The Retro-PES Corner

fmicablues7 said:
Road to the World Cup (CPU Co-op Challenge on PES 3):


I played a friendly game as France against England, and i won 3-0, they couldn't do anything. Pogba and Kanté destroyed their midfielders.
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Proving that unfortunately there's nothing new under the sun!

Look forward to seeing how it pans out. Let's hope Shevchenko stays fit.
 
mattmid said:
Proving that unfortunately there's nothing new under the sun!

Look forward to seeing how it pans out. Let's hope Shevchenko stays fit.
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When i looked at the lineup, especially the midfield (Lampard-Gerrard-Scholes-Hargreaves), i was expecting more from them. But then, i remembered what happened to them in reality. :LOL:

I hope so for Sheva. A good draw would help me a lot also. Wait and see.
 
World Cup Draw :

Group A:
South Africa
Nigeria
Paraguay
Australia

Group B:
Germany
Portugal
Croatia
Spain

Group C:
Chile
Netherlands
Brazil
Russia

Group D:
United States
Costa Rica
France
Saudi Arabia

Group E:
Sweden
Argentina
Greece
Japan

Group F:
Egypt
Bulgaria
Wales
Italy

Group G:
Denmark
Serbia and Montenegro
Turkey
England

Group H:
Ukraine
Czech Republic
Poland
Uruguay

Good draw for Ukraine. Not easy but no giants. Group B is surely the group of the death.
 
@fmicablues7 that's a nice draw I think. Czech Republic is tough (surely Nedved along with others, and do they still have giant Koller? I imagine him to be a nightmare to mark) but the other two are fully in your reach (especially Poland.. just met them in my first own challenge.. will talk about it later).. plus you have Sheva and they don't.
Group B is indeed super tough but group C isn't joking either.. ! Good luck on your adventure.

I personally started a World Cup on PES 3 with China..
My group stage was with Belgium, Portugal and Poland as I said above.

I unexpectedly won my first game against Belgium thanks to a goal of number nine and captain Li Yuanping.. I then controlled the game without much emotions and proceed to win; while they have good individualities like Mpenza, Sonck (who played awfully anyway), Van Buyten and others they are very far from the overpowered team of our present days.
In the second one I lost against a very strong Portugal who, despite me injuring the king Rui Costa in the first minutes, kept the game in their hands for pretty much all the time; their physical defense conceded me nothing (Couto was a wall), I defended their tries as I could and I just had one chance that their defense cleared out last second before having to succumb to an header of Pauleta and a goal of Conceicao in the last 10 minutes.

Finally against Poland, which I found a very mediocre team, I just need a single point.. they played pretty awfully for most of the time, leaving me field and chances that my forwards couln't score, until at about 70th minute the cold shower.. they score after a lucky, dirt action in my field in a corner.. I see ghosts of my playoffs qualification, but luckily Zhang Yuning finds an header minutes later and I can celebrate my final phase advancing.. but the draw isn't exactly lucky: ARGENTINA will be my first opponent.. oh well.

A word on China.. they are technically WAY worse than default guys.. maybe two or three players have special abilities, and they all have horrible overalls, I have to use their rare good attributes the best I can..
By the way, it's lovely how this game highlights bad players. Bad touches, stops, passes or shots feels so natural, and low stamina effects too. Even after a season with Castolo and co I'm still surprised anytime by the work they did at the times. That said, I think next time I'll pick a more middle of the table team as it's starting to be a bit extreme, I need to relax a bit :D.

p.s. sorry for the long write up, can't avoid it after such fruitful play sessions!
 
@fmicablues7: Damn, that Group B is bound to be really interesting! As for your Ukraine, I can't say who the favourite to win the group might be...I'd say Poland is the underdog there.
Can I place a bet? This is how I predict it will end up after the group phase is finished.
1st - Czech Republic
2nd - Ukraine
3rd - Uruguay
4th - Poland

@Madmac79: Nothing to be sorry about Mad, enjoyed reading your write-up. I tried China in PES5 and it's always a hell of a journey, they're quite weak. Besides Li Tie, every player is not good enough for the WC level...
Good luck on your match against Argentina, planning to change your strategy specifically for that game?
 
miguelfcp said:
@WhoAteMeDinner: Here's the starting eleven, plus a few interesting bench players and our new acquisition Park Jyun Hi.

https://imgur.com/a/gsXGwUF

I'm on the beginning of the pre-season so with a bit of pre-season individual and collective training some of them are bound to improve even more. Stein is the oldest of our starting-11 (31) so the rest of the players are still developing, except for Ruskin and Fouque who seem to have reached their peak, and also Ordaz's stats haven't increased much this last season. On the other hand, Jackson (newgen) is on his way to become one of the best defenders in the world if he keeps developing at this pace.

As you can see, and contrary to popular belief, the defaults may seem worthless but if you give them a chance most of the younger ones actually become solid players. You do need to understand their weaknesses, as trying to build-up play using Stein as if he were Pirlo will certainly punish you immediately. Unlike modern PES games, just looking at the players' overall rating is not going to help you; guys like Stein or Ruskin will be utterly worthless if you don't maximize their strengths and minimize their weaknesses. For example, 90% of Ruskin's game is running back and forth to help the defense and then make off-the-ball runs to look for space in wide areas; if he then gets the ball I'll cross it. As soon as I try something more complex with him like build-up play or dribble out defenders, he's lost out there. Same with Van den Berg, if I spawn the R1 button for a few minutes he'll lose all his energy, so when I'm controlling him I know I should be extra-careful with stamina usage.
It really feels like real football because I'm literally forced to use every player in different ways if I want to win, which contributes a lot for that elusive thing we call "player individuality" in PES.

Also I just added to my default strategy two alternative formations to be triggered manually, one for offensive set-pieces and the other for defensive ones. The defensive one lets Fouque up front as SS, four midfielders with defensive duties and 5 CBs; the offensive one uses the tallest players + players with best aerial game as strikers, Stein and Ruskin as the only defensive-minded. Still testing it to see if it's something worth exploring.

@mattmid: Your post reminded me, have any of your players reached the 100th match? My Gutierrez is one match away from it, whilst Jaric and Stein if I recall properly are close too.
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@miguelfcp , I looked through your default player stats and was mighty impressed with the overall
development, just shows how sticking with these unheralded players for many seasons does pay off. I see you have a few quick defenders and the likes of Ruskin is very swift, still a hell of a performance to be in WEFA places in Divsion 1 of the ML, as your attacking options are way below mine, with the rapid Dario Silva and Ojigwe and the maestro that is Arellano.

Good play man. :BEER:
 
miguelfcp said:
@fmicablues7: Damn, that Group B is bound to be really interesting! As for your Ukraine, I can't say who the favourite to win the group might be...I'd say Poland is the underdog there.
Can I place a bet? This is how I predict it will end up after the group phase is finished.
1st - Czech Republic
2nd - Ukraine
3rd - Uruguay
4th - Poland

@Madmac79: Nothing to be sorry about Mad, enjoyed reading your write-up. I tried China in PES5 and it's always a hell of a journey, they're quite weak. Besides Li Tie, every player is not good enough for the WC level...
Good luck on your match against Argentina, planning to change your strategy specifically for that game?
Click to expand...

Thank you Miguel.
I have some very far memory of China being super bad in PES5 too, indeed.

Honestly I don't know if I'll change something against Argentina: this 4-2-2-2 China use as default (2 dm, 2 am) seems to cover the field decently, plus I'm a bit phobic of over covering after the recent games, so the module will stay, might changing markings, arrows and whatnot when I'll see their eleven. Maybe I'll let play Zhang Yuning from the first minute as he seems like the physically stronger and taller forward that I have, since working long balls it's probably the best option here.. but will any of it make any difference when the gap is this large? I think only a really bad day from them and a wonderful one from me could save me. Will find out tomorrow anyway!
 
Madmac79 said:
@fmicablues7 that's a nice draw I think. Czech Republic is tough (surely Nedved along with others, and do they still have giant Koller? I imagine him to be a nightmare to mark) but the other two are fully in your reach (especially Poland.. just met them in my first own challenge.. will talk about it later).. plus you have Sheva and they don't.
Group B is indeed super tough but group C isn't joking either.. ! Good luck on your adventure.

I personally started a World Cup on PES 3 with China..
My group stage was with Belgium, Portugal and Poland as I said above.

I unexpectedly won my first game against Belgium thanks to a goal of number nine and captain Li Yuanping.. I then controlled the game without much emotions and proceed to win; while they have good individualities like Mpenza, Sonck (who played awfully anyway), Van Buyten and others they are very far from the overpowered team of our present days.
In the second one I lost against a very strong Portugal who, despite me injuring the king Rui Costa in the first minutes, kept the game in their hands for pretty much all the time; their physical defense conceded me nothing (Couto was a wall), I defended their tries as I could and I just had one chance that their defense cleared out last second before having to succumb to an header of Pauleta and a goal of Conceicao in the last 10 minutes.

Finally against Poland, which I found a very mediocre team, I just need a single point.. they played pretty awfully for most of the time, leaving me field and chances that my forwards couln't score, until at about 70th minute the cold shower.. they score after a lucky, dirt action in my field in a corner.. I see ghosts of my playoffs qualification, but luckily Zhang Yuning finds an header minutes later and I can celebrate my final phase advancing.. but the draw isn't exactly lucky: ARGENTINA will be my first opponent.. oh well.

A word on China.. they are technically WAY worse than default guys.. maybe two or three players have special abilities, and they all have horrible overalls, I have to use their rare good attributes the best I can..
By the way, it's lovely how this game highlights bad players. Bad touches, stops, passes or shots feels so natural, and low stamina effects too. Even after a season with Castolo and co I'm still surprised anytime by the work they did at the times. That said, I think next time I'll pick a more middle of the table team as it's starting to be a bit extreme, I need to relax a bit :D.

p.s. sorry for the long write up, can't avoid it after such fruitful play sessions!
Click to expand...

Totally agree, Berger, Nedved, Rosicky, Koller (like a Harts on steroids :SHOCK:). That is one tough group for our @fmicablues7 , good luck man. PES 3 football is a tough mistress. :OH::OH::OH:
 
Madmac79 said:
Thank you Miguel.
I have some very far memory of China being super bad in PES5 too, indeed.

Honestly I don't know if I'll change something against Argentina: this 4-2-2-2 China use as default (2 dm, 2 am) seems to cover the field decently, plus I'm a bit phobic of over covering after the recent games, so the module will stay, might changing markings, arrows and whatnot when I'll see their eleven. Maybe I'll let play Zhang Yuning from the first minute as he seems like the physically stronger and taller forward that I have, since working long balls it's probably the best option here.. but will any of it make any difference when the gap is this large? I think only a really bad day from them and a wonderful one from me could save me. Will find out tomorrow anyway!
Click to expand...

You can't play as China in the World Cup Challenge, as the entire team has been bribed to throw every game. Chinese football :CRY::CRY::CRY::CRY::CRY:
 
@WhoAteMeDinner: Cheers man. I too am absolutely astonished by their development, as in my long history of playing PES I never kept the defaults for so long (usually I kept one or two just for sentimental reasons).

Turns out, I thought we were playing the WEFA Masters Cup but actually we've qualified for the WEFA Championships. I was convinced this worked like the CL/Europa League scheme but no: actually, the first two teams (in our league, Bayern and Benfica) get to the WEFA Championships but skip the group phase, in which the 3rd - 6th placed teams will have to participate before meeting those top-2 teams from around the ML world.
As for the Masters Cup, it's made of D1 Cup winners - we won it but our qualification for the superior WEFA competition overrides it - and WEFA Championships sides who fail to qualify for the elimination round.

It's a breath of fresh air after years of playing the CL/Europa League, that's for sure.

@Madmac79: I usually use a similar strategy too, kind of a classic 4-4-2 but with one AMF "disguised" as SMF, alongside a SMF, a DMF and a CMF. What I dislike about China is that I can't use a long-ball strategy, which comes in so handy when controlling these horrible NTs, because they're all...short! If I want to win the WC with, say, Northern Ireland, at least I know I'll be competitive on the aerial game (offensively and defensively), even if I can't put together more than 4/5 short-passes in a row. Now with China, you're lucky if you come upon a guy who's 180cm tall at least, and no 190cm panzers to fight for long balls...

Your crossover challenge discussion reminded me, remember when Portugal beat North Korea 7-0 in a 2010 World Cup group stage match? North Korea's government cut the broadcast of the match when Portugal scored the 4th goal. Then it was cultivated the idea there that Portugal would've had won the World Cup, to smoothen the humiliation amongst the people - hey, at least we lost against the Champions!
 
miguelfcp said:
@fmicablues7: Damn, that Group B is bound to be really interesting! As for your Ukraine, I can't say who the favourite to win the group might be...I'd say Poland is the underdog there.
Can I place a bet? This is how I predict it will end up after the group phase is finished.
1st - Czech Republic
2nd - Ukraine
3rd - Uruguay
4th - Poland

@Madmac79: Nothing to be sorry about Mad, enjoyed reading your write-up. I tried China in PES5 and it's always a hell of a journey, they're quite weak. Besides Li Tie, every player is not good enough for the WC level...
Good luck on your match against Argentina, planning to change your strategy specifically for that game?
Click to expand...

Finishing second will be my minimal objective. Czech Republic seems too strong for me. I really think your ranking reflect well the strength of the teams. I will also post the others groups results. It will be interesting to see how fare Ronaldo and Messi in stronger teams than they are nowadays.

I won't post detailed narration of my games, as my english is not so good, even though i like to read @Madmac79 @mattmid stories.
 
I normally play PES 6 and have done since I first bought it on ps2 in February 2007 - now playing it on pc. I've recently tried pes 1. I find that shooting/scoring is very difficult. Anybody else notice that?
 
All this world cup has me wanting to start one now. I think I'll get to the winter break with Domzale first though and then pause that there to start a world cup challenge.

@Madmac79 I'm sorry but taking out Rui Costa is like taking out one of our own (Minanda!) very poor showing :NO: A good move on your part though as it must have weakened them somewhat. :D I enjoyed reading the write up and you did a great job of qualifying though! Good luck against Argentina, you never know in a one off game.

@fmicablues7 Goal difference could be crucial in that group. It seems that tight that a win and a draw might get you through if you can end with a positive goal difference. It's almost a case of maybe needing Czech Republic to beat the other two and make it into a mini group between you and the other two. I'm trying to remember who Uruguay had back then, Forlan(?) and Dario Silva (if @WhoAteMeDinner will release him for the tournament :LOL: )

@WhoAteMeDinner Hamsun, trooper that he is, scored a goal with his bandage on as well.
 
thinking of starting the international challenge with Ireland in PES6 (though I hate that games shot system, keeps blazing over the bar) and trying to win now you're getting me thinking :)

or maybe just PES3 and the normal int. cup mode.
 
@fmicablues7 as far as I can tell (not mother language english too here, it probably shows often :D) your english is good.. I've read you many times before and you always strike me as very clear and precise. Please do narrate your games if that's the only thing keeping you back!

@mattmid You are right, the second it happened I immediately tought about the Minanda-Rui Costa discussion of days ago, but it wasn't voluntary anyway :D , just a normal tackle and he had the orange cross, then he came back on the field, failed a goal while injured and CPU took him out the exact second later (looked super real life like :D).
Argentina seems like mission impossible but we'll see!
 
@fmicablues7: I agree with the guys, I always understand what you write so feel free to write detailed posts if you want to.

@Orhainmalz: Glad you mentioned it (and yeah the game is emulated perfectly on the PSP), ISS PS1 is a great platform for a World Cup challenge too. You can clearly notice the difference between good and bad NTs...I recommend it!
 
liam0709 said:
I normally play PES 6 and have done since I first bought it on ps2 in February 2007 - now playing it on pc. I've recently tried pes 1. I find that shooting/scoring is very difficult. Anybody else notice that?
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Yep, @liam0709 , basically the further back you go in PES titles on the Playstation 2, the tougher and more demanding scoring gets. In PES 1 and PES 2, headed goals and scoring from outside the box were rare events (not that realistic), only players with missiles of shots like Adriano, Zidane, Rui Costa and Nedved could score from outside. The game engine and ball physics were completely re-built for PES 3 and bullet headers and rocket shots became very possible with good play. :BY:
 
mattmid said:
All this world cup has me wanting to start one now. I think I'll get to the winter break with Domzale first though and then pause that there to start a world cup challenge.

@Madmac79 I'm sorry but taking out Rui Costa is like taking out one of our own (Minanda!) very poor showing :NO: A good move on your part though as it must have weakened them somewhat. :D I enjoyed reading the write up and you did a great job of qualifying though! Good luck against Argentina, you never know in a one off game.

@fmicablues7 Goal difference could be crucial in that group. It seems that tight that a win and a draw might get you through if you can end with a positive goal difference. It's almost a case of maybe needing Czech Republic to beat the other two and make it into a mini group between you and the other two. I'm trying to remember who Uruguay had back then, Forlan(?) and Dario Silva (if @WhoAteMeDinner will release him for the tournament :LOL: )

@WhoAteMeDinner Hamsun, trooper that he is, scored a goal with his bandage on as well.
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Nice one @mattmid , what a trooper. I put a massive headband on Kleberson, (my news PES 3 ML DMF signing) and gave him a new, massive barnet, and he is now playing like Samson with the jawbone of an ass.:SHOCK: Bandages, headbands and big hair seem to turn ordinary players into He-Man. :TU:
 
WhoAteMeDinner said:
Yep, @liam0709 , basically the further back you go in PES titles on the Playstation 2, the tougher and more demanding scoring gets. In PES 1 and PES 2, headed goals and scoring from outside the box were rare events (not that realistic), only players with missiles of shots like Adriano, Zidane, Rui Costa and Nedved could score from outside. The game engine and ball physics were completely re-built for PES 3 and bullet headers and rocket shots became very possible with good play. :BY:
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Even pes 5 which I played just last night I found the shooting hard. If memory serves me right pes 4 was the one where it was easy to chip the keeper (haven't played it since 2005 so I may be wrong).
 
miguelfcp said:
@fmicablues7: I agree with the guys, I always understand what you write so feel free to write detailed posts if you want to.

@Orhainmalz: Glad you mentioned it (and yeah the game is emulated perfectly on the PSP), ISS PS1 is a great platform for a World Cup challenge too. You can clearly notice the difference between good and bad NTs...I recommend it!
Click to expand...

@miguelfcp , agree, my PES 3 fellow super supporter @fmicablues7 , has better English than me, it is proper good. :SAL::SAL::SAL:
 
Orhainmalz said:
thinking of starting the international challenge with Ireland in PES6 (though I hate that games shot system, keeps blazing over the bar) and trying to win now you're getting me thinking :)

or maybe just PES3 and the normal int. cup mode.
Click to expand...

@Orhainmalz , I would say that playing PES 6 may reduce you to despair and controller throwing, with the crazy shot control and other big gamplay glitches, but would point out that picking the wonderful Ireland team of ten years back, will include: Given, Dunne, Duff, Kilbane, Keane. Top players and not exactly total no-hopers and also-rans like China, Saudi Arabia and DPRK.

Maybe I should play as Engerland in PES 3 World Cup Challenge, they never do anything either. Who is a no-hoper ? :THINK:
 
@WhoAteMeDinner Depends whether you want to under or over achieve. :D

The Ireland team might only have one of the Keane's though as the other one might go home early in a strop.


Or you could play PES2008 add in the current England side and practice the dive button with Sterling (it was that version wasn't it where you could try for a penalty?)
 
mattmid said:
@WhoAteMeDinner Depends whether you want to under or over achieve. :D

The Ireland team might only have one of the Keane's though as the other one might go home early in a strop.


Or you could play PES2008 add in the current England side and practice the dive button with Sterling (it was that version wasn't it where you could try for a penalty?)
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Yeh, the greater Keano or I Keano as he is called here has a bit of hair trigger fuse, wrong colour towels in the hotel and he is back on the plane. :COAT::COAT::COAT:
 
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