LOL I'm too young to remember that. But seen it on YouTube
Problem with Advanced is if I'm running to the right towards goal and I want to shoot bottom left corner will I shoots backwards?
PES 2018 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread
- Thread starter ThomasGOAL
- Start date
LOL I'm too young to remember that. But seen it on YouTube
Problem with Advanced is if I'm running to the right towards goal and I want to shoot bottom left corner will I shoots backwards?
Ffs Geeeee don't ask me .. . .it's bad enough trying to concentrate in a tough game trying to break a team down and then just before shooting you're going "is it down left for top right? no no it's down left for bottom right . .oh wait the video said. . ." couldn't be doing with it.
robbieryan
I dream of occasional fanzine mentions
No you'll just hit the post or bar
- Staff
- #2,344
That is 100% why I could never adapt to it. It's not the developers' fault - but there's no way I can concentrate on trying to left-stick dribble through a crowd of defenders, nudging the stick left and right, and then press shoot and immediately translate what I want to do into a backwards interpretation, like I'm playing football in a mirror.
It seems like an utterly arse-backwards implementation - but there must be a reason for it. The only explanation I can think of is to force you to shoot in a different direction other than the one you're running in all the time - and it's still mental.
I'd love to use it, but I just can't - again, it's my problem - but I really dislike when people watch videos and say things like "well of course the shots are all rockets, they're not using advanced shooting". Same applies to manual passing. There's almost a condescending snobbery about it, and I really don't like that.
and after it hits the post and i wanna tap it in the bottom left hand corner do i press left back on the left stick or will that hit the other post? 
Come Chris its easy, its like tapping your head and rubbing your belly but watching it in front of a mirror.
Ah Chris do you think I'm a snob for playing manual? No way buddy. .. ..I was thinking about the mirror thing as well.
Come Chris its easy, its like tapping your head and rubbing your belly but watching it in front of a mirror.
Is this the comedy section of the site? ha ha
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- Joined
- 7 August 2004
Backwards is specifically for shooting low. If you press towards then you still shoot at goal, you just shoot for the top corner not the bottom.
Advanced shooting is difficult to grasp at first because of the 20 years or more where we've always pointed towards goal to shoot. It's funny because it makes sense to everybody when they're taking a penalty, whether it's old PES or 2017. The difference is that the camera, and the fact that penalties are always about hitting the ball forwards and never back, means that for a PK it just makes sense. You don't think of pressing down as pressing away from goal.
Advanced shooting is difficult to grasp at first because of the 20 years or more where we've always pointed towards goal to shoot. It's funny because it makes sense to everybody when they're taking a penalty, whether it's old PES or 2017. The difference is that the camera, and the fact that penalties are always about hitting the ball forwards and never back, means that for a PK it just makes sense. You don't think of pressing down as pressing away from goal.
lancers
League 1
I don't know why you cannot control the weight of the shot with the length of time the shot button is depressed. Height and direction should be controlled by the direction of the left stick alone. Really how hard can this be to implement?
lancers
League 1
Advanced through balls makes the game more difficult for me I find anything assisted at all makes it too easy to get in on goal. Not good enough to play on full on manual passing play PA1. Hopefully PA1 can become much looser just barely assisted.
You're describing normal shooting there .. . .advanced is pulling the stick in the opposite way of where you want the ball to go.
James Beaver
Championship
- Joined
- 21 December 2014
Inspired by this discussion I did a couple of searches and figured out how to put side spin into an advanced (lobbed) through ball.
If you are using guides, the principle is straightforward: the ball tries to travel the path travelled by the guide. That is, if you make a bend in the path of the guide, a spin will be introduced to try to make the ball follow this bend. I just tested it on the practice ground and it works. A great little addition.
The original discussion is here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WEPES/comments/55s04s/need_help_with_advanced_through_balls_desperately/
I don't use guides anymore, so the use of such a spin is pretty tricky.
For me, there are few more satisfying PES moments than a well placed advanced through ball.
can you do a hard low shot on basic shooting?
Kovy personally speaking . ..I'm no expert but pulling back on the left stick when hitting the ball hard does it for me as well as when closer pressing shoot button twice quickly while putting full power on the shoot button sometimes works.
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- Joined
- 7 August 2004
I was surprised that I felt better at advanced through balls when I switched the guide off. I still don't really use it for through balls, I chiefly use manual passing instead - but I do find it's great for putting curl on the ball, for spreading the play over longer distances, or for those little flick/lay-off passes where you don't want to risk overhitting the ball.
- Staff
- #2,357
This is completely out of nowhere (and off-topic, but hell, we've been off-topic for a while now)... But... Does anyone remember the PS2's analogue buttons (pressure-sensitive) setting the power?
I think it was an ISS, and it was impossible to master - but I really liked the idea.
I often wonder if something similar could be achieved using the SIXAXIS controls - tilt the controller forward (after pressing shoot) for a laces shot (so you're doing with the controller what you'd do with your foot), and the reverse for a shot with a climbing loft.
If the game took the controller position when you pressed the shoot button as "neutral" - so that you're not always hitting the same type of shot depending on your comfortable controller position - it'd work, I reckon. (But it'll never happen because you can't replicate motion controls with an Xbox One controller.)
That would give you the control of "advanced shooting", but without having to maintain two different thought processes using the same input (i.e. using a single stick to control a run and a shot, in different directions).
It's the kind of thing I think devs are (rightly) scared of experimenting with, given the money involved if everyone hates it. But control-wise, things have been stagnating for 10+ years (and you can always hide it away in the settings menu, alá "advanced shooting", and credit to Konami for doing that).
Noooo, not you mate. I've even used it myself recently, but gave up when I realised that the AI strings first-time passes together without looking, while you're there hitting realistically misplaced passes. It's like gluing two different games together, with the AI playing on easy mode, and you playing on simulation mode. Doesn't work for me.
I was just referring to the guys who think that because manual passing exists, the lowest-assisted passing model doesn't matter. "Play on manual if you don't like it", that kind of thing. Not guys like you.
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haven't played in a long time, i know a couple of years ago you had to press triangle after loading up to keep the shot low, guess that was removed also
That's long gone kovy.
lancers
League 1
I pull back on the left stick to keep the shots low using Advanced Shooting but I was talking about how hard the shots are. Longer you stay on the shot button the harder the shot kinda like FIFA's use of the power bar sensitivity for passing. It could be adjusted to taste.
Ok lancer it's just that the way they are explaining it pulling down low to the left can make the shot go high to the right or something like that . .. I just thought that you had to use the combinations that they tell you to use. . . .. but as I don't use it . .you would know more than I would about it.
Chuny
-
- Joined
- 11 December 2007
What do you think about that?-
Don't you think Ball Winning is too low? More often than not, Messi will win the ball if it's a 50-50 situation. And more often than not, he will keep the ball in physical battles.
lancers
League 1
Bo Jackson Tecmo Bowl.
DarthKebab
Fully Assisted Noob
- Joined
- 11 May 2008
The problem I have with this game, after growing up playing since the SNES days is the rewarding feeling when shooting and scoring not being there anymore.
Its down to a number of factors:
Space being wide open now on the pitch
More movement angles available for the player giving more chance of easily walking around an opponent for a clear shot
No individuality in players now when shooting accuracy, always forcing keeper into a diving save
Body positioning, correct foot, angle no longer factored in
Goalkeeper position, reacting to danger poor
Basically just the feeling that ive not earned a goal which for me has been missing for years, the game is giving me a goal as a way to try entertain, all the talk of Advanced, Manual, Basic means nothing when the end result is just a feeling of meh.
We play these games hours on end and that one more game feeling is just lost now, even FIFA for me now gives me greater satisfaction in scoring goals with contextual animations than PES does, theres no surprises any more, I don't feel the game is going to open up and give me more the more I play it.
For me I need that back or else ill just stop playing again after 3 weeks.
Its down to a number of factors:
Space being wide open now on the pitch
More movement angles available for the player giving more chance of easily walking around an opponent for a clear shot
No individuality in players now when shooting accuracy, always forcing keeper into a diving save
Body positioning, correct foot, angle no longer factored in
Goalkeeper position, reacting to danger poor
Basically just the feeling that ive not earned a goal which for me has been missing for years, the game is giving me a goal as a way to try entertain, all the talk of Advanced, Manual, Basic means nothing when the end result is just a feeling of meh.
We play these games hours on end and that one more game feeling is just lost now, even FIFA for me now gives me greater satisfaction in scoring goals with contextual animations than PES does, theres no surprises any more, I don't feel the game is going to open up and give me more the more I play it.
For me I need that back or else ill just stop playing again after 3 weeks.
PRO_TOO
Team Heffernan
I love em on manual when I drill a low rocket into the net from 5 meter behind the penalty area! I tried advanced but never really liked it. The vice versa thing when shooting is weird, imo.
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+1
I think you hit the real issue. I asked myself why is that and i think the main reasons are:
1) player individuality has gone
2) everything feels light, lifeless
3) defending has become shit
In old pes players had weight, ball physics was great, midfields battle were crucial, defending was tough but skill based, crossing was a beauty in action (especially pes3-5).
The game feels flat all around. in certain stadium certain conditions certain teams u can still have a good game here and there, but the flatness has killed this series. Pes 2014 and in a way pes 2011 were a step in the old good direction but after seabass was fired it all went "pes6" way, very arcadish, dull, monotonous.
I think you hit the real issue. I asked myself why is that and i think the main reasons are:
1) player individuality has gone
2) everything feels light, lifeless
3) defending has become shit
In old pes players had weight, ball physics was great, midfields battle were crucial, defending was tough but skill based, crossing was a beauty in action (especially pes3-5).
The game feels flat all around. in certain stadium certain conditions certain teams u can still have a good game here and there, but the flatness has killed this series. Pes 2014 and in a way pes 2011 were a step in the old good direction but after seabass was fired it all went "pes6" way, very arcadish, dull, monotonous.
Guys, this rewarding feeling? Most people are saying that the feeling isn't there anymore .. . I'm playing Pes 16 at the moment and it feels great to score a good goal. .the same in Pes 17 ... . .I don't feel the difference in the old games . ..it's probably just me .. . . or is it the fact that scoring wasn't as frequent in those games and the same can be said for the amount of chances created and probably there was a feeling that you earned your goal and appreciated it more?
PRO_TOO
Team Heffernan
as long as i still jump out of my chair here and then when i score... the feeling is still present sometimes, i guess!
DarthKebab
Fully Assisted Noob
- Joined
- 11 May 2008
Chances are more frequent, so scoring is more frequent because of the reasons I listed, offering more freedom to the user and not giving much thought process to the AI itself and how to counteract that all goes in the favour of the user.
When I can put any midfield player and have up to 10 long shots allowed on goal per game with a very high percentage of a goal something is wrong for me.
romagnoli
Misses Retri
- Joined
- 7 August 2004
This is another bloody long one, sorry!
Slowing the game down and reintroducing passing error should help a lot in starting the sequence of events that leads to a deeper PES.
Right now, superaccurate passing means fast pacing, so both teams can keep up with play and so that the whole (assisted) passing experience feels more 'thrilling' to the average user. Fast pacing means you need a more intense press to keep up. But fast pacing and high accuracy means it's easy to move the ball into the attack, and intense pressing where the attack cannot shield the ball means the defensive positioning is allowed to be looser so that pressers have some chasing to do, and that the team on the ball can beat the press.
But passing favours the recipient over the defender a lot of the time - as if anticipation stats for the two are lopsided in favour of attack. Hence the crossing issue too, where super accurate drilled crosses aren't reacted to in time. So defenders are given the ability to catch up with dribbling attackers, to try and stop wingers or pacey forwards just rinsing through and scoring at will.
Shooting is made so powerful so that teams can make the most of their moment before the defenders catch up, because the game is already so fast that slower shots will look more limp, and because of years of justifiable complaining that shooting feels lifeless already. With 2017, keepers are generally brought into line with shooting, rather than Konami trying to address both at once and risking a greater imbalance.
There are a lot of issues, then, that need improvement, but they're all tangled up with each other.
To me, the first step that needed to be taken was for the pace of the game to drop down a notch, so I'm glad that 2018 is taking that step. That allows more space within the pitch, more thinking time. That allows for more passing error, because you are being asked to decide whether or not to attempt a pass, rather than just chain shit together like a QTE. That means passing moves won't be as clinical, so pressing needs to be met with more shielding and pacey players need to be able to get away from slower, more physical types.
With a slower pace, passing error and first touch error, I feel like the wheels are set in motion for further improvements in keeping with what we all broadly want from the game. It'll be interesting to see how the more manual positioning for aerial balls works out too - it's a new variable that adds depth but could create imbalance, either defensively or offensively.
Over the next few years it'll be important that we all try and think what needs to change first to create space for the next change. We'll never fix everything at once.
Slowing the game down and reintroducing passing error should help a lot in starting the sequence of events that leads to a deeper PES.
Right now, superaccurate passing means fast pacing, so both teams can keep up with play and so that the whole (assisted) passing experience feels more 'thrilling' to the average user. Fast pacing means you need a more intense press to keep up. But fast pacing and high accuracy means it's easy to move the ball into the attack, and intense pressing where the attack cannot shield the ball means the defensive positioning is allowed to be looser so that pressers have some chasing to do, and that the team on the ball can beat the press.
But passing favours the recipient over the defender a lot of the time - as if anticipation stats for the two are lopsided in favour of attack. Hence the crossing issue too, where super accurate drilled crosses aren't reacted to in time. So defenders are given the ability to catch up with dribbling attackers, to try and stop wingers or pacey forwards just rinsing through and scoring at will.
Shooting is made so powerful so that teams can make the most of their moment before the defenders catch up, because the game is already so fast that slower shots will look more limp, and because of years of justifiable complaining that shooting feels lifeless already. With 2017, keepers are generally brought into line with shooting, rather than Konami trying to address both at once and risking a greater imbalance.
There are a lot of issues, then, that need improvement, but they're all tangled up with each other.
To me, the first step that needed to be taken was for the pace of the game to drop down a notch, so I'm glad that 2018 is taking that step. That allows more space within the pitch, more thinking time. That allows for more passing error, because you are being asked to decide whether or not to attempt a pass, rather than just chain shit together like a QTE. That means passing moves won't be as clinical, so pressing needs to be met with more shielding and pacey players need to be able to get away from slower, more physical types.
With a slower pace, passing error and first touch error, I feel like the wheels are set in motion for further improvements in keeping with what we all broadly want from the game. It'll be interesting to see how the more manual positioning for aerial balls works out too - it's a new variable that adds depth but could create imbalance, either defensively or offensively.
Over the next few years it'll be important that we all try and think what needs to change first to create space for the next change. We'll never fix everything at once.