the one I support, but I don't go about on the pretense that I know everything.

You are very good at answering posts without actually answering any of the points in it.

So what your saying is just because there are some many different nationalities coming through immigration into London, then it means its ok not to field a single homegrown british player and arsenal should cater to include multi -nationalities in the squad and neglect players who were actualy born in the country?

We don't neglect the English players, the ones we have had who have left have not been good enough.

I know wilcott is not from London, I was merely using him as an example to illustrate the effect an english player can bring to the team and supporters.

Reyes had the same effect when he joined, Fabregas when he started playing, they are not English. Re-read my post.


No your mistaken sunshine, it does matter as fifa obviously see a problem in it as I do in fielding a team without any home grown players. Fifa boss Sepp Blatter has proposed that European clubs must field a minimum of six home players or face legal action.
Of course your chairman David Dein is shitting his pants about this proposal and is using his position in the G14 group to appeal against it. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/6219798.stm

This will never happen. Footballers are merely employers of a company. Once you start messing with this you are restricting freedom of movement and employment. Think about it.

I'm not a pub person myself, and I don't watch games off the TV.
So I don't know where you got the idea that I done any of those things.

Oh ok then on your PC, maybe you sing to yourself. Why don't you answer my question? How do you know our atmosphere is bad?
 
I notice these kinds of things as I observe. Also many fans Ive spoken to have complained about how lifeless the atmosphere is at the ground. And clockender, Fifa's new law will happen. Fifa are not messy much around in terms of employment, Dein and your argument hold no water. It only states that they can field only 5 foreigners on match day, thats not restricting anyones personal freedom or human rights. So no matter how much you pray and kid yourself in thinkning it won't happen, it will do. Believe it. And when it does happen, your going to have to find british talent or bring the ones that have been neglected through the ranks from the academy.
 
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Fifa's new law will happen. Fifa are not messy much around in terms of employment, Dein and your argument hold no water. It only states that they can field only 5 foreigners on match day, thats not restricting anyones personal freedom or human rights. So no matter how much you pray and kid yourself in thinkning it won't happen, it will do. Believe it. And when it does happen, your going to have to find british talent or bring the ones that have been neglected through the ranks from the academy.

wow... i never thought people would bring affirmative action into sports... and for the majority population aswell... wow...

so what ur saying is we're gonna have to field 6 englishmen on the field no matter what... even if their play is inferior to the foreigners? explain how this is not restricting personal freedom or human rights? ur in affect saying to a foreigner that they're not allowed to play because they're not english... not because they're skill isn't good enuff to be on the field... but because they're French or Brazilian or Italian or any other nationality not English...

in this case... ignorance certainly isn't bliss... its more like a delusion or an inferiority complex...
 
Blatter also wants to keep 16 teams in the EPL so...anything is possible

so who will man u field?

Neville (if he hasnt retired)
Scholes (if he hasnt retired)
Rooney
Carrick
Ferdinand
Smith

er....

Dong?


Bottom line is football isnt like it used to be, its all changed. Cheap foreigners started it all, because english players where vastly overpriced. You can accuse Arsenal of having foriegners when every club has them!
 
wow... i never thought people would bring affirmative action into sports... and for the majority population aswell... wow...

so what ur saying is we're gonna have to field 6 englishmen on the field no matter what... even if their play is inferior to the foreigners? explain how this is not restricting personal freedom or human rights? ur in affect saying to a foreigner that they're not allowed to play because they're not english... not because they're skill isn't good enuff to be on the field... but because they're French or Brazilian or Italian or any other nationality not English...

in this case... ignorance certainly isn't bliss... its more like a delusion or an inferiority complex...

That is not what I am saying, that is what fifa's new laws are saying. Again this is not restricting who or how many foriegners the club can buy. On the field there must be at least 6 homegrown players so being named as a english club means you will see english players. Don't pretend you care about individual rights and freedom as such, your only concerned because arsenal will be in the shit when this happens. There is rules as such as if you are not permitted a work permit, your not qulified to play in this country, I don't see anyone complaining about that. This law fifa will be implementing has also been done before in Italy and Spain where there was only allowed 6 non-EU players in each squad back in the 90's.
 
Hey! antred liverpool has changed the table now their the riches club it going to be exciting in this community
 
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so who will man u field?

Neville (if he hasnt retired)
Scholes (if he hasnt retired)
Rooney
Carrick
Ferdinand
Smith

er....

Dong?


Bottom line is football isnt like it used to be, its all changed. Cheap foreigners started it all, because english players where vastly overpriced. You can accuse Arsenal of having foriegners when every club has them!

What is your point? Nobody said that only arsenal had foriegners in their squad, just the fact that they are the only english team with no english players on the field. As I said before there is just as much overpriced foriegners as there is with english players. Its just people point to rooney, rio and swps and start jumping on the bandwagon claiming all english players are overpriced. Read back and I listed many examples of quality english players who were bought for reasonable prices and named just as many examples of overseas players who are just as overpriced as some english players. If you see who has cost the most in the all time transfer record in england it is a foriegn player. I discredited this myth that you have to pay over the odds for a english player and the sorry excuse that these goons cry of how 'english players are just not good enough because of how pennant and jeffers turned out'.
 
Al you`ve open a can of worms...no one reads word for word they pick your intension and start from there.You`ve been explaining for 2 days :lol: you say light blue we say stop it medium blue
 
Well all I can say is Ive tried enlightening a few folks but people dont want to see my point because iuf they did they know their team has to change its attitude and policy. Hopefully in the future when this new rule is implanted and you start seeing the benefits, seeing more young english players like your wilcotts, or rooneys emerge through the ranks at big clubs abit more and start seeing the local players come through providing the team with a new lease of energy, some of you morons might contemplate looking back and realise what I was saying was actually correct all along. Until then, long may you suffer with trophy barren seasons without any answers.
 
Well all I can say is Ive tried enlightening a few folks but people dont want to see my point because iuf they did they know their team has to change its attitude and policy. Hopefully in the future when this new rule is implanted and you start seeing the benefits, seeing more young english players like your wilcotts, or rooneys emerge through the ranks at big clubs abit more and start seeing the local players come through providing the team with a new lease of energy, some of you morons might contemplate looking back and realise what I was saying was actually correct all along. Until then, long may you suffer with trophy barren seasons without any answers.

You talk about enlightenment but i just gave you a list of united players that would qualify, two them being near retirement age now and you just ignored it.

So what are united going to do? Unless fifas policy includes british isles players your screwed.
 
You talk about enlightenment but i just gave you a list of united players that would qualify, two them being near retirement age now and you just ignored it.

So what are united going to do? Unless fifas policy includes british isles players your screwed.

Really. I didnt respond turkey neck because you missed out two other english players which passed by your fading memory. Brown and Ricardson are english if I recall correctly and part of the first team. Not to mention the players we have loaned out who are english propests such as Phil Bardsley, Chris Eagles, Lee Martins and Lee simpson. Yes I'm sure we are screwed as we only 12 english players in our squad compared to arsenal's mighty number of 2. My goodness what on earth are we going to do! Get your facts correct first sunshine, then I might give you the benefit of a response.
 
This rule would be a disaster for football as the richest clubs would buy all the best players and bench them leaving championship players for the rest
 
That is not what I am saying, that is what fifa's new laws are saying. Again this is not restricting who or how many foriegners the club can buy. On the field there must be at least 6 homegrown players so being named as a english club means you will see english players. Don't pretend you care about individual rights and freedom as such, your only concerned because arsenal will be in the shit when this happens. There is rules as such as if you are not permitted a work permit, your not qulified to play in this country, I don't see anyone complaining about that. This law fifa will be implementing has also been done before in Italy and Spain where there was only allowed 6 non-EU players in each squad back in the 90's.

you may not be saying it, but u certainly are endorsing it... i'm not talking about hiring foreign players... i'm talking about playing them on the field... restricting players on the field because of their nationality is just as bad as not hiring them... I do care about individual rights asshole... u don't know anything about me so don't u dare bring shit up with me about where my morals lie... not being permitted to work without a permit is an immigration law smart ass... normally its a tax issue, but it's also used as a safety issue, national security all that jolly good shit...

seriously... the only thing you've made perfectly clear is how poor England's future in football is(in your mind)... it takes a restriction of foreign players before it is necessary to field a team with englishmen... that's what this new law says... or is this some sort of political hypocricy... some nationalist pride bs?
 
I remember Mourinho saying that if you're gonna play/manage in this country, you're expected to give something back by helping the countries youth system. To be fair, he has a point.
I, like many other people, couldnt care less about the English national side. For me, my club comes first. But this isnt about what I care about or whats important to me. Its about giving something back to the country that you work in. Kinda like paying taxes.
This isnt about financial reasons or the quality of the players in the country, its for the sake of being unselfish.

One thing that I like about International football is that the players arent getting paid to play for their country so you know they arent playing for selfish reasons. Its nice to see players giving it their best with so much passion for a change unlike what you see at club level with guys like Ashley Cole. Now if clubs arent gonna help the country develop players, this is gonna ruined. I know some people dont care but does your opinion matter? No.
 
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One thing that I like about International football is that the players arent getting paid to play for their country so you know they arent playing for selfish reasons. QUOTE]

I'm not sure that they don't get paid for playing. Didn't one of the African countries threaten not to play in the world cup because they hadn't been paid?
 
I remember Mourinho saying that if you're gonna play/manage in this country, you're expected to give something back by helping the countries youth system. To be fair, he has a point.
I, like many other people, couldnt care less about the English national side. For me, my club comes first. But this isnt about what I care about or whats important to me. Its about giving something back to the country that you work in. Kinda like paying taxes.
This isnt about financial reasons or the quality of the players in the country, its for the sake of being unselfish.

One thing that I like about International football is that the players arent getting paid to play for their country so you know they arent playing for selfish reasons. Its nice to see players giving it their best with so much passion for a change unlike what you see at club level with guys like Ashley Cole. Now if clubs arent gonna help the country develop players, this is gonna ruined.

Why should English clubs help the English national team? What benefit do clubs get when their players are away on international duty? Usually they get players who come back with knocks or even worse long term injuries (Owen, WC2006, he's on 100k a week).

The FA have to do more to help themselves. They can afford to pay Sven £5m a year but where is THIER investment in the future? Why don't we have a national institute like the French do at Claire-Fontaine? This is surely the way forward, a national academy.

Quoting Mourinho is fine but what has he done to help this country's youth system? He buys young English players (SWP) and plays them eevry week? Does he blood Chelsea's English youngsters week in week out? Nah, he continues to buy big foreign stars, Sheva, Ballack, Drogba.

I know some people dont care but does your opinion matter? No.

Seeing as this is a forum then everyone's opoinion counts, even yours unfortunately.
 
Why should English clubs help the English national team? What benefit do clubs get when their players are away on international duty? Usually they get players who come back with knocks or even worse long term injuries (Owen, WC2006, he's on 100k a week).

The FA have to do more to help themselves. They can afford to pay Sven £5m a year but where is THIER investment in the future? Why don't we have a national institute like the French do at Claire-Fontaine? This is surely the way forward, a national academy.

Quoting Mourinho is fine but what has he done to help this country's youth system? He buys young English players (SWP) and plays them eevry week? Does he blood Chelsea's English youngsters week in week out? Nah, he continues to buy big foreign stars, Sheva, Ballack, Drogba.
I like how you picked out SWP and ignored players like Lampard, Terry, Joe Cole and Ashley Cole.

Seeing as this is a forum then everyone's opoinion counts, even yours unfortunately.
Yeah, and national teams play their football inside this forum. :roll:
 
I like how you picked out SWP and ignored players like Lampard, Terry, Joe Cole and Ashley Cole.

I picked on SWP because he is young and a Mourinho buy. Ashley Cole is an established star, hardly an investment of youth. Lampard, Cole were buys by Ranieri. Terry was an established player when Mourinho arrived thats why I left them all out. Maybe you would like to enlighten me on what Mourinho has done for promoting youth in this country?
 
you may not be saying it, but u certainly are endorsing it... i'm not talking about hiring foreign players... i'm talking about playing them on the field... restricting players on the field because of their nationality is just as bad as not hiring them... I do care about individual rights asshole... u don't know anything about me so don't u dare bring shit up with me about where my morals lie... not being permitted to work without a permit is an immigration law smart ass... normally its a tax issue, but it's also used as a safety issue, national security all that jolly good shit...

seriously... the only thing you've made perfectly clear is how poor England's future in football is(in your mind)... it takes a restriction of foreign players before it is necessary to field a team with englishmen... that's what this new law says... or is this some sort of political hypocricy... some nationalist pride bs?

Don't come with this 'I don't know how mightier than thou you are' bollocks, because fact is if arsenal had enough english/homegrown players and you were all well and good, you wouldnt be complaining,. You're obviously a glorywhore who wants their team to win at any cost and dont really care about delevopment or having any connection to the sport, just want the your team to field the best of the best, win at all cost mentality.

Where have I said Engalnds future in football is poor? never did I say england is bad because of foriegners, I say they are good for the game but that does not mean we should go to the extreme and buy all of them and forget about nurturing homegrown talent. Like Rune egde i could care less about the england national teams results,I'm not saying a team shouldn't field anyone but locals. But it'd be nice to see actual English players in English teams. I don't think that's too much to ask. If teams have to field a team compromised of at least 6 of their national players, then those teams will take more of an interest in developing players instead of buying them from abroad. The cheque book rules as an easier option than nurturing youngsters. Your also forgeting that any nationality can be consired as homegrown considering they have been developed between the ages of 15 and 21 for three years as a junior , so its not a case if your an englishmen with only english roots you get to play. This rule has been implanted before its just some santions were changed within the treaty. Fifa has already been backed by theUniion the next step is to take it into the EC. tHIS this rule wont come into effect overnight but in the near future and will be benificial..The foreign players are good for the game although you can see there are quite a few mercenairies and this is one reason why Arsenal have players leaving every summer and always find it difficult to keep their top players. But we do need a rule to come in to stop teams fielding sides with few or even no English players at all. It doesn't encourage home grown talent to compete at a high levels.

You look at France and they have great young players coming through all the time. This is because the youngsters get a chance to prove themselves in the French league as it is not so popular and thus the top foreign players don't want to play there. It's the same in Argentina and Brazil and where the supporters go absolutley crazy. Now if english and say italian players started playing in argentina and were the basis of their teams, I don't thinks the fans would feel connected to the club as they do now. Have you seen the crowds in derbys at Boca juniors vs River Plate, absolute fantastic where the stadiums are shaking and fans making the most noise and are the most passionate.
 
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