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PES 2012 Discussion Thread .......

Where did you see that the ball physics have been re-worked??

p.s. I think you guys forgot:
Virtua Striker (arcade game but my mate bought it on the Dreamcast)
Michel Futbol Master
 
Post #590.

It's a quote from Adam though, and we all know that anything he says should be taken with a pinch of salt!
 
I'm not sure I'm having as much problems with the ball physics as of late. It bobbles quite nicely. Maybe its the LCD? Maybe change of country?

Hmmm..
4udk7t.png
 
I don't think it's a case of bobbling but a question of weight as Anderson said. The ball doesn't feel like it weighs anywhere near enough. It leads to passing feel a bit fast for some i guess, not to mention 100 yard clearences before the ball bounces and a feeling that the ball doesn't dip really on long shots. These are generally things people have mentioned before.
 
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Rob92 said:
Liking that the ball physics have been reworked - hopefully it's more of a complete overhaul.

This is one area PES 2011 is a joke, the ball physics are horrible.
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Online in ranked or MLO they are a compete joke! No question about that!

Offline or when you put top player on in a match, they are tolerable but still have their issues. Too many inconsistencies.

I'm going to drum round a lot of sites to get peoples feeling on the online setup. Why is Regular difficulty the default? Why?

Regular AI is still stupid like with PES 2010, 2009 etc...

Don't get why konami going to make say, professional difficulty the Standard which would sort out the through ball and triple tap cross abuse! Also the ball isn't as pinball as it is on regular which is just madness really, madness in a bad way!

Northzzz said:
I don't think it's a case of bobbling but a question of weight as Anderson said. The ball doesn't feel like it weighs anywhere near enough. It leads to passing feel a bit fast for some i guess, not to mention 100 yard clearences before the ball bounces and a feeling that the ball doesn't dip really on long shots. These are generally things people have mentioned before.
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yes, its a tad too fast for passes. the 100 yard clearances are bad, very bad and an example of the weight issues in terms of it's physics.

They really need to sort out the sound when the ball is passed, shot, crossed etc.. it's ridiculous! A net sound would be good also!
 
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I really really hope PES improves ball physics, including my pet hate - the lack of swerve on shots! Make it like free kicks and corners please! It exists, just implement it.

You would think it's the easiest thing to fix out of it's current bugs ;)

Thanks Rob for the quote before. I didn't read Adam's post above.

PES is almost there. Just a coat of paint and some tweaking and it could go from being sometimes amazing to always great! Well, something like that haha...
 
kobayashi said:
Online in ranked or MLO they are a compete joke! No question about that!

Offline or when you put top player on in a match, they are tolerable but still have their issues. Too many inconsistencies.

I'm going to drum round a lot of sites to get peoples feeling on the online setup. Why is Regular difficulty the default? Why?

Regular AI is still stupid like with PES 2010, 2009 etc...

Don't get why konami going to make say, professional difficulty the Standard which would sort out the through ball and triple tap cross abuse! Also the ball isn't as pinball as it is on regular which is just madness really, madness in a bad way!



yes, its a tad too fast for passes. the 100 yard clearances are bad, very bad and an example of the weight issues in terms of it's physics.

They really need to sort out the sound when the ball is passed, shot, crossed etc.. it's ridiculous! A net sound would be good also!
Click to expand...

It's not in MLO, it doesnt state it anywhere as far as I'm aware. For me it's Professional, thats how it feels. The default mode online is alot more competent than it was in PES 09 and PES 10.
 
kobayashi said:
Online in ranked or MLO they are a compete joke! No question about that!

Offline or when you put top player on in a match, they are tolerable but still have their issues. Too many inconsistencies.

I'm going to drum round a lot of sites to get peoples feeling on the online setup. Why is Regular difficulty the default? Why?
Regular AI is still stupid like with PES 2010, 2009 etc...

Don't get why konami going to make say, professional difficulty the Standard which would sort out the through ball and triple tap cross abuse! Also the ball isn't as pinball as it is on regular which is just madness really, madness in a bad way!
Click to expand...

That is the reason I don't play ranked games online anymore. They force you to play on difficulty level that supports noobish tactics
 
About the ball physics: I think the way the ball jumps is not a problem.
What I find a problem is how fast a passed ball looses its speed. Especially with low through passes. It looks like the ball is played into a pool of mudd. That should be corrected.
 
Totally agree with regard to the default setting being upped.


I get Konami's friendly approach to all things human, but it also allows monsters to develop on it's on doorstep by exploitation of flaws/glitches whatever:MAD:

The sad truth is the determined cheats will always find a way to f-up the proper players online which is sad!


Edit: Oh and how can you guys forget Olympic Soccer on the PS? Perhaps Alan Green's finest commentary hour
 
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Kaiser said:
Totally agree with regard to the default setting being upped.


I get Konami's friendly approach to all things human, but it also allows monsters to develop on it's on doorstep by exploitation of flaws/glitches whatever:MAD:

The sad truth is the determined cheats will always find a way to f-up the proper players online which is sad!


Edit: Oh and how can you guys forget Olympic Soccer on the PS? Perhaps Alan Green's finest commentary hour
Click to expand...

I loved that game, hammered that for a long, long time.
 
Han said:
About the ball physics: I think the way the ball jumps is not a problem.
What I find a problem is how fast a passed ball looses its speed. Especially with low through passes. It looks like the ball is played into a pool of mudd. That should be corrected.
Click to expand...

Yes, the ball slows down too quickly, that's my main issue with it. Maybe the ball could curl more too when shooting and taking free kicks.
 
Jamezinho said:
Adam @ WENB:
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To be honest, with 09 and 10 they said the same. the moment you start playing a new pes the ball physics are alway's different. in the beginning we tend to believe the phyisics have become better, but they are just different en therefor we think it's better.
 
Enlil said:
To be honest, with 09 and 10 they said the same. the moment you start playing a new pes the ball physics are alway's different. in the beginning we tend to believe the phyisics have become better, but they are just different en therefor we think it's better.
Click to expand...

In fairness many people had complaints about PES2011's ball physics as early as the MLO beta, the main criticism being the way the ball slows down too quickly when in rolling along the turf.
 
On the subject of football games then i think we've missed the grandest of them all, Boys Soccer Team 5. I found it in a compilation of SNES roms that i, erm borrowed from a friend. It is pretty much an RPG turn-based football game with awful English translation - see picture.
 
Is alot of that not down to the way Fifa does it though ? I dont have any concerns personally. I never feel for the most part, that looks or feels wrong. If I did, it would spoil my own personal enjoyment. For me personally I think alot of it boils down to how I perceive the relevant techniques of strikes, and how the game adheres to the principles. In that regard, everything feels fine. No issues. The theory is correct, so I'm happy. I guess if I played both Fifa and PES then I may start to look a little deeper as I'd have an obvious comparison.
 
great news about ball physics, ad rule, better ref. ball physics was excellent in pes5 imho.

But i expect a more enjoyble ml off line. All games feel the same, more stadia, more atm, better commentary and a more appealing menu/more realisti negotations etc.

Also konami...make a DLC with teams from the 80es...i would give u 20 euros for full 1980es leagues!!!
 
Northzzz said:
On the subject of football games then i think we've missed the grandest of them all, Boys Soccer Team 5. I found it in a compilation of SNES roms that i, erm borrowed from a friend. It is pretty much an RPG turn-based football game with awful English translation - see picture.
Click to expand...

Ah, the Captain Tsubasa series. I've played the whole series in the 90s. The Japanese versions too. Love 'em to bits. Still play 'em to this day. You know it's based on a cartoon right? Not sure what the characters names were in the UK, maybe Oliver Hutton, Mark Landers..

Not sure anyone here would like these games though; Football RPG.

Wendetta said:
Also konami...make a DLC with teams from the 80es...i would give u 20 euros for full 1980es leagues!!!
Click to expand...

Ah I would love that. Both 80's and 90's. Best thing is include classic club teams from 50's - 90's.
 
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I get a feeling that sticking swerve onto regular shots would make the keepers look even more suspect than usual.

I would like to see the ball physics tweaked somewhat. I don't think that they are terrible at the moment but there are instances where a certain kicking animation results in the ball spinning the wrong way.

Shooting does need to be reworked. Keep the L1 lobs as they are, clean up the R2 shot animations and tweak long shots (mainly, add curve).

MLO needs to be a bit more incentivised. I don't play in the competitions as they are not representative of how the game should be played.

Also, regarding the talk of football games of old. I was reminded of Virtua Striker ver 2000.1 on Dreamcast. It was arcadey as hell but it had the best long shots that I have ever seen in a football game to date. Similarly that game also had a better sense of perspective - The goal actually seems as big as it would in real life. In both PES and FIFA the goals seem to be shrunken somewhat and it seems all too easy to stick the ball over the bar.

Goals in PES do seem a bit samey. I'm not sure if it's the keeper AI but certain shots are impossible to score simply because the AI dictates that certain shot animations are never going to result in a goal.

Here's a couple of vids from Virtua Striker. Again, ignore the terrible gameplay and look at the perspective of things

YouTube - Virtua Striker 2 v.2000.1: My Best Goals. Goal # 4.

YouTube - Virtua Striker Dreamcast goles
 
Badgerman said:
I get a feeling that sticking swerve onto regular shots would make the keepers look even more suspect than usual.

I would like to see the ball physics tweaked somewhat. I don't think that they are terrible at the moment but there are instances where a certain kicking animation results in the ball spinning the wrong way.

Shooting does need to be reworked. Keep the L1 lobs as they are, clean up the R2 shot animations and tweak long shots (mainly, add curve).

MLO needs to be a bit more incentivised. I don't play in the competitions as they are not representative of how the game should be played.

Also, regarding the talk of football games of old. I was reminded of Virtua Striker ver 2000.1 on Dreamcast. It was arcadey as hell but it had the best long shots that I have ever seen in a football game to date. Similarly that game also had a better sense of perspective - The goal actually seems as big as it would in real life. In both PES and FIFA the goals seem to be shrunken somewhat and it seems all too easy to stick the ball over the bar.

Goals in PES do seem a bit samey. I'm not sure if it's the keeper AI but certain shots are impossible to score simply because the AI dictates that certain shot animations are never going to result in a goal.

Here's a couple of vids from Virtua Striker. Again, ignore the terrible gameplay and look at the perspective of things

YouTube - Virtua Striker 2 v.2000.1: My Best Goals. Goal # 4.

YouTube - Virtua Striker Dreamcast goles
Click to expand...

Its been like this for years, god only knows how they miss this. It irritates the hell out of me. It's basics. They get so much so right, then they screw up with exactly this.
 
Jimmy G-Force said:
You keep saying this but where does it show as Regular on MLO ? It feels nothing like Regular Ai. I'm almost positive it's set to Professional. It certainly feels that way, it's nothing like PES 09 or PES 10 in this regard.
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Well my reasoning is that yes it's much, MUCH better than how PES 2009 and 2010 was but still. i wondered why it's harder to defend on MLO compared to when i play on top player online. I mean i noticed when players like Dotan, Robben etc.. run at you, sometime your just helpless when on top player the art of defending is there to an extent. The game in general just feels 'fast'.

There isn't too big a difference between Professional and Top Player. Top player is better but I'm sure if it was professional the game would be a lot more solid online, it would be slower, with no issues with through balls, triple tap etc..

I'll see tonight if i can do a friendly with professional but I'm sure MLO like with ranked matches is set to regular.

To me MLO feels just like online ranked. The main thing is that we need Konami to sort out the default setting issue online for ranked an MLO. I can only see PES benefiting from top player or professional being set as the standard.
 
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Jamezinho said:
In fairness many people had complaints about PES2011's ball physics as early as the MLO beta, the main criticism being the way the ball slows down too quickly when in rolling along the turf.
Click to expand...

Yes!, i know but i was justg saying that WENB said in the past that ball physics were much improved, but they weren't they were just different.

Last night played a game. At first i thought the ball would go past the post, but when it hit the ground it suddenly spins into the goal, very unrealistic. I almost cried.
 
Enlil said:
Yes!, i know but i was justg saying that WENB said in the past that ball physics were much improved, but they weren't they were just different.

Last night played a game. At first i thought the ball would go past the post, but when it hit the ground it suddenly spins into the goal, very unrealistic. I almost cried.
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Hopefully they've learned their lesson this year and tell it how it is.
 
They have to be careful with the ball physics though. I've felt on previous version it's been like a bowling ball heading for the pins. After a pass it's speed is constant, neither slowing or speeding up!

A source of frustration many times. They are alot better in PES2011 and I'm sure can only be improved upon.
 
One thing that is particularly annoying me.

Sort out the replay camera angles! There's about 5 of them and all of them are dogshite. One of them is the TV view, another is flat against the floor which distorts perspective. There's one where the camera is zoomed in so far and focusing on such a small spot that the ball regularly leaves the view (also distorts perspective).

Why when you can freely move about on the PS2 are you given such debilitating options on the PS3?

Little things like this irk me more than they should.

Finally they need to implement the ball physics so that they react with the woodwork properly. i.e the ball should be able to hit the bar, bounce over the line and bounce back out a la Fifa.
 
I know the replay angles arent great, but you do know the last angle allows you to move the camera wherever you want? Well pretty much lol
 
Yea it is a free cam, but it's still awkward. Why introduce something that doesn't work well when you already have one that works really really well?
 
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