PES 2017 PlayStation & Xbox Discussion Thread

Deco said:
E-mail from playstation to tell me that the game in which I put the most hours into was Pes 2014.. . .really? That's news to me . ..I would have said Pes 2017.
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I spent a lot of time on it too, up to the point I couldn't stand the terrible LOD for the PC, and...as always with me...a gameplay issue of the defenders following the attackers deep into the box. Other than that though, I remember it being a decent start to the new engine, but definitely needed some editing work.
 
Matt10 said:
I spent a lot of time on it too, up to the point I couldn't stand the terrible LOD for the PC, and...as always with me...a gameplay issue of the defenders following the attackers deep into the box. Other than that though, I remember it being a decent start to the new engine, but definitely needed some editing work.
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It had great potential . .I still think they should have built on from it, although the pitches looked a bit small and looked like they were painted on.
 
Matt10 said:
I need to step away from PES 2017 for a second. Trying to get teams to play realistically, and challenging, is doing my head in.

Once I can stop one-time-passing all over the pitch, then I will know there is a challenge. In its current form...it's not possible. Attack...retreat...defend...Attack...REPEAT. It's boring me to death.

I've exhausted most options, now to dive a bit more into global editing of players (PC) and determine what ratings actually matter.

Player Roles (DMF in fluid formations especially, make sure they are only DMF in Out of Possession) matter a huge deal. Tactics matter way too much, sorry it's true, as a former player myself - I knew my assignment, and the general intent - but PES 17 players operate as if they are going to be beaten with a stick if they don't listen to their manager.

Why is it that for a series that does so well in making the ball feel independent, does such a poor job at placing the fundamentals of the individuals who have to get control of the ball? These fundamentals are as common as having a kick about with your friends...

Instead, we have, by priority:

1. Preset Tactics (A/D levels)
2. Advanced Tactics
3. Formations
4. Player Roles
5. The ball (!)
6. The player styles
7. The player abilities
8. Player physicality (weight/height/etc)
9. Football fundamentals...i.e "see the ball, get the ball"

Those reasons above is why you can boss Manchester City with Melbourne Victory.

It's a sad state, for me, when my beloved PES brings no challenge. I've spent countless hours on a patch combo with reaper, and now I feel completely like time is wasted, and the gorgeous pitches we managed to snag, are going to be filled with footprints of a DMF who is caught in two minds, because there is noone paying attention to the fundamentals of the beautiful game.

Am I alone here? What has everyone else been doing to really enjoy this game, and not feel like you have to take pity on the CPU?
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Mate I had been on the same boat and it's really frustrating when PES 2017 had the right tools and the core to deliver the PES that is enjoyable, fair and dynamic but they went the easy root and copied a bit off FIFA 17 and made everything simpler. I was playing WE9-LE the other day and I remember beating Burnley at 4-0 home thinking it was pretty easy and the next game, got trashed by Chelsea 4-1. And I was completely outplayed by a BETTER team. PES 2017 does the opposite and in a RNG way.
 
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Deco said:
E-mail from playstation to tell me that the game in which I put the most hours into was Pes 2014.. . .really? That's news to me . ..I would have said Pes 2017.
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I was just reading this, my most played game is Minecraft, Playstation Edition... Man, sharing my account with my brother and his kids was maybe not a good idea after all
 
Never! Anyway, I wish there was a way for me to get more of those stats. At the moment it only seems like stats that Sony uses to spy on its users.
 
Isslander said:
Never! Anyway, I wish there was a way for me to get more of those stats. At the moment it only seems like stats that Sony uses to spy on its users.
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It felt a bit weird to be told which game that I played the most . . .I didn't realise that this type of thing was being recorded.
 
Nice work Matt.

It basically proves what Papinho from the OS found. Attacking-defensive levels in PES 2017 are hardcoded as Numbers in Attack/Defence (many/medium/few), that you can't change ingame (in PES 2015 and 2016 you could). Preset tactics seem to already have predefined combination of these.
 
Matt10 said:
Look what I found out........

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Great findings matt, i'm looking for a way to set that att/def over a fluid tacts since november....
I watched all the video, now i've to try some tricks...
Really thnks, i think that could be a fix for the time over the '65. When some teams (RM,Leicester,Milan,Juventus) switch to the last attack prowness (the red) . Probably i have to rewrite all my tacts, anyway thnks again.
This could change and fix the whole gameplay.. (i need time to test).
 
Tinker said:
Nice work Matt.

It basically proves what Papinho from the OS found. Attacking-defensive levels in PES 2017 are hardcoded as Numbers in Attack/Defence (many/medium/few), that you can't change ingame (in PES 2015 and 2016 you could). Preset tactics seem to already have predefined combination of these.
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I think could be changed somewhere through hexedit... on Dino tools the options to change that (Few,Medium,Many) is again enabled, but i think there are some bugs in tactics tab of that program, so i have to try and manually change the tactics in Dino and then compare with previous unedited default tact , then find the relative byte and change it in hexedit but i think is possible. The parts to search i think is also inside the exe, these behaviors are named shape in dt18 and also in the exe.
I think that the most of the teams are relinked to Real Madrid Shape and that in knockout match bring them to the Super Forward CB Behavior where Bonucci in a Final Champions play as CF for 50 minutes (from '65 to '120) on 0-0
 
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This is fantastic! I'm definitely going to try editing all Premier League teams in my OF over the weekend. :DANCE:
 
Great work again Matt
Can somebody give an insight into what attack/defence levels to use for all premier league teams
 
mmm. tried right now but seems that after the '65 all those settings are again overrided, doesn't matter which settings, have tried almost all the simple tactics.
Using Man Utd in ML, first match is the charity shield aganist Leicester, i've changed every time the tacts and restart a lot of new ML to test, but on 0-0 after the'65 the Leicester switch on the red and the match lost any sense, this happens sistematically in any ML i've tried. Again... uff...

Thnks anyway :)
 
kilay said:
mmm. tried right now but seems that after the '65 all those settings are again overrided, doesn't matter which settings, have tried almost all the simple tactics.
Using Man Utd in ML, first match is the charity shield aganist Leicester, i've changed every time the tacts and restart a lot of new ML to test, but on 0-0 after the'65 the Leicester switch on the red and the match lost any sense, this happens sistematically in any ML i've tried. Again... uff...

Thnks anyway :)
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Well, that's not necessarily related to what the video is in regards to. The video illustrates finding the base of the att/def level for teams, and then match scenario can, and most likely will, kick in. At least now I don't see teams that start with Orange attack and Blue defense, on All-Out defense. I think as long as it carries over, which it will, to a competition mode, that will be all that matters.
 
Tinker said:
Nice work Matt.

It basically proves what Papinho from the OS found. Attacking-defensive levels in PES 2017 are hardcoded as Numbers in Attack/Defence (many/medium/few), that you can't change ingame (in PES 2015 and 2016 you could). Preset tactics seem to already have predefined combination of these.
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Precisely. Pap and I have discussed this in pm a couple times and previous iterations the numbers in attack/defense determined everything.

The hardcoding portion is what is uncovered in the video. This means those who want to modify a team, they had better know what type of att/def level that team should be in first, because it is not as simple as changing their Preset Tactics, then hoping that "All Out Defense" means it's going to be a "Blue" in defense. It means that Preset Tactics have zero to do with the attack/defense levels, which proves further just how disconnected formations/tactics/player individuality really is.
 
Matt10 said:
Look what I found out........

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Was just thinking about this yesterday. I was playing PES 2013 and envied how the players didn't panic and sprint back to their defending positions when they loose the ball, and today Matt10 comes up with this, legend!

kilay said:
mmm. tried right now but seems that after the '65 all those settings are again overrided, doesn't matter which settings, have tried almost all the simple tactics.
Using Man Utd in ML, first match is the charity shield aganist Leicester, i've changed every time the tacts and restart a lot of new ML to test, but on 0-0 after the'65 the Leicester switch on the red and the match lost any sense, this happens sistematically in any ML i've tried. Again... uff...

Thnks anyway :)
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Hey kilay, is this only for cup final matches or charity shields/super cups, or is it like this on every matches? And does match situations affect the cpu behavior, i mean like whether the cpu is leading or behind in the game. What if we turn off the automatic 'change tactics' switch for the cpu, will it have any effects?
 
Elja said:
Hey kilay, is this only for cup final matches or charity shields/super cups, or is it like this on every matches? And does match situations affect the cpu behavior, i mean like whether the cpu is leading or behind in the game. What if we turn off the automatic 'change tactics' switch for the cpu, will it have any effects?
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The most of the knockout matches, that happens not to all the teams, and happens if the result is equal or the CPU is loosing.
It happens also in the most of the derby and in the cl/el group... too often for my taste.
We can do nothing to change that behavior inside the game, i think the cpu switch to the simple tactic all on attack(but without showing the changes in the game plan)
 
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Matt10 said:
Look what I found out........

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Some good news as well, reaper found out that you can change the formations in the normal plan AFTER you have selected the type of ATT/DEF for the team you are editing. This means you can go to the Normal Game Plan > Change Preset Tactics > Change Formation (now, you can choose a variety of preset formations). From there, just go back to the Simple Tactical Settings Screen and you will be good to go.
 
This is a great discovery thanks! I tested a couple of games myself as bologna vs milan CPU

CPU green/green some nice build up play and well worked goals they were playing lots of give and go 1-2s in the final third the CPU played calmly and passed it around really enjoyed this match lost 3-2

CPU orange/orange its basically shoot on sight for CPU in the final third I lost 5-1 I have played 6 seasons in ML and not seen the types of goals scored in this match including CPU rocket shot top corner from outside the box.In Milans tactics I also set it to frontline pressure aggressive and after the game the stats said 42 interceptions by milan to my 18 thats crazy high most I have seen in ML was 31

Overall it makes big changes to how the cpu play in the final third with how they build up or aggressively shoot
 
I edited Hull last night as they are always the first team I play in Master league.Did what Matt stated as I wanted orange orange to test so set at all out defence.Started game and they stayed at green green then scored.This stayed the same in il around 60 mins then they went orange orange and pushed for a second.
Have o set it up wrong from the start???
 
nadge said:
I edited Hull last night as they are always the first team I play in Master league.Did what Matt stated as I wanted orange orange to test so set at all out defence.Started game and they stayed at green green then scored.This stayed the same in il around 60 mins then they went orange orange and pushed for a second.
Have o set it up wrong from the start???
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It takes some repetition to get right. I did the same thing in the original video and had to cut it out, which threw me in a panic of the discovery.

Make sure you choose that ATT/DEF level first, then make sure the screen is still in the Simple Tactical settings (only 3 icons, "Edit Lineup, Simple Tactical Settings, Back to Normal Gameplan" before exiting out.
 
Ahh that's good to hear that even the master struggled first time :D
Will test further tonight.Must amit though the Hull game was great finished 2-1 to them and played again with default settings and it was 0-0 with 10 men behind the ball and felt very tedious
 
nadge said:
Ahh that's good to hear that even the master struggled first time :D
Will test further tonight.Must amit though the Hull game was great finished 2-1 to them and played again with default settings and it was 0-0 with 10 men behind the ball and felt very tedious
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Yeah, you're right about that. It's such a difference in challenge. I still, personally, want even more resistance in the midfield, but at least this is on the right track.

I managed to get the custom formations (so, the ones that have been modified by someone else) to stay in-tact, but am trying to get it working for those that use fluid formations since some/most editors use the SB to be "SMF" in the in possession so those LB/RB don't lolly-gag in the back line while the team pushes forward.

I'm also getting stuck in on player edits, which is going to take this game full scale to what I'm looking for. Primarily values, and I really don't care about the perceived individuality in this case because these are geared to achieve fundamentals first, is Defensive Prowess (defensive mindset/reactions), Body Balance (Pressure to perform) and Ball Winning (removing that "stunned" animation).
 
Matt, its awesome you've found these work arounds. Your commitment to getting the most out of PES is unquestioned. It just sucks that we have to go to those lengths just to get quality CPU A.I.
 
This is awesome..it kills those silly wide open spaces and passes from centre back to center forward due to little midfield play..one thing I did notice against man u ..I set them to all out defence. 3 games ..first game nil nil they stayed orange attack and def level throughout ..same when I won 1-0 ...but when they were winning in last 15 or so they switched to Blue..everyone behind the ball
 
Great find matt, this really is a game changer when combined with a few more tactic edits.

Tinker said:
So do you guys play more with orange/orange or green/green?
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To me it looks like the ATT/DEF level effects how clinical the cpu is in front of goal, so I'm using O/O for the big teams and G/G for the smaller ones.
 
I agree with Lewpop, the ATT/DEF level seems to affect the tooth of the cpu in every game department. It is particularly striking in front of the goal.
It seems to me the cpu uses less those laser shots when on green in attack.
 
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